Jets "challenge" to put together OL

[slats]

26 minutes ago, Raideraholic said:

Becton could be a really good left tackle in time.  If you expect him to be that player in his first year, Jmo you’re probably setting yourself up for disappointment.    It might take him till year three before you start to see him really put it together.( See Trent Brown - took him a couple years ).    
Again that’s just my own opinion, and I could be wrong.   

I hope it’s quicker than a three year trajectory, but I definitely agree that he doesn’t have to start his career as a top LT -or even at LT- to go on to have a HoF level career. 
 

But if the Jets get Collins from the ‘Boys, I throw Becton out there on there on the left side and let him roll. Jets OL going from weakness to strengthen in one off season. 

[NYJ1]

On 6/25/2020 at 10:54 AM, JiF said:

The OL is the unit that has to work together more than any other on the team.  Continuity, reps, that stuff goes along way with the OL.  The Jets could be turning over 4 out of 5 positions this season with mediocre talent and not a lot of time to gel. I'm not sure that's equal footing as the rest of the league.  

I got a bad feeling about this season...

 

Very true. The fact is, all of the new players added are either big injury risks or their quite mediocre. Really the only proven guy is McGovern and he's proven to be mediocre. I find it hard to say the Jets could be as bad on the OL as they were last season, but worst case scenario they wouldn't be much better. Actually, best case scenario is probably no better than mediocre. Becton has huge potential but the rest have never been any better than guys fighting for a roster spot. I doubt any of them have very been the unspoken shoe in at a certain spot? I don't know if I have a bad feeling about this season? I figure it can't possibly be any worse than any of the last 5 seasons? The main thing that sticks out like a sore thumb is how little talent the Jets have? No matter how good your HC might be, he'll never be able to compensate for a lack of talent. Last season was actually a miracle coaching job by Gase.

[freestater]

On 6/25/2020 at 10:54 AM, JiF said:

The OL is the unit that has to work together more than any other on the team.  Continuity, reps, that stuff goes along way with the OL.  The Jets could be turning over 4 out of 5 positions this season with mediocre talent and not a lot of time to gel. I'm not sure that's equal footing as the rest of the league.  

I got a bad feeling about this season...

 

Our opening day o-line had not taken a single game snap together as a unit until week 1. I'm cautiously optimistic that we can buck that trend. 

[NYJ1]

On 6/25/2020 at 11:33 AM, slats said:

I know I'm in the minority, but this is one of the reasons I start Becton on the right side his rookie season as long as I feel like Fant can hold down the left side for a year. Gives him a chance to be an animal in the running game and work on his NFL pass protection while not worrying about Darnold's blind side. 

We shall see, but I think everyone is hoping Becton is a plug and play LT with short amount of instruction/coaching.

[NYJ1]

When the Jets were on the clock, and Wirfs and Becton were still there. I thought the choice was obvious. I was certain Douglas would take Wirfs. But I wasn't upset when Becton was selected. I thought Douglas just agreed with scouts that the long term was better with Becton?

[slats]

14 minutes ago, NYJ1 said:

When the Jets were on the clock, and Wirfs and Becton were still there. I thought the choice was obvious. I was certain Douglas would take Wirfs. But I wasn't upset when Becton was selected. I thought Douglas just agreed with scouts that the long term was better with Becton?

I’m right with you here. To me, Wirfs was the safer pick. I think the guy’s floor is perennial all star guard. Becton’s floor, just because of the uncertainty related to his size, is the IR. But his ceiling is HoF LT. I don’t know if I would’ve had the balls to make the same pick, but I really do appreciate the swing for the fences here. 

[RobR]

3 hours ago, Raideraholic said:

Becton could be a really good left tackle in time.  If you expect him to be that player in his first year, Jmo you’re probably setting yourself up for disappointment.    It might take him till year three before you start to see him really put it together.( See Trent Brown - took him a couple years ).    
Again that’s just my own opinion, and I could be wrong.   

I wish people would stop comparing Becton with Trent Brown and Orlando Brown. The only thing they have in common is height and weight, and that is where the comparisons should end.

Becton is a much better athlete than either Brown and if you watch his tape you'll see it. He's 365 lbs. and moves around like he's 300 lbs. There is a reason why many had him as the highest rated OT in the draft, myself included way before he was drafted. His ceiling is through the roof because we've never seen a man of his stature enter the NFL.....ever. I've even done the comparisons with Walter Jones and Ogden and Becton still is another level higher.

[RobR]

3 hours ago, Raideraholic said:

Becton could be a really good left tackle in time.  If you expect him to be that player in his first year, Jmo you’re probably setting yourself up for disappointment.    It might take him till year three before you start to see him really put it together.( See Trent Brown - took him a couple years ).    
Again that’s just my own opinion, and I could be wrong.   

Double post

[Sonny Werblin]

I can’t say what the jets O line will look like this year, but i am so looking forward to a future left side of Bechton and Clark. It is the second coming of Shell and Upshaw.

[RobR]

9 minutes ago, slats said:

Becton’s floor, just because of the uncertainty related to his size,

Why would you think his floor is the IR? He's never had any major injuries in the past and he's played quite a bit heavier than he is right now. Also if you look at some of these jumbo OT's you see less injury prone players.....it's a false narrative. Not too mention he's almost downright skinny for 365lbs.

Just appreciate him for the freak his is, because that's what he is.....a freak of nature. And now he's a Jet.

[slats]

Just now, RobR said:

Why would you think his floor is the IR? He's never had any major injuries in the past and he's played quite a bit heavier than he is right now. Also if you look at some of these jumbo OT's you see less injury prone players.....it's a false narrative. Not too mention he's almost downright skinny for 365lbs.

Just appreciate him for the freak his is, because that's what he is.....a freak of nature. And now he's a Jet.

Hey man, like I said, I appreciate the move by Douglas. I hope he and you are 100% right about Becton. I think you might be. But the dude is, as you say, freakishly big. I get that he’s a healthy big, but there just aren’t many comps out there for a 21-year-old his size. I just have an amateur’s concern about the knees on a guy that size holding up to an NFL career, for instance. And again, I like that JD ignored that concern. 

[RobR]

2 minutes ago, slats said:

But the dude is, as you say, freakishly big. I get that he’s a healthy big, but there just aren’t many comps out there for a 21-year-old his size. I just have an amateur’s concern about the knees on a guy that size holding up to an NFL career, for instance.

I don't get the concern because most of the bigger players at his position have been healthy throughout their careers. Look at guys like Ogden and Jones who I mentioned before.....they don't have any injury histories that some on the board are speculating because of his large size. It's a false narrative that for some reason is being propagated here on JN.

[TNJet]

On 6/25/2020 at 11:33 AM, slats said:

I know I'm in the minority, but this is one of the reasons I start Becton on the right side his rookie season as long as I feel like Fant can hold down the left side for a year. Gives him a chance to be an animal in the running game and work on his NFL pass protection while not worrying about Darnold's blind side. 

If we go with Fant on the blindside Sam will be injured soon. If this is our best option we better resign Beachum immediately.

[bitonti]

16 hours ago, RobR said:

I wish people would stop comparing Becton with Trent Brown and Orlando Brown. The only thing they have in common is height and weight, and that is where the comparisons should end.

Becton is a much better athlete than either Brown and if you watch his tape you'll see it. He's 365 lbs. and moves around like he's 300 lbs. There is a reason why many had him as the highest rated OT in the draft, myself included way before he was drafted. His ceiling is through the roof because we've never seen a man of his stature enter the NFL.....ever. I've even done the comparisons with Walter Jones and Ogden and Becton still is another level higher.

there he is 

I was going to tell the original poster

just wait until your RobR gets home from work

there's gonna be a spanking 

just you wait, Mister.

[LIJetsFan]

On 6/26/2020 at 11:31 AM, TheMo said:

Look you can't rely on just one piece of information to discount a guy. PFF isn't this final word people take it to be. They are a bunch of guys like us who look at the television tape we do and have a great system that they apply to prospects. Why people seem to hold them in any higher regard than a poster is beyond me. 

Becton probably is better at run blocking than pass at this time. But that doesn't mean his pass blocking isn't good, just means his run blocking is awesome. 

I'd like to add by asking a question.  Who do you think has studied more and knows more about Becton, PFF or the Jets?  Who do you think has more well schooled and more highly skilled evaluators on staff, PFF or the Jets?   (and please no lame SOJ snarky comments from the peanut gallery)      

[Jet Nut]

On 6/25/2020 at 10:56 AM, FidelioJet said:

The o-line is still very questionable.

Basically a bunch of back-ups from other teams and the #11 overall pick that wasn’t a particularly good pass blocker in college.

Have we upgraded? Probably. How much? We don’t really know.

Not being able to work together sooner will hurt this team more than others.

Wasn’t a particularly good pass blacker in college?

OK, still selling this?  

[Jet Nut]

On 6/25/2020 at 11:21 AM, FidelioJet said:

Pass blocking grader - 58th percentile of Tackles in college.   That’s not good! 

How do you think that’s going to translate to the NFL.  Anyone not terrified by those numbers simply isn’t paying attention or sticking your head in the sand.

 

Pretty much would rather you watched him play than read PFF and get terrified 

 

[Philc1]

On 6/28/2020 at 7:23 PM, RobR said:

Why would you think his floor is the IR? He's never had any major injuries in the past and he's played quite a bit heavier than he is right now. Also if you look at some of these jumbo OT's you see less injury prone players.....it's a false narrative. Not too mention he's almost downright skinny for 365lbs.

Just appreciate him for the freak his is, because that's what he is.....a freak of nature. And now he's a Jet.

Becton is only 5 pounds heavier than Trent Brown

 

I’m so sick of the Becton haters acting like he’s 400 pounds

 

[Philc1]

21 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Wasn’t a particularly good pass blacker in college?

Well yeah but that assessment would actually require watching tape of him at Louisville and not simply relying on a dumb soundbyte by Tony Pauline

[Philc1]

On 6/25/2020 at 10:53 AM, rangerous said:

yep.  i read this too. these guys all need to get into training camp.  it does look like they have upgraded the overall talent on the oline and much as beachum played well it's not like any team is ringing his phone off the hook at the moment.

That’s my biggest concern

 

Shortened TC and preseason means less time for the new starters to learn Gase’s playbook

 

[Jet Nut]

On 6/25/2020 at 2:33 PM, FidelioJet said:

I’m not saying he’s not going to be a good player but there is a TON of risk there. IMO, WIRF’s was the safer pick

SAFER PICK.  Where have I heard that before?  
Let me think.  

Oh yeah, wasnt that what Maccagnan always went with.  Took the safe route.  Was a major reason he deserved to get the hook and should have gotten it sooner

[Philc1]

Just now, Jet Nut said:

SAFER PICK.  Where have I heard that before?  
Let me think.  

Oh yeah, was what Maccagnan always went with.  Took the safe route.  Was a major reason he deserved to get the hook and should have gotten it sooner

The “safer pick” is a guy who didn’t even play Left Tackle in college 

 

What is this nonsense?

[Jet Nut]

36 minutes ago, LIJetsFan said:

I'd like to add by asking a question.  Who do you think has studied more and knows more about Becton, PFF or the Jets?  Who do you think has more well schooled and more highly skilled evaluators on staff, PFF or the Jets?   (and please no lame SOJ snarky comments from the peanut gallery)      

Too bad Joe Douglas didn’t bring any experience into this draft.  
 

Like maybe if he were an OL or something.

[rangerous]

9 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

That’s my biggest concern

 

Shortened TC and preseason means less time for the new starters to learn Gase’s playbook

 

i think too many fans look at the oline and think they need an all pro or top 10 person at every position.  talent is nice to have but the oline really needs to be able to play together and learn the blocking schemes.  it takes time.  the top guys usually have more physical ability to overcome mistakes.  a second tier guy who doesn't make mistakes will be equally valuable.

[Raideraholic]

7 hours ago, Philc1 said:

Becton is only 5 pounds heavier than Trent Brown

 

I’m so sick of the Becton haters acting like he’s 400 pounds

 

TRENT Brown goes 380

[Philc1]

13 hours ago, rangerous said:

i think too many fans look at the oline and think they need an all pro or top 10 person at every position.  talent is nice to have but the oline really needs to be able to play together and learn the blocking schemes.  it takes time.  the top guys usually have more physical ability to overcome mistakes.  a second tier guy who doesn't make mistakes will be equally valuable.

OL’s need time to gel.  The 2008 OL everyone raves about they were shaky the first few games that season I saw Woody and Faneca turnstile it up several times 

[Philc1]

6 hours ago, Raideraholic said:

TRENT Brown goes 380

He’s 358, Becton is 363

[Raideraholic]

8 hours ago, Philc1 said:

He’s 358, Becton is 363

GO to any  Patriots board and ask what weight Trent Brown played for them.   380 pounds .       It’s like in college they list a Wr 6’5 band turns out he’s 6’3 .

https://www.forbes.com/sites/oliverthomas/2018/11/27/trent-brown-a-very-unique-left-tackle-for-bill-belichick-patriots/#21713ae6697a

Excerpt : Brown, officially listed at 6-foot-8 and 380 pounds, has a way of making those around him look like kindling in contrast.

But looks have proven to be deceiving when it comes to the New England Patriots’ starting left tackle.

Brown can also move like one.

 

[Kleckineau]

There is a lot of raw meat filling the o line positions. I would feel a little better if some one like Callahan Scarnechia or Munchak or any other proven teacher were cooking this meal. I am not too bullish on Pollack coaching these guys up.

[rangerous]

9 hours ago, Philc1 said:

OL’s need time to gel.  The 2008 OL everyone raves about they were shaky the first few games that season I saw Woody and Faneca turnstile it up several times 

exactly.  even last season's oline played much better once they had a chance to play together at the end of the season.  i think sometimes fans forget it's a team game and probably more of a team game than any other pro sport.

[Philc1]

2 hours ago, Raideraholic said:

GO to any  Patriots board and ask what weight Trent Brown played for them.   380 pounds .       It’s like in college they list a Wr 6’5 band turns out he’s 6’3 .

https://www.forbes.com/sites/oliverthomas/2018/11/27/trent-brown-a-very-unique-left-tackle-for-bill-belichick-patriots/#21713ae6697a

Excerpt : Brown, officially listed at 6-foot-8 and 380 pounds, has a way of making those around him look like kindling in contrast.

But looks have proven to be deceiving when it comes to the New England Patriots’ starting left tackle.

Brown can also move like one.

 

Ok fair enough then he weighs more than Becton 

[Philc1]

1 hour ago, rangerous said:

exactly.  even last season's oline played much better once they had a chance to play together at the end of the season.  i think sometimes fans forget it's a team game and probably more of a team game than any other pro sport.

I guess the reason Winters is still sticking around is he already knows Gase’s system and won’t need time to learn

 

But he still sucks

 

[rangerous]

47 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

I guess the reason Winters is still sticking around is he already knows Gase’s system and won’t need time to learn

 

But he still sucks

 

i don't know.  unless van roten or even the rookie can't play the position as good i can't see winters sticking.  his cap number is too high for his ability.

[THE BARON]

On 6/25/2020 at 11:33 AM, slats said:

I know I'm in the minority, but this is one of the reasons I start Becton on the right side his rookie season as long as I feel like Fant can hold down the left side for a year. Gives him a chance to be an animal in the running game and work on his NFL pass protection while not worrying about Darnold's blind side. 

I have been saying the same thing since prior to Beckton being drafted.  He has little to no pass blocking experience.  That does not come quickly, either.  There is going to be a learning curve.  I will be shocked if Beckton can actually start on the left side.  I'm all but positive we will see Fant there.  And don't be too surprised of Beckton has growing pains even on the right side.  He is an exciting draft pick due  to the combination of speed and size, but he had no pro-preparatory work in college.  He was used like a bull dozer.  

[RobR]

1 hour ago, THE BARON said:

I have been saying the same thing since prior to Beckton being drafted.  He has little to no pass blocking experience.  That does not come quickly, either.  There is going to be a learning curve.  I will be shocked if Beckton can actually start on the left side.  I'm all but positive we will see Fant there.  And don't be too surprised of Beckton has growing pains even on the right side.  He is an exciting draft pick due  to the combination of speed and size, but he had no pro-preparatory work in college.  He was used like a bull dozer.  

Maybe you can explain to me how a three year starter in the ACC, who passblocked for QB's that threw for almost 10,000 yards has no passblocking experience. I can't seem to wrap my head around that one, or the multiple videos I've posted right here of Becton, not Beckton passblocking.

No "pro-preparatory work in college", lmao you can't make this stuff up.