Report: Ravens in trade discussions for Jamal Adams

[Charlie Brown]

4 hours ago, Sonny Werblin said:

So, you were afraid Darnold was young and needed development, but you ranked Allen third?

Hey I really thought Darnold wasn't a consideration at all because I really didn't think that he would be available and of the QBs left I thought Allen was  3rd, not to knock him but I thought Rosen was more pro ready.

Allen has been good and Rosen had been in a bad situation after bad situation so we still have to wait as to final judgment on Rosen...

[Sonny Werblin]

15 hours ago, Charlie Brown said:

Hey I really thought Darnold wasn't a consideration at all because I really didn't think that he would be available and of the QBs left I thought Allen was  3rd, not to knock him but I thought Rosen was more pro ready.

Allen has been good and Rosen had been in a bad situation after bad situation so we still have to wait as to final judgment on Rosen...

Thanks for clarifying. I'm with you on Rosen. I thought skill-wise Darnold, Mayfield and Rosen were on a level above the others. I didn't like Allen at all and was totally frustrated with with the evaluators who elevated Allen because of his raw physical abilities and dismissed Jackson as an athlete better cast as a WR or RB when anyone who watched their games would know that Jackson was a more accurate passer. 

[Kleckineau]

16 hours ago, Charlie Brown said:

Hey I really thought Darnold wasn't a consideration at all because I really didn't think that he would be available and of the QBs left I thought Allen was  3rd, not to knock him but I thought Rosen was more pro ready.

Allen has been good and Rosen had been in a bad situation after bad situation so we still have to wait as to final judgment on Rosen...

Reality of it at this point, (and this can still change) other than the dynamic Jackson that QB class has been a big fat nothing burger.

[Jetsfan80]

5 hours ago, Sonny Werblin said:

Thanks for clarifying. I'm with you on Rosen. I thought skill-wise Darnold, Mayfield and Rosen were on a level above the others. I didn't like Allen at all and was totally frustrated with with the evaluators who elevated Allen because of his raw physical abilities and dismissed Jackson as an athlete better cast as a WR or RB when anyone who watched their games would know that Jackson was a more accurate passer. 

I still laugh at how wrong Bill Polian was about Jackson, and how long it took for him to acknowledge his wrongness:

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/bill-polian-finally-admits-he-was-wrong-to-say-lamar-jackson-should-switch-from-quarterback-to-receiver/

Bill Polian finally admits he was wrong to say Lamar Jackson should switch from quarterback to receiver

The former NFL general manager explains how he messed up his draft evaluation of Jackson

It might've taken more than a year and a half, but former general manager Bill Polian, who won six Executive of the Year awards and one Super Bowl during his career with the Bills, Panthers, and Colts, is finally ready to admit he was wrong about Lamar Jackson. 

All it took for him to admit his error was Jackson leading the Ravens to the playoffs in a half season of work a year ago as the Ravens remade their offense on the fly and then Jackson taking the Ravens to new heights this season in an even better offense. After hammering the previously unbeaten Patriots on Sunday night, the Ravens are 6-2 and Jackson is rightfully an MVP candidate in his second NFL season -- his first as a full-time starter.

And so, Polian is ready to admit he was wrong to say before the 2018 draft that Jackson would be better off switching from quarterback to receiver. Jackson was coming off a career at Louisville that saw him average 3,601.5 passing yards and 28.5 touchdown passes per season from 2016-17.

"I was wrong, because I used the old, traditional quarterback standard with him, which is clearly why John Harbaugh and Ozzie Newsome were more prescient than I was," Polian told USA Today Sports on Tuesday.

"And Greg (Roman) found a way in how he's developed a system to use those dynamic skills," Polian added. "Bottom line, I was wrong."

 

At the halfway point of the season, Jackson is completing 64.3 percent of his passes and averaging 7.6 yards per attempt. He's thrown 12 touchdowns and five interceptions. Additionally, he's rushed for 637 yards and five touchdowns. He's been so damn near unstoppable that the Patriots' top-ranked defense even got bludgeoned by Jackson. As a result, Jackson is heavily involved in the MVP race with Deshaun Watson, even if Russell Wilson is leading the race by a decent margin at this point in the season. It turns out being a ridiculous athlete is actually beneficial to a quarterback. Who could've known?

"The definition has changed, no question," Polian said, in a quote that reflects how the league can sometimes be so resistant to change, especially when it comes to less traditional methods of playing quarterback. "What he's doing is amazing."

Jackson's immediate and sustained success continues to make what Polian said in February 2018 look all the more foolish.

"I think wide receiver. Exceptional athlete. Exceptional ability to make you miss. Exceptional acceleration. Exceptional instinct with the ball in his hand -- and that's rare for wide receivers," Polian told ESPN Radio at the time. "[Antonio Brown] and who else? Name me another one who's like that. Julio [Jones]'s not like that. This guy is incredible in the open field. Great ability to separate. Short and a little bit slight and clearly, clearly not the thrower the other guys are. 

 

"The accuracy isn't there. Don't wait to make that change. Don't be like the kid from Ohio State [Terrelle Pryor] and be 29 when you make that change."

Polian was hardly the only person in the NFL community to think Jackson's game wouldn't translate to the next level. At the combine, the Chargers even asked Jackson if he was going to work out as a receiver.

To Polian's credit, he did say at the time that he hoped he was wrong about Jackson. He said he wanted him to succeed as an NFL quarterback. But he just didn't think Jackson had this in him.

"I could be wrong on him, and I hope I am. I hope he succeeds as a quarterback. But I also go back to, if he's going to miss, why is he going to miss. You don't make a living as a quarterback running in the National Football League," Polian said at the time. "Cam [Newton] is the exception. You try to take exceptions and say they're the rule: they're not. Bill Parcels taught me that a long time ago. Parcells often said, if you have one or two exceptions on your team, you'll end up with a team full of exceptions. You can't make a living with those guys. You get one every now and then but it's hard to do it."

 

Jackson likely hasn't forgotten about Polian's remarks and the Chargers' request. After he lit up the Dolphins for five touchdowns back in Week 1, Jackson said, "Not bad for a running back."

As Polian mentioned, the Ravens deserve credit for seeing what so many other teams simply refused to see or even look for. It's why they traded back into the end of the first round to draft him, even though they still had Joe Flacco penciled in as the starting quarterback. It's why they made the transition from Flacco to Jackson during the season, understanding that Jackson gave them a better chance to embark upon a playoff run, which is what they promptly did with the rookie under center. And it's why they spent the offseason constructing an offense around his unique skill set, promoting Greg Roman to offensive coordinator job, signing Mark Ingram, and drafting Marquise Brown.

Now the Ravens are 6-2, in control of the AFC North, and a legitimate Super Bowl threat after proving their ability to beat the Patriots, and Jackson is already an MVP candidate. And here's the scariest part about all of this: Including the playoffs, Jackson has only started 16 games. Imagine how much better he can and likely will get.

[win4ever]

Hey I really thought Darnold wasn't a consideration at all because I really didn't think that he would be available and of the QBs left I thought Allen was  3rd, not to knock him but I thought Rosen was more pro ready.
Allen has been good and Rosen had been in a bad situation after bad situation so we still have to wait as to final judgment on Rosen...

When the college season ended, honestly I had Rosen No. 1. However, as the offseason went on, I didn’t see the intangibles that a lot of folks were touting. Teammates didn’t seem to like him, coach didn’t, and he rarely seemed to elevate the team.

I remember posting some scouting report on Jackson, saying he was very much underrated, and it was well received here, so I think most people were open to the idea.

I figured Darnold was No. 1, so I barely scouted him. I thought Mayfield was underrated by the fans (obviously not the Browns), and Jackson. The only QB I didn’t want was Allen, because he was just too inconsistent.

Although I’ll admit I didn’t think Rosen was going to be the abject disaster he turned out to be on the field.

[Charlie Brown]

1 hour ago, win4ever said:

 

When the college season ended, honestly I had Rosen No. 1. However, as the offseason went on, I didn’t see the intangibles that a lot of folks were touting. Teammates didn’t seem to like him, coach didn’t, and he rarely seemed to elevate the team.

I remember posting some scouting report on Jackson, saying he was very much underrated, and it was well received here, so I think most people were open to the idea.

I figured Darnold was No. 1, so I barely scouted him. I thought Mayfield was underrated by the fans (obviously not the Browns), and Jackson. The only QB I didn’t want was Allen, because he was just too inconsistent.

Although I’ll admit I didn’t think Rosen was going to be the abject disaster he turned out to be on the field.

 

I too thought Jackson COULD be successful in the right circumstances.

However, I did not think and do not think that Jackson would have been successful in New York as a Jet. 

IMO the Jets would NOT have played to Jackson's strengths as the Ravens have done and our horrific OL and poor skill players on offense would have demanded Jackson to run more and probably get him hurt.

Revisionist history now says Jackson was going to be great no matter what..

But I remember Bill Polian saying that Jackson wasn't a QB and that he should switch to WR.....

If Jackson falls into those with those kinds of football evaluations and sentiments he isn't as successful..

And Jackson having to say this....

 

 

So while Jackson has since thrived, I am not sure he is automatic Good Player on the Jets....

[win4ever]

10 hours ago, Charlie Brown said:

I too thought Jackson COULD be successful in the right circumstances.

However, I did not think and do not think that Jackson would have been successful in New York as a Jet. 

IMO the Jets would NOT have played to Jackson's strengths as the Ravens have done and our horrific OL and poor skill players on offense would have demanded Jackson to run more and probably get him hurt.

Revisionist history now says Jackson was going to be great no matter what..

But I remember Bill Polian saying that Jackson wasn't a QB and that he should switch to WR.....

If Jackson falls into those with those kinds of football evaluations and sentiments he isn't as successful..

And Jackson having to say this....

 

 

So while Jackson has since thrived, I am not sure he is automatic Good Player on the Jets....

Oh I think Todd Bowles would have converted him to LB to pair with Lee.   I don't think there's any question in my mind that Bowles was absolutely the worst guy to develop a QB, and Mac was not going to make it easy anyway.  I don't think we have to look any further than picking Hackenberg, and then doing absolutely nothing in his first year.  Any fool could tell you that he had mechanical issues that needed to be corrected immediately, which is what I figured his "redshirt" year would be.  Come to find out, they did absolutely nothing.  He was just sitting around absorbing the game, when it was his mechanics that needed to be changed.  

I thought Jackson was being underrated because there's a ton of guys in college football that thrive because they can run RPOs (Manziel being a big one) but his open field ability was next level.  Guys like Taylor or Tannehill could move, but Jackson was a dynamic RB in the open field, which really changed the game.  He made some adjustments to passing and now he's a stud.  

I think a lot of variables about old time scouting is changing, especially in terms of size and fit, as we're seeing a change towards scheme fit vs. talent.  Unfortunately, Mac wasn't given the message.