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Joe Douglas walks away from 2020's NFL draft a JETS WINNER and we're immediately making the playoffs come 2020-2021 and beyond (and into the SB)

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36 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

His arm strength looked weaker his rookie year.

Matt Flynn once threw 6 TDs in a game, and so did Ryan Fitzpatrick. Geno Smith once posted a perfect QB rating. That doesn’t therefore mean their ceiling was or is Aaron Rodgers.

Matt Flynn was a 7th rounder and never considered to have a high ceiling coming out. 

Ryan Fitzpatrick was a 7th round pick out of Harvard (pick 250) and a career loser with 0 playoff appearances despite 8 different teams and 15 years later; and was never considered to have a ceiling to begin with. 

Geno Smith? There were never any talks about Geno being 1st overall worthy and/or top 5 overall coming out of West Virginia; and there were never any Suck For Geno threads here on JN (TGG/JI) as there were with Suck 4 Luck and Suck For Sam posts. 

And Aaron Rodgers (himself) if not for being drafted into a legendary Green Bay Packers Franchise (before being able to sit and ride the bench for 3 years while learning behind a veteran HOF Brett Favre); probably wouldn't even have an Aaron Rodgers ceiling as if today. 

Sam Darnold was a 3rd overall NFL draft pick and considered to have a ceiling that's off the charts. 

I fell in love with him during his true Freshman season and have wanted him a Jet ever since. 

Kid was the Rose Bowl MVP and broke the All-Time Rose Bowl Record for most TD passes (5) as only a Freshman @ USC when he dropped 52 points against Saquan Barkley's PSU defense (during a 3 point win throughout an All-Time classic NCAA shootout) while dropping 33/53 (62.3%) for 453 Passing Yards and 5 TDs (1 INT) along with a flawless QB Rating of 161.4 

All 53 throws (super high ceiling). 

Between Darnold vs. Barkley that was one of the greatest bowl games I've ever experienced. Top 5 ever. The world witnessed two stars born (on that night). 

Sam Darnold was special during his 1st ever game. An instant NFL Monday Night Football Classical. Youngest QB to start a week 1 game of All-Time. Monday Night Football. @ Detroit. First career NFL Pass is returned the other way Pick-6 (Brett Favre-esque). 

He showed NY his heart, courage, focus, ability to shake off a bad play, mental toughness, arm talent, I.Q, leadership ability and competitive nature (during only his first ever NFL career start).

After his pick 6 int he immediately recovered and instantly responded by going out there and going 16/20 (80%), 198 Passing Yards, 2 TDs/0 INTs and QB Rating of over 100+ the rest of the way (legendary Sam Darnold game). 

Yes but why are we even talking about Aaron Rodgers and his ceiling to begin with?

Unlike Darnold, Rodgers was drafted into a legendary Green Bay Packers Franchise and sat the bench a full 3 years (learning and developing behind HOF Brett Favre) before ever becoming a starter. 

Aaron Rodgers didn't become a starter until his 4th year in the league (25 years old). 

Aaron Rodgers didn't win his 1st (and only) SB until his 6th year in the league (2010). 

Aaron Rodgers was 27 years old (6 years in) before he ever lifted his first and only SB 🏆

And did not win his first of two MVPs until 2011 (7th year in the league) @ 28 years old. .

Give Sam Darnold another 5-6 years until he's a 7-8 year pro @ 27-28 years old and then and only then can we mention Aaron Rodgers when talking Sam Darnold's ceiling 

(only a two year player and only 22 years of age).

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4 hours ago, shevys said:

Yeah, but you’re a broken record repeating the same stuff over and over. Your garbage Tannehill signature says it all. 

I was thinking last night "how long is long enough to keep Tannehill in my sig?" Your response is good evidence that it hasn't been long enough. Thank you for the feedback.

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16 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

If his ceiling is Rodgers then lots of QBs’ ceilings are Rodgers. His ceiling is not Rodgers — arguably the best passer that’s ever walked the earth.  

I’m quite sure I like Darnold better than @jgb but he’s not wrong in that the failure to produce as an elite QB so far doesn’t therefore mean he will do it with a better group around him. 

There are plenty of probowl QBs who’ve put up far better numbers, during seasons when the players around him are crap — whether due to bust picks, bust FAs, injuries promoting the undeserving, or just age. 

Everything that’s cold - even everything freezing - isn’t 0 Kelvin. Darnold doesn’t always have 1.5 seconds to throw or anything like that hyperbole. By the numbers the Jets’ QBs (Darnold and Falk both) had pressure in 2.5 seconds or less on 27% of dropbacks — an embarrassment from bad team-building, but that was 4th-worst. It’s also not significantly worse than others just-better: e.g. it’s roughly the same time-to-pressure as the 27% Russell Wilson suffered through (as he has had mostly meh or crap lines for most of his career), and most of the disparity is in low fractions of a second anyway. Never mind the Jets’ pass protection got noticeably better once Kalil was off the field, but most of Kalil’s action was with Falk not Darnold. Ditto Edoga, who was just awful as a rookie, but was only on the field for a minority percentage of Darnold’s snaps as well. 

Some seem have this idea that every other QB has 3.5-4 seconds to throw on 80% of their dropbacks. Part of what compounds the problem is Darnold takes longer to throw than most, so you never get to see it with QBs who get rid of it in <2.5 seconds like Brees & others. It’s also baseless that Watson would be lousy here because of the OL, when he’s had the worst protection in the league since entering it. Adding Tunsil mid-season last year made it better, but still not good. 

Have you watched Watson and Wilson play? They hold the ball forever because they are ridiculous athletes. Their “throw away” is a 1-2 yard run. Not all QBs/Offenses are the same which is why these pressure stats aren’t the best indicators of good/bad pass protection. Keep in mind Gase calls one of the most inefficient offenses in the league-Olineman aren’t required to pass block for 2.5 seconds on the 10 bubble screens he calls a game. Football Outsiders has a stat called “failed completions”-Gase offenses consistently rank on the top of that list. 

I agree the Aaron Rodgers comparisons are lofty, but also keep in mind Aaron Rodgers was playing in Berkeley CA  when he was Sams age. Got to give this kid some more time before we make any definitive declarations. Hopefully the two years with Adam Gase don’t damage him too much because I had really high hopes after his rookie year. 

 

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2 hours ago, JetFan20 said:

Have you watched Watson and Wilson play? They hold the ball forever because they are ridiculous athletes. Their “throw away” is a 1-2 yard run. Not all QBs/Offenses are the same which is why these pressure stats aren’t the best indicators of good/bad pass protection. Keep in mind Gase calls one of the most inefficient offenses in the league-Olineman aren’t required to pass block for 2.5 seconds on the 10 bubble screens he calls a game. Football Outsiders has a stat called “failed completions”-Gase offenses consistently rank on the top of that list. 

I agree the Aaron Rodgers comparisons are lofty, but also keep in mind Aaron Rodgers was playing in Berkeley CA  when he was Sams age. Got to give this kid some more time before we make any definitive declarations. Hopefully the two years with Adam Gase don’t damage him too much because I had really high hopes after his rookie year. 

 

All the time. I lead an exciting life.

I’m referring to Wilson in the regard of time to first pressure. That’s on the OL. I’d suspected it was really bad but didn’t realize this past year was on par with the Jets. Watson’s protection has been different in that he’ll sometimes get time but other times it’ll be nothing. That latter part is one of the real hallmarks when people talk of "he had no chance" dropbacks, and he had it way often because his line is still so inconsistent (Goff had similar for the Rams last year but it gets ignored and all blame goes to Goff to most casual fans who don’t realize or care how badly his line often played, and because he’s not a master under pressure either). It seemed like less for Watson because he can not only evade pressure longer but, when he doesn’t take one of his many sacks, he makes positive plays on them more than most (Darnold in particular).

The Jets’ OLs worse weakness would seem to have been run blocking but it’s hard to get into the woulda-beens with a RB who didn’t hit the hole/line because his "patience’ leads him to wait for a better opportunity that didn’t usually materialize. So it was bad, but it wouldn’t have seemed as bad if he didn’t dilly dally, like even a never-was has-been like Powell looked noticeably superior (and the line with the change).

This notion that Darnold not only had the worst ever pass blocking line ever, but that the disparity is so bad no one else had to deal with similar, is simply a made-up excuse. I fully agree they sucked, but not to the degree people are suggesting, and even less for Darnold who QB’d a minority of his season behind an injured Osemele or has-been Kalil or unready Edoga (never mind typically playing with all 3 together).

The line needs to improve and so does the QB behind it. I’m looking forward to both.

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14 hours ago, More Cowbell said:

Ok, we agree to disagree. Ypu basically not addressing anything I said and just repeating yourself.

Nonsense, as usual. I’m comparing our line to others you admit you don’t watch despite your claims like Darnold only gets 1.5 seconds to throw, in a way no other QB has had to deal with, as well as suggestions he’s as good as all of them when it’s put that no one else could have performed under these circumstances.

Yes we disagree, and your next statement isn’t what it means to agree to disagree. My response was enough and enumerating a response to your entire word salad rather than most of it was ample. But for you:

  • The magical Carroll didn’t get good or consistent QB play until a good and consistent QB stepped in, who didn’t need prototypical #1s, and whose play doesn’t suffer without them so the team and it’s fans can instead cling to excuses why he’s not really good.
  • Wilson had no prior-year "consistency" in scheme or teammates his rookie year.
  • Buttfumbler sucked even when he had time and more than ample run support.
  • Deep route Anderson performed better with a weak-armed Josh McCown (also behind a sucky line with sucky RB support). 

There — now the rest of your excuses have been addressed, if that’s what you were clinging to.

One of us is grounded in comparison, showing the line sucked but the disparity isn’t what you think; the other thinks his own hyperbole is an adequate substitute for fact. I feel like I need to spell out which you’ve been.

I like Darnold and am not pessimistic on him. He hasn’t had it as easy as some. But these over the top assertions the other way make my stance on him seem the otherwise because of the ridiculous excuse-making for any and all of his shortcomings to date. He needs to get better, and so do the players on offense around him.

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3 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Nonsense, as usual. I’m comparing our line to others you admit you don’t watch despite your claims like Darnold only gets 1.5 seconds to throw, in a way no other QB has had to deal with, as well as suggestions he’s as good as all of them when it’s put that no one else could have performed under these circumstances.

Yes we disagree, and your next statement isn’t what it means to agree to disagree. My response was enough and enumerating a response to your entire word salad rather than most of it was ample. But for you:

  • The magical Carroll didn’t get good or consistent QB play until a good and consistent QB stepped in, who didn’t need prototypical #1s, and whose play doesn’t suffer without them so the team and it’s fans can instead cling to excuses why he’s not really good.
  • Wilson had no prior-year "consistency" in scheme or teammates his rookie year.
  • Buttfumbler sucked even when he had time and more than ample run support.
  • Deep route Anderson performed better with a weak-armed Josh McCown (also behind a sucky line with sucky RB support). 

There — now the rest of your excuses have been addressed, if that’s what you were clinging to.

One of us is grounded in comparison, showing the line sucked but the disparity isn’t what you think; the other thinks his own hyperbole is an adequate substitute for fact. I feel like I need to spell out which you’ve been.

I like Darnold and am not pessimistic on him. He hasn’t had it as easy as some. But these over the top assertions the other way make my stance on him seem the otherwise because of the ridiculous excuse-making for any and all of his shortcomings to date. He needs to get better, and so do the players on offense around him.

Ph, was that all I said? Thanks for the update

 

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9 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

Ph, was that all I said? Thanks for the update

 

In addition to what was already answered? Yep.

Tell me more how Darnold’s struggles stemmed from him having just 1.5 seconds to throw, even as his average time to throw was about double that.

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8 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Nonsense, as usual. I’m comparing our line to others you admit you don’t watch despite your claims like Darnold only gets 1.5 seconds to throw, in a way no other QB has had to deal with, as well as suggestions he’s as good as all of them when it’s put that no one else could have performed under these circumstances.

Yes we disagree, and your next statement isn’t what it means to agree to disagree. My response was enough and enumerating a response to your entire word salad rather than most of it was ample. But for you:

  • The magical Carroll didn’t get good or consistent QB play until a good and consistent QB stepped in, who didn’t need prototypical #1s, and whose play doesn’t suffer without them so the team and it’s fans can instead cling to excuses why he’s not really good.
  • Wilson had no prior-year "consistency" in scheme or teammates his rookie year.
  • Buttfumbler sucked even when he had time and more than ample run support.
  • Deep route Anderson performed better with a weak-armed Josh McCown (also behind a sucky line with sucky RB support). 

There — now the rest of your excuses have been addressed, if that’s what you were clinging to.

One of us is grounded in comparison, showing the line sucked but the disparity isn’t what you think; the other thinks his own hyperbole is an adequate substitute for fact. I feel like I need to spell out which you’ve been.

I like Darnold and am not pessimistic on him. He hasn’t had it as easy as some. But these over the top assertions the other way make my stance on him seem the otherwise because of the ridiculous excuse-making for any and all of his shortcomings to date. He needs to get better, and so do the players on offense around him.

Sperm let me ask you a question, with the way you are responding to me which is extremely  demeaning,  do you actually expect me to engage in a back and forth with you? We went through this same BS a while back where you wouldn't  let up and I finally lost my cool. Remember that one where you banned me because you consistently  harassing  pretty much like you are doing now? 

What we are having here is not a conversation, it is king sperm saying listen peon, I am right and your opinion doesn't  matter and how dare you argue with me. So just go away already.

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Anyone talking Rodgers and Darnold in the same paragraph needs to cut back on the goof balls.

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16 minutes ago, Kleckineau said:

Anyone talking Rodgers and Darnold in the same paragraph needs to cut back on the goof balls.

Why, do you think it isn't  possible for Sam to develop into a Rogers like QB?

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1 hour ago, More Cowbell said:

Why, do you think it isn't  possible for Sam to develop into a Rogers like QB?

Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

never.

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11 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

His arm strength looked weaker his rookie year.

Matt Flynn once threw 6 TDs in a game, and so did Ryan Fitzpatrick. Geno Smith once posted a perfect QB rating. That doesn’t therefore mean their ceiling was or is Aaron Rodgers.

I totally agree that arm strength isnt key.  Otherwise Browning Nagle would have been in the HOF

But there isnt a throw that Darnold cant make and his arm is stronger than most

And again that means squat, just isnt an issue

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3 hours ago, More Cowbell said:

Sperm let me ask you a question, with the way you are responding to me which is extremely  demeaning,  do you actually expect me to engage in a back and forth with you? We went through this same BS a while back where you wouldn't  let up and I finally lost my cool. Remember that one where you banned me because you consistently  harassing  pretty much like you are doing now? 

What we are having here is not a conversation, it is king sperm saying listen peon, I am right and your opinion doesn't  matter and how dare you argue with me. So just go away already.

Lol

You: ”Well let’s agree to disagree. Also blah blah last word which is mostly untrue, to indicate the opposite of agree to disagree.”

Me: respond, enumerating to address the remaining parts of your excuse salad you complained about in your last word stuff, since you think that leaving out these insignificant things meant I’m wrong.

You: ”Responding to my post, which I made directly to you, is harassment. I’m such a victim here.”

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1 hour ago, Jet Nut said:

I totally agree that arm strength isnt key.  Otherwise Browning Nagle would have been in the HOF

But there isnt a throw that Darnold cant make and his arm is stronger than most

And again that means squat, just isnt an issue

I never said (elite) arm strength was key or a prerequisite to being good. Just that showing weaker arm strength makes someone’s upside decidedly not Aaron Rodgers who throws on a rope dead-on target, and that one sporadic, terrific game doesn’t make one’s upside Rodgers either. Hence the Flynn/Geno comment; if Geno could do that regularly he’d have been awesome. He couldn’t, so he wasn’t awesome. 

Darnold’s arm strength is more than adequate to make any throw (or whatever, 98-99% of them which is more than enough even if there are 5-10 passes per season a Rodgers could maybe make that he couldn’t; BFD). 

Just that as a rookie, when he wasn’t throwing bullets, to say he looked like Rodgers was his upside was a big stretch. Rodgers wasn’t the comp, and one game doesn’t make the upside the comp anyway because many bad QBs have had great individual outings. Consistently doing it is what makes the great ones so special.

He’s got a lot of upside. Just that he’s got a long way to go with consistent pinpoint accuracy and decision-making before entertaining any serious Rodgers-is-his-upside discussions. 

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3 hours ago, Kleckineau said:

Anyone talking Rodgers and Darnold in the same paragraph needs to cut back on the goof balls.

Exactly.

(Sam Darnold is already a two year starter @ only 22 years of age).

gettyimages-77978767-612x612.jpg.99365770f935ea7a67dc8d5fb99ca77d.jpg

Aaron Rodgers didn't start until his 4th year in the league (after being a bench warmer for 3 years behind #4 Brett Favre) @ 25 years old. 

b3abbcc2-1746-4616-9d80-4c7792c35b0e-large16x9_AP20020071788961.jpg.6a9eb78093f005e7a59d6f20391902a0.jpg

Aaron Rodgers didn't even win his 1st (and only) SB until his 6th year in the league (@ 27 years old). 

And Aaron Rodgers never won his 1st (of two) league MVP's until his 7th year in the league (28 years old). 

Aaron Rodgers is an overrated hype machine and now 36 years old with only 1 SB 🏆 (already 15-16 years later) despite $134 million contract that includes $100 million guaranteed)

Give me Sam Darnold over Aaron Rodgers any given Sunday and 2x during the future. 

Sam Darnold last year played behind the worst offensive line in all of football and had the 2nd worst NFL run game along with an awful set of WRs and still out played, out performed, outclassed and had himself a much better 2nd half of 2019 (8 games) than that of "Aaron Rodgers". 

Rodgers: 168/286 (58.7%), 1,678 passing yards, 10 offense TDs/2 INTs; QB Rating of 84.2 (6-2 Record). 

S.Darnold: 163/267 (61.0%), 1,947 passing yards, 15 offensive TDs/4 INTs; QB Rating of 93.3 (6-2 Record). 

Give me...

 

961995563_9a55f038fd47265669a665353244c9b4(1).thumb.jpg.7835f39b9c0b77f8cb191cb4ed3cd942.jpg

 

 

 

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20 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Lol

You: ”Well let’s agree to disagree. Also blah blah last word which is mostly untrue, to indicate the opposite of agree to disagree.”

Me: respond, enumerating to address the remaining parts of your excuse salad you complained about in your last word stuff, since you think that leaving out these insignificant things meant I’m wrong.

You: ”Responding to my post, which I made directly to you, is harassment. I’m such a victim here.”

Thanks for proving my point. I'm reporting this post to Maxman as harrassment.  

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1 hour ago, More Cowbell said:

Very insightful analysis. 

You asked a simple question. I gave a simple answer. If diatribe is what you wanted stick with DWC

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23 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

He’s got a lot of upside. Just that he’s got a long way to go with consistent pinpoint accuracy and decision-making before entertaining any serious Rodgers-is-his-upside discussions. 

What are you talking about?

How good did the bench warmer look during his rookie and 2nd season while riding the... Bench?

b3abbcc2-1746-4616-9d80-4c7792c35b0e-large16x9_AP20020071788961.jpg.c5c670dc7717919372d2794934891e59.jpg

Rodgers: 168/286 (58.7%), 1,678 passing yards, 10 offense TDs/2 INTs; QB Rating of 84.2 (6-2 Record). 

S.Darnold: 163/267 (61.0%), 1,947 passing yards, 15 offensive TDs/4 INTs; QB Rating of 93.3 (6-2 Record). 

Sam Darnold last year played behind the worst offensive line in all of football, had the 2nd worst NFL run game along with an awful set of WRs...and still out played, out performed, outclassed and had himself a much better 2nd half of 2019 (8 games) than that of "Aaron Rodgers". 

And until Aaron Rodgers can win more than only 1 SB he'll never be allowed to be compared and mentioned alongside the likes of multiple SB winning and All-Time great QBs such as...

Tom Brady, Joe Montana, Terry Bradshaw, Bart Starr, John Elway, Troy Aikman, Peyton Manning, Ben Roethlisberger, Eli Manning etc. 

I don't even want my QB in Sam to be compared to "Aaron Rodgers" I want my kid QB compared to those guys. 

Rodgers is closer to a Jim Kelly/Dan Marino/Donovan McNabb category than he is, those guys. 

And you may feel talking Darnold to Rodgers upside is unrealistic however Sam Darnold just kicked Rodgers ass during the 2nd half of only his 2nd season (very comparable). 

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12 minutes ago, Kleckineau said:

You asked a simple question. I gave a simple answer. If diatribe is what you wanted stick with DWC

I asked you why do you not think Sam can not develop into a QB like Rogers and your reason was Nooooooo never. 

 

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4 minutes ago, Defense Wins Championships said:

What are you talking about?

How good did the bench warmer look during his rookie and 2nd season while riding the... Bench?

b3abbcc2-1746-4616-9d80-4c7792c35b0e-large16x9_AP20020071788961.jpg.c5c670dc7717919372d2794934891e59.jpg

Rodgers: 168/286 (58.7%), 1,678 passing yards, 10 offense TDs/2 INTs; QB Rating of 84.2 (6-2 Record). 

S.Darnold: 163/267 (61.0%), 1,947 passing yards, 15 offensive TDs/4 INTs; QB Rating of 93.3 (6-2 Record). 

Sam Darnold last year played behind the worst offensive line in all of football, had the 2nd worst NFL run game along with an awful set of WRs...and still out played, out performed, outclassed and had himself a much better 2nd half of 2019 (8 games) than that of "Aaron Rodgers". 

And until Aaron Rodgers can win more than only 1 SB he'll never be allowed to be compared and mentioned alongside the likes of multiple SB winning and All-Time great QBs such as...

Tom Brady, Joe Montana, Terry Bradshaw, Bart Starr, John Elway, Troy Aikman, Peyton Manning, Ben Roethlisberger, Eli Manning etc. 

I don't even want my QB in Sam to be compared to "Aaron Rodgers" I want my kid QB compared to those guys. 

Rodgers is closer to a Jim Kelly/Dan Marino/Donovan McNabb category than he is, those guys. 

 

Lol Eli Manning over Aaron Rodgers

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29 minutes ago, kdels62 said:

Lol Eli Manning over Aaron Rodgers

I was being sarcastic in order to point out that Rodgers has been in this league now for 15-16 years and at 36 years old only has one SB win (while holding his Packers Franchise hostage with unheard before like contract(s) at the same time). 

If we're not allowed to mention Darnold's ceiling and potential in comparison to a 3 year bench warmer in Rodgers well then Rodgers isn't allowed to be mentioned within the same breath as multiple SB winners...

Goes both ways (comparisons). 

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4 hours ago, More Cowbell said:

Why, do you think it isn't  possible for Sam to develop into a Rogers like QB?

       ^^You see the little comma you added after the word "Why". Take away the comma and its a very different question. The comma is what makes my response Nooooooooooooo never cogent.

 

1 hour ago, More Cowbell said:

I asked you why do you not think Sam can not develop into a QB like Rogers and your reason was Nooooooo never. 

 

 

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34 minutes ago, Defense Wins Championships said:

I was being sarcastic in order to point out that Rodgers has been in this league now for 15-16 years and at 36 years old only has one SB win (while holding his Packers Franchise hostage with unheard before like contract(s) at the same time). 

If we're not allowed to mention Darnold's ceiling and potential in comparison to a 3 year bench warmer in Rodgers well then Rodgers isn't allowed to be mentioned within the same breath as multiple SB winners...

Goes both ways (comparisons). 

Isn't there an old picture of you in full dolphins gear, along with apropos chin strap?

Could've swore it floated around in the old JI days

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On 4/21/2020 at 11:32 AM, Sperm Edwards said:

I never said (elite) arm strength was key or a prerequisite to being good. Just that showing weaker arm strength makes someone’s upside decidedly not Aaron Rodgers who throws on a rope dead-on target, and that one sporadic, terrific game doesn’t make one’s upside Rodgers either. Hence the Flynn/Geno comment; if Geno could do that regularly he’d have been awesome. He couldn’t, so he wasn’t awesome. 

Darnold’s arm strength is more than adequate to make any throw (or whatever, 98-99% of them which is more than enough even if there are 5-10 passes per season a Rodgers could maybe make that he couldn’t; BFD). 

Just that as a rookie, when he wasn’t throwing bullets, to say he looked like Rodgers was his upside was a big stretch. Rodgers wasn’t the comp, and one game doesn’t make the upside the comp anyway because many bad QBs have had great individual outings. Consistently doing it is what makes the great ones so special.

He’s got a lot of upside. Just that he’s got a long way to go with consistent pinpoint accuracy and decision-making before entertaining any serious Rodgers-is-his-upside discussions. 

I have to say this.  If you believe that Darnold doesnt have a strong arm, his arm strength wasn't listed as a strength on every single scouting profile then I have no idea what you've read on the guy or what games you watched.

And you keep going back to Rodgers throws are on a rope and Darnold aren't therefore they're different QBs and never will be the same.  But then say that arm strength isnt a prerequisite to being good.

Ultimately we agree that you dont need a cannon arm.  Weaker armed QBs like Brees, Ryan, Brady, Montana can obviously do quite well

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37 minutes ago, Kleckineau said:

       ^^You see the little comma you added after the word "Why". Take away the comma and its a very different question. The comma is what makes my response Nooooooooooooo never cogent.

 

 

Pardon the typo, it's next to the space bar in my phone. So why do you think it 

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1 hour ago, More Cowbell said:

Pardon the typo, it's next to the space bar in my phone. So why do you think it 

First off Aaron Rodgers is absolutely one of the most talented guys to play the position. He belongs in the conversation with guys like Brady, Montana, Marino, Manning etc.

Darnold? Does anyone think he has that talent??

Darnold doesnt and very few other QBs  have the potential to be Rodgers 2.0

Rodgers arm talent is off the charts and was from his 1st season up to right now.

Darnold has a good arm but comparing him to Rodgers is like comparing Bobby Murcer to Babe Ruth.

Rodgers can move. Really move. He can succeed with a meh Oline. He has innate instincts you cant teach. Plus he is dangerous if flushed from the pocket, can turn a broken play into a nice gain. 

Darnold? nah. Never gonna be that guy. He does some very dumb things when the protection breaks.

I liked Darnold coming to the Jets and still feel he can be the guy but he will never be an Aaron Rodgers.

Rodgers is so freakin talented I honestly believe if he played for BB in New England for 20 years like TB and signed for less on contract years like Brady did they would have 10 Lombardi trophies. 

Rodgers only has one ring so far because he sucks up all the capital in Green Bay with his contracts  which causes weak spots in the roster as opposed to Brady who (cough cough) took less so the team could keep a balanced roster.

 

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19 minutes ago, Kleckineau said:

First off Aaron Rodgers is absolutely one of the most talented guys to play the position. He belongs in the conversation with guys like Brady, Montana, Marino, Manning etc.

Darnold? Does anyone think he has that talent??

Darnold doesnt and very few other QBs  have the potential to be Rodgers 2.0

Rodgers arm talent is off the charts and was from his 1st season up to right now.

Darnold has a good arm but comparing him to Rodgers is like comparing Bobby Murcer to Babe Ruth.

Rodgers can move. Really move. He can succeed with a meh Oline. He has innate instincts you cant teach. Plus he is dangerous if flushed from the pocket, can turn a broken play into a nice gain. 

Darnold? nah. Never gonna be that guy. He does some very dumb things when the protection breaks.

I liked Darnold coming to the Jets and still feel he can be the guy but he will never be an Aaron Rodgers.

Rodgers is so freakin talented I honestly believe if he played for BB in New England for 20 years like TB and signed for less on contract years like Brady did they would have 10 Lombardi trophies. 

Rodgers only has one ring so far because he sucks up all the capital in Green Bay with his contracts  which causes weak spots in the roster as opposed to Brady who (cough cough) took less so the team could keep a balanced roster.

 

Ok, thanks for your thoughts. 

My feeling is Sam can attain what Rogers has because at the same points in their careers, Rogers was sitting on the bench watching Farve while Sam is playing not behind a meh line as you said Rogers would still excel behind, he was playing behind one that was horrible, possibly the worst I have ever had to see. I also believe Sam can be as accurate  because I have seen him make enough pinpoint throws to know he can do it. Also Rogers first 3 years as a starter he threw a combined 31 picks so this accuracy was developed as he got more experience. This is not to say he does not have incredible  accuracy,  his last 2 seasons are perhaps the best of his career. As far as pocket presence,  Rogers does seem to have eyes in the back of his head and he is so smooth in the pocket. This is another thing I saw in Sam in year 1 before his OL was basically did not block anyone. He isn't  at Rogers level but he has a sense of where the rush is coming from. 

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11 hours ago, Kleckineau said:

You asked a simple question. I gave a simple answer. If diatribe is what you wanted stick with DWC

Harrassment!

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9 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

I have to say this.  If you believe that Darnold doesnt have a strong arm, his arm strength wasn't listed as a strength on every single scouting profile then I have no idea what you've read on the guy or what games you watched.

And you keep going back to Rodgers throws are on a rope and Darnold aren't therefore they're different QBs.  But arm strength isnt a prerequisite to being good.

Ultimately we agree that you dont need a cannon arm.  Weaker armed QBs like Brees, Ryan, Brady, Montana can obviously do quite well

No, he does have a strong arm. But it didn’t look so strong his rookie year. It didn’t look like Pennington II, but frankly it didn’t even look as strong as that shrimpy dickhead in Cleveland in their first head-to-head (or plenty as the season went on). It looked noticeably stronger a year later. 

I never said arm strength is a prerequisite for being good, so I don’t know why you keep harping on that. I’m saying that is a measurement when comparing to a hard thrower, and particularly the guy who’s arguably the most accurate fastballer there’s ever been. That’s not Darnold’s upside comp, beyond the theoretical notion that anyone who can throw hard has the upside of Aaron Rodgers.

Watson would be another example of someone who may have that elite upside in terms of numbers, but he won’t ever be Rodgers II. It’s hardly an insult to other young QBs to acknowledge that Rodgers is just a different animal. 

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