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Why did Douglas state he was going to begin contract talks with Jamal?

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22 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

And how do you know each of these 5 points didn't happen behind the scenes?  Just because Douglas hasn't told any of the behind-the-scenes stuff to the media (which is exactly what any good GM does; give very little to the media) doesn't mean these things weren't happening.  

There is no placating Jamal Adams.  Nothing JD said to Adams behind the scenes was ever going to be satisfactory.  Because Jamal's a little b*tch and always had him.  The fault for Jamal's personality disorders doesn't fall on Joe Douglas.

Well i clearly stated this "Without being in the rooms we have no idea how things went down but by all indication the jets front office"

There has been enough stuff in the press to suggest that most of the things I said were true.  "We want jamal to be a jet for life' we are talking with  him yada yada yada.

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16 hours ago, Big_Slick said:

I was with up until that last statement. A box SS is not worth that much cap space. Either he takes a very team friendly deal or we keep him for the 2 years remaining on his rookie contract and then can franchise him not once but twice for less $$$ than the contract you propose.

I respect your opinion, but you gotta at least tell me what you think the Jets should offer him.

By the way, how many all-pro players have the Jets had in the last 10 years?  My memory is short because I don't remember even having one player who fits that bill.

The Giants will be paying Leo $12 Million.  Jamal has to be worth more than that, no?

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On 6/19/2020 at 1:28 PM, Beerfish said:

 the jets brain trust got fooled into patting him on the head and saying the things he wanted to hear rather than giving him the truth.  with certain people if you try and avoid conflict by placating them you are setting up problems down the road.

The CEO should have told Adams to talk to the GM an coach instead of butting in originally.

The GM should have made it very clear that they like the player and will take deal down the road but also that they HOLD ALL THE CARDS and will deal with him when thy get the chance on the teams time line.

Instead they tried to baby him and they are reaping the reward now to some extent.

 

 

 

Disagree

JD (Jets brain trust) played this exactly as he should have

he said the generic P/R comments of "we'd like to have Jamal a Jet for life ... as he should have.

he had no intention of offering Jamal a contract yet (unless it was very team friendly) ... as he should not have

If Jamal didn't understand that only a very team friendly deal would make an extension happen at this time, then that's on him ... not JD

Jamal is the baby, this is no surprise to JD ... he saw the temper-tantrum at the trade deadline.

There is no reaping ... there is only maintaining the big picture plan that JD already has in place

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On 6/19/2020 at 10:54 AM, Rhg1084 said:

Early in the offseason Douglas publicly stated he was going to begin contract talks with Jamal. Then he completely went radio silent on the subject? I’m not trying to excuse Jamals diva behavior as of late. Just thought it was weird JD would make that proclamation then do nothing about it thus infuriating Jamal

Boy, did you pick the wrong place to bring this up

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38 minutes ago, ljr said:

 

Disagree

JD (Jets brain trust) played this exactly as he should have

he said the generic P/R comments of "we'd like to have Jamal a Jet for life ... as he should have.

he had no intention of offering Jamal a contract yet (unless it was very team friendly) ... as he should not have

If Jamal didn't understand that only a very team friendly deal would make an extension happen at this time, then that's on him ... not JD

Jamal is the baby, this is no surprise to JD ... he saw the temper-tantrum at the trade deadline.

There is no reaping ... there is only maintaining the big picture plan that JD already has in place

He misread jamal adams totally, yes jamal is a baby and showed that very early but he if you come out and say the pr friendly stuff then those words and any others you  use come back.  We want to have jamal a jet for life is FAR above any normal pr comment.

As I've said this is far more on Adams than anyone else but our GM and owner and such misread the guy, he needed to be told to stfu and we will see about a contract later one instead they patted him on the head,, and still get the shaft for their trouble.

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2 hours ago, Alka said:

By the way, how many all-pro players have the Jets had in the last 10 years?  My memory is short because I don't remember even having one player who fits that bill.

A lack of All-Pro talent isn't a good reason to pay Adams.  Never has been.  You don't just overpay players simply because your team has been bad.  That's just an easy way to get into problems down the road.  We saw that with Maccagnan, who spent like a cokehead on unworthy talent time after time.

I'm fine with spending.  But it has to be smart.  Rather than spending $15-20M per on Jamal Adams, take that money and spend it on one of the upcoming FA WR's, a list that includes Chris Godwin, Kenny Golladay, JuJu Smith-Schuster, Keenan Allen, Allen Robinson, Cooper Kupp and T.Y. Hilton.  Or save up a bit, as we're going to have to start thinking about paying Darnold as soon as 2021.

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On 6/19/2020 at 12:11 PM, viffer said:

Salary cap is tied to revenues. If the total revenues for the NFL are down 30% - 40% this year, the salary cap will be way, way down next year. That is not a joke. That is reality.

Paying a frickin' safety a new contract when he is under contract for 2-3 years yet when the cap for next year could be a disaster is just plain stupid.

It's as simple as this. Well said.

Giving Adam's $12 million a year if the cap is going to be $200 million isn't terrible.

GIving Adam's $12 million a year when the cap gets reduced  to $150 million a year (pure speculation),  which equals 8% of your salary cap, when you already had him under contract for about $6 million, is just bad business.

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31 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

He misread jamal adams totally, yes jamal is a baby and showed that very early but he if you come out and say the pr friendly stuff then those words and any others you  use come back.  We want to have jamal a jet for life is FAR above any normal pr comment.

As I've said this is far more on Adams than anyone else but our GM and owner and such misread the guy, he needed to be told to stfu and we will see about a contract later one instead they patted him on the head,, and still get the shaft for their trouble.

 

cool ... will agree to disagree on what JDs reads & words should be/have been

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On 6/19/2020 at 8:13 AM, slats said:

Douglas' best stance in the Jamal situation is to continue to say he wants Jamal to be a Jet for life. Nothing to see here. 

I imagine the "radio silence," really took hold after Jamal poo-poo'd the idea of just getting paid like a top end SS. 

Yep probably a strategy of some sort, either that or the old " It seemed like a good idea at the time"

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It’s not uncommon for a GM to says he’s going to begin discussion, if the player has been publicly pressuring to team to do something with his contract.

I wouldn’t expect the GM to say anything else about it after that, though. It’s not like he’s hot to give daily updates in the discussions. They begin, they go well or poorly, then a thing happens. No need for him to yap about it.

This thread is full of fans simultaneously wanting a coach that plays it close to the best, but also talks too much. 

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On 6/19/2020 at 11:09 AM, JoJoTownsell1 said:

All I remember is that Douglas said he wanted to make Adams a Jet for life. I don't recall Douglas saying that he would  begin contract talks by date XX/XX/XXXX. 

Douglas could also be the kind of guy that doesn't like to be pressured into contract talks so the more Adams talks the less likely Douglas is to start negotiating especially when the Jets have all the leverage the next couple of years. 

Great way to shut Adams up:

Ring ring...ok Jamal I’ll get back to you on that extension.
ring ring....  Hi Marcus. Cmon down to my office. I’m extending your contract immediately. 

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14 hours ago, Alka said:

I respect your opinion, but you gotta at least tell me what you think the Jets should offer him.

By the way, how many all-pro players have the Jets had in the last 10 years?  My memory is short because I don't remember even having one player who fits that bill.

The Giants will be paying Leo $12 Million.  Jamal has to be worth more than that, no?

Leo is not worth 12 million and it was a great move by JD to unload him to Gettleman. The Jets should not offer Jamal any extension. He's under contract for 2 more years and then he can be franchise tagged for another two. That will cost less than an extension for 15 million per year.

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On 6/19/2020 at 11:18 AM, Scott Dierking said:

But, the pandemic certainly affects business decisions.

Reality here, football is a business and unknown revenue streams have bearing upon what you spend. 

There will likely be huge losses even if there is a full season, but no fans can attend. That is also going to trickle down to lowering the salary cap and then contracts may adjust down to some degree along with that. There are a lot of factors and moving parts here. Heck, Jets don't even want to put out ~10M for 1 year on CB Logan. Does anyone think they want to put out a contract to Jamal that would have anywhere from 35-50M in guaranteed money?.

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7 minutes ago, UnknownJetFan said:

There will likely be huge losses even if there is a full season, but no fans can attend. That is also going to trickle down to lowering the salary cap and then contracts may adjust down to some degree along with that. There are a lot of factors and moving parts here. Heck, Jets don't even want to put out ~10M for 1 year on CB Logan. Does anyone think they want to put out a contract to Jamal that would have anywhere from 35-50M in guaranteed money?.

No doubt that next year's cap is going to take a downward hit, based upon less revenues. That is what the cap is comprised of.

As well, my bet is that free agent spending sprees, by and large on average, are going to take a hit also. Meaning less money spent on average players.

The Jets doling out a huge contract right now, without an educated look at what the cap may be next year would be reckless. That would be for ANY player. The Jets are under no gun to make a decision now. And an educated decision serves them best.

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16 minutes ago, UnknownJetFan said:

There will likely be huge losses even if there is a full season, but no fans can attend. That is also going to trickle down to lowering the salary cap and then contracts may adjust down to some degree along with that. There are a lot of factors and moving parts here. Heck, Jets don't even want to put out ~10M for 1 year on CB Logan. Does anyone think they want to put out a contract to Jamal that would have anywhere from 35-50M in guaranteed money?.

So I agree with everyone citing the potential significant loss of revenue this year for the league, and the potential effect that could have on the salary cap, but I also don't expect a crazy adjustment to the cap even in the worst case scenario where there isn't a season. I expect the league has already hammered out a variety of numbers and the way that they'll address next year's cap. It won't be a one year covid dip where teams can spend $170M next year but it'll be back up to $230M the following year. Much like teams can move money from one year to the next in the current CBA, the league will spread out this year's losses over a few seasons. 

Similar effect, less dramatic. Still doesn't make any sense to break the bank for a 6'1" 215lb guy who runs a 4.56 40, though. 

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Just a guess but when team Jamal opens the talks at $20 million/per that's a recipe for going no where quickly. I mean, if that's really what they're starting at it's just ridiculous. Douglas probably just walked away from the table and said something like, let's talk when you have more reasonable expectations.

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15 minutes ago, slats said:

So I agree with everyone citing the potential significant loss of revenue this year for the league, and the potential effect that could have on the salary cap, but I also don't expect a crazy adjustment to the cap even in the worst case scenario where there isn't a season. I expect the league has already hammered out a variety of numbers and the way that they'll address next year's cap. It won't be a one year covid dip where teams can spend $170M next year but it'll be back up to $230M the following year. Much like teams can move money from one year to the next in the current CBA, the league will spread out this year's losses over a few seasons. 

Similar effect, less dramatic. Still doesn't make any sense to break the bank for a 6'1" 215lb guy who runs a 4.56 40, though. 

Maybe it will affect the actual cap, maybe it won't.

But, with certain reduced revenues this year, teams will be looking at bottom line, and as a whole, spending less on free agents and players. It is just the way of business. You have less revenue last year, you spend less the following year. There may be a couple of mavericks out there, but as a whole I would not see it happening. Heck, FA money dried up this year, by and large.

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5 minutes ago, Scott Dierking said:

Maybe it will affect the actual cap, maybe it won't.

But, with certain reduced revenues this year, teams will be looking at bottom line, and as a whole, spending less on free agents and players. It is just the way of business. You have less revenue last year, you spend less the following year. There may be a couple of mavericks out there, but as a whole I would not see it happening. Heck, FA money dried up this year, by and large.

It's going to effect the cap, I'm just saying it won't be a one-year spike. 

And I agree that the "cash on hand," problem could definitely be an issue, too. There are a number of teams with plenty of cap space next year, though (like the Cheats), who will be in position to take advantage of the soft market. 

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Letter from the Jets to Jamal Adams.

Dear Mr. Adams

The NY Jets would be happy to to open discussions about the possibility of reworking your contract in order to give you financial security moving forward.  We would love to make you a Jet for life!  In order to reach such a deal now we needs you to understand the following two points.

Firstly you are trying to do all of this during a very uncertain time for the league in terms of the salary cap.  It might be better to wait for a time when the future salary cap numbers can be estimated with more accuracy on both sides.   We are not having these talks in a vacuum.  Stadiums are empty and revenues have fallen off a cliff across the professional sporting world.  But look, if it absolutely has to be now then you are going to have to take less money in order to get the deal done.  Think of it like trying to sell a house in the middle of a wildfire.  If you absolutely have to get it done now then the price has to come down. 

Secondly it simply is not the time to make a deal now in terms of your personal timeline.  You are under contract with the NY Jets for two more years and effectively for a third year after that given the rules around franchise tagging.  But let's not talk about that third year.  The NY Jets already own your NFL rights for the next two years at reasonable money.  If you want more money and longer years to provide you with personal financial security, then we are happy to do that deal but the starting point for negotiations is not zero.  We will discuss a four-year extension  for years 3 through 6 but the first two years are already in the books from a contract standpoint.

Here is our offer

2020 -  7.1M - Current deal

2021 - 9.8M - Current deal

2022 - 13.5M -  Discounted from 15M because of league cap uncertainty

2023 - 15M

2024 - 15M

2025 - 15M

Total (average)  = $14.625 P/Y for the *new* years making him the top paid safety in the league for those years

Total (average) = 12.5M P/Y reflects the fact the the Jets are not simply going to "tear up" the current deal.

Please note:

- The offer is only reduced to a very small degree as a result of the uncertain climate.  This is a concession from the NY Jets.

- The offer is being made at least two years early and it still gives you additional years at top dollars league wide for a safety.  This too is a concession from the Jets.

- It is generally bad business to redo a contract with a player in the media.  We have not done so in this or any other case.  By moving forward with this offer today it will give the impression that the NY Jets can be blackmailed.  This is not a good look and sets a terrible precedent.  Yet here we are making an offer anyway.  This represents a concession from the NY Jets. 

 

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14 hours ago, ljr said:

 

Disagree

JD (Jets brain trust) played this exactly as he should have

he said the generic P/R comments of "we'd like to have Jamal a Jet for life ... as he should have.

he had no intention of offering Jamal a contract yet (unless it was very team friendly) ... as he should not have

If Jamal didn't understand that only a very team friendly deal would make an extension happen at this time, then that's on him ... not JD

Jamal is the baby, this is no surprise to JD ... he saw the temper-tantrum at the trade deadline.

There is no reaping ... there is only maintaining the big picture plan that JD already has in place

And the $1mm question........ is Jamal part of that big picture?

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How anyone can remotely blame anyone but Adams for the point we are at now, is crazy to me. Especially if you include his hissy fit from last years trade deadline. 

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On 6/19/2020 at 3:54 PM, Rhg1084 said:

Early in the offseason Douglas publicly stated he was going to begin contract talks with Jamal. Then he completely went radio silent on the subject? I’m not trying to excuse Jamals diva behavior as of late. Just thought it was weird JD would make that proclamation then do nothing about it thus infuriating Jamal

Probably because he was going to?  I don't reccall him giving a date when the talks would start.  Maybe he was going to conduct the offseason, get his draft picks signed and then address Jamal?  I won't pretend to know, but what I do know is that he never promised a date it would happen by and I believe he did want Jamal to be a Jet for life.  Now?  No idea.

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29 minutes ago, EM31 said:

Letter from the Jets to Jamal Adams.

Dear Mr. Adams

The NY Jets would be happy to to open discussions about the possibility of reworking your contract in order to give you financial security moving forward.  We would love to make you a Jet for life!  In order to reach such a deal now we needs you to understand the following two points.

Firstly you are trying to do all of this during a very uncertain time for the league in terms of the salary cap.  It might be better to wait for a time when the future salary cap numbers can be estimated with more accuracy on both sides.   We are not having these talks in a vacuum.  Stadiums are empty and revenues have fallen off a cliff across the professional sporting world.  But look, if it absolutely has to be now then you are going to have to take less money in order to get the deal done.  Think of it like trying to sell a house in the middle of a wildfire.  If you absolutely have to get it done now then the price has to come down. 

Secondly it simply is not the time to make a deal now in terms of your personal timeline.  You are under contract with the NY Jets for two more years and effectively for a third year after that given the rules around franchise tagging.  But let's not talk about that third year.  The NY Jets already own your NFL rights for the next two years at reasonable money.  If you want more money and longer years to provide you with personal financial security, then we are happy to do that deal but the starting point for negotiations is not zero.  We will discuss a four-year extension  for years 3 through 6 but the first two years are already in the books from a contract standpoint.

Here is our offer

2020 -  7.1M - Current deal

2021 - 9.8M - Current deal

2022 - 13.5M -  Discounted from 15M because of league cap uncertainty

2023 - 15M

2024 - 15M

2025 - 15M

Total (average)  = $14.625 P/Y for the *new* years making him the top paid safety in the league for those years

Total (average) = 12.5M P/Y reflects the fact the the Jets are not simply going to "tear up" the current deal.

Please note:

- The offer is only reduced to a very small degree as a result of the uncertain climate.  This is a concession from the NY Jets.

- The offer is being made at least two years early and it still gives you additional years at top dollars league wide for a safety.  This too is a concession from the Jets.

- It is generally bad business to redo a contract with a player in the media.  We have not done so in this or any other case.  By moving forward with this offer today it will give the impression that the NY Jets can be blackmailed.  This is not a good look and sets a terrible precedent.  Yet here we are making an offer anyway.  This represents a concession from the NY Jets. 

 

I appreciate the work you put into this, but no. No extension offer this year. As you said in here, it's bad business. A bad precedent. Jamal Adams, no matter how special he may think he is, is not that special. 

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19 minutes ago, Anthony Jet said:

How anyone can remotely blame anyone but Adams for the point we are at now, is crazy to me. Especially if you include his hissy fit from last years trade deadline. 

The issue is that if a numb er of our usual dumbass jet fans on this forum knew exactly what kind of guy Adams was our front office should also know.  And knowing what type of guy Adams is you simply do not do anything to encourage his behaviour OR to give him any thoughts of the situation other than what it is because you know for sure he will cry like a baby and point at your words and thus win the media battle.

Adams is a shiny beaotch that Ive wanted gone for a long long time.

Our GM and owner have so far handled this not as well as they should have.

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4 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

The issue is that if a numb er of our usual dumbass jet fans on this forum knew exactly what kind of guy Adams was our front office should also know.  And knowing what type of guy Adams is you simply do not do anything to encourage his behaviour OR to give him any thoughts of the situation other than what it is because you know for sure he will cry like a baby and point at your words and thus win the media battle.

Adams is a shiny beaotch that Ive wanted gone for a long long time.

Our GM and owner have so far handled this not as well as they should have.

I’ll agree on the owner part. When Jamal went over the heads of the coach and GM not that the owner should’ve shut him down but somewhere in the shoulder to cry on he should’ve reminded him there is a power structure and allowing one member of the organization to undermine that makes the whole structure weaker moving forward 

As for the GM, I guess if we have to worry about everyone’s feelings in this day and age your right but as a Reasonable grown ass man I don’t see his comments or actions as anything wrong. Complimented the player without any specifics. Not much more he can be expected to do thru the media 

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59 minutes ago, section314 said:

And the $1mm question........ is Jamal part of that big picture?

sure if he sits tight on his current deal ... and learns to play nice with the other kids in the sandbox

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3 hours ago, slats said:

I appreciate the work you put into this, but no. No extension offer this year. As you said in here, it's bad business. A bad precedent. Jamal Adams, no matter how special he may think he is, is not that special. 

I understand your point but ultimately it all comes down to one side sacrificing something if the compensation from the other side is compelling enough.  If it is principle that is being sacrificed and if the compensation is big enough then in fact it does not create a bad precedent at all IMO.... Something along the lines of "No, we don't do deals early except where the player who is asking for such a deal is willing to bring his asking price down by 20%-25%" or some such.

Do i think Adams is willing to bring his price down by that much? No I don't but at that point we have removed one of his straw man excuses from the table.

The Jets are indeed willing to negotiate but Mr Adams is not.

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6 hours ago, Barry McCockinner said:

Just a guess but when team Jamal opens the talks at $20 million/per that's a recipe for going no where quickly. I mean, if that's really what they're starting at it's just ridiculous. Douglas probably just walked away from the table and said something like, let's talk when you have more reasonable expectations.

or he just did this, and walked out w/o a word spoken

nathan-fillion-coffee-spit-take.gif

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Good teams very rarely comment on player negotiations. This maybe is a sign of us starting to really do things properly. 

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