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Interesting Take on Darnold

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2 hours ago, Trolly McTrollface said:

Forget how anyone here feels about Darnold for just a second...

That has to be the craziest explanation for the Jets history of poor QB play I’v ever read, and I’ve been reading about this team for over 50 years.

That last paragraph is beyond words. 

 

The explanation is pretty simple-The league has been trending towards offense and the Jets have been prioritizing defense. 

Since 1995 here is the list of first round picks Jets have used on offense 

Kyle Brady

Keyshawn Johnson

Chad Pennington

Anthony Becht

Santana Moss

DBrickashaw Ferguson

Nick Mangold

Dustin Keller

Mark Sanchez

Sam Darnold

Mehki Becton

 


 

 

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6 hours ago, GreekJet said:

The explanation is pretty simple-The league has been trending towards offense and the Jets have been prioritizing defense. 

Since 1995 here is the list of first round picks Jets have used on offense 

Kyle Brady

Keyshawn Johnson

Chad Pennington

Anthony Becht

Santana Moss

DBrickashaw Ferguson

Nick Mangold

Dustin Keller

Mark Sanchez

Sam Darnold

Mehki Becton

 


 

 

Ok, I’ll bite. 

Show me how listing our first round picks “explains very simply” his theory that “the national and local media, along with the fan calling for players heads midway through the first quarter”are to blame for the Jets not developing QBs?

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15 hours ago, PepPep said:

  Like me, I think most fans see Darnold as a promising young QB with a bright future, because right now you don't really know what he'll end up as- its too early.

You can't look at the two seasons he's been in the league so far, at 23, on the Jet teams he's played on and DEFINITIVELY tell me 'it's not going to happen for him'.

HOF QB's show flashes from day 1 moment 1 

they take over games

Pro Bowl QB's show flashes, even when they are rookies or when the OL is less than ideal.

Is he a star? honest question. Does anyone in the world other than Jets fans think this guy is decent? 

15 hours ago, Jet_Engine1 said:

Weapons? Really? Back to Geno sh*t, now?

No. How about a competent O line? Jesus ****, Jets fans just suck, and yes, you suck the most Matt!

I am the way the Jets made me 

if Sam Darnold becomes elite I'll come back here with a bouquet of roses for all those who got offended

and my sincerest apologies

the thing is, i don't think that's how it's going to go down 

I'm prepared making these predictions 

what's the worst that could happen? I'm wrong and they win a Super Bowl? 

golly gee, heaven forbid 

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15 hours ago, Mogglez said:

Then don't talk football with people who aren't totally miserable f*cks.

so you want me to avoid all my fellow jets fans

15 hours ago, Mogglez said:

If you don't root for the team to win games and parade around like some know it all better-than-you "fan", you're a loser. Plain and simple.

Me?  I'm no one of importance.  No one here is.   I've had this username since 2007.  You want a medal for the 2 years you have on me?  The difference between us is, you have a smug attitude and act like you have some sort of obligation and authority to tell people that they're ridiculous for rooting for their team and the players on it.  Meanwhile you have the track record of a 14 year old draft blogger who just discovered what a keyboard and mouse is, and reading some of your posts and evaluations, no, you really haven't learned much since 2005 or 2009.  

Given all that, ask yourself your own question.  Why should anyone give a sh*t what you have to say when you were pulling this same lecturing bullsh*t 15 years ago with Dewayne Robertson and 11 years ago with Gholston?

Lastly, looking at the reactions to my post calling you out, I'm not the only one sick of you acting like this.

Yes I've been wrong "Rooting" for this team in the past

 

Humans replace all the cells in their body every seven years or so ago, we were literally different people back then

 

I'm not trying to lecture, I'm trying to make predictions. 

The Draft, The Weather, Science Fiction, The Stock Market, Gambling ATS, these are all "future prediction" activities

I ask people to make signature bets to donate to charity of the winner's choice (and the board will attest, I've followed through on my losses, despite several losers welching on their bets. 

Is Welching a PC term? Is it offensive to the Welches Grape people?  

Anyway I get how it could seem like lecturing. the point of all this is I'm trying to see things from all sides and I want people to have skin the game. 

DRob by the way none of us knew how bad his knee was when he was drafted. I'm not a Doctor. The NY Jets pay people for that. Or are supposed to. at least. The real Drob story he was drafted high in a weak draft, he wore out what little knee he had left playing for this team and then he was done.

The Gholston story was about a perfect workout warrior who end of the day probably has some mental illness. Just not the good "Ray Lewis" kind. These are both opportunities for learning. 

Your post got reactions because it was funny it was also kind of complimentary to me 

that you'd look up my posts from 2005 on a board I no longer post here, a place most of us is a pile of sh*t pancakes and take the time to screenshot and upload

all that is attention. I like attention. It means I'm thought of and remembered even after I'm gone.

So thanks, friend. 

believe it or not I've been right too... many many times...  Wrong is funny... "credibility" left the building along with Elvis. 

In closing it was nice to talk to you James Robert Mogglez the third. 

 

tell the stoolsprayers back at JI to look up my posts about the Iraq war being a bad idea in 2002 if you want to look at post about someone being right 

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1 hour ago, bitonti said:

HOF QB's show flashes from day 1 moment 1 

they take over games

Pro Bowl QB's show flashes, even when they are rookies or when the OL is less than ideal.

Is he a star? honest question. Does anyone in the world other than Jets fans think this guy is decent? 

I am the way the Jets made me 

if Sam Darnold becomes elite I'll come back here with a bouquet of roses for all those who got offended

and my sincerest apologies

the thing is, i don't think that's how it's going to go down 

I'm prepared making these predictions 

what's the worst that could happen? I'm wrong and they win a Super Bowl? 

golly gee, heaven forbid 

All of my post was entirely tongue in cheek, I'm glad we don't talk about many contentious issues here anymore, because aside from outside stuff,  I always appreciate your musings ( you and Warfish are now the heart of the "Shut up and Show me" contingent"). 

I like Sam. I hope hes our FQB for the next 15, but I think the Jets core problems really aren't fixable, and that the fish stinks from the head. 50 years of poor ownership and management, bad decisions, terrible PR moves, awful drafting, ridiculous hirings and firings, terrible roster management,  a schizophrenic head coach, and a reputation as a poorly run circus of a franchise are all simply too much to expect a 23 year old kid to fix on his own. FFS, the franchise Trades up to draft a QB at #3 overall, and their next pick is a 25 year old DT from a Community College program.....and the following year, they go DT in the first...LOL. 

 

Sam has no real chance in NY, does he? Its going to be painful watching him flounder and Gase get crazier as Danny Dimes becomes the next Matt Ryan. 

 

Anyway, I guess you missed the 😆 at the end of my post...

 

The Goddamned Jets.

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3 minutes ago, Jet_Engine1 said:

Anyway, I guess you missed the 😆 at the end of my post...

The Goddamned Jets.

the internet is a tough place for nuance 

I do think it is possible for someone to succeed in this hellhole

but the guy has to be an underdog

not the type of person who's enjoyed life as QB1 at Puss and Sunshine Univesity 

Everyone has to lean into who they really are 

the jets are Jamal Adams and the Honey Badger, best case

guys who get crapped on by Bama 9 years out of 10 and "DGAF"  

they are never going to be favorites or the choice of the Haircut and sailboat crowd

those people are called Giants fans 

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4 minutes ago, bitonti said:

the internet is a tough place for nuance 

I do think it is possible for someone to succeed in this hellhole

but the guy has to be an underdog

not the type of person who's enjoyed life as QB1 at Puss and Sunshine Univesity

Everyone has to lean into who they really are 

the jets are Jamal Adams and the Honey Badger, best case

guys who get crapped on by Bama 9 years out of 10 and "DGAF"  

they are never going to be favorites or the choice of the Haircut and sailboat crowd

those people are called Giants fans 

Does Jim Harbaugh have a kid playing QB anywhere? 

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Late to the topic, but the two hurdles at play here are the O-line and Adam Gase. He had absolutely no chance at times in the pocket. Also, Gase still thought it was a good idea to call long developing routes from receivers last year, knowing how bad the line was......

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1 minute ago, Jet_Engine1 said:

Does Jim Harbaugh have a kid playing QB anywhere? 

half of these kids of QBs end up quitting like Elways's kid at ASU. they grow up rich. 

I know everyone assumes this is a trolling statement but honestly, look at James Morgan. He's going to get snaps when (not if) Darnold becomes unavailable again - they used a 4th rd pick on him for a reason 

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, BroadwayBen said:

Gase still thought it was a good idea to call long developing routes from receivers last year, knowing how bad the line was......

BINGO!!!

Jackpot GIFs | Tenor

 

Thank you................

People who support Gase 100% don't get the fact that a causual review of games from last year shows it took Gase almost until midseason to realize that 1) Long developing play were to be avoided and 2) becuase our OL was so horrific it might help Sam out to have a safety release valve underneath!

I'm just praying that Sam has enough football moxie to move Gase along so that we can finally see positive results!

I'm Bullish on Sam and yes even Gase for this year...

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4 hours ago, bitonti said:

HOF QB's show flashes from day 1 moment 1 

they take over games

Pro Bowl QB's show flashes, even when they are rookies or when the OL is less than ideal.

Is he a star? honest question. Does anyone in the world other than Jets fans think this guy is decent? 

I am the way the Jets made me 

if Sam Darnold becomes elite I'll come back here with a bouquet of roses for all those who got offended

and my sincerest apologies

the thing is, i don't think that's how it's going to go down 

I'm prepared making these predictions 

what's the worst that could happen? I'm wrong and they win a Super Bowl? 

golly gee, heaven forbid 

Seriously?  Drew Brees , Eli Manning, Peyton Manning, John Elway, Joe Montana, Steve Young, Jim Kelly all had slow starts

You know you really fooled me.  Up till this point I thought you knew something

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1 hour ago, Charlie Brown said:

BINGO!!!

Jackpot GIFs | Tenor

 

Thank you................

People who support Gase 100% don't get the fact that a causual review of games from last year shows it took Gase almost until midseason to realize that 1) Long developing play were to be avoided and 2) becuase our OL was so horrific it might help Sam out to have a safety release valve underneath!

I'm just praying that Sam has enough football moxie to move Gase along so that we can finally see positive results!

I'm Bullish on Sam and yes even Gase for this year...

Pretty sure that particular group of people is down to SAR I, and anyone who wants a ride in his BMW to the game. 

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18 minutes ago, Bowles Movement said:

Seriously?  Drew Brees , Eli Manning, Peyton Manning, John Elway, Joe Montana, Steve Young, Jim Kelly all had slow starts

You know you really fooled me.  Up till this point I thought you knew something

why are you comparing Sam to HOFers?

u know the list of people who were drafted high and failed with slow starts dwarfs this list significantly, right?

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15 minutes ago, slats said:

Pretty sure that particular group of people is down to SAR I, and anyone who wants a ride in his BMW to the game. 

exactly, i think i'd represent the highest possible evaluation of Gase and that is "meh" with a dose of , if it doesnt get better, gtfoh!!

 

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1 hour ago, Losmeister said:

why are you comparing Sam to HOFers?

u know the list of people who were drafted high and failed with slow starts dwarfs this list significantly, right?

Because all of these Hall of Famers had slow an less than impressive starts to their careers despite Bitontis assertion that greatness is apparent at first snap.

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2 minutes ago, Bowles Movement said:

Because all of these Hall of Famers had slow an less than impressive starts to their careers despite Bitontis assertion that greatness is apparent at first snap.

If the Jets had any of those guys, the fans and the tabloids would have torn into the franchise about how they were just another Jets QB bust.

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34 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

plenty who have failed, and there have been plenty that have risen

no. the list on the one end is significantly longer than the other.

please understand...  i am HOPING...   i really am...       the odds are just not in our favor...

i look forward to a future where i say

" I was SO doubtful, but i was wrong and boy am happy as a pig in schitt that I was!!"

 

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13 minutes ago, Losmeister said:

no. the list on the one end is significantly longer than the other.

please understand...  i am HOPING...   i really am...       the odds are just not in our favor...

i look forward to a future where i say

" I was SO doubtful, but i was wrong and boy am happy as a pig in schitt that I was!!"

 

I get it.  We've squabbled on this enough to know eachothers stances lol.  I'm just adding to the discussion. 

I'm glad that you can at least admit you're rooting for the player to do well, unlike the resident "draft guru".

I can't stand Jamal Adams.  Neither can a lot of people here right now.  I think we can all agree that we'll still root for him to help the team as long as he wears Green and White.

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@Mogglez

ffs  I have craved a top ten qb my whole sodding life as a jet fan...  it's easy to root for Sam

.. hes a great kid...I just have jets induced ptsd... 

no more...  his numbers make me doubt..   no more

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13 hours ago, Trolly McTrollface said:

Ok, I’ll bite. 

Show me how listing our first round picks “explains very simply” his theory that “the national and local media, along with the fan calling for players heads midway through the first quarter”are to blame for the Jets not developing QBs?

**** history. Here's some current events for you...

 

In 2018 the clueless hack who was pretending to be GM traded a boatload of picks to move up to #3 overall to draft a QB for the pathetic Offense his team had been fielding for 2 years. His next pick? A 25 year old DT from a Community College program.  

 

The following year, genius decides to.....draft an undersized DT with his first pick. 

 

LOL. 

 

You aren't stupid, and I know a lot of it is schtick at this point, but putting a QB behind a disaster if an O line, with garbage skill players surrounding him, and then blaming the QB for not "elevating" the mob of UPS drivers and Club bouncers masquerading as NFL players, with a sprinkling of journeymen and veteran castoffs thrown in is absurd. 

 

Kelvin "weakest OT in Football" Beachum, Old Man Khalil, Broken Winters, and the epic tandem of Art Shells Grand-nephew and Chuma Edoga (lol) rounding it out? Please. I think a 40 year old Dan Marino would find a way to contract Mono too if that's what he had for protection. 

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23 hours ago, Trolly McTrollface said:

Ok, I’ll bite. 

Show me how listing our first round picks “explains very simply” his theory that “the national and local media, along with the fan calling for players heads midway through the first quarter”are to blame for the Jets not developing QBs?

Look at that list-it tells a story. The Jets draft QBs and then pour their resources into the defense. Good offenses typically invest first round picks into that side of the ball. 

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10 hours ago, Jet_Engine1 said:

**** history. Here's some current events for you...

 

In 2018 the clueless hack who was pretending to be GM traded a boatload of picks to move up to #3 overall to draft a QB for the pathetic Offense his team had been fielding for 2 years. His next pick? A 25 year old DT from a Community College program.  

 

The following year, genius decides to.....draft an undersized DT with his first pick. 

 

LOL. 

 

You aren't stupid, and I know a lot of it is schtick at this point, but putting a QB behind a disaster if an O line, with garbage skill players surrounding him, and then blaming the QB for not "elevating" the mob of UPS drivers and Club bouncers masquerading as NFL players, with a sprinkling of journeymen and veteran castoffs thrown in is absurd. 

 

Kelvin "weakest OT in Football" Beachum, Old Man Khalil, Broken Winters, and the epic tandem of Art Shells Grand-nephew and Chuma Edoga (lol) rounding it out? Please. I think a 40 year old Dan Marino would find a way to contract Mono too if that's what he had for protection. 

You forgot the Osemele debacle also... look, I get it. We all know about the OL. It was bad. I realize that, and I give Bell and Darnold a bit of a pass for having to line up behind it. Bell even more so, in fact.

Here’s the thing though.

Take a look at the OLs most QBs drafted high in the 1st round have in front of them.... we talk often here about Murray, Mayfield, and Jones. Their OL were very bad also. Bad teams pick high in the 1st...

Josh Allen, when drafted had the same bad OL issue. To the Bills credit they addressed it after his rookie year... which brings me to the fact maybe the Jets could have addressed it had they just stayed where they were in the 18 draft, and taken a QB, instead of giving the Colts the #6 pick and 3 second rounders.

Do you think another QB and  those 3 2nds might have helped improve this team more than Sam has in two years? I do. Do you look back and say the trade has worked out for us? I don’t.

i know it’s not Sam’s fault we moved up, Macc didn’t think he’d be there. He was probably moving up to get Baker, but the price we paid for him is something Sam has to own, and overcome.

After two years we’re looking at basically the same situation we were going into the ‘18 season. A young QB, who we hope will be good, yet we really have no idea if he will be. That’s frustrating.

Bottom line? Bad OL, bad GM, lack of weapons, whatever. if you’re being honest, I think you’d say you expected to see more from Darnold than he’s shown.

49 minutes ago, GreekJet said:

Look at that list-it tells a story. The Jets draft QBs and then pour their resources into the defense. Good offenses typically invest first round picks into that side of the ball. 

I was referring to the “the local and national media and fans midway through the first quarter...” narrative.

Still not sure what the list has to do with that, but apparently, that’s on me. 😉

 

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12 hours ago, Losmeister said:

@Mogglez

ffs  I have craved a top ten qb my whole sodding life as a jet fan...  it's easy to root for Sam

.. hes a great kid...I just have jets induced ptsd... 

no more...  his numbers make me doubt..   no more

I'm with you my friend. I tend to take a more positive spin than you. But still he has to cut out the completely idiotic stuff where he is waiting too long and either throws an interception trying to force something or a takes a sack. It was almost predictable and you wanted to shake him. He's a talented guy with what appears to be a solid work ethic. But with hopefully a better line and a passable set of weapons he needs to be in the close to top 10 statistically for me to continue being optimistic.

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32 minutes ago, TheMo said:

I'm with you my friend. I tend to take a more positive spin than you. But still he has to cut out the completely idiotic stuff where he is waiting too long and either throws an interception trying to force something or a takes a sack. It was almost predictable and you wanted to shake him. He's a talented guy with what appears to be a solid work ethic. But with hopefully a better line and a passable set of weapons he needs to be in the close to top 10 statistically for me to continue being optimistic.

He will always have a gunslinger mentality and I surely don't want to change that (i.e. Favre).  But he just has to STOP throwing it up for grabs when none of his guys are open.  He does it constantly and even when there is little pressure at times.  Immature for sure.  That's all in his head.

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43 minutes ago, TheMo said:

I'm with you my friend. I tend to take a more positive spin than you. But still he has to cut out the completely idiotic stuff where he is waiting too long and either throws an interception trying to force something or a takes a sack. It was almost predictable and you wanted to shake him. He's a talented guy with what appears to be a solid work ethic. But with hopefully a better line and a passable set of weapons he needs to be in the close to top 10 statistically for me to continue being optimistic.

Exactly.

Despite the way people want to spin it, guys like me, @Dunnie @Losmeister, @bitontiand @Villain The Foe are Jets fans who would like nothing better than to see Darnold become a top 10 QB.

None of us derive any pleasure from, or enjoy seeing him play like a bottom 5 QB.  We understand that he doesn’t have a lot of help around him, however we also think that Darnold has not performed very well either.

 If that annoys people, that’s fine, they’re being a “good fan” and supporting their guy, I suppose.

We have two years in the books now, and there are a lot more people voicing “concerns” about Sam, both here and in the media. But there isn’t one of us “Doubters” who want to end up being on the right side of this argument.

We’d be very happy to take an L here, and be reminded of it for years.

 

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16 hours ago, Losmeister said:

no. the list on the one end is significantly longer than the other.

please understand...  i am HOPING...   i really am...       the odds are just not in our favor...

i look forward to a future where i say

" I was SO doubtful, but i was wrong and boy am happy as a pig in schitt that I was!!"

 

And I predict you will be saying that by the end of 2021 at the latest.  

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1 hour ago, Trolly McTrollface said:

You forgot the Osemele debacle also... look, I get it. We all know about the OL. It was bad. I realize that, and I give Bell and Darnold a bit of a pass for having to line up behind it. Bell even more so, in fact.

 

where have you given Darnold any kind of "pass"?  please post the link.  Not buying in. 

And please just stop with the copmparisons of yourself to @Losmeister or @bitonti who have both through the years have been obvious Jets fans with deep concerns and love for the team.  Somehow you don't match up in that regard.  And I don't see their screen names tarred and feathered like yours.  So it's not any surprise to anyone either.

I gotta get outa here for the day.  Letting a troll get a tad under my skin.  You win McFly... McTroll

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13 minutes ago, Dcat said:

He will always have a gunslinger mentality and I surely don't want to change that (i.e. Favre).  But he just has to STOP throwing it up for grabs when none of his guys are open.  He does it constantly and even when there is little pressure at times.  Immature for sure.  That's all in his head.

When he sees guys open for an easy first down you take that. The idea is eventually teams will be forced to clamp those down allowing you the opportunity for the big shots down field that he seems to want to take too often. Brady and Manning made HOF careers out of those throws. Not asking him to be Pennington post injury, hope it didn't sound like that. 

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10 minutes ago, Dcat said:

He will always have a gunslinger mentality and I surely don't want to change that (i.e. Favre).  But he just has to STOP throwing it up for grabs when none of his guys are open.  He does it constantly and even when there is little pressure at times.  Immature for sure.  That's all in his head.

Most of his bad decision making tends to come from trying to do too much. He has to break that thinking. That's difficult to do, though, when your $13M/year star RB is netting 3.2 ypc and your #1 WR is Robby Anderson. 

I'm optimistic that with improvements to the offense so will come improvements with Darnold, but I'm not completely sold on the improvements yet this year, either. I keep talking about hoping for a strong finish from this team this year because I expect another slow start. 

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On 7/3/2020 at 3:05 AM, GreekJet said:

The explanation is pretty simple-The league has been trending towards offense and the Jets have been prioritizing defense. 

Since 1995 here is the list of first round picks Jets have used on offense 

Kyle Brady

Keyshawn Johnson

Chad Pennington

Anthony Becht

Santana Moss

DBrickashaw Ferguson

Nick Mangold

Dustin Keller

Mark Sanchez

Sam Darnold

Mehki Becton

 


 

 

So close to 50% of the time they went offense?  

And Id bet the rest of their picks work out to around 50% offense. 

Its more of a case that their offensive picks, after the 1st round, sucked and didnt pan out.  When they have gone offense with their 1sts, they've been pretty solid

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I have two questions:

Does @bitonti really think Darnold hasn't flashed potential and WTF does IAYIPA ONTST% mean? 

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19 hours ago, Losmeister said:

why are you comparing Sam to HOFers?

u know the list of people who were drafted high and failed with slow starts dwarfs this list significantly, right?

Because they all had slow starts.

Elway was benched.

It was a pretty simple concept to grasp.

Better question is why do you trash a 22 year old, 2 year QB at every turn?

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