Barry McCockinner Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 Just now, EM31 said: Have you addressed the question of the potentially $25 million we would be throwing away if we gave him a new deal now? Make him the highest paid in the league by one dollar if we must and if that is what would make him fell less disrespected. I would wince but OK I would take that deal. However we would then need to get him to give back the $25 million we are losing by making him that deal today. That would be like giving him $25 million on top of making him the highest paid player which is a firing offense for any GM I don't think it makes much sense to extend him this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prez33 Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 Just noticed the Chiefs are in talks with Mahomes on a contract negotiation. He was drafted the same year as Adams. Both are studs. But only one gets validation for restructuring right now. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Barry McCockinner Posted May 28, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted May 28, 2020 4 minutes ago, Prez33 said: Just noticed the Chiefs are in talks with Mahomes on a contract negotiation. He was drafted the same year as Adams. Both are studs. But only one gets validation for restructuring right now. I mean - the guy is the best QB in the game and the reigning Superbowl MVP on a trajectory to goat. Not many guys can make the case for a new deal in year 3 - Mahomes you just back up the brinks truck and give him a wheel barrow. 4 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyLV Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 I am not a fan of giving gigantic money to Jamal but it also seems like if you can sign him to say a 4 year extension that is actually a 7 year deal you can offer him a contract the gives Jamal the guaranteed money he wants, does not place any additional burden on the Jets for the next 3 years from a cap standpoint, and also looks like he is one of the higher paid defensive players in the year. Nice signing bonus, then big roster bonus in year 6 and salaries he will never likely get in years 6 and 7. It is the Tanny philosophy but could be a viable option as well in this case. Personally I would trade or more likely just do nothing at least for this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EM31 Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 10 minutes ago, Prez33 said: Just noticed the Chiefs are in talks with Mahomes on a contract negotiation. He was drafted the same year as Adams. Both are studs. But only one gets validation for restructuring right now. lool..... noooooooooooo I don't care how highly some may think of Adams.... Really? comparing a Safety to the cornerstone QB of the Superbowl champions is/should be a bridge too far even for those folks. Mahomes is probably the most valuable asset for any team in the NFL today. With all due respoct that includes the Donald's and the Bosa's and the Thomas' of this world. 2nd isn't even in the same continent and Jamal Adams ain't even on that list anywhere. Edited to add that Adams is 37th on that list if you go by that ranking 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 13 minutes ago, Barry McCockinner said: Well that's better for sure. But you also want to keep them for the second contract. The only time you should be getting rid of all-pro type players before their second contract is if you have the problem of choosing between guys in that category or if they're a total head case causing massive distractions. When you have too many top players in their prime you have to start picking and choosing based on positional value (among other things). We do not have that problem, lol. He is on his rookie deal. I see no rush to pay him now. If a team bowls us over with an offer, I'd take it. If not, I would look to resign him. I think negotiating before the 5th year option even starts is bad business and sets a bad precedent. I think this is especially true where the next man up in that situation will be a QB that has not show he will perform as a top tier starter. I'd certainly like to push the Darnold decision down the line as far as I could and QB is a position where unrest will cause real problems. 10 minutes ago, Barry McCockinner said: I don't think it makes much sense to extend him this year. This is what I am saying. I don't want to trade him, but I am certainly willing if the deal is good. This isn't a Darron Lee take what you can get, or Jonathan Vilma bad fit. It is not even a Jeremy Shockey we need to move this loudmouth. Yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 21 minutes ago, Prez33 said: I’ve said all along, if he’s asking for salary comparable to Byard, Jackson, Mathieu and Collins, that’s not unreasonable. But if he’s asking for significantly more than that, I’m done defending him. There are limits to what you pay a safety. Well then be prepared to stop defending him. Because that's absolutely what he wants. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheNuuFaaolaExperience Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 18 minutes ago, Prez33 said: Just noticed the Chiefs are in talks with Mahomes on a contract negotiation. He was drafted the same year as Adams. Both are studs. But only one gets validation for restructuring right now. Having the best QB moves the needle. Having the best safety doesn't. Mahomes is better at being the best QB than Adams is at being the best safety. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slimjasi Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 The bottom line is that there really is no incentive to get anything done this year, barring Adams just flat out holding out. He's under contract and will be a Jet next season, unless the Jets get exactly what they want in a trade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugg Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 19 minutes ago, Prez33 said: Just noticed the Chiefs are in talks with Mahomes on a contract negotiation. He was drafted the same year as Adams. Both are studs. But only one gets validation for restructuring right now. Yes, a QB who is vital to an NFL team's success is in fact "validated". You make the point, if unintentionally, many of us have made since the day he was drafted; how picking a safety (or a DT) that high is idiocy. Only reinforces why picking Mahomes or Watson made sense, and Adams, good player he made be, was a horrible pick at a nonpremium position. Picking a safety that high means his 2nd contract was bound to be a dog's breakfast. You could replace him with minimal disruption a whole bunch cheaper.TODAY. Cannot do that with a pass rusher DL or LB(failing to take Josh Allen over Q, again, idiocy) , a primo WR, a shutdown CB or a QB. EVERY DAY Maccganan's legacy as the worst GM ever gets further cemented. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugg Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 16 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said: He is on his rookie deal. I see no rush to pay him now. If a team bowls us over with an offer, I'd take it. If not, I would look to resign him. I think negotiating before the 5th year option even starts is bad business and sets a bad precedent. I think this is especially true where the next man up in that situation will be a QB that has not show he will perform as a top tier starter. I'd certainly like to push the Darnold decision down the line as far as I could and QB is a position where unrest will cause real problems. This is what I am saying. I don't want to trade him, but I am certainly willing if the deal is good. This isn't a Darron Lee take what you can get, or Jonathan Vilma bad fit. It is not even a Jeremy Shockey we need to move this loudmouth. Yet. Adams can be under contract for 3 seasons. He can mewl and bitch all he wants. He and his agent can invent new innovative ways to play elsewhere. Nobody is writing those checks for what Douglas wants in return. Holding out under the new CBA is not an option. Know what Prez; STFU and play. My bet; he and his agent pretend "The Rams are interested". Then the Seahawks. And then the Raiders. They are not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EM31 Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 11 minutes ago, slimjasi said: The bottom line is that there really is no incentive to get anything done this year, barring Adams just flat out holding out. He's under contract and will be a Jet next season, unless the Jets get exactly what they want in a trade. If both sides are willing to give something up I see no issue talking now. No great urgency either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slimjasi Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 7 minutes ago, EM31 said: If both sides are willing to give something up I see no issue talking now. No great urgency either. Nothing wrong with talking at all. But I just don't see anything happening before this coming season. Could be wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 I don't consider the franchise tag "being under contract" but it will be an option. It should certainly be part of the financial talks with his agent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lizard King Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 1 hour ago, Barry McCockinner said: Yes - that's exactly what I'm saying. We can. It won't be an issue. BTW - Darnold hasn't earned a second contract yet. Adams has outplayed his first contract. I would imagine a lot of high first rounders outplay their contract. With that said, paying a box safety like he’s Ed Reed in his prime is insane. Especially given how we already have CJ Moseley at a belt busting deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry McCockinner Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 4 minutes ago, Lizard King said: I would imagine a lot of high first rounders outplay their contract. With that said, paying a box safety like he’s Ed Reed in his prime is insane. Especially given how we already have CJ Moseley at a belt busting deal. Mosely will be 29 next year and we can save cap space by cutting him. 29/30 is usually a good time to say good bye. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BallinPB Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 24 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said: Well then be prepared to stop defending him. Because that's absolutely what he wants. Here comes my defense. He deserves to be the highest paid safety in the league and he can just point to the fact that he was 1st team All Pro last year. Whether the Jets want to give him that money is another argument but I have no problem with him asking to paid higher than any safety in the league. It would be foolish of him not to ask for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 Just now, BallinPB said: Here comes my defense. He deserves to be the highest paid safety in the league and he can just point to the fact that he was 1st team All Pro last year. Whether the Jets want to give him that money is another argument but I have no problem with him asking to paid higher than any safety in the league. It would be foolish of him not to ask for that. He can ask for the moon if he wants. Just noting that, for those like Prez33 who have set a line in the sand for what a reasonable contract is, and will pull their support for Jamal if he exceeds that, they're going to be disappointed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 6 minutes ago, Barry McCockinner said: Mosely will be 29 next year and we can save cap space by cutting him. 29/30 is usually a good time to say good bye. Financially, it doesn't make sense to cut Mosley until 2022. Prior to June 1, 2021, we'd suffer a $12.5M dead cap hit. After June 1, 2021 (but prior to 2022) we'd save $8M but also suffer $9.5M in dead money. If we cut Mosley in 2022, we'd save $15.5-$17M and only suffer a $1-3M dead cap hit. Thanks Macc. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
14 in Green Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 1 hour ago, EM31 said: Why is this whole renegotiation idea only something that gets raised when it benefits the player? Why does the lets cut this guy and not pay him the rest of his contract idea something that gets raised when it benefits the team? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BornJetsFan1983 Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 37 minutes ago, TheNuuFaaolaExperience said: Having the best QB moves the needle. Having the best safety doesn't. Mahomes is better at being the best QB than Adams is at being the best safety. well when you put it like that well said. My updated new prediction of the future Adams will hold show up when he is supposed to, and not come when he doesnt have to. He will play for the Jets this year and the next with the same contract if a trade doesnt happne. I do not think a trade will happen at this point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
14 in Green Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 Just now, Jetsfan80 said: Financially, we can't cut Mosley until June 1, 2021 the earliest. Prior to that we'd suffer a $12.5M dead cap hit. After June 1, 2021 we'd save $8M but also suffer $9.5M in dead money. The ideal time to let Mosley go would be in 2022, when we'd save $15.5-$17M and only suffer a $1-3M dead cap hit. Thanks Macc. Why do we want to cut Mosely? Is it because he's another good player, and we hate paying them? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry McCockinner Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 3 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said: Financially, it doesn't make sense to cut Mosley until 2022. Prior to June 1, 2021, we'd suffer a $12.5M dead cap hit. After June 1, 2021 (but prior to 2022) we'd save $8M but also suffer $9.5M in dead money. If we cut Mosley in 2022, we'd save $15.5-$17M and only suffer a $1-3M dead cap hit. Thanks Macc. you right - I misread that chart on otc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warfish Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 36 minutes ago, Prez33 said: Just noticed the Chiefs are in talks with Mahomes on a contract negotiation. He was drafted the same year as Adams. Both are studs. But only one gets validation for restructuring right now. Because only one is a QB superstar who changes everything and just won a Super Bowl One is a Strong Safety dressed up as an average EDGE rusher who has yet to have a .500 season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
14 in Green Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 Just now, BornJetsFan1983 said: well when you put it like that well said. My updated new prediction of the future Adams will hold show up when he is supposed to, and not come when he doesnt have to. He will play for the Jets this year and the next with the same contract if a trade doesnt happne. I do not think a trade will happen at this point. #goingoutonalimb. ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerfish Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 1 hour ago, Prez33 said: Just noticed the Chiefs are in talks with Mahomes on a contract negotiation. He was drafted the same year as Adams. Both are studs. But only one gets validation for restructuring right now. Yeah a box safety who creates no turnovers on a 5 or 6 win team is as valuable as the guy we passed on who is the best player in the league in the most important position in the league. Adams, Brady, Mahommes and Aaron Donald, the mount rushmore of difference makers. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 5 minutes ago, 14 in Green said: Why do we want to cut Mosely? Is it because he's another good player, and we hate paying them? I was responding to Barry's post and noting the financial difficulties in cutting him prior to 2022. I did not state one way or the other whether I'd be in support of cutting him. I will say that moving on from Mosley (whether via cut or trade) a year early rather than a year late would be the wise move. Eventually we should be looking to switch to more of a 4-3/4-man front given the draft capital spent on Quinnen Williams (who does not fit in a 3-4). But primarily using 4-3/4-man looks makes no sense as long as Mosley is on the roster. Mosley was not signed by Douglas and I imagine Gase did not sign off on the move either. It makes sense that they'd eventually move on from him. Much like 2020 will probably be the last season that Bell is in a Jets uniform. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry McCockinner Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 1 minute ago, 14 in Green said: Why do we want to cut Mosely? Is it because he's another good player, and we hate paying them? He was responding to my suggesting we could do it next season. Usually when guys get in the 29/30/31 area you don't want to be paying them a large percentage of your cap. Those are good guys to let walk to FA and try to get a comp pick out of, even if it's a year too early. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 1 minute ago, Barry McCockinner said: He was responding to my suggesting we could do it next season. Usually when guys get in the 29/30/31 area you don't want to be paying them a large percentage of your cap. Those are good guys to let walk to FA and try to get a comp pick out of, even if it's a year too early. We wouldn't get a comp pick if we cut Mosley. But waiting until after 2023 to let him walk would not be ideal. Trading him in 2022 would be the best move. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 19 hours ago, Barry McCockinner said: I honestly don't get why you'd ask me this question. The obvious difference is other teams have to give up multiple draft picks to get him first. The Jets have already made their draft investment, and now how first dibs on signing him long term. If he continues to play at a high level and goes to free agency he'll have the type of interest you mention. The value of the draft pick when you hit is you get the early years relatively cheap, and first dibs on the second contract. I think my reply didn't get posted, or somehow I don't see it. But here's the gist: The answer is you're counting all the cost one side of an equation but not the other; on the Jets' side you're counting two high draft investments only once. The Jets invested a high draft pick to get him in 2017. I'm with you there, but this is a sunk cost. Another team would have to invest a high pick or more to get him in 2020. Also true. The Jets would be RE-investing high draft pick(s) in Adams by turning down another team's offer. Whoops! You've conveniently left that last part #3 out of your analysis. Meanwhile it's literally the single biggest reason for Douglas moving him (if he even does). Of secondary value is the contract he's already seeking; sarcasm/trolling aside, no one is seriously advocating the Jets just let him go for nothing by cutting him (nor trading him for some late round pick just so they don't pay to get rid of him). Put another way, the Jets forking over similar dollars for another FA safety to replace him - even one not quite as good - isn't the same as "well why didn't they just extend Adams??" The obvious reason is the difference between Adams and some other $14MM+/year veteran FA safety - if they even choose to fill a SS hole that way - isn't worth spending (by turning down) yet another 1st rounder plus whatever else they might get for him. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashmouth Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 On 5/25/2020 at 10:51 PM, Warfish said: Ravens are a Super Bowl contender. We're not. I feel good about the Raven's interest. A #1 and a #2 will make it happen if I'm GM. I would much rather have a crap team trade For Jamal with the Ravens we get a high 20's low 30's first rounder and second rounder with a crap team we get a possible top 10 pick . This would be a good trade for the Ravens because that team is already built and I think they would be getting the better end of that deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 47 minutes ago, TheNuuFaaolaExperience said: Having the best QB moves the needle. Having the best safety doesn't. Mahomes is better at being the best QB than Adams is at being the best safety. Also there is a 0.0% chance the Chiefs ultimately refuse to pay anything Mahomes asks for. The Jets, meanwhile, already entertained offers for Adams before his 3rd season was over. Not a subtle point, any more than it's subtle that Mahomes is the best player at what's by far the most important position. Oh yeah, and he's a champion already. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 1 minute ago, Smashmouth said: I would much rather have a crap team trade For Jamal with the Ravens we get a high 20's low 30's first rounder and second rounder with a crap team we get a possible top 10 pick . This would be a good trade for the Ravens because that team is already built and I think they would be getting the better end of that deal. That's the conundrum. A crap team likely doesn't want Adams. He's closer to being a luxury piece than he is a central piece for a non-contender. But I could be under-selling the market a bit. If, say, the Browns, with all their cap space and mediocre results of late, were to join in the fray that would be a great trade to make. For everyone other than Jamal, that is. lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SouthernJet Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 this scares me cause of respect ravens and douglas have for each other..the ravens wouldnt even be talking unless douglass both sais yes lets talk and also open to trade..damn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry McCockinner Posted May 28, 2020 Share Posted May 28, 2020 5 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said: I think my reply didn't get posted, or somehow I don't see it. But here's the gist: The answer is you're counting all the cost one side of an equation but not the other; on the Jets' side you're counting two high draft investments only once. The Jets invested a high draft pick to get him in 2017. I'm with you there. Another team would have to invest a high pick or more to get him in 2020. Also true. The Jets would be RE-investing high draft pick(s) in Adams by turning down another team's offer. Whoops! You've conveniently left that last part #3 out of your analysis. Meanwhile it's literally the single biggest reason for Douglas moving him (if he even does). Of secondary value is the contract he's already seeking; sarcasm/trolling aside, no one is seriously advocating the Jets just let him go for nothing by cutting him (nor trading him for some late round pick just so they don't pay to get rid of him). Put another way, the Jets forking over similar dollars for another FA safety to replace him - even one not quite as good - isn't the same as "well why didn't they just extend Adams??" The obvious reason is the difference between Adams and some other $14MM+/year veteran FA safety - if they even choose to fill a SS hole that way - isn't worth spending (by turning down) yet another 1st rounder plus whatever else they might get for him. I simply don't agree with the idea of trading away an all-pro in his prime years for the chance at drafting another guy who likely won't be as good of a player. Bird in the hand. If we had a situation where we had several prime year players who needed to be paid it would be a different story. But we got macc'd. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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