Ashtyn Davis vs Jamal Adams

[PepPep]

3 hours ago, AFJF said:

So when the Davis pick was made, I read comments from Davis himself and from analysts saying he was best suited and most comfortable as a deep safety, leading me to believe he was Marcus Maye's eventual replacement.

After watching him in action, while he may say he's most comfortable playing deep, he's certianly capable of being a difference maker in a variety of roles much like Jamal is.

Adams is certainly the bigger hitter while in the box, but Davis is plenty capable of playing inside while offering what looks to be far superior coverage against the pass.  Keep in mind, Davis had 7 incterceptions in his final 36 games college games.  Adams has 7 interceptions in his last 82 games between college and pro.

At first I thought the "Davis is Adams' replacement" talk was silly conspiracy stuff.

Looking at how versatile he is while possibly being an upgrade in coverage, I'm not so sure anymore.

 

Thoughts?

I don't see it. Just because he too is versatile doesn't make him a possible replacement. I think he is versatile in a different way. Not nearly as good of a tackler as Adams. Doesn't have the same in box run defense instincts that Adams have. He can't rush the passer like Adams. However, he's a faster player. He MAY be better in coverage. He MAY play better on the back end. 

So, yeah, versatile in different ways. Certainly not a potential replacement.   

This is just JD drafting for the future with GW telling him this is a great talent he can use right away in 3 safety sets. I hate that we passed on Baun but I love Davis as a player. 

[Lith]

3 hours ago, AFJF said:

Thoughts?

I think you are overthinking this one.  His strength is playing deep, which would make him a good complement to Adams, but both guys offer the kind of versatility that Williams seems to like.

I am thinking ryour first instinct is correct.

[Dcat]

5 minutes ago, THE BARON said:

I don't think so.  I don't think this selection was made with getting rid of Maye or Adams in mind.  I think JD saw a lot of value in the player at that draft position.  It is a huge upgrade for depth at that position and it affords them another DB to use in nickel coverage.  For sure, he is not a replacement for Adams.  Adams is a SS that is close to being a small fast LB.  That is the way GW has been smartly using him.  Davis is a pure FS.  A pass coverage guy more like Kerry Rhodes.  Time will tell if Davis will be a better player at the FS position over Maye, but I don't think there were any plans  to can either Maye or Adams... The plan was general improvement dictated by ultimate value 

I would think they are frustrated with Maye.  Well they have him for 2020, Davis' rookie season, which is smart.  If Maye plays lights out, then the Jets have a pleasant surprise they could resign or if he bolts as a FA perhaps pick up a comp pick. 

[THE BARON]

5 minutes ago, Dcat said:

I would think they are frustrated with Maye.  Well they have him for 2020, Davis' rookie season, which is smart.  If Maye plays lights out, then the Jets have a pleasant surprise they could resign or if he bolts as a FA perhaps pick up a comp pick. 

It will be interesting to see how Maye responds... I remember he looked better than Adams a lot of the time during their respective rookie seasons.  Then Maye got injured and fell off as Adams vaulted to elite status... I hope Maye can pick it up this season...

[Larz]

How can you be far superior in coverage compared to a guy with elite grades? 

[Wonderboy]

17 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Just from an essentially pragmatic point of view, you’d have to think if Gase and Douglas had to pick two of the three safeties between Davis, Maye, and Adams to move forward with, they’re going to pick the two guys who are quiet, team-first worker bees (who will cost them relative pennies over the next three years) and let the one guy go who openly tried to humiliate them from the floor of the locker room at midseason, who also wants to break the bank. Adams might be the better singular talent, but it’s a Terrell Owens situation where his production probably isn’t worth dealing with the personality. If Jamal Adams was so easily triggered and so insecure that he’d be that disruptive over a phone call from the Cowboys, imagine what he’s like behind the scenes on a daily basis.

Terrell just tweeted:

“TomShane who? Who TomShane? He compared my product to that cheerleading wannabe Adams. You be bugging TomShane. Don’t go there son. I love me some me. Adams love me some me is just impostering. I’m the original love me some me. And don’t you forget it”. 

[Wonderboy]

2 hours ago, Dcat said:

I really like what I have watched on him.  Kid is going to be special. I am starting to gradually accept the fact that the Jets will be known as the "safety" team.  Just change the team song to The Safety Dance.  All set.  

Davis and Maye. Nice duo.

[Wonderboy]

31 minutes ago, Dcat said:

I would think they are frustrated with Maye.  Well they have him for 2020, Davis' rookie season, which is smart.  If Maye plays lights out, then the Jets have a pleasant surprise they could resign or if he bolts as a FA perhaps pick up a comp pick. 

Or overhaul the backend of the secondary altogether. Paying 20M for two safeties ain’t happening.  I could see JD going the cheap route and letting Maye walk and replacing him with Davis and trading Adams and replacing him with a cheaper option. 20M versus 5M. Duh. 

[jetstream23]

4 hours ago, AFJF said:

So when the Davis pick was made, I read comments from Davis himself and from analysts saying he was best suited and most comfortable as a deep safety, leading me to believe he was Marcus Maye's eventual replacement.

After watching him in action, while he may say he's most comfortable playing deep, he's certianly capable of being a difference maker in a variety of roles much like Jamal is.

Thoughts?

[jetstream23]

And a 9,865 word reply coming from @Defense Wins Championships in 3......2......

[Larz]

It’s quite possible that JD more or less told Gase and Williams “2 for you and 2 for you” to start with and they had a wish list. 
 

works for me 

[#27TheDominator]

1 hour ago, Larz said:

How can you be far superior in coverage compared to a guy with elite grades? 

Hmm, let's think about this carefully.

[#27TheDominator]

1 hour ago, jetstream23 said:

And a 9,865 word reply coming from @Defense Wins Championships in 3......2......

July!

[Lil O]

4 hours ago, TnT said:

Davis will sub at both safety spots, play additional safety sets, get snaps at nickel corner, possibly outside corner, gunner/kick & punt return coverage, maybe even a little return action.....

good value.
Let’s see where he excels and not get ahead of ourselves.

I agree.  This kid is far too athletic to just play safety.   I think he’s actually going to end up being a CB/hybrid, and Greg Williams will move him around Ala the honey badger.  I believe he is the fastest DB we have.  

[Lil O]

5 hours ago, Greenseed4 said:

Thoughts: I think the idea is to have interchangeable safeties who can play box or roamer. What Adams lacks in athleticism he makes up for with pre-snap and instincts; what Davis lacks in pre-snap and instincts he makes up for with elite athleticism.  We can have TWO presidents and completely baffle opposing QBs. 

I hear what you’re saying but I think this is more about experience than talent/smarts.  Jamal has played longer and therefore has seen more defenses and therefore has better instincts. I say this because I watched a video of Davis watching tape with a teammate. The next game Davis intercepted the ball and took it all the way back for a pick six. His teammate ran down the field with him blocking laughing the entire time because Davis told him that this was gonna happen when they looked at the tape. Davis  watched the tape, dissected the play, And then Davis produced on the field. That might be slightly different than instincts, but again I think the instincts come from being smart watching tape, and competing against many defenses. Seems like this kid has already got that going.  In time I think his “instincts “ will be incredible!

[#27TheDominator]

16 minutes ago, Lil O said:

I agree.  This kid is far too athletic to just play safety.   I think he’s actually going to end up being a CB/hybrid, and Greg Williams will move him around Ala the honey badger.  I believe he is the fastest DB we have.  

Nah.

 

[Lil O]

5 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

Nah.

 

Holy JaMoly!

[Lil O]

7 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

Nah.

 

He won the 100 meters in both Texas and Cali...Gase wasn’t screwing around when he talked about acquiring some speed.

[#27TheDominator]

6 minutes ago, Lil O said:

He won the 100 meters in both Texas and Cali...Gase wasn’t screwing around when he talked about acquiring some speed.

He is undersized and faces an uphill battle to make the team, but he is a nice UDFA and has a chance IMO - primarily a nickel prospect.

[Larz]

2 hours ago, #27TheDominator said:

Hmm, let's think about this carefully.

Adams is fantastic in coverage. It’s absurd to suggest some rookie is far superior based on 3 highlights from college. 
 

 

[choon328]

8 hours ago, AFJF said:

So when the Davis pick was made, I read comments from Davis himself and from analysts saying he was best suited and most comfortable as a deep safety, leading me to believe he was Marcus Maye's eventual replacement.

After watching him in action, while he may say he's most comfortable playing deep, he's certianly capable of being a difference maker in a variety of roles much like Jamal is.

Adams is certainly the bigger hitter while in the box, but Davis is plenty capable of playing inside while offering what looks to be far superior coverage against the pass.  Keep in mind, Davis had 7 incterceptions in his final 36 games college games.  Adams has 7 interceptions in his last 82 games between college and pro.

At first I thought the "Davis is Adams' replacement" talk was silly conspiracy stuff.

Looking at how versatile he is while possibly being an upgrade in coverage, I'm not so sure anymore.

 

Thoughts?

I don't think Davis tackles very well. I think he's a true deep safety that can cover all over the field.  He's not an in the box safety at all. 

[bitonti]

Adams is an SS

Maye is an SS

someone in the zoom call said it 

they didn't have a single high free safety on the roster before Davis was drafted

this Davis VS Adams stuff is ridiculous

Marcus Maye is 27 and stinks 

[More Cowbell]

7 hours ago, Alka said:

I was just going to post the same thing until I read your post.  Couldn't have said it better myself.

I think this just shows people will post that absolutely most absurd  reasons to dump Adams

[TnT]

5 hours ago, Lil O said:

He won the 100 meters in both Texas and Cali...Gase wasn’t screwing around when he talked about acquiring some speed.

 

5 hours ago, #27TheDominator said:

He is undersized and faces an uphill battle to make the team, but he is a nice UDFA and has a chance IMO - primarily a nickel prospect.

That 40 time is for real...

more impressive is the 21 reps of 225.

Hope we can stash him on the ps.

[Snook]

10 hours ago, Dcat said:

I really like what I have watched on him.  Kid is going to be special. I am starting to gradually accept the fact that the Jets will be known as the "safety" team.  Just change the team song to The Safety Dance.  All set.  

Thank you. Now I have to concentrate about Electric Avenue to get the song out of my head for the next five hours.

[Jetsfan80]

5 hours ago, Larz said:

Adams is fantastic in coverage. It’s absurd to suggest some rookie is far superior based on 3 highlights from college. 
 

 

He's so fantastic in coverage that Gregg Williams took him out of traditional 2-deep and M2M coverage and used him primarily as a pass rusher and ILB.  

[32EBoozer]

13 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

I doubt he was drafted to replace anyone.  He’s just a very good player that was likely at top of their board.

My guess is you’ll see the three of them on the field together often.  Listening to Douglas yesterday on WFAN - if definitely sounds like they intend to use Davis in  a lot of different ways.

Over-the-top coverage help for Bills receiving group of John Brown and Stephon Diggs..... absolute burners! GW and JD realizing the chess game in the AFC east. Bills now the team to beat for title. Time to match speed with speed.

Mims added and OL beefed up to score points against 2 stingy defenses in a Pats & Bills. Need to protect Sam and get the running game going.

JD spent the last season evaluating and devising his counter moves to the teams in his division getting better 

[Philc1]

11 hours ago, Larz said:

How can you be far superior in coverage compared to a guy with elite grades? 

Depends on who is doing the grading

[Philc1]

2 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

He's so fantastic in coverage that Gregg Williams took him out of traditional 2-deep and M2M coverage and used him primarily as a pass rusher and ILB.  

Adams’ is essentially just a better Landon Collins

[bealeb319]

No, I think they should re-sign Jamal.
Thing is, does this move suggest theyre preparing not to?
 

I don't think this move has anything to do with Jamal. I would not be surprised to see Davis playing a cornerback role next year.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using JetNation.com mobile app

[Wonderboy]

11 hours ago, #27TheDominator said:

Nah.

 

Were the cops chasing him?  Dang

[Scoop24]

Another pointless Jamal Adams thread . 

[Dcat]

13 hours ago, bitonti said:

Adams is an SS

Maye is an SS

someone in the zoom call said it 

they didn't have a single high free safety on the roster before Davis was drafted

this Davis VS Adams stuff is ridiculous

Marcus Maye is 27 and stinks 

Who was the guy in the Zoom who has worked with pros? (I think he joined later in the meeting.)   That's who clarified the Davis pick for us.  I learned more from him in a few minutes than watching the entire draft.  Does he post here??

[bitonti]

On 5/2/2020 at 6:22 AM, Dcat said:

Who was the guy in the Zoom who has worked with pros? (I think he joined later in the meeting.)   That's who clarified the Davis pick for us.  I learned more from him in a few minutes than watching the entire draft.  Does he post here??

i'm not sure - he had an inscrutable username and his mic went in and out. 

but he also called the CB Bryce Hall pick dead nuts accurate - 2 rounds before it happened 

he had an advanced understanding of Gase's offense and what sort of WR fit that offense 

to paraphrase this dude (I believe he was a WR coach of some-kind):

Gregg Williams' Defense is not like Bowles Man2Man it's actually a Cover 2 with CBs ballhawking in space, Jamal/SS brought low and a single high FS 18-20 yards behind the LOS. That dude stands flat footed at the snap and has to cover a 100 acres of ground back there 

prior to the Davis pick THE JETS DID NOT HAVE THIS PLAYER

not a single guy on the roster who could run that FS spot. No, not one. 

this is why when Gregg Williams finally got a pick in the 3rd round for defense, it was his more dire need. Maybe even worse than Edge rusher. 

those who remember 2019 defense at certain points Darryl Roberts was back there, it's a position requiring CB speed and deep FS football IQ. 

 

TL;DR Ashtyn Davis pick could transform the Jets' defense in coverage. 

 

[flgreen]

Cal head coach Justin Wilcox praises Jets draft pick Ashytn Davis: 'a lot of room to grow'

Kristian Dyer

4 hours ago

Ashtyn Davis is a special athlete and the New York Jets are getting a raw player who is still an unfinished product. To hear Justin Wilcox, Davis’ head coach at Cal, the Jets are getting a player who is just beginning to scratch the surface on his potential.

A former walk-on at Cal, the safety was a three-year starter who had 171 career tackles, 19 passes defended and seven interceptions. A track star who was an All-American in the hurdles at Cal, he also was a huge asset on special teams. Davis was a bit of a surprise selection to NFL Draft insiders and most Jets fans, who didn’t see safety as a pressing need on the team.

But Davis is such a special athlete with upside, according to Wilcox, and that makes his development the past few years unique. The Jets defense is a great fit for Davis, according to his former head coach in college.

“I still think you know one of the best things he does is play the middle of the field overlap and people play a lot of post-defense and half-field defense where they got, you know, vision on the quarterback in the middle of the field to break and make a play on the ball,” Wilcox said Friday night on a conference call. 

“And, you know, I just think that's something that he does exceptionally well and will continue to get better at but we still got a lot of room to grow. He's not a finished product. And that’s where it will be fun to watch and see how it develops and that best position and see what he becomes.”

Davis projects at either safety position. In addition, he is versatile and athletic enough to play cornerback.

In some ways, he is like a high school recruit who was so talented that he played quarterback but is such a good athlete that he’s being recruited at four or five spots on the field.

His best position, Wilcox said, is open to debate.

“I don't know the answer to that, I agree that Ashtyn is young as a player, he’s played for safety for three years,” Wilcox said.

“And just the training prior was – he’s just an athlete you know he’s a kid who grew up in Santa Cruz, riding dirt bikes and cliff jumping, you know, he is that guy. He’s a high hurdler and has gotten really good, really fast in running the hurdles and it'll be fun to watch. But I agree that he's still very much a work in progress and that's a good thing - that's a compliment because he's done a lot so far.”