Jamal Adams ranked #1 in ESPNs top 10 Safteys

[Dunnie]

What is our record the past two years if we didn't have Adams?

Worse

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[Dunnie]

Wow even though Marcus Maye is better? Maye > Adams 

wow epic troll alternate universe sh*t right here.

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[Dunnie]

Quinnen and Denzel if things break correctly.  If they both hit and want to renegotiate in 2022 we don’t want to be strapped with a box contract on a constraining safety. 
SAR I

Denzel he's a freaking rookie . Lmao

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[Jet Nut]

1 minute ago, T0mShane said:

Literally every team has the available resources to “buy” Jamal Adams, especially when you consider the fact that he marked himself down by not requiring the re-up this offseason to facilitate a trade. Any team could buy the “best safety in the game” for a couple of draft picks and ~$5 million bucks.

Literally the worst argument you can make.  One that proves absolutely nothing and is a waste of time to continue, I already gave a response.  

I'll add one more into the mix.  Maybe JD doesnt actually want to trade away his best player like the handful of internet GMs.  The ones that believe all you have to do is trade your only all pro and get a return of multiple all pros for the price of one? 

 

[playtowinthegame]

10 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

If you ask the question that way then the point is lost on you, but I’ll give it a try anyway.

The point is to keep one’s options open. Paying Adams more solves nothing; he’s tied to the Jets for upwards of the next 4 seasons without an extension, and in doing so the team keeps its options open to moving him if the right deal comes along specifically because the haven’t shot themselves in the foot with a huge (and unnecessary) signing bonus.

Meanwhile for all you know the Jets may need to still upgrade at a several positions yet. Just because one drafts a player at a position doesn’t therefore make the position adequately filled. If that were the case no one would sign veteran FAs and wouldn’t typically have a need to extend their own.

The team has as many question marks as it has solutions. If you seriously need them enumerated I question how closely you follow the team. Here are positions or position groups containing the not-sure-things - presuming everyone stays healthy, mind you - however badly we want them to work out:

QB, RB, WR1, TE, OLx4 on offense

DE, EDGE, other LB, CBx2 on defense

Now even the biggest pessimist wouldn’t think all of them will fail, but we won’t know which they’ll be nor how many of them. As the team gets closer to where it wants to be, presumably that list will lessen and then you make your shopping list.

I’m not saying he will be, but what if Becton is terrible? Is the team supposed to handicap itself with a stopgap LT and expect a strong safety to fully make up the difference? Is the team just going to draft someone else in its next go-for-broke opportunity and put the team’s full fate on whatever LT they draft in a year that may end up having no good LT prospects (let alone good ones as rookies).

Now repeat that for at least 4 other positions - quite easily more - and see how quickly that dries up. 

The attitude you convey is one that stipulates car & health insurance is unnecessary for you this year because you don’t think you’ll get into an accident or very sick or both, and aren’t planning on buying a house either this year or next, so you can instead spend your incoming cash and all your savings on a sweet vette that you don’t need. 

Worst of all - as though any other reason is necessary - is the elephant in the room of how extending Adams now is 100% pointless.

This post is like Home Defense for the Jamal stans. 

[Dunnie]

nailed it

... say the self proclaimed weekend warrior GM's ... Lmao

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[Dunnie]

FS/SS hybrid is definitely more valuable than a SS/LB hybrid.  Mathieu gets INTs (17 for his career, or 2.4 per season), Pass Deflections (61; 12 last year) and even a few Sacks (5.0 over the last 2 seasons since being used as a SS) that people love to use to defend Adams.  I dare say he's as effective on the blitz as Adams is, if not moreso, given the infrequency with which he is used in that role.
The closer to the LOS a DB is used, the less valuable he is to a team.  

Nah

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[Dcat]

1 minute ago, Dunnie said:

... say the self proclaimed weekend warrior GM's ... Lmao

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100%

For some here, having a star is more important than winning it seems.

 

[Dcat]

10 minutes ago, Dunnie said:

Worse

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nope

[Dcat]

4 minutes ago, Dunnie said:

... say the self proclaimed weekend warrior GM's ... Lmao

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Oh I forgot... You are always right.  My bad. 

[T0mShane]

9 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Literally the worst argument you can make.  One that proves absolutely nothing and is a waste of time to continue, I already gave a response.  

I'll add one more into the mix.  Maybe JD doesnt actually want to trade away his best player like the handful of internet GMs.  The ones that believe all you have to do is trade your only all pro and get a return of multiple all pros for the price of one? 

 

Your argument is that there are probably a lot of secret and huge offers for Jamal Adams but Joe Douglas rejects them out of hand but also Joe Douglas hasn’t re-signed Jamal Adams.

[Jet Nut]

7 minutes ago, Dcat said:

100%

For some here, having a star is more important than winning it seems.

 

Actually my thinking is a bird in the hand type thing.

There isnt a guarantee anywhere that youre going to trade Jamal, lets say to Dallas, for a 17th in the first and corresponding pick in the 3rd and those two players are better, combined, than Jamal.  

My thinking is if you trade him for a 1, you pray hard that whoever that pick is he turns into a player as good as Jamal.   Something you already have, the actual guarantee.

 

[Jet Nut]

6 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Your argument is that there are probably a lot of secret and huge offers for Jamal Adams but Joe Douglas rejects them out of hand but also Joe Douglas hasn’t re-signed Jamal Adams.

No my argument is this argument makes absolutely no sense and proves nothing and equally pointless.

But not knowing who offered what or even what JD wants isnt a point.  The only thing we know is 30 GMs anonymously ranked Jamal at the top of his position and some of you cant handle that.  It has nothing to do with trades and doesnt go away because there hasn't been a trade.

[T0mShane]

2 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Actually my thinking is a bird in the hand type thing.

There isnt a guarantee anywhere that youre going to trade Jamal, lets say to Dallas, for a 17th in the first and corresponding pick in the 3rd and those two players are better, combined, than Jamal.  

My thinking is if you trade him for a 1, you pray hard that whoever that pick is he turns into a player as good as Jamal.   Something you already have, the actual guarantee.

 

If draft picks are coin flips then why aren’t teams lining up to give them to the Jets for the bird in the hand safety? 

[Dunnie]

Actually my thinking is a bird in the hand type thing. There isnt a guarantee anywhere that youre going to trade Jamal, lets say to Dallas, for a 17th in the first and corresponding pick in the 3rd and those two players are better, combined, than Jamal.  

My thinking is if you trade him for a 1, you pray hard that whoever that pick is he turns into a player as good as Jamal.   Something you already have, the actual guarantee.

 

 

This ^...it's almost impossible to attain this kind of talent in the draft ... I'd love to look at every damn drafts n history to see the quantity of players picked in round 1 that end up hitting the pro-bowl2 of their first 3 years ... And more importantly made all pro... Versus total number picked. 

Oh yeah ... and is also the consensus pick for best at his position.

 

 

You can hate Jamal ... But don't make sh*t up about him not being a baller and a game changer.

 

 

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[Jet Nut]

5 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

If draft picks are coin flips then why aren’t teams lining up to give them to the Jets for the bird in the hand safety? 

I got it, why dont you write all 30 who voted and ask them that question.

And why does this mean they voted him 1?  Did I miss the answer to that simple question.  For all the spinning in an attempt to make his ranking as the best go away, it just somehow doesnt go away.  He is thought of as the best around the league.  Sorry

 

[slats]

8 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Actually my thinking is a bird in the hand type thing.

There isnt a guarantee anywhere that youre going to trade Jamal, lets say to Dallas, for a 17th in the first and corresponding pick in the 3rd and those two players are better, combined, than Jamal.  

My thinking is if you trade him for a 1, you pray hard that whoever that pick is he turns into a player as good as Jamal.   Something you already have, the actual guarantee.

 

Very good chance that first rounder will be a good player. You hope to at least find contributors in the third. 

The money saved by not making JA the highest paid safety ever could be used to buy another player at a position of greater importance. 

So that's three players for Jamal Adams. 

[Dunnie]

Very good chance that first rounder will be a good player. You hope to at least find contributors in the third. 
The money saved by not making JA the highest paid safety ever could be used to buy another player at a position of greater importance. 
So that's three players for Jamal Adams. 

Then just trade for three established good players at least one being an all pro player ... I would have zero problem.s with that.

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[Jet Nut]

6 minutes ago, Dunnie said:

You can hate Jamal ... But don't make sh*t up about him not being a baller and a game changer.

I've repeated this from day one.

You dont ike him and his tweets, fine.  Its your opinion

You dream of a haul from a trade or you think every trade is a win for your team, fine.  Its your opinion

But when you try and make the case for trading him because he isnt good then your opinion is just wrong because every shred of evidence says it is

[slats]

Just now, Dunnie said:

Then just trade for three established good players at least one being an all pro player ... I would have zero problem.s with that.

The choices today are basically trade him or play him under his current contract. I'm fine with either. 

The only stupid option is paying him two years early in a year where we don't even know if we're gonna have a football season, or what the salary cap is going to look like next year or the next ten. 

[EM31]

14 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

If draft picks are coin flips then why aren’t teams lining up to give them to the Jets for the bird in the hand safety? 

Safeties in general are not worth that much money.

It is not clear that Adams is even the best safety despite rectally discovered anonymous polling.

Even if you pay Adams what he seems to want this week there is no real price certainty for any GM who goes that route and trades for him.  Who is to say that once Adams gets his money that he will not feel "disrespected" again five minutes later?  Revis played it that way on multiple occasions.   And so ponying up players or picks now in order to have the right to put your team into that jeopardy makes no sense.

There is a real cost to any team that has to put up with this kind of nonsense.  It has to affect the locker room morale and eventually the product on the field.  Other players will say the right thing in interviews, but to the extent that they are saying anything at this point they seem to be doing so through gritted teeth.

<any or all of the above are reasons why the other 31 teams are no knocking down JDs door with offers>

By the way your work product on this Adams saga has really been quite stellar from the start.

[Bugg]

16 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Actually my thinking is a bird in the hand type thing.

There isnt a guarantee anywhere that youre going to trade Jamal, lets say to Dallas, for a 17th in the first and corresponding pick in the 3rd and those two players are better, combined, than Jamal.  

My thinking is if you trade him for a 1, you pray hard that whoever that pick is he turns into a player as good as Jamal.   Something you already have, the actual guarantee.

 

You can sign this year's Eric Weddle or Honey Badger for $10-13 million per every March, or fill in a replacement level FA . Either way, minimal drop in production, and a chance to fill other holes with the difference between those and $20 million per. Grant Douglas might very well think franchising Adams for a few years works too. Either way signing him for the years and $ Adams wants is nuts. And as to whining about being tagged; getting $13 million + for a few years is a pretty good deal. Problem may be an agent looks rather worthless in that situation. 

[Dunnie]

Safeties in general are not worth that much money.

It is not clear that Adams is even the best safety despite rectally discovered anonymous polling.

Even if you pay Adams what he seems to want this week there is no real price certainty for any GM who goes that route and trades for him.  Who is to say that once Adams gets his money that he will not feel "disrespected" again five minutes later?  Revis played it that way on multiple occasions.   And so ponying up players or picks now in order to have the right to put your team into that jeopardy makes no sense.

There is a real cost to any team that has to put up with this kind of nonsense.  It has to affect the locker room morale and eventually the product on the field.  Other players will say the right thing in interviews, but to the extent that they are saying anything at this point they seem to be doing so through gritted teeth.

By the way your work product on this Adams saga has really been quite stellar from the start.

You know who's not worth that money ??? Bad or Jag players.

 

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[Bugg]

3 minutes ago, EM31 said:

Safeties in general are not worth that much money.

It is not clear that Adams is even the best safety despite rectally discovered anonymous polling.

Even if you pay Adams what he seems to want this week there is no real price certainty for any GM who goes that route and trades for him.  Who is to say that once Adams gets his money that he will not feel "disrespected" again five minutes later?  Revis played it that way on multiple occasions.   And so ponying up players or picks now in order to have the right to put your team into that jeopardy makes no sense.

There is a real cost to any team that has to put up with this kind of nonsense.  It has to affect the locker room morale and eventually the product on the field.  Other players will say the right thing in interviews, but to the extent that they are saying anything at this point they seem to be doing so through gritted teeth.

<any or all of the above are reasons why the other 31 teams are no knocking down JDs door with offers>

By the way your work product on this Adams saga has really been quite stellar from the start.

Think that's overrated. A lot of this is media and internet generated nonsense. An NFL team is still a work place. There are good guys and a-holes. Adams may be an a-hole, but that's part of any business.He's still their  a-hole.

And wonder to what degree the fact we have this huge sports media complex that hasn't had an actual game of any kind to cover in over 3 months. 

[Jet Nut]

22 minutes ago, slats said:

Very good chance that first rounder will be a good player. You hope to at least find contributors in the third. 

The money saved by not making JA the highest paid safety ever could be used to buy another player at a position of greater importance. 

So that's three players for Jamal Adams. 

I get the thought process, I get what those who want to trade him are hoping for,.  But given in the last 60 years how infrequently its happened that we've picked players as talented, driven and highly rated as a Jamal Adams.  How often are players taken at 17 or lower picked who are?  Im just not as sold that the chances are that good.  

If we trade him for another all pro type player and a decent contributor how much money are we saving down the road?  

A all pro/pro bowl player for a chance and a contributor is the sell and not everyone would buy that.  I get the idea, just not as convinced it works.  To me most big deals, the team that trades away the star loses.  

I get it just finding it hard to believe we would or any team would believe theres a good chance that it would turn into 3 players like were hoping for.  I would do it in a heartbeat if it was a guaranteed or even a good chance of working out like the dream does.

[EM31]

6 minutes ago, Dunnie said:

You know who's not worth that money Bad or Jag players.

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I agree with you that with the benefit of hindsight we can pick apart many FA contracts and question whether it was worth it.  None of that is a reason to be stupid in this case just because mistakes have been made elsewhere.  Adams is not a place to park $20M per season or even $15M out of a fixed salary cap.  Almost anywhere else is a better way to spend that money.

And all of that is even before you get the "being a distraction" nonsense.

[Dunnie]

13 gets it done in my book .. I'd sign him to that for 5 years yesterday.

I agree with you that with the benefit of hindsight we can pick apart many FA contracts and question whether it was worth it.  None of that is a reason to be stupid in this case just because mistakes have been made elsewhere.  Adams is not a place to park $20M per season or even $15M out of a fixed salary cap.  Almost anywhere else is a better way to spend that money.
And all of that is even before you get the "being a distraction" nonsense.

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[Jet Nut]

7 minutes ago, Bugg said:

You can sign this year's Eric Weddle or Honey Badger for $10-13 million per every March, or fill in a replacement level FA . Either way, minimal drop in production, and a chance to fill other holes with the difference between those and $20 million per. Grant Douglas might very well think franchising Adams for a few years works too. Either way signing him for the years and $ Adams wants is nuts. And as to whining about being tagged; getting $13 million + for a few years is a pretty good deal. Problem may be an agent looks rather worthless in that situation. 

And you can dream it all works out that way.  Weddle was available after he slowed down and was headed to what his 10th season?  And wasn't as good as Adams.  I dont know what the drop off would be, what we would also get through FA.

If it were this easy, every all pro player would be traded.  Every star in the league would have a line that formed for a trade, everyone of them would offer its team a financial saving that could be used in FA and at least a draft pick.

Yet it doesnt happen.

 

 

[EM31]

5 minutes ago, Bugg said:

Think that's overrated. A lot of this is media and internet generated nonsense. An NFL team is still a work place. There are good guys and a-holes. Adams may be an a-hole, but that's part of any business.He's still their  a-hole.

And wonder to what degree the fact we have this huge sports media complex that hasn't had an actual game of any kind to cover in over 3 months. 

Whether is was TO or Manziel or Haynesworth, at some point being an A-hole does exact a toll on the rest the team.  In every single case the other players on the roster continued to say the right things in public right up until the end and supporters of the offending players were always quick to downplay the importance of that.  

Until after the fact when the real tension/cancer was acknowledged for what it really was.

[EM31]

3 minutes ago, Dunnie said:

13 gets it done in my book .. I'd sign him to that for 5 years yesterday.

 

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At some point a number become attractive to both sides and 13M might be that number.

Heck, both sides could spin it as a win.  The Jets hold the line for a deal that is 13M per season but, in terms of new money for new years over and above his current contract, Adams side could claim the Jets were giving up $20+ per year for the "extra" years.

[GreekJet]

11 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

If you ask the question that way then the point is lost on you, but I’ll give it a try anyway.

The point is to keep one’s options open. Paying Adams more solves nothing; he’s tied to the Jets for upwards of the next 4 seasons without an extension, and in doing so the team keeps its options open to moving him if the right deal comes along specifically because the haven’t shot themselves in the foot with a huge (and unnecessary) signing bonus.

Meanwhile for all you know the Jets may need to still upgrade at a several positions yet. Just because one drafts a player at a position doesn’t therefore make the position adequately filled. If that were the case no one would sign veteran FAs and wouldn’t typically have a need to extend their own.

The team has as many question marks as it has solutions. If you seriously need them enumerated I question how closely you follow the team. Here are positions or position groups containing the not-sure-things - presuming everyone stays healthy, mind you - however badly we want them to work out:

QB, RB, WR1, TE, OLx4 on offense

DE, EDGE, other LB, CBx2 on defense

Now even the biggest pessimist wouldn’t think all of them will fail, but we won’t know which they’ll be nor how many of them. As the team gets closer to where it wants to be, presumably that list will lessen and then you make your shopping list.

I’m not saying he will be, but what if Becton is terrible? Is the team supposed to handicap itself with a stopgap LT and expect a strong safety to fully make up the difference? Is the team just going to draft someone else in its next go-for-broke opportunity and put the team’s full fate on whatever LT they draft in a year that may end up having no good LT prospects (let alone good ones as rookies).

Now repeat that for at least 4 other positions - quite easily more - and see how quickly that dries up. 

The attitude you convey is one that stipulates car & health insurance is unnecessary for you this year because you don’t think you’ll get into an accident or very sick or both, and aren’t planning on buying a house either this year or next, so you can instead spend your incoming cash and all your savings on a sweet vette that you don’t need. 

Worst of all - as though any other reason is necessary - is the elephant in the room of how extending Adams now is 100% pointless.

You act as if paying Adams is going to cripple the Jets financially and I just don’t see it. There are plenty of teams that have a 20MM+ player on defense and are competitive. If the Jets trade Adams for a late first and use the cap space on a guy like Allen Robinson is that good business? Trade a guy who is on a HOF trajectory in his prime because of “positional value”?  
 

You throw out all these hypotheticals, but the reality is if the Jets don’t start drafting better it’s not going to matter. It’s been proven time and again that you can’t patchwork these holes in free agency. The idea is to draft and develop your own talent and supplement your young core through free agency. 

[Jetsfan80]

56 minutes ago, Dunnie said:

This ^...it's almost impossible to attain this kind of talent in the draft ... I'd love to look at every damn drafts n history to see the quantity of players picked in round 1 that end up hitting the pro-bowl2 of their first 3 years ... And more importantly made all pro... Versus total number picked. 

Oh yeah ... and is also the consensus pick for best at his position.

 

 

You can hate Jamal ... But don't make sh*t up about him not being a baller and a game changer.

 

 

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Nah.

Quantify "Baller" please.

[Jetsfan80]

Today's reminder that Logan Ryan and Eric Reid, who put up equal or better numbers than Jamal Adams last year, are still currently unemployed.

[Jet Nut]

22 minutes ago, EM31 said:

supporters of the offending players were always quick to downplay the importance of that.  

Until after the fact when the real tension/cancer was acknowledged for what it really was.

Probably because its obvious that Adams isnt a TO.  A TO was a cancer because he was a bad teammate who didnt show up for practices, didnt play for the team, played for himself.  Adams isnt that player.  Hes done nothing to the team or his teammates.  You night want to put then in the same boat but it doesn't hold water.  His teammates like him and still see him as a leader.  Q was being interviewed, after the whole trade thing hit and was asked about Adams and he said he our leader.  I know you'll dispute it or deny its real but Q isnt the only one.  

Ive said it before, I'll say it again, players dont ever get involved with other players contract negotiations.  Teammates can differentiate the business side of the game from on field and the locker room side of the game.  

[Jet Nut]

56 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Today's reminder that Logan Ryan and Eric Reid, who put up equal or better numbers than Jamal Adams last year, are still currently unemployed.

And are currently not as good as Adams according to those that count.  They ones who would sign the unemployed dont agree with your assessment.  

Or are you thinking and saying that if Adams were cut and on the open market he'd be unemployed for more than, oh a minute?  Please tell me you dont think this