Gase Malaise - I Tried

[JetsLife]

Hope I'm wrong, but I can't shake what many of us have felt from the beginning - Gase is an OC at best (maybe a good OC). But he's not a NFL HC and never will be.

Way too much data indicating he doesn't have what it takes to lead a team to to a title, much less consistent playoff berths. 6-10, 7-9, 9-7, 5-11 - yes sure. But to take a team all the way? 

Obviously none of this is news nor rocket science - seems around 65% of Jets nation including me hated the hire, understood Gase was a charlatan as an HC, yet another moronic Johnson hire. Not least he had a zero track record as a HC - so Johnson entrusts his franchise and young potential franchise QB to such results?

Yet going in to last season I re-upped my season tix after some seasons off in hopes it could pan out. As I watched week 1 v Buffalo at home that putrescent Jets offense go 3 & out time and again, putting up 16 points total off 4 first half turnovers - I knew then I'd stop payment on my season tix after the Cleveland MNF game I'd promised to go to with my brother. I was reminded then how much of a game day incompetent Gase can be.

It sucks as I think he could be competent on a weekly basis if he wanted to. But he simply lacks the proper killer instinct to see it done. He's comfortable with winning a meaningless battle while losing the war. I tried with Gase and I hope I'm wrong.

[SAR I]

SAR I 

[Warfish]

We'll see this year.

What else is there to say at this point?

It's all been said.  Pro and Con,

So let's just see.

[#27TheDominator]

I don't see any reason to worry about him if you think he is a good OC.  Everything about being a head coach seems okay.  Won the power struggle?  Check. Took command of the roster?  Check.   Didn't want to pay a ton for a RB?   Didn't lose the team during a disastrous stretch?  Worked with Darnold to improve during the season?  Check, check, check.  The main issue I have is that he doesn't seem to be a very good OC.  

[ljr]

22 minutes ago, JetsLife said:

Hope I'm wrong, but I can't shake what many of us have felt from the beginning - Gase is an OC at best (maybe a good OC). But he's not a NFL HC and never will be.

 

 

so far I'm less happy with his OC performance than his HC performance

 

[jetscrazey]

Gase has 1 year to prove 2019 wasn't a fluke and he's willing to evolve. 

[Beerfish]

No he is not a good oc at all.  He has totally been in charge of the offense side of the ball in his hc years and the offenses have been consistently terrible.

[SAR I]

23 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

No he is not a good oc at all.  He has totally been in charge of the offense side of the ball in his hc years and the offenses have been consistently terrible.

(1-7) + (6-2) = 20.19

SAR I

[Greenbloodblitz]

1 hour ago, Warfish said:

We'll see this year.

What else is there to say at this point?

It's all been said.  Pro and Con,

So let's just see.

 

46 minutes ago, ljr said:

 

so far I'm less happy with his OC performance than his HC performance

 

Fair..

I personally happen to think he has a lot more going on upstairs than the last few guys we've had here.

I also believe he's way more in touch with the players of this generation than people give him credit for.

I saw Zero problems with him as a head coach and I actually really like him and his interviews and press conferences. However he did have a few obvious flubs in his play-calling, and he has admitted as such.

Sometimes really smart guys are Their Own Worst Enemy and they don't know when to admit that their weaknesses are hindering them. Bill Parcells comes to mind in that capacity.

I may be one of the few but I openly admit that I not only wanted Gase, but I'm totally rooting for him and I'm in his corner.

All I want is wins and I really don't give a flying rats ass how he gets it done.

[Riggins]

He sucks as an OC but he is rich as hell. oh yea he's also an A-hole.

[nyjunc]

I'm still learning about Gase but his resume is much better than bill Belichick's after 4 seasons.  After 6 seasons no one thought BB could win a SB and then he coached a dynasty.

Adam Gase has struggled as an Offensive coach but his teams have overachieved every season he's been a HC.  The O struggles have come with struggles at QB, he's never really had a good, healthy QB over 16 games and despite this still made the playoffs once.

There are many things I don't like about him but I keep going back to his teams winning more than that should have and that gives me hope.  We are much more talented this year if healthy.  I hope he has the opportunity to have Sam for 16 games.

[greenwichjetfan]

5 hours ago, SAR I said:

(1-7) + (6-2) = 20.19

SAR I

-2 <> 20.19

[Butterfield]

Not the type of coach i would hire.  

[SAR I]

35 minutes ago, Butterfield said:

Not the type of coach i would hire.  

Because the team you predicted to go 6-10 perfectly healthy went 7-9 completely injured. 

Because the team that opened 1-7 with every reason to quit finished 6-2 and bought in to the coaching staff.  

Because the quarterback that needed to take the next step, did, going 7-5 through mono and ending the season 6-2 with 14 TD, 4 INT, 93.3 RAT. 

What a bad coach.   Makes Kotite look like Lombardi.  

SAR I

[Butterfield]

7 minutes ago, SAR I said:

Because the team you predicted to go 6-10 perfectly healthy went 7-9 completely injured. 

Because the team that opened 1-7 with every reason to quit finished 6-2 and bought in to the coaching staff.  

Because the quarterback that needed to take the next step, did, going 7-5 through mono and ending the season 6-2 with 14 TD, 4 INT, 93.3 RAT. 

What a bad coach.   Makes Kotite look like Lombardi.  

SAR I

What?  I didn’t predict any of that.  

[Dcat]

7 hours ago, ljr said:

 

so far I'm less happy with his OC performance than his HC performance

 

that sizes it up for me.  The problem is not his being HC.  The problem is the lunacy of his offense. 

[SAR I]

2 minutes ago, Dcat said:

that sizes it up for me.  The problem is not his being HC.  The problem is the lunacy of his offense. 

Darrell Loggains doesn’t get paid $400,000 a year to hold a clipboard.  He was a rookie OC. If the offense struggles, Loggains will potentially be replaced.  If Darnold excels but the team’s record doesn’t reflect it, Loggains will be retained. 

Gase is the head coach.  The head coach did a great job in a catastrophe last season.  

SAR I

[SAR I]

6 minutes ago, Butterfield said:

What?  I didn’t predict any of that.  

Post a link to your prediction for the 2019 New York Jets from last August.  

SAR I

[Dcat]

2 minutes ago, SAR I said:

Darrell Loggains doesn’t get paid $400,000 a year to hold a clipboard.  He was a rookie OC. If the offense struggles, Loggains will potentially be replaced.  If Darnold excels but the team’s record doesn’t reflect it, Loggains will be retained. 

Gase is the head coach.  The head coach did a great job in a catastrophe last season.  

SAR I

The players like him well enough.  Landry was a primadonna biatch in Miami.  What you saw last year was an incoherent Gase offense.   Just like they have been everywhere except for Denver when Manning did what he wanted.   LOL @ it being a "Loggains" offense.  You will have to prove that one.  That's just pure nonsense. 

I look forward to seeing vast improvement in the game plan.  

[SAR I]

3 minutes ago, Dcat said:

The players like him well enough.  Landry was a primadonna biatch in Miami.  What you saw last year was an incoherent Gase offense.   Just like they have been everywhere except for Denver when Manning did what he wanted.   LOL @ it being a "Loggains" offense.  You will have to prove that one.  That's just pure nonsense. 

I look forward to seeing vast improvement in the game plan.  

Well, if Gase gets 100% of the criticism of the offense then he also gets 100% of the praise for the defense.  Not bad. 

SAR I

[Jet Nut]

8 hours ago, JetsLife said:

Hope I'm wrong, but I can't shake what many of us have felt from the beginning - Gase is an OC at best (maybe a good OC). But he's not a NFL HC and never will be.

He held a team together after injuries over took the team.  After he lost his starting QB and his backup QB.

He held them together to go 6-2 over the last 8 games where it would have been easy to lose the players and the team.

With all those injuries, especially to the QB position, he gets the Jets to 7-9.  A number before the season few would have thought we'd get to and some would have been happy with.  Most of the optimists here had us at 6-10.  

Given the lousy offensive numbers and ranking, with or with or without giving the benefit of the doubt over the QB injuries, the OL and the WR unit it would seem that he has the HC part down.  His players seem to like him, seem to play hard for him and dont quit.  

[Dcat]

9 minutes ago, SAR I said:

Well, if Gase gets 100% of the criticism of the offense then he also gets 100% of the praise for the defense.  Not bad. 

SAR I

Williams runs the defense.  Gase runs the offense with help from his sidekick.  What is it you don't understand about this fact?  Why are you trying to distort the truth about who runs this offense?  It is Gase.   Not Loggains.  Defense is Williams and no one else.  That is the Jets coaching structure whether you like it or not.  You can't claim it is anything else, other than what it is.   

FWIW, I'm willing to cut him slack and give him a fair chance here.  But let's stop making things up.. like Kenny Loggins is running this offense.

[Butterfield]

27 minutes ago, SAR I said:

Post a link to your prediction for the 2019 New York Jets from last August.  

SAR I

I didn’t make any projections.  I don’t spend my time doing such things.  I certainly don’t have time to be looking through old posts anyways.  

[Jet_Engine1]

7 hours ago, SAR I said:

(1-7) + (6-2) = 20.19

SAR I

No. Check your work. 

 

(1-7) + (6-2) = x

(-6) + (4)

x = -2

[BROOKLYN JET]

[#27TheDominator]

43 minutes ago, SAR I said:

Darrell Loggains doesn’t get paid $400,000 a year to hold a clipboard.  He was a rookie OC. If the offense struggles, Loggains will potentially be replaced.  If Darnold excels but the team’s record doesn’t reflect it, Loggains will be retained. 

Gase is the head coach.  The head coach did a great job in a catastrophe last season.  

SAR I

 Very knowledgeable post.  Darrell Loggains, first name Dowell, was a rookie OC, despite having been OC for Tennessee in 2014 under Munchak, for Chicago in 2016 and 2017 under Fox and in 2018 in Miami.  

[The Crusher]

59 minutes ago, SAR I said:

Darrell Loggains doesn’t get paid $400,000 a year to hold a clipboard.  He was a rookie OC. If the offense struggles, Loggains will potentially be replaced.  If Darnold excels but the team’s record doesn’t reflect it, Loggains will be retained. 

Gase is the head coach.  The head coach did a great job in a catastrophe last season.  

SAR I

Wow, Loggins getting paid $100k per foot? Impressive. 

[slats]

9 hours ago, #27TheDominator said:

I don't see any reason to worry about him if you think he is a good OC.  Everything about being a head coach seems okay.  Won the power struggle?  Check. Took command of the roster?  Check.   Didn't want to pay a ton for a RB?   Didn't lose the team during a disastrous stretch?  Worked with Darnold to improve during the season?  Check, check, check.  The main issue I have is that he doesn't seem to be a very good OC.  

Pretty much exactly where I am. I think I'd be more excited about the season if Loggains had been replaced with an OC who was really going to run the offense. Keep what's working, keep the terminology, and add more dynamic plays and play-calling. 

That didn't happen, though, so Gase is going to have to get this ragtag offense performing a lot better against a tougher schedule this year, with much less time to prepare. It's a tall order but, unlike the previous six Jet HC hires, Gase failed to secure a winning season in his first year, so he doesn't really get a honeymoon period. The fans already have the pitchforks out. 

I expect a rough season, but if Darnold's numbers continue to improve and the team is winning games down the stretch, I think he'll survive the year. And a lot of fans will not like it. There's so much riding on Becton and Mims. The Jets really need them to be looking like RoY candidates early and often. 

[BettyBoop]

1 hour ago, SAR I said:

Darrell Loggains doesn’t get paid $400,000 a year to hold a clipboard.  He was a rookie OC. If the offense struggles, Loggains will potentially be replaced.  If Darnold excels but the team’s record doesn’t reflect it, Loggains will be retained. 

Gase is the head coach.  The head coach did a great job in a catastrophe last season.  

SAR I

And a GREAT relocation package!!!

[The Crusher]

13 minutes ago, BettyBoop said:

And a GREAT relocation package!!!

Yeah, rumor had it he had just about  enough of the shire. 

[Happy Clouds]

9 hours ago, JetsLife said:

......It sucks as I think he could be competent on a weekly basis if he wanted to.

Not trying to be a wise guy. I’m just not exactly sure why you think he doesn’t want to be competent?  How does that help him or the team?

[Lith]

2 hours ago, Dcat said:

that sizes it up for me.  The problem is not his being HC.  The problem is the lunacy of his offense. 

I am beginning to come around to this way of thinking.  That he may be a better HC than he is an OC.  The offense was awful at times and inconsistent, even when healthy during the last two months.  But this team could easily have imploded last year and didn't.  6-2 does not make a season, but still, winning 6 of 8 in this League is not easy.  He deserves some credit for the way the team finished the season. 

That said, the defense was consistenly better than the offense.  And just watching the games, it was hard to come away with the thought that this was a well-coached offense.  Maybe Gase would be more successful as a HC if he actually hired a solid OC and turned the offense over to someone not named Dowell Loggains.

Not sold on him yet as a long term answer, but he earned the right to be back for 2020.  Lets see how the season plays out/

[SAR I]

2 hours ago, Dcat said:

Williams runs the defense.  Gase runs the offense with help from his sidekick.  What is it you don't understand about this fact?  Why are you trying to distort the truth about who runs this offense?  It is Gase.   Not Loggains.

I've been to Jets camp and I'm in field level seats 2 hours before kickoff for 8 home games last season.  Loggains is running the offense.  Like many head coaches Gase has influence on the plays called, but Gase is not our offensive coordinator and Loggains is more than a puppet.  I know this breaks the convenient narrative that Gase runs the O but that's simply not true.  He's a head coach.  He has too much responsibility to be just the OC.  Loggains comes to NJ to become an OC, not carry a clipboard, he's not interested in that type of career destruction.

2 hours ago, Dcat said:

Defense is Williams and no one else. 

Williams is surely given a level of autonomy based on his age and experience level, but Gase is the head coach and Gase surely has input during weekly gameplan prep and in-game situations.  Gase demands a blitz, Adams steals the ball for a TD, and everyone praises Gregg as if Adam had nothing to do with it. 

It's just silly.  Gase is the head coach.  He gets credit when we win, he gets criticism when we lose, this media creation that Gase is responsible for all the failure and Darnold and Gregg get all the credit for the surprising victories is boiler-plate Manish-level media trolling at its finest.

SAR I

[Dcat]

1 minute ago, SAR I said:

I've been to Jets camp and I'm in field level seats 2 hours before kickoff for 8 home games last season.  Loggains is running the offense.  Like many head coaches Gase has influence on the plays called, but Gase is not our offensive coordinator and Loggains is more than a puppet.  I know this breaks the convenient narrative that Gase runs the O but that's simply not true.  He's a head coach.  He has too much responsibility to be just the OC.  Loggains comes to NJ to become an OC, not carry a clipboard, he's not interested in that type of career destruction.

Williams is surely given a level of autonomy based on his age and experience level, but Gase is the head coach and Gase surely has input during weekly gameplan prep and in-game situations.  Gase demands a blitz, Adams steals the ball for a TD, and everyone praises Gregg as if Adam had nothing to do with it. 

It's just silly.  Gase is the head coach.  He gets credit when we win, he gets criticism when we lose, this media creation that Gase is responsible for all the failure and Darnold and Gregg get all the credit for the surprising victories is boiler-plate Manish-level media trolling at its finest.

SAR I

We may not be in disagreement.  Let's clarify what we both mean by the vague term "running the offense".  

Offensive play design: 100% Gase
Seeing that the team does the reps in practice and follows the script: Louggains

It is Gase's offense.  Loggains just doing the grunt work.  

[#27TheDominator]

1 hour ago, Happy Clouds said:

Not trying to be a wise guy. I’m just not exactly sure why you think he doesn’t want to be competent?  How does that help him or the team?

He is not giving 110%?