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What if Corona hits a team hard?


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7 minutes ago, Rangers9 said:

I don’t see how anyone can be pro herd immunity. Plus there’s no clinical proof that if you get the virus you’re exempt from ever getting it again. They don’t completely understand antibodies yet. Also there is no proof that any therapeutics are going to work. There is one that they think in certain cases can help patients esp in terms of recovery. But not to save lives of people in critical circumstances. I’m kind of concerned about this “warp speed” initiative for remedies. Already we’re seeing that drugs and tests that have some kind of limited FDA approval are ineffective. 

But what is the solution?  Quarantine for 12 months in the hopes we find a vaccine?  We've got 34 million people asking for unemployment from a system that doesn't have the money.  And before you say "lives are more important than money", try explaining that to the totally healthy 48 year old father of 3 who suddenly has no job, no house, etc.  Or the 65 year old who never got sick, but can't get the job back that he lost (as it's common knowledge that the older you are, the harder it is to find work once you lose it).

I realize there's no perfect answer, but I cannot accept that the "best" one is to make hundreds of millions suffer so that hundred of thousands don't die for a few months.

But I'm open to hearing alternatives I haven't considered . . .

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5 hours ago, kevinc855 said:

Thank god guys like you who think it’s ok to kill thousands of people so you can go to Taco Bell aren’t the majority of people 

As opposed to people like you who are totally fine with TENS OF MILLIONS of people potentially losing jobs, homes, businesses, etc. just so you can continue to live in Mr. Roger's neighborhood . . .

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6 hours ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

There is actually good reason to believe that by August there will be more effective treatments available than there were back in March. Back in March we were just using random, unverified treatments on the hopes that they would work. By August we will have more data on all these treatments to know which are more effective. 

Also if hospitals aren't flooded, doctors will have more time with each patient to handle their specific needs which should, in theory, help their chances of survival. 

I firmly believe the shutdown was needed to prevent mass deaths and i also firmly believe that the time has come to slowly reopen with the understanding that doing so comes with an increase in deaths. It really sucks, but the cost of shutting down could be far worse in the long term. 

As for sports, I am pretty confident these players will get tested repeatedly and once they test positive will get the benefit of the best treatments at the earliest stages and therefore should be fine relative to their chances of survival if they didn't play and caught  the virus at home while dining at a restaurant, going to the gym, a strip club etc... 

Hey I hope you're right.  But this virus leads to things like pneumonia, which hundreds of thousands die from every year in this country alone despite our best efforts . . .

Edit:  50,000 die, while 1,000,000 seek hospital care

https://www.thoracic.org/patients/patient-resources/resources/top-pneumonia-facts.pdf

Edited by OCCH23
incorrect statistic
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15 minutes ago, OCCH23 said:

But what is the solution?  Quarantine for 12 months in the hopes we find a vaccine?  We've got 34 million people asking for unemployment from a system that doesn't have the money.  And before you say "lives are more important than money", try explaining that to the totally healthy 48 year old father of 3 who suddenly has no job, no house, etc.  Or the 65 year old who never got sick, but can't get the job back that he lost (as it's common knowledge that the older you are, the harder it is to find work once you lose it).

I realize there's no perfect answer, but I cannot accept that the "best" one is to make hundreds of millions suffer so that hundred of thousands don't die for a few months.

But I'm open to hearing alternatives I haven't considered . . .

IMO you have to wait for the testing. And tracing capability. Why we are not there yet you’ll have to ask the administration. But it’s crazy to have these massive outbreaks in places like meat packing plants and try to sweep it under the rug. Because if a thousand people who work there are infected they can spread it to thousands more. They did cell phone tracing of people at one meat packing plant who were infected and they found that people who came in contact with them (it was in the Midwest) were traced as far away as Cali and Florida. So as imperfect a tool as testing and tracing are it’s the only real tool we have until a vaccine or proven therapeutics. They’ve done this effectively to beat spread in China, Korea etc. And Germany has had much success. Just study and try to duplicate what has worked even if it means a slowdown in reopening. It’s only been 2 months. If you do a thorough and a smart job you will have an effective reopening and fewer deaths. 

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Look the virus spreads. Even in the WH. And I’m hearing politicians and even the Chief Justice of the Wisconsin Supreme Court try to blame it on workers. Saying they were the ones who brought it into their work places so it’s their fault not the employer. Well then test them before they come into the work place. Don’t just let them work there so they can spread it more. And what if work conditions are not conducive to social distancing. OSHA is not enforcing rules they are only offering recommendations. The companies are given the authority. You need a firm policy if you want to have safe work places. And blaming the employees is garbage and an excuse. 

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16 minutes ago, OCCH23 said:

Hey I hope you're right.  But this virus leads to things like pneumonia, which hundreds of thousands die from every year in this country alone despite our best efforts . . .

In the 2017-18 season 61.000 died from the Flu and that's with a vaccine. A interesting fact came out this week if a hospital claims a death was due to the virus they get a extra 1200 dollars from Medicare on people that have Medicare..

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3 hours ago, Rangers9 said:

Look the virus spreads. Even in the WH. And I’m hearing politicians and even the Chief Justice of the Wisconsin Supreme Court try to blame it on workers. Saying they were the ones who brought it into their work places so it’s their fault not the employer. Well then test them before they come into the work place. Don’t just let them work there so they can spread it more. And what if work conditions are not conducive to social distancing. OSHA is not enforcing rules they are only offering recommendations. The companies are given the authority. You need a firm policy if you want to have safe work places. And blaming the employees is garbage and an excuse. 

People are out and about though. Places are busy. The Mohansic driving range off the Taconic according to my old man was packed. Florida is opening. Everyone I talk to is over this. The internet takes are seemingly not real life(stay home indefinitely), which seems in line with everything that has happened over the last 4 years.

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1 minute ago, OCCH23 said:

He can't -- they totally shoot down the narrative . . .

The rate, specifically outside of the tristate, is miniscule. And if you're living in that area if youre healthy you'll be fine if you quarantine and take care of yourself.. The fear mongering is beyond bizarre.

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24 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

What's the mortality rate? Use real numbers, king.

Roughly 1 out of every 600 NYC resident has died of COVID-19 (assuming 8.5m residents and 14k deaths). That could be infinitely worse. Further, Any number you quote, won’t count the indirect losses of life because of the lack of resources. Or do you think heart attacks, aortic dissections, strokes, ruptured intestines etc. just stopped happening? And before you ask for real numbers, every system is actively looking at it. But it’s bad.
 

No matter what nonsense you quote, the flu has never, in my medical career, had the capacity to overwhelm a hospital system to the point of sacrificing care for others. Everybody wants to get back to normal, myself included.  It acting like this is a hot take / fake news, makes you look ignorant and just as bad the jackals protesting. 

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1 minute ago, BroadwayJoe12 said:

Roughly 1 out of every 600 NYC resident has died of COVID-19 (assuming 8.5m residents and 14k deaths). That could be infinitely worse. Further, Any number you quote, won’t count the indirect losses of life because of the lack of resources. Or do you think heart attacks, aortic dissections, strokes, ruptured intestines etc. just stopped happening? And before you ask for real numbers, every system is actively looking at it. But it’s bad.
 

No matter what nonsense you quote, the flu has never, in my medical career, had the capacity to overwhelm a hospital system to the point of sacrificing care for others. Everybody wants to get back to normal, myself included.  It acting like this is a hot take / fake news, makes you look ignorant and just as bad the jackals protesting. 

Yeah, but everyone he talks to is over this

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2 minutes ago, BroadwayJoe12 said:

Roughly 1 out of every 600 NYC resident has died of COVID-19 (assuming 8.5m residents and 14k deaths). That could be infinitely worse. Further, Any number you quote, won’t count the indirect losses of life because of the lack of resources. Or do you think heart attacks, aortic dissections, strokes, ruptured intestines etc. just stopped happening? And before you ask for real numbers, every system is actively looking at it. But it’s bad.
 

No matter what nonsense you quote, the flu has never, in my medical career, had the capacity to overwhelm a hospital system to the point of sacrificing care for others. Everybody wants to get back to normal, myself included.  It acting like this is a hot take / fake news, makes you look ignorant and just as bad the jackals protesting. 

Whats the mortality rate? Numbers plz

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5 hours ago, OCCH23 said:

Hey I hope you're right.  But this virus leads to things like pneumonia, which hundreds of thousands die from every year in this country alone despite our best efforts . . .

Hundreds of thousands of people die each year from Pneumonia in the U.S.?  You sure about that?

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3 minutes ago, HawkeyeJet said:

Hundreds of thousands of people die each year from Pneumonia each year in the U.S.?  You sure about that?

In the US, about 50,000 die each year, with 1,000,000 seeking hospital care.

https://www.thoracic.org/patients/patient-resources/resources/top-pneumonia-facts.pdf

So you are right, my numbers are off, I'll go back and edit them.

But my point still stands that "answers to the virus" aren't necessarily answers for those who are already susceptible to it . . .

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5 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Post a link to this, seriously.

I’m privy to a town hall that our senior administrators have every single week with hospitals across the state, we tally our hospitals’ cases, discharged, deaths etc. every day, every week.  I can tell you as of 4.23.2020 NYC had 14,427 deaths out of 134,874 cases. I’m so terribly sorry if the numbers aren’t so readily accessible to you. 

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9 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Post a link to this, seriously.

Dude, 1 out of 600 is .17%, so that's not exactly surprising.

 

15 minutes ago, BroadwayJoe12 said:

Roughly 1 out of every 600 NYC resident has died of COVID-19 (assuming 8.5m residents and 14k deaths). That could be infinitely worse. Further, Any number you quote, won’t count the indirect losses of life because of the lack of resources. Or do you think heart attacks, aortic dissections, strokes, ruptured intestines etc. just stopped happening? And before you ask for real numbers, every system is actively looking at it. But it’s bad.
 

No matter what nonsense you quote, the flu has never, in my medical career, had the capacity to overwhelm a hospital system to the point of sacrificing care for others. Everybody wants to get back to normal, myself included.  It acting like this is a hot take / fake news, makes you look ignorant and just as bad the jackals protesting. 

It's not "fake news", it's two sides of the same coin.

Your statistic shows a mortality rate < 0.2%, leading many to think it's not the crisis the media portrays it as.  

But it's also true that even that % leads to an overwhelming/impossible task for hospitals to deal with.

If you're telling me as a medical professional that we're already at "the point of sacrificing care for others", then I'll believe you.  But we supposedly spent the past 2 months avoiding that.  We can't afford to wait for "everyone to get better" -- no matter when they open things up, people will get sick again.  NJ's governor is waiting another month -- what does he expect that to do?  It's doubtful we'll have an answer by then, but another month of revenue is down the tubes.

I'm obeying all the rules, I just don't agree/understand the logic behind them.  So if you have any insight from the medical perspective I'll gladly listen . . .  

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23 hours ago, OCCH23 said:

The only joke is that we're sitting here afraid of what happens if a team gets "hit hard" with a virus that statistically speaking has NO effect on 85% of the population, sickens most of the rest like the flu does (have to wait it out), and has a mortality rate of WAY less than 1% if you're not elderly/immune-compromised.

If the data changes, so will my mind.  But I'm amazed every day at how easy it's been to convince people this is the zombie-apocolypse we've all be waiting for, when the majority of people afraid they might get it probably already had it and didn't even know . . .

Ok and whats your point? Yes alot of these people may have had it and didnt know..but thats the problem..if they didnt know, they may have unknowingly affected a family member or individual who is more at risk of suffering from this. Im all for football but, im also all for safety.

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39 minutes ago, BroadwayJoe12 said:

Roughly 1 out of every 600 NYC resident has died of COVID-19 (assuming 8.5m residents and 14k deaths). That could be infinitely worse. Further, Any number you quote, won’t count the indirect losses of life because of the lack of resources. Or do you think heart attacks, aortic dissections, strokes, ruptured intestines etc. just stopped happening? And before you ask for real numbers, every system is actively looking at it. But it’s bad.
 

No matter what nonsense you quote, the flu has never, in my medical career, had the capacity to overwhelm a hospital system to the point of sacrificing care for others. Everybody wants to get back to normal, myself included.  It acting like this is a hot take / fake news, makes you look ignorant and just as bad the jackals protesting. 

Hospitals throughout the United States are empty. Furloughs up the wazoo. 30 million unemployed and counting. Things are thankfully improving in NY, but this one size fits all lockdown is banana land.

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On 5/8/2020 at 8:25 PM, flgreen said:

I guess if your watching CNN they are.  LOL

I actually had no idea, so I just went and looked it up.  20 deaths out of 500,000 workers.  No doubt even 1 death is 1 to many, but i don't know if I would say that's devastated.

It seems  the epic center of the whole American experience is the NJ-NYC area.  If I still lived there I would be very concerned too.  So you guys do what you've got to do, and be safe.

You can include MSNBC, ABC, NBC, CBS, etc.... If only we had serious news organizations... Oh wait there is one :-)  

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We should all be laser focused as a country on how we get the Chinese back and make them pay for the utter irresponsibility of letting this virus spread outside their country. The cover up they've perpetrated on the entire world population should not be left unpunished. The WHO should also be punished for allowing them to help China cover it up. There should be a special session at the UN to sanction and punish China for what they did and MAKE it STICK where it counts in the pocket book. Every country should pull all businesses from China. and never buy another product from them going forward once all businesses are pulled. Then immediately take away their internet lol....

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On 5/9/2020 at 12:29 AM, RJIII said:

They can get a new job, next man up. The NFL will play, on time, with fans. Enjoy it! 

<solitary man cloistered on couch drinking Piel’s chides gutless NFL players for not wanting to sweat-wrestle other NFL players during an international pandemic for his brief, solitary enjoyment>

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32 minutes ago, 68JET11 said:

We should all be laser focused as a country on how we get the Chinese back and make them pay for the utter irresponsibility of letting this virus spread outside their country. The cover up they've perpetrated on the entire world population should not be left unpunished. The WHO should also be punished for allowing them to help China cover it up. There should be a special session at the UN to sanction and punish China for what they did and MAKE it STICK where it counts in the pocket book. Every country should pull all businesses from China. and never buy another product from them going forward once all businesses are pulled. Then immediately take away their internet lol....

And the Bank of China should have to forgive all personal and business loans made to any American citizens who are totally not compromised! Especially those exceeding $210 million dollars! And coming due soon! 

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