Sports is now on the precipice-Miami Marlins Covid

[neckdemon]

21 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Harping on the timeline when the positive curve will likely end up looking identical is not the correct way to look at it. States were going to get hit eventually. It's died off in NJ and NY thankfully. Belgium just saw a massive spike in cases- their fault or just their time?

it is when their positive curve didn't have to look identical. florida had the huge benefit of not getting hit in the beginning and could analyze what worked and what was a mistake. instead desantis chose to go against the guidelines and now florida is paying the price. and so is his approval ratintg in the state as well. he ****ed up, thats all there is to it

[HessStation]

7 minutes ago, UntouchableCrew said:

I feel like there are two different things being discussed here.

Clearly NY/NJ made mistakes early on when this thing was blowing up. I'm not commending NY/NJ (Cuomo/Murphy) for being great in March. Nobody was, obviously lots of mistakes were made.

I'm talking about the ongoing effort to flatten this thing -- and the job the people are doing to make it happen. NY/NJ have been exemplary in that respect -- the cases, and deaths have been completely flattened.

Months and months in -- that STILL isn't happening in most of the country -- that's the issue and that's why we probably won't have sports this fall.

you just used “regions are on different timelines” as the entire thesis to your argument. Wtf

[UntouchableCrew]

1 minute ago, HessStation said:

you just used “regions are on different timelines” as the entire thesis to your argument 

No -- I'm arguing that if everyone did this together, correctly there are no different regional timelines and we've already put this behind us.

I mean, people in many of these places STILL aren't wearing masks. There's no difference in timelines. There are just idiots who aren't going to allow us to beat this.

[Matt39]

6 minutes ago, neckdemon said:

it is when their positive curve didn't have to look identical. florida had the huge benefit of not getting hit in the beginning and could analyuze what worked and what a mistake. instead desantis chose to go against the guidelines and now florida is paying the price. and so is his approval ratintg in the state as well. he ****ed up, thats all there is to it

The are mandated mask and social distancing orders in effect in all of the hot areas. These are not areas that voted for Desantis either. The most important precaution to take is keeping the most susceptible (old/underlying conditions) as separated from infected people as possible. Positive tests in highly populated states was inevitable. The timeline has been different for everyone.

[shawn306]

8 minutes ago, UntouchableCrew said:

I feel like there are two different things being discussed here.

Clearly NY/NJ made mistakes early on when this thing was blowing up. I'm not commending NY/NJ (Cuomo/Murphy) for being great in March. Nobody was, obviously lots of mistakes were made.

I'm talking about the ongoing effort to flatten this thing -- and the job the people are doing to make it happen. NY/NJ have been exemplary in that respect -- the cases, and deaths have been completely flattened.

Months and months in -- that STILL isn't happening in most of the country -- that's the issue and that's why we probably won't have sports this fall.

Totally agree with this

Sadly it is going to take an athlete dying from this before people take this seriously. Just saw Hightower and Chung from the Pats are opting out I am sure there is going to be more. I read the Freddie Freeman story, scary stuff.

We as a country just for whatever reason have not been able to get a grip on this.

[neckdemon]

1 minute ago, HessStation said:

Sorta to untouchable’s inadvertent point, we are on different timelines of virus maturity in regions. Add To that the accelerated testing now vs then. 
 

I mentioned this before, yeah I wonder where, most importantly deaths, end up peaking in FL and TX...without ever having a full scale lockdown 

 

if the positivity rate was the same i could see blaming it on accelerated testing. and if hospitalization numbers weren't going up i'd also say ok it's the testing. but the truth is that positivity rates in florida vs nj are far apart and hospitilizations in florida are spiking up and will eclipse 10,000 soon if it doesn't stop

[Matt39]

2 minutes ago, UntouchableCrew said:

No -- I'm arguing that if everyone did this together, correctly there are no different regional timelines and we've already put this behind us.

That's not how this virus works though. It's on its own timeline, regardless of how many social distance/mask mandates you put into place. Obviously as you saw with the concert in New York and people out and about in Florida, there's only so much you can do.

[HessStation]

5 minutes ago, UntouchableCrew said:

No -- I'm arguing that if everyone did this together, correctly there are no different regional timelines and we've already put this behind us.

I mean, people in many of these places STILL aren't wearing masks. There's no difference in timelines. There are just idiots who aren't going to allow us to beat this.

Which brings me back to 1. Sweden and 2. what I thought was the science behind pandemics is that it’s herd immunity that eventually beats it?

[Jet Nut]

5 hours ago, The Crusher said:

Where do you live? We got soccer for days around here. Pretty sure my kids are the only ones around here that fight play it. Yet, Lacrosse is really gotten big here in the last decade. 

Same in NJ with regards to Lacrosse.  

I should restate soccer.  I'd say smaller kids play, but when they get older I've found that Lacrosse is much more popular.  This is for NJ.  In South Florida the kids dont seem to play much organized team sports.  I dont see anyone playing Lacrosse, soccer or baseball.  They hit the beach, surf or long board as far as I can tell.  

[Matt39]

6 minutes ago, neckdemon said:

if the positivity rate was the same i could see blaming it on accelerated testing. and if hospitalization numbers weren't going up i'd also say ok it's the testing. but the truth is that positivity rates in florida vs nj are far apart and hospitilizations in florida are spiking up and will eclipse 10,000 soon if it doesn't stop

Where are you seeing this? This is updated today and not all are covid related.

https://bi.ahca.myflorida.com/t/ABICC/views/Public/ICUBedsCounty?%3AshowAppBanner=false&%3Adisplay_count=n&%3AshowVizHome=n&%3Aorigin=viz_share_link&%3AisGuestRedirectFromVizportal=y&%3Aembed=y

[HessStation]

6 minutes ago, neckdemon said:

if the positivity rate was the same i could see blaming it on accelerated testing. and if hospitalization numbers weren't going up i'd also say ok it's the testing. but the truth is that positivity rates in florida vs nj are far apart and hospitilizations in florida are spiking up and will eclipse 10,000 soon if it doesn't stop

But does the positive tests include those  having antibodies only and no longer sick?

[JetFreak89]

4 minutes ago, HessStation said:

Which brings me back to 1. Sweden and 2. what I thought was the science behind pandemics is that it’s herd immunity that eventually beats it?

Sweden was debunked earlier in the thread, not sure why we are still using it as an example of excellence. 

[neckdemon]

11 minutes ago, shawn306 said:

Totally agree with this

Sadly it is going to take an athlete dying from this before people take this seriously. Just saw Hightower and Chung from the Pats are opting out I am sure there is going to be more. I read the Freddie Freeman story, scary stuff.

We as a country just for whatever reason have not been able to get a grip on this.

all i'm going to say is that the blame has to go to leadership....

[HessStation]

Just now, JetFreak89 said:

Sweden was debunked earlier in the thread, not sure why we are still using it as an example of excellence. 

Excellence? No. Debunked of what? They have completely flattened the curve to almost zero while incorporating policies closer to the US states in question without completely destroying their middle class economics, while maintaining a death rate lower than multiple European counties who were hit at the same time. 

[Losmeister]

2 minutes ago, HessStation said:

Excellence? No. Debunked of what? They have completely flattened the curve to almost zero while incorporating policies closer to the US states in question without completely destroying their middle class economics, while maintaining a death rate lower than multiple European counties who were hit at the same time. 

they have one of the worst death rates

they have seen no economic benefit from staying open

their nordic neighbors fared far better

[EM31]

Honestly I think that everyone needs it to happen in their own back yard before that community collectively takes it seriously enough take the hard measures necessary to bend the curve.  That is why Florida and Texas and others needed to go through this first.  Kinda, sorta

Only when the refrigerated trucks start to pull up next to the morgues to receive the overflow bodies and when people are told to go home (to die) because there aren't enough ICU beds and someone else has a better long term prognosis.  That is when they get serious as happened in NY.

Slut shaming for wearing a mask is not a thing in many places any more.

People learn. Things change.

[Bugg]

Think the NFL has to consider a bubble system. Or consider playing games without crowds at training facilities, if only to cut out one variable. Objectively looks like MLB having players travel the country is fraught with problems. I am not nearly as concerned as many here are . But if mere positive tests are grounds to shut everything down, you have to cut down chances for exposures.  

[Matt39]

3 minutes ago, Losmeister said:

they have one of the worst death rates

they have seen no economic benefit from staying open

their nordic neighbors fared far better

Their mortality rate is 7.2 per 100k. Far from the worst.

[neckdemon]

13 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Where are you seeing this? This is updated today and not all are covid related.

https://bi.ahca.myflorida.com/t/ABICC/views/Public/ICUBedsCounty?%3AshowAppBanner=false&%3Adisplay_count=n&%3AshowVizHome=n&%3Aorigin=viz_share_link&%3AisGuestRedirectFromVizportal=y&%3Aembed=y

https://ycharts.com/indicators/florida_coronavirus_hospitalizations

[kevinc855]

Sports is not happening in 2020....why keep trying. It took 2 days for mlb to collapse 

[Losmeister]

all marlins games suspended tul SUnday

[Matt39]

1 minute ago, neckdemon said:

https://ycharts.com/indicators/florida_coronavirus_hospitalizations

Hospitalizations vs ICU is a different number. ICU beds, ventilators etc, Florida is doing fine.

[Gastineau Lives]

1 hour ago, Jetster said:

Because UNLIKE NY, NJ, they didn't have a mandate to return Covid patients to nursing homes, unlike the Dolt Governor Cuomo. Between that edict & constantly calling for more ventilators that killed 80% of patients that they were used on he did an amazing job. The idea that the idiot then criticizes anybody or any state as another beautiful example of the hypocracy so rampant in this country. 

LMAO yeah because we should have had this disease on LOCK at the beginning when no one had ever seen the thing. Get the **** out of here.

[Gastineau Lives]

2 hours ago, Embrace the Suck said:

NJ has contributed around 10% (15k+) of the US covid deaths to this point. Fl has contributed (5k+) deaths. Those numbers will change clearly, but lets not act like FL sucks and NJ is awesome.

No, let's pretend that the first month of a pandemic is the same as the fifth month. 

[Losmeister]

7 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Their mortality rate is 7.2 per 100k. Far from the worst.

worse than their neighbors...  ( i didnt state that. which IS what i meant, but thats my bad)

and still worse than USA, Brazil and France and.....

[Losmeister]

https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/data/mortality

[Matt39]

4 minutes ago, Gastineau Lives said:

No, let's pretend that the first month of a pandemic is the same as the fifth month. 

What exactly are you arguing here? The obvious error was the nursing home decision, it's the biggest reason behind the difference in mortality rate. The timeline of infection isnt overly meaningful with such a contagious virus. It was going to spread. Belgium is currently spiking too. We know more now thankfully and keeping the most susceptible away is by far the most important, while younger people are more frequently testing positive and are surviving. 

[Gastineau Lives]

2 hours ago, Embrace the Suck said:

NJ has contributed around 10% (15k+) of the US covid deaths to this point. Fl has contributed (5k+) deaths. Those numbers will change clearly, but lets not act like FL sucks and NJ is awesome.

The bottom line is that there is no excuse for the numbers to be what they are in Florida in August. None. Not with the information that they had. They all took their cues from Trump and are being ****ed in the ass now because of it. So let's not go comparing Florida et al to NJ et al since the ass ******* is clearly not even close to being over. 

[HessStation]

4 minutes ago, Losmeister said:

they have one of the worst death rates

they have seen no economic benefit from staying open

their nordic neighbors fared far better

NY death rates were far worst than Sweden’s

NY 20MM, 31k deaths

Sweden 10MM, 5k deaths 

 

Nnot destroying their economy didn’t help their economy”?

 

Compare the Rust Belt or Mid Atlantic to Metro NY...they’ve fared far better

 

 

[Gastineau Lives]

2 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

What exactly are you arguing here? The obvious error was the nursing home decision, it's the biggest reason behind the difference in mortality rate. The timeline of infection isnt overly meaningful with such a contagious virus. It was going to spread. Belgium is currently spiking too. We know more now thankfully and keeping the most susceptible away is by far the most important, while younger people are more frequently testing positive and are surviving. 

Actually it's not. Not even close. I got as far as your first sentence.

[Losmeister]

Just now, HessStation said:

NY death rates were far worst than Sweden’s

NY 20MM, 31k deaths

Sweden 10MM, 5k deaths 

 

Nnot destroying their economy didn’t help their economy”?

 

Compare the Rust Belt or Mid Atlantic to Metro NY...they’ve fared far better

 

 

were we talking about NY? I wasn't. I was talking about Sweden not being a model. Nothing more. We all already know NY was a disaster, literally.

[Aaron Hernandez]

.

[EM31]

2 hours ago, Jetster said:

Because UNLIKE NY, NJ, they didn't have a mandate to return Covid patients to nursing homes, unlike the Dolt Governor Cuomo. Between that edict & constantly calling for more ventilators that killed 80% of patients that they were used on he did an amazing job. The idea that the idiot then criticizes anybody or any state as another beautiful example of the hypocracy so rampant in this country. 

Seriously need to stop spouting Fox News/Trump talking points.

[Losmeister]

3 minutes ago, HessStation said:

NY death rates were far worst than Sweden’s

NY 20MM, 31k deaths

Sweden 10MM, 5k deaths 

 

Nnot destroying their economy didn’t help their economy”?

 

Compare the Rust Belt or Mid Atlantic to Metro NY...they’ve fared far better

 

 

and can you imagine what the #'s would be like if NY and NJ didnt take the meausres they did (albeit far too late) and just syaed open like Sweden? 

i dont even want to think abbout that.

[neckdemon]

7 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Hospitalizations vs ICU is a different number. ICU beds, ventilators etc, Florida is doing fine.

You sound just like Desantis. "Florida is doing great, we are stabilizing" As the cases spike and every other day they set a new record for daily deaths. I didn't say anything about ICU numbers I said number of hospitilizations are an indication that the positive test rates are not being driven by an increase in testing. The increase in testing is finding more cases for sure, but number of hospitilizations spiking tells you that transmission is also spiking.