2020 New England Patriots QB

[greenwichjetfan]

40 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Lay-up

 

Nick Bosa gearing up for a career game on 11/15!

[section314]

9 hours ago, 14 in Green said:

I hear what you're saying, but I hope that doesn't happen. I love it when the rare person (from either side of any controversy) mans up and says "Screw it. I said it. I meant it. It's what I believe."

I respect those men. The ones who bow to public pressure from either side, they're as spineless as the ones who stay silent for fear of tarnishing their brand.

Tonight I respect Drew Brees. Same as I do Kapernik. Doesn't matter if I agree with either of them. Hopefully I still respect Brees next week.

Well put. It's just amazing to me that athletes, celebrities, etc continue to feel the need to share their opinions with the rest of us, like they are some mystical, all knowing powers that we actually give two sh*ts about.

[Lupz27]

9 hours ago, johnnysd said:

Kinda not really two sides of this issue though the way I see it. 

If history has taught us anything their is always 2 sides, and most times they both think they are 100% correct, and no middle ground, and the scariest part is that’s how wars start.

[Lupz27]

1 hour ago, KRL said:

Here's truth that people should be using in this social media age:

Every man should be swift to hear, slow to speak and slow to anger

100% agree with this NOW more then ever as I’ve done a lot of educating myself the last week or so.  But the hard truths are 1. While I do agree with what you said we are not all wired mentally to be that person, I myself have trouble with this, and is something I am going to make a real conscious effort to better myself at this.  2.  Their are people specifically in this country whom just wont stand for what’s going on, and that leads straight to almost justified anger, now how they act on that anger is a completely different conversation.

[Lupz27]

1 hour ago, 68JET11 said:

First of all, before I start, let me begin by saying, I'll be 63 years old this year and I don't go on facebook, or twitter, or other social media. I have no outlet to let my voice speak other than if I were to take a megaphone and go to some city lol... I belong to the HUMAN race, not the white or black race. I say this because that's how I was brought up even though I'm a white guy. We were taught to respect other people because that's how you'd want to be treated in similar situations. I don't profess to know how hard it is or was for black people when I was growing up, but I can say that I did not look at skin color to determine who would be my friend or not. It is the same way I look at life today. I am now greatly concerned with what is being taught to our children, and who is actually doing the teaching. I can't believe parents would allow their children to attend demonstrations of the kind that are taking place this last week and watch all the destruction that is going on. The correct way is to peacefully protest your views. The death of George was tragic and hopefully justice will prevail for his family. If we allow the type of learning and teachings that go on in our education system we will only continue on with this type of behavior. I know my parents did not teach me that if I wanted to say something that the right way was to behave violently. To watch this is truly horrifying. I get what Black Lives Matter stands for, but at some point just hearing an announcer get fired for saying All Lives Matter is absurd. We as HUMAN's if we are ever going to be able to live together and stop the hatred between us need to DROP all the labels and start calling each other HUMAN beings and resist the color designation. We need to start teaching our children respect again, and what it means.

Well said, but there is way to many years of damage for this to be fixed over night, or even in a decade, and MOST humans are done waiting in this country, and sick of the politicians taking 15 years to agree on how other Humans should be treated, why is this so hard look in the mirror ask your self how would you like to be treated today, and go out and treat others that exact way it literally a 30 second exercise yet the government just doesn’t get it.  And I’m not saying I do either I don’t, but I want to, and it’s gonna take some time to remove the 41 years of thinking one way.

[Long Island Leprechaun]

1 hour ago, THE BARON said:

A couple of comments from me here.  Jarrett Stidham is going to be ideal with BB and JM.  I don't think he's a stop gap QB.  He's going to be an ideal system complimentary QB in NE.  

And comments on JB and the reactions to his recent remarks. 

Media and economic terrorism leveled against people that say things that are controversial and even outright ignorant is destructive.  When people are coerced into holding back their opinions and thoughts under pain of economic destruction and media terror, the resulting social condition is dangerous.  It creates flashpoints, deprives people of opportunities to learn and grow and it is a surefire way to strenghten social divisions.  When people feel that their lives may be over for expressing an opinion, it gives them reason to believe that their ideas, even if badly ignorant are well founded.  People keep their silence and nothing is learned or reaffirmed.  

Here is a very important fact that many people lose understanding of... 

The mass media including TV networks, newspapers and Hollywood studios are *NOT* public services.  They are profit driven, absolutely. 

Sadly, your last line includes politicians as well, who are both profit and power driven and will often say or do anything to be elected/re-elected. Somewhere, we lost our capacity for civility in disagreement and a willingness to listen to what the other guy has to say and sit with it enough to have some empathy for their concerns.

On a side note, I agree with your concern about the cost of expressing opinion. But it's not just media that drives the curtailment of expression. It's also corporations, who fear alienating customers or damaging their brand. Or colleges fearing lawsuits. On the other hand, what we say IS an expression of our character, so we also have to own responsibility for our words. 

p.s. I thought Brees handled his correction of his initial comments well. He frankly did about the only thing he could do as someone who is a team leader and face of a franchise. Some here might see him as being "spineless," but for me it reflects someone who is modeling flexibility and a willingness to hear out those who have been hurt by his comments. Brees is a decent guy. He would have been better served to say nothing, but that water is under the bridge.

[THE BARON]

37 minutes ago, section314 said:

Well put. It's just amazing to me that athletes, celebrities, etc continue to feel the need to share their opinions with the rest of us, like they are some mystical, all knowing powers that we actually give two sh*ts about.

They are tools for the media masters.   As stated in a previous post.  The networks, newspapers, record companies and Hollywood studios are not public services.  They are absolutely profit driven.  The fresh faces we see today wont be much use to the profiteers when their shelf life expires.  We get a new crop of "mystical, all knowing powers" every decade or so.  There will also be a new crop of consumers.  Nothing is trite or banal to new ears, new eyes and new minds.  Even the vapid pop music that gets force fed to consumers will still be all the rage to the next generation of listeners... 

[THE BARON]

3 minutes ago, Long Island Leprechaun said:

Sadly, your last line includes politicians as well, who are both profit and power driven and will often say or do anything to be elected/re-elected. Somewhere, we lost our capacity for civility in disagreement and a willingness to listen to what the other guy has to say and sit with it enough to have some empathy for their concerns.

On a side note, I agree with your concern about the cost of expressing opinion. But it's not just media that drives the curtailment of expression. It's also corporations, who fear alienating customers or damaging their brand. Or colleges fearing lawsuits. On the other hand, what we say IS an expression of our character, so we also have to own responsibility for our words. 

Agree fully on all points. Excellent addition to my post.  TY ! 

[Lupz27]

35 minutes ago, section314 said:

Well put. It's just amazing to me that athletes, celebrities, etc continue to feel the need to share their opinions with the rest of us, like they are some mystical, all knowing powers that we actually give two sh*ts about.

Well they are told their opinions, and actions do help get the message spread further then if it was just coming from unheard people with 10 followers on social media.

[T0mShane]

This DiPietro-Canty Brees segment is amazing. 

[Jetsfan80]

11 hours ago, Daddy Wang Doodle said:

In before duh lock!

Isn't part of this to educate people on the plight and injustices black people face compared to others? To villainize a guy who sees things differently, seems to defeat the entire purpose of "educating" those who don't understand.

It's self-defeating.

How much "education" does he need at this point?  The players kneeled for a reason (at least initially), and that reason is playing out right now, across the country.  All 50 states are involved in the protest, as well as 8 other countries.  His locker room and city are filled with diversity.  What part does he still not understand?

[More Cowbell]

11 hours ago, Aaron Hernandez said:

Yeah, he's basically a clansmen now who should be chased out of public life for expressing an opinion. The guy who's donated countless hours and money trying to help lift up New Orleans over the the years would have been better off looting and burning down a small business this week than answering a question honestly 

Drew attempted to walk his comments about kneeling back today but it was incredibly stupid for him to make mention of them at this time. Had he said this a month ago, nobody would care but when a fire is burning and it is trying to be put out, you don't  pour gasoline on it. He should have just kept his view to himself. 

[68JET11]

1 hour ago, Snook said:

These message boards (community forums) are considered social media by many people.

I guess, not for me, just a place I get to agonize about our beloved NYJETS, and very briefly about other topics lol...

[Jetsfan80]

2 hours ago, 68JET11 said:

I don't know how to answer that other then yes, without getting into a political discussion which I frown from on this type of forum. Teachers should teach subject matter, not their opinions. I believe you should learn your character from your parents. 

And when people learn racism from their parents, what then?  Racism isn't innate.  It is learned.  That re-education would have to come from somewhere else, no?

[flgreen]

This is probably a VERY bad topic for a football board, but it's here, so ..........  We certainly have a BIG problem with violence in this country.  I personally don't know the solution to it, but I know what isn't the solution.  Turing it into a political football, or reacting with wanton violence, destruction of innocent peoples property, or random beatings and murder.

Here's some numbers from the FBI just to keep things in prespective. They can be confirmed with Google.  I didn't want to attach a link because they are usually attached to an article with an agenda from either side.

1,004 people were shot and killed by the police in 2019.   WAY to many, but most of them wer armed.

9 unarmed Black people were killed by the police

18 unarmed white people were killed

229 Black people were murdered by white people

504 white people were killed by black people

Over 7,000 murders were black on black.

Like I said I don't know the solution, but it's clear, at least to me, that the problem isn't necessarily all racism, but the fact that we are a violent people.  

Turning a back on violent behavior, is only going to make the situation much more severe.  

 

 

[More Cowbell]

11 hours ago, Daddy Wang Doodle said:

In before duh lock!

Isn't part of this to educate people on the plight and injustices black people face compared to others? To villainize a guy who sees things differently, seems to defeat the entire purpose of "educating" those who don't understand.

It's self-defeating.

Drew wasn't  seeing things differently, he was totally ignoring what kneeling was all about and associating  it with something totally unrelated that was put forward by someone trying to score points with other ignorant people. From day one Kaepernick made it clear why he was kneeling. It was never about disrespecting the flag. 

[Jetsfan80]

9 minutes ago, flgreen said:

1,004 people were shot and killed by the police in 2019.   WAY to many, but most of them were armed.

Without context, that is meaningless.  What assumptions are you making about the ones that were armed?  Were they pointing their guns at cops, or did they have a registered gun in their glove compartment?

This breakdown would imply there is a lot more we need to know about those armed men who were killed, and that even without that information, there was STILL evidence of implicit bias.  These numbers indicate that cops perceive an armed black or hispanic man as more dangerous than an armed white man:

[68JET11]

5 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

And when people learn racism from their parents, what then?  Racism isn't innate.  It is learned.  That re-education would have to come from somewhere else, no?

I get there are bad people in this world and you're correct that there are some that would learn that from their parents. They happen to be in the VAST minority however from most of the people that I have met in my opinion. For example as all this was going on in the country, I played golf with 2 black gentleman the other day. Not once did they or myself display any type of anomosity towards each other, and we had a wonderful day laughing and poking fun at each other. I get there are people that have learned that type of behavior from before we were even born. To blame this generation for prior generations mistakes can't be a theme going forward if we're to change the behavior everywhere.

[More Cowbell]

11 hours ago, 14 in Green said:

I hear what you're saying, but I hope that doesn't happen. I love it when the rare person (from either side of any controversy) mans up and says "Screw it. I said it. I meant it. It's what I believe."

I respect those men. The ones who bow to public pressure from either side, they're as spineless as the ones who stay silent for fear of tarnishing their brand.

Tonight I respect Drew Brees. Same as I do Kapernik. Doesn't matter if I agree with either of them. Hopefully I still respect Brees next week.

I could see your point if Brees said he disagrees with kneeling because he doesn't  think the police and black community  have a real issue but what he said was totally off the mark and ignorant. 

[greenwichjetfan]

2 hours ago, 68JET11 said:

I don't know how to answer that other then yes, without getting into a political discussion which I frown from on this type of forum. Teachers should teach subject matter, not their opinions. I believe you should learn your character from your parents. 

This comes from a good place so I have no issue with it, but practically, the problem here are the uneducated, unfit parents with many issues including racist thoughts/tendencies. 

[68JET11]

1 minute ago, greenwichjetfan said:

This comes from a good place so I have no issue with it, but practically, the problem here are the uneducated, unfit parents with many issues including racist thoughts/tendencies. 

True, I did say this trying to come from a good place.

[More Cowbell]

10 hours ago, 14 in Green said:

Really? I don't know man. There are very few issues where there aren't two sides.

Not saying its the case here, but many issues that few believed in have seen complete reversals in public opinion because of the few who persistently held firm to "their side of it."

You're entitled to your opinion though, and yours are usually pretty sound even when I don't agree with one them.

 

What he means is what Brees commented on was never the reason for kneeling in the forst place. I want to say I never thought Kaepernick chose the best way to expess his feeling on cops and black people but Brees was way off in his comments. 

[nyjunc]

3 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Without context, that is meaningless.  What assumptions are you making about the ones that were armed?  Were they pointing their guns at cops, or did they have a registered gun in their glove compartment?

This breakdown would imply there is a lot more we need to know about those armed men who were killed, and that even without that information, there was STILL evidence of implicit bias:

Now do percentage of violent crime. This link is from 2018(2019 hasn't been released yet) and African Americans committed 53.3% of murders, the percentages are similar in 16 & 17.  13% of population with over 50% of murders.  Do you think that plays a role?

 

https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2017/crime-in-the-u.s.-2017/tables/table-43

 

[More Cowbell]

3 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

Wait, so he said 

 "will never agree with anybody disrespecting the flag of the United States of America or our country" 

And you guys think he’ll be cut from his team for that?  No way.  

A lesser player for sure, but not him.

It's  the context, not the thought

[nyjunc]

Just now, More Cowbell said:

What he means is what Brees commented on was never the reason for kneeling in the forst place. I want to say I never thought Kaepernick chose the best way to expess his feeling on cops and black people but Brees was way off in his comments. 

Kaepernick was a bad leader of this movement.  It's easy to see why his well intentioned message got lost.  Whether the Castro stuff, his girlfriend and her silliness, cops as pigs socks, etc...  He did a great job bringing attention, a poor job with his message.

[Jetsfan80]

Just now, 68JET11 said:

I get there are bad people in this world and you're correct that there are some that would learn that from their parents. They happen to be in the VAST minority however from most of the people that I have met in my opinion. For example as all this was going on in the country, I played golf with 2 black gentleman the other day. Not once did they or myself display any type of anomosity towards each other, and we had a wonderful day laughing and poking fun at each other. I get there are people that have learned that type of behavior from before we were even born. To blame this generation for prior generations mistakes can't be a theme going forward if we're to change the behavior everywhere.

You can't use one example from your own experience and project out from there that racism isn't a big problem.

Racism isn't just about the ones with torches.  Its a systemic problem, with plenty of statistics to support this is the case.  Racism didn't just disappear after Jim Crow ended.  It just went into hiding.  And racist policies like Redlining (look it up, if you're not aware) directly prevented non-white families from building wealth in this country and still has vast consequences in 2020.

Have you had any serious conversations with these black men you interact with, beyond surface level niceties?  Have you asked them about THEIR experiences with racism?  It might be eye-opening to learn how pervasive it is, even if its not always completely obvious in how it plays out. 

I can tell you from conversations I've had that black men and women that many of them constantly have to be on alert with their surroundings.  They notice if they're the only black person in a room and can have increased anxiety in those situations.  They have to have a plan in place on what to do if police pull them over.  

[nyjunc]

1 minute ago, More Cowbell said:

It's  the context, not the thought

That's his feelings, why is that not ok? You don't have to agree.  

[More Cowbell]

2 hours ago, EM31 said:

Yet another in before the lock.

Drew Brees is 100% entitled to his opinions and he absolutely entitled to express his opinions.  Defending to the death and all that.

But he is also in line to receive everyone else's reactions to those opinions.  And that is as it should be.

On a related note Colin Kaepernick is likely to get a job offer at some point this year in my opinion.  Basically I think that much of the world has come around to the idea that he was right all along (if they were not there already).  The offer of employment might even happen before November if the team owner is ballsy enough.

There certainly is a need for QB's

[Jetsfan80]

7 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

Now do percentage of violent crime. This link is from 2018(2019 hasn't been released yet) and African Americans committed 53.3% of murders, the percentages are similar in 16 & 17.  13% of population with over 50% of murders.  Do you think that plays a role?

 

https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2017/crime-in-the-u.s.-2017/tables/table-43

 

 

This is dismissive of the problem at hand.  The black community is well aware of the issues they have, and some of them (like the school-to-prison pipeline) are not the fault of the community itself.  Black people are not innately evil or more dangerous than white people. 

And I can use those statistics against you too by pointing out all the black-on-black crime that the "All Lives Matter" crew loves to throw out there.  White cops should have no reason to be more "afraid" of a person of color than anyone else.  

And none of that excuses or explain away why it is, on average, more dangerous to be a person of color than a white person in an interaction with police.

[More Cowbell]

2 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

Kaepernick was a bad leader of this movement.  It's easy to see why his well intentioned message got lost.  Whether the Castro stuff, his girlfriend and her silliness, cops as pigs socks, etc...  He did a great job bringing attention, a poor job with his message.

Agree 100%. The way he went about things was really poorly executed.  There are so many other ways he could have chosen to put forward what is a well intentioned gesture. This is way to controversial 

[Lupz27]

1 minute ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

This is dismissive of the problem at hand.  The black community is well aware of the issues they have, and some of them (like the school-to-prison pipeline) are not the fault of the community itself.  

None of that excuses or explain away why it is, on average, more dangerous to be a person of color than a white person in an interaction with police.

Some people just don’t understand the difference between Race, and Poverty.

[nyjunc]

8 minutes ago, 68JET11 said:

I get there are bad people in this world and you're correct that there are some that would learn that from their parents. They happen to be in the VAST minority however from most of the people that I have met in my opinion. For example as all this was going on in the country, I played golf with 2 black gentleman the other day. Not once did they or myself display any type of anomosity towards each other, and we had a wonderful day laughing and poking fun at each other. I get there are people that have learned that type of behavior from before we were even born. To blame this generation for prior generations mistakes can't be a theme going forward if we're to change the behavior everywhere.

It's interesting.  I live in a great place with high percentages of basically every race.  With my kids sports teams we are in the minority(except for baseball), in many cases my kids are the only white kids (football, basketball).  I never see any issues.  I'm not black so I can't say what they are thinking inside but we travel together outside our little bubble here and I haven't seen any issues flare up.

[More Cowbell]

3 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

That's his feelings, why is that not ok? You don't have to agree.  

Because kneeling was never about disrespecting the flag. What don't  you understand about that. Is it disrespectful on it's  face. Yes, but anyone who ever listened to CK about why he was kneeling knows he wasn't  doing it for that reason. 

[Jetsfan80]

2 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

Because kneeling was never about disrespecting the flag. What don't  you understand about that. Is it disrespectful on it's  face. Yes, but anyone who ever listened to CK about why he was kneeling knows he wasn't  doing it for that reason. 

And it ignores that it's pretty much impossible for people of color to have the same view of the flag as white people.  The IDEA of America, that all people are created equal, and endowed by their Creator with inalienable rights, is a perfect idea.  But it's one that has never been executed properly in the history of the nation.

Juneteenth tends to mean FAR more to a black person than July 4th does.

[68JET11]

10 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

You can't use one example from your own experience and project out from there that racism isn't a big problem.

Racism isn't just about the ones with torches.  Its a systemic problem, with plenty of statistics to support this is the case.  Racism didn't just disappear after Jim Crow ended.  It just went into hiding.  And racist policies like Redlining (look it up, if you're not aware) directly prevented non-white families from building wealth in this country and still has vast consequences in 2020.

Have you had any serious conversations with these black men you interact with, beyond surface level niceties?  Have you asked them about THEIR experiences with racism?  It might be eye-opening to learn how pervasive it is, even if its not always completely obvious in how it plays out. 

I can tell you from conversations I've had that black men and women that many of them constantly have to be on alert with their surroundings.  They notice if they're the only black person in a room and can have increased anxiety in those situations.  They have to have a plan in place on what to do if police pull them over.  

So it was just one example, but there are others, like when I was in HS, and my best friend from going to NJ All State Choir happened to be a black guy from Edison NJ that I never met before, or my older sister in HS dating a black guy. I don't specifically talk to black people about racism, because I treat people as I want to be treated no matter what their color and vice versa. Again, I understand that racism is still a problem in America, but there are WAY more NON-racist people in my opinion, then are. As far as what to do no matter what your skin color is when being pulled over by the police, would be to listen and obey instead of running or acting out. Sorry, just how I feel.