Jets’ rash of linebacker injuries could come with huge payoff

[sec101row23]

On 5/24/2020 at 10:43 AM, Beerfish said:

Darron Lee has more career ints than Jamalmazing.

As for the ilb issue this article is late to the party.  All of that was quite evident last year.

Also the reason why you do not invest heavily salary wise or draft pick wise for ilb.

Jets currently have $26M in cap space tied up in just Mosely and Williamson this year, easily the highest paid ILB duo in the league.   The Jets roster has been built backwards for the last 5 to 7 years.  So many resources wasted on positions that don’t move the needle.  

[NYJ1]

3 hours ago, SAR I said:

You mean Gregg Williams.

SAR I

I mean ADAM GASE. In fact, this season is much more about a referendum on Adam Gase than it is anyone else. Gregg Williams doesn't have anything to prove. He's already proven he's a great defensive coordinator. Not to mention on the Jets the defense is the best unit on the team. The Jets offense sucks and it's Gase's job to get the offense going.

[SAR I]

2 minutes ago, NYJ1 said:

I mean ADAM GASE. In fact, this season is much more about a referendum on Adam Gase than it is anyone else. Gregg Williams doesn't have anything to prove. He's already proven he's a great defensive coordinator. Not to mention on the Jets the defense is the best unit on the team. The Jets offense sucks and it's Gase's job to get the offense going.

This thread is about the defense.  The Jets defense was good all year and finished very strong, very impressive for a bunch of second, third, and fourth stringers.

If you give credit to ADAM GASE for the great defensive performance last year then you are entitled to criticize ADAM GASE if the defense isn't as good this year.

If you didn't give credit to ADAM GASE for the great defensive performance last year then you are only entitled to criticize GREGG WILLIAMS if the defense isn't as good this year.

Can't have it both ways.  We aren't a bunch of drunks in a parking lot.  We know what's what.  Savvy?

SAR I

[rangerous]

On 5/24/2020 at 9:20 AM, NYJ1 said:

Well, we had Mike Macagnan as our GM. He drafted Darron Lee and actually thought it was a great move. Remember Toilet and Mac talking to the media and saying how Darron Lee was going to play inside and outside and was a central pillar for the defense moving forward? Lol

they got their man when they drafted adams.

[rangerous]

22 hours ago, SAR I said:

This thread is about the defense.  The Jets defense was good all year and finished very strong, very impressive for a bunch of second, third, and fourth stringers.

If you give credit to ADAM GASE for the great defensive performance last year then you are entitled to criticize ADAM GASE if the defense isn't as good this year.

If you didn't give credit to ADAM GASE for the great defensive performance last year then you are only entitled to criticize GREGG WILLIAMS if the defense isn't as good this year.

Can't have it both ways.  We aren't a bunch of drunks in a parking lot.  We know what's what.  Savvy?

SAR I

yep.  i'm no rabid gase fan but you just can't have it both ways.  defense stinks?  gase's fault.  offense stinks?  gase's fault.  defense good?  williams is greatest defensive coach.  offense good?  we told darnold was going to be great.  it gets kind of ridiculous.  the guy has only been hc for a season and already a lot of fans want him to move on.  meanwhile we don't hear a thing about players like gore and thomas and darnold who do have good things to say about gase.

[THE BARON]

On 5/24/2020 at 10:14 AM, Integrity28 said:

Darron Lee was a poor mans Jamal Adams. Typical Mac. Drafting to upgrade players he filled already. Just like DL. Never gonna fill holes that way.

IMHO, Darron Lee could be a key player in a specific defense. 

These days, if I had to design a base defense for the pro game or even the college game, I would run a one gap 4-2-5.  Little to no substitutions for anything but goal-line and short yardage.  In that case, the substitutions would be on the defensive line.  Drop your 5 or 9 technique DE and sub in another true DT.  Of course, your two pure backers would have to be big dudes that can hit ant tackle.  

The rest of it goes like this...

In a base 4-2-5 the guy you flex is the hybrid S/LB who can line up in coverage or with the backers on the strong side of the offense. 

Adams would make that defense work like a charm.  Darron Lee could *possibly* cut it due to range/closing speed, but he'd have to get a lot better in coverage.  He'd also have to watch highlight reels of Kyle Clifton and learn how to tackle like a boss

[Jetsfan80]

9 minutes ago, THE BARON said:

IMHO, Darron Lee could be a key player in a specific defense. 

Well he's currently unemployed, so.....

[THE BARON]

2 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Well he's currently unemployed, so.....

Indeed.  But he could have been useful under specific circumstances such as the unconventional base defense I described above. 

[THE BARON]

1 hour ago, rangerous said:

yep.  i'm no rabid gase fan but you just can't have it both ways.  defense stinks?  gase's fault.  offense stinks?  gase's fault.  defense good?  williams is greatest defensive coach.  offense good?  we told darnold was going to be great.  it gets kind of ridiculous.  the guy has only been hc for a season and already a lot of fans want him to move on.  meanwhile we don't hear a thing about players like gore and thomas and darnold who do have good things to say about gase.

The fans that want to see him go have more in mind than just the team's record.  Knowledgeable fans can see that Gase is not flexible either due to being stubborn or even worse, due to inability.   Gase appears to have the worst kind of flaw.  He is married to one specific system and wants to jam his players into it regardless of their unique talents and weaknesses.

Gase wants to run an offense and a passing game for a QB like Peyton Manning.  Such an offense is counter to what Darnold brings to the table, not even to mention what system Bell thrives in.  

Gase is a loser.  I don't need to look at the record. 

[Jetsfan80]

1 minute ago, THE BARON said:

Indeed.  But he could have been useful under specific circumstances such as the unconventional base defense I described above. 

That would be VERY unconventional.  And as we know, most DC's like to run multiple fronts out there.  

Even with expanded rosters, "specialty players" are simply not worth a roster spot if they're above excellent or at least very good at what they do.  Hence why Lee is not on a roster.

[rangerous]

8 minutes ago, THE BARON said:

The fans that want to see him go have more in mind than just the team's record.  Knowledgeable fans can see that Gase is not flexible either due to being stubborn or even worse, due to inability.   Gase appears to have the worst kind of flaw.  He is married to one specific system and wants to jam his players into it regardless of their unique talents and weaknesses.

Gase wants to run an offense and a passing game for a QB like Peyton Manning.  Such an offense is counter to what Darnold brings to the table, not even to mention what system Bell thrives in.  

Gase is a loser.  I don't need to look at the record. 

as others have said, the bellichicken couldn't have won with the group the jets put on the field the past couple of seasons.  so fans claim that gase can't win with the same group so that somehow makes him a bad coach.  we'll see as gase players start to get put into the jets system.  and, by the way, i'm not quite sure how anyone makes this conclusion based on his time with the doltfins.  the doltfins made the playoffs once and then had two bad seasons when tannehill was injured.  and to ad insult to injury they blame gase for tannehill's supposed decline during his stewardship and the fact that he was released when , in fact, tannehill was released after gase left.

the bottom line is the fans who want him gone have no idea what gase's record will be as jets coach and want him gone.  that's a pretty irrational stance to take, imo.

[THE BARON]

12 minutes ago, rangerous said:

as others have said, the bellichicken couldn't have won with the group the jets put on the field the past couple of seasons.  so fans claim that gase can't win with the same group so that somehow makes him a bad coach.  we'll see as gase players start to get put into the jets system.  and, by the way, i'm not quite sure how anyone makes this conclusion based on his time with the doltfins.  the doltfins made the playoffs once and then had two bad seasons when tannehill was injured.  and to ad insult to injury they blame gase for tannehill's supposed decline during his stewardship and the fact that he was released when , in fact, tannehill was released after gase left.

the bottom line is the fans who want him gone have no idea what gase's record will be as jets coach and want him gone.  that's a pretty irrational stance to take, imo.

if Bellchick had the group the Jets has last year, I *guarantee* you that that he would not have finished dead last in offensive production.  I also guarantee you that if BB had Darnold as a starting QB, he would not elect to run the offense that Gase is stuck on. 

I can explain these things with the finest English available, but I cant make a rock understand it...

Gase is not a good HC... 

[THE BARON]

29 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

That would be VERY unconventional.  And as we know, most DC's like to run multiple fronts out there.  

Even with expanded rosters, "specialty players" are simply not worth a roster spot if they're above excellent or at least very good at what they do.  Hence why Lee is not on a roster.

He would not be a specialty player that is only used on occasions.  In a base 4-2-5 he would be a three down player.  Same as the DE/OLB in the 34 or 46 defense.  In the 34 the OLB/DE gets flexed so you can scheme, change your front and so on.  In a 4-2-5 you don't flex the DE/OLB, you flex the S/OLB.  

Again... The flex S/OLB has to be able to do both jobs just like the 34 DE/OLB has to be able to do both jobs.  They are specifically skilled to that position, but they are not "specialty" players.  

In a pass heavy league, a 4-2-5 would be designed to put pressure on the QB by means of one gap DE's pinning their ears back and at the same time, forcing the QB to take longer to get the ball out due to loaded coverage. 

You would need the right guy to be your flex LB/S just like you need the right guy to be your flex DE/OLB in a 34.  

[Wonderboy]

On 5/24/2020 at 1:49 PM, Beerfish said:

turnovers are usually game changing plays.  If we want to extol jamal adams as an ilb then by all means.

When people throw around his pro bowl status, his best player on the team, he should be the highest paid safety in the league they forget what made the great safeties of the past great. 

His list of actual game changing plays is short.

I counted 1 in 3 years. One.