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Why We Should Ignore Sports Media - The Worst Take Ever on the Jamal Trade


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19 hours ago, kevinc855 said:

This Article is true tho...jets showing signs of dysfunction again 

Please explain how?  Seattle massively overpaid for a safety.  Plus we got rid of a headache who was making our lives miserable.  Even his former teammates are happy he is gone.  So please tell me how the Jets are the dysfunctional ones?

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This Article is true tho...jets showing signs of dysfunction again 

If belichick did this everyone would be licking his butt.  I’m sure he’s thrilled that the jets have 2 extra firsts and won’t be tying up 15% of their cap space on a safety who can’t cover.

I mean, it’s Bleacher Report

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19 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

So, you think Sam is happy that we’re tanking?

Maybe I’m wrong but I can’t imagine he would be.  I would think would rather we made an attempt at winning.

You still don’t get it.  We are trying to build a long term winner.  It’s not gonna happen in one year.  As much as you hat Douglas he had done the right approach.  Maybe one day the lightbulb will go on 😂 

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4 hours ago, Dcat said:

But he would have to be stupid.  Only a moron would see what Adams did and what JD did and reach a conclusion that the Jets are tanking.  And I think Sam's a pretty smart kid.  

Trading Adams was the culmination of an off-season that I, personally, thought was going to be a step in bettering the team - but pretty much after each move it became clearer and clearer that we were tanking again - or if don't want to say tanking - not making a real attempt to be competitive.  Rebuilding, again, as they say.

Signing basically back-up OL - mostly on one year deals

Letting Robby walk

Filling just about every hole we had with JAGS

Trading away your best and only impact player.

It was clear to me about a two months ago that JD had no intention of trying to build a truly competitive roster this year - the Adams move made it virtually inarguable.  except for on JN it seems.  Heck JD acknowledged that himself in a tweet yesterday but the JN fans simply won't accept it for what it is.

I've accepted it and am now okay with it.  Another rebuild year, so be it.....Hopefully we'll try to win next year.

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10 minutes ago, RedBeardedSavage said:

Other ways to characterize this offseason;

  • Prioritizing building through the draft
  • Using free agency to improve the offensive line without mortgaging the future
  • Using free agency to band-aid holes (Perriman, Desir, Flacco)

Even if we characterize things differently, it's completely objective to say the worst aspect of the team last year was the offensive line, and we're much improved in that area.

It's also objective to say the worst aspect of this franchise the past decade was our position valuation. We took three 5 techniques and two strong safeties in the first round during that time. That's half a decade of drafts on positions that rarely impact W/L. 

If you drive in the wrong direction for a 100 miles, a U-Turn isn't going to put you back on time. 

I think we agree on just about everything you stated.

I will disagree though on one thing - I believe the OL has taken a slight step back - upgraded at center, downgraded at T - Guards are pretty flat. 

But otherwise, yes - we plugged in JAG type, short term fixes to hold down roster spots during the rebuild.   The complete and fundamental lack of understanding how to build an NFL roster in the past has caused this to happen - so we agree....

But two things need to stated....

1) Most Jets fans, particularly on this board, won't admit it - for some reason have a hard time accepting we're in full-on rebuild mode.  This team isn't trying to win this year.

2) We still know little about JD's ability to build a team - all we know is he's capable of taking one apart.  Hopefully he's as good as building as he is at dismantling.

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27 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

Trading Adams was the culmination of an off-season that I, personally, thought was going to be a step in bettering the team - but pretty much after each move it became clearer and clearer that we were tanking again - or if don't want to say tanking - not making a real attempt to be competitive.  Rebuilding, again, as they say.

Signing basically back-up OL - mostly on one year deals

Letting Robby walk

Filling just about every hole we had with JAGS

Trading away your best and only impact player.

It was clear to me about a two months ago that JD had no intention of trying to build a truly competitive roster this year - the Adams move made it virtually inarguable.  except for on JN it seems.  Heck JD acknowledged that himself in a tweet yesterday but the JN fans simply won't accept it for what it is.

I've accepted it and am now okay with it.  Another rebuild year, so be it.....Hopefully we'll try to win next year.

I think you analysis is near-universally flawed.

This team is better at every single position, bar rushing strong safety, than it was in 2019.

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2 minutes ago, Warfish said:

I think you analysis is near-universally flawed.

This team is better at every single position, bar rushing strong safety, than it was in 2019.

replacing sh---y players with different sh---y players - doesn't mean better...just different.

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10 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

replacing sh---y players with different sh---y players - doesn't mean better...just different.

Having read your views this offseason, I just don't think you have a very good grasp of the situation here, talent wise.  Pining for the lost Robby Anderson would be one good example of very questionable evaluation, both from a salary-worth standpoint, and a talent evaluation standpoint.  Being upset we let loose a very sub-par, limited skill-set, UDFR WR who was asking for way too much money for this production is not a sin, nor is replacing him with a 1st/2nd round grade talent in Mims.

End of the day Fidelio, you're just a constant and unrelentingly and extremely negative person this off-season.  Seems nothing that has been done has pleasured you, which IMO says more about you than it does the moves. 

Universal unhappiness with the Jets off-season is just......yeah, it's just odd.  And that's coming from one of JN's most consistent "show me" pragmatic pessimists.   Maybe you just need a break from the Jets for a year....especially since you so clearly think they're going to be horrible this year anyway.

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46 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

I think we agree on just about everything you stated.

I will disagree though on one thing - I believe the OL has taken a slight step back - upgraded at center, downgraded at T - Guards are pretty flat. 

But otherwise, yes - we plugged in JAG type, short term fixes to hold down roster spots during the rebuild.   The complete and fundamental lack of understanding how to build an NFL roster in the past has caused this to happen - so we agree....

But two things need to stated....

1) Most Jets fans, particularly on this board, won't admit it - for some reason have a hard time accepting we're in full-on rebuild mode.  This team isn't trying to win this year.

2) We still know little about JD's ability to build a team - all we know is he's capable of taking one apart.  Hopefully he's as good as building as he is at dismantling.

 

1. Full rebuild mode... hmm. I don't think anyone here thinks we're SB contenders. There are some that are more optimistic than others, sure. I think we have a better roster than last year, mainly because our offensive line should be betterBut the whole "isn't trying to win this year" argument is pretty foolish, IMO. I don't see a move, or series of moves, that were both responsible & realistically on the table that could've been characterized as "trying to win this year".

2. We can discern that JD rationally judges positional value. We finally drafted a LT high in the draft. We chose not to pay a strong safety, albeit a really good one, 15+ million a year... and instead received two firsts by shipping him off. GM's aren't judged by one year but I think it's pretty fair, though, to say JD's start has given a lot of us hope. 

Does any of that mean we're going to have a better record this year than last? Maybe not. There are still some serious flaws with this roster. 

But it's like body recomposition vs weight loss. You can eat right and exercise religiously for six months and weigh the same as you did at the start - and superficially some might say "well that doesn't sound like you improved". But if your body fat % dropped significantly and your lean muscle mass increased, then you've accomplished a lot. 

JD is doing a full recomp in the way this roster is constructed, and he's just started. Some of us are excited, not because we're going to win 12 games this year, but because we have a GM that appears to be going about it the right way... finally. 

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How do these guys get jobs?

I will say, though, I wonder if the friction predates the trade deadline stuff on both sides. I wonder if Adams was salty for being sat for a couple plays because he was taking dumb penalties.

If his skin was that thin in NY, it will be equally thin in Seattle.

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11 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Having read your views this offseason, I just don't think you have a very good grasp of the situation here, talent wise.  Pining for the lost Robby Anderson would be one good example of very questionable evaluation, both from a salary-worth standpoint, and a talent evaluation standpoint.  Being upset we let loose a very sub-par, limited skill-set, UDFR WR who was asking for way too much money for this production is not a sin, nor is replacing him with a 1st/2nd round grade talent in Mims.

End of the day Fidelio, you're just a constant and unrelentingly and extremely negative person this off-season.  Seems nothing that has been done has pleasured you, which IMO says more about you than it does the moves. 

Universal unhappiness with the Jets off-season is just......yeah, it's just odd.  And that's coming from one of JN's most consistent "show me" pragmatic pessimists.   Maybe you just need a break from the Jets for a year....especially since you so clearly think they're going to be horrible this year anyway.

I honestly don't want to go back and forth over little things but I'm mostly disappointed they didn't do enough for Sam.

Not paying Robby was silly, where is all this money going? At some point you have to pay someone.  I would certainly rather paid Robby $2mm more a year than giving Fant $10mm and kept Beachum.

I had hoped JD would make a strong push to heavily upgrade the OL - he didn't.  found a solid, middle of the pack, center - but the rest was no better than the garbage we had - there were players out there b- we, again, chose not to pay.  This off season should have been all about Sam.  It wasn't and that was disappointing.

I think Sam Darnold has top 5 QB talent - he has all the tangible and intangibles to be successful, and this franchise has handled him as if we're in the Bizzaro world.  Allocating resources in all the wrong places.

With that said,  I like Mims a lot (steal of the draft as far as I'm concerned) I like Zuniga a lot, super explosive player that can and I hope will be very productive in the NFL.  I'm simply not sure what else you're universally excited about.

You want to say we're planning for the future, so be it.  I get it.  But we've been rebuilding for a decade straight right now - at some point you have to at least make an attempt to win.

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I saw a show today that wondered when the Jets would start keeping good players 

its a valid criticism 

I liked the trade because of compensation but the Jets do need to start keeping the good players 

the guys the Jets draft with the Seahawks picks might want big contracts when the time comes or be busts and talk crap on Twitter btw

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1 hour ago, FidelioJet said:

You want to say we're planning for the future, so be it.  I get it.  But we've been rebuilding for a decade straight right now - at some point you have to at least make an attempt to win.

I know it's hard for us fans, but we have to remember this:  Douglas has not been rebuilding for a decade, and he can do nothing about the failures and poor decision we already made in that period.

He is here now, and his job it to fix the ship.  He's had one year so far, with mixed results (some very bad moves, quite a few good ones, and this great trade).  Judging him and his decisions as if he also was the GM in 2005 is understandable, but misguided.

We can be angry at the Jets and the state their in, and have been in for years now, but we absolutely must judge the current regime by what the current regime does, not by the past prior to them.  IMO Douglas has been very good so far overall, and is doing it right, plugging something into all the holes immediately to stop the bleeding from all our many talent-gap wounds.  Now is not the time to build an O-line Super Unit (much as I would have liked that) and not helped any other position.  In hindsight, I like Douglas's direction for offseason #1 - stop the bleeding.

Now we'll see if we're materially more competitive than we were last year, and we damn well should be.  We ARE better at almost every spot, even the O-line.  Are we great at O-line, lol, no.  But with Becton and the signings, I reject that we just "replaced sh*t with sh*t".  The line got alot of attention, without breaking the bank or locking us out of other fixes.  Best we can do for today.

Now, the next offseason, and those two #1's, will be a huge one for Douglas, and maybe then if we lag on O-line of don't help Sam I might agree with you.  But if he invests those #1's in a WR and another O-lineman, hell, thats HUGE.  And we did help Sam this offseason, as well as the team as a whole.  Better O-line, better WR room as a whole, better backup QB's if Sam misses time yet again, better RB group with Gore.  We ARE better, on paper, on O.  Sam should do better as things stand today.

Lets give it some time, see how it goes.  I too have doubts, first and foremost Coach Gase.  But I too have to be patient, and give the Gase/Douglas duo time.  Not like we have a choice anyway, amiright? Lol!

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2 hours ago, Warfish said:

I know it's hard for us fans, but we have to remember this:  Douglas has not been rebuilding for a decade, and he can do nothing about the failures and poor decision we already made in that period.

He is here now, and his job it to fix the ship.  He's had one year so far, with mixed results (some very bad moves, quite a few good ones, and this great trade).  Judging him and his decisions as if he also was the GM in 2005 is understandable, but misguided.

We can be angry at the Jets and the state their in, and have been in for years now, but we absolutely must judge the current regime by what the current regime does, not by the past prior to them.  IMO Douglas has been very good so far overall, and is doing it right, plugging something into all the holes immediately to stop the bleeding from all our many talent-gap wounds.  Now is not the time to build an O-line Super Unit (much as I would have liked that) and not helped any other position.  In hindsight, I like Douglas's direction for offseason #1 - stop the bleeding.

Now we'll see if we're materially more competitive than we were last year, and we damn well should be.  We ARE better at almost every spot, even the O-line.  Are we great at O-line, lol, no.  But with Becton and the signings, I reject that we just "replaced sh*t with sh*t".  The line got alot of attention, without breaking the bank or locking us out of other fixes.  Best we can do for today.

Now, the next offseason, and those two #1's, will be a huge one for Douglas, and maybe then if we lag on O-line of don't help Sam I might agree with you.  But if he invests those #1's in a WR and another O-lineman, hell, thats HUGE.  And we did help Sam this offseason, as well as the team as a whole.  Better O-line, better WR room as a whole, better backup QB's if Sam misses time yet again, better RB group with Gore.  We ARE better, on paper, on O.  Sam should do better as things stand today.

Lets give it some time, see how it goes.  I too have doubts, first and foremost Coach Gase.  But I too have to be patient, and give the Gase/Douglas duo time.  Not like we have a choice anyway, amiright? Lol!

Fair enough. 
I actually don’t disagree with most of what you’re saying.  But I do believe we could have easily done more with OL and kept Robby.  

From my perspective Sam should be, pretty much the only thing that matters.  I would like to have seen him behind a strong OL with a couple of quality weapons. The NFL is a funny thing. Give your QB time, surround him with a weapon or two and all of a sudden you’re a contender. 

It’s certainly possible JD isn’t nearly as high on Sam as I am - that would explain a lot and this off-season would make much more sense to me.  

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On 7/27/2020 at 6:15 PM, Jets723 said:

How is trading a Safety “Setting Darnold up for Failure”?  If anything we are helping Sam by getting more draft capital to help the offense 

And freeing up cap dollars to go sign a FA Wide Receiver this offseason.  

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On 7/27/2020 at 8:00 PM, Grandy said:

Trading away someone who plays one of the most unimportant positions, and has 2 picks in 3 years away for 2 firsts is not tanking. He's never intercepted a starting quarterback as a safety for goodness sake. 

We were 0-9 in games where Jamal played, but we were missing our starting QB and 7-6 with Darnold last year. Could you even recall the 2 games Jamal missed?

We also lost to the Dolphins with Adams in the lineup but beat them when Adams was hurt.

It's best just to ignore Fidelio.  

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23 hours ago, LIJetsFan said:

I don't know who is more out of touch, you or Tanier.  Sorry fellow Jets fan but you've been way off base for a while now.  

He misses the Mike Maccagnan approach to free agency.

Let that sink in for a second.  

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17 hours ago, Larz said:

I saw a show today that wondered when the Jets would start keeping good players 

its a valid criticism 

I liked the trade because of compensation but the Jets do need to start keeping the good players 

the guys the Jets draft with the Seahawks picks might want big contracts when the time comes or be busts and talk crap on Twitter btw

 

The last good player we drafted that was worth retaining on an expensive 2nd contract was Darrelle Revis.  

We drafted Revis in 2007.

None of the players we drafted and let go have gone on to success elsewhere since Revis.  Not a single one.  OK maybe one:  Demario Davis.  

And the last draft pick we re-signed for big money, Muhammad Wilkerson, turned into a a lazy dog.  

The problem isn't retention.  It's acquisition.  We've been one of the worst-drafting teams in the league from 2008-2019 (probably the worst in that span).  That was our biggest problem.

The 2020 draft will, hopefully, be the first of many good drafts for the team under Joe Douglas.

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Oh no! The Jets traded a SS... There goes the season... They traded a guy that apparently no one on the team likes, or at least not enough to openly support him. A blatant self-promoter and budding drama queen who's antics probably appeal to people who fit the millennial stereotype (they come in all ages), but pretty much no one else. I doubt he will be missed by anyone other than those with a crush on him. The idea that Jamal's 'star power' was what won games is laughable. The idea that he is irreplaceable is laughable. The idea that the team may be better today due to shipping out a player, who while talented, may not have meshed with the team (addition through subtraction) isn't far fetched.    

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20 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

replacing sh---y players with different sh---y players - doesn't mean better...just different.

So you admit The Robby Anderson was a Sh---y player.

😂

One thing that's great about being an inescapably horrible franchise is that it keeps people like you dead inside.

I'm dead inside as well just with a more cavalier approach. It more fun than your everything is horrible and I'm the only one who can see it routine.

hqdefault.jpg.7ebe272bf5ede57b76cd1186d8f38e9a.jpg

 

The free agents that were available were not worth the money or commitment to this team at this point. We are not making a SB run with or without them.  Sam's not ready the team is not there.  This year is about finding out which of the "Sh---y" players who we gave an opportunity to  will rise to the occasion and become part of the plans moving forward.

If we end up with a center and guards along with the LT of the future in Becton and a couple good WRs out of the group to add in with Crowder I'd say that's not bad. The players on Defense we saw start to flash last year congeal for another year. We'll be getting Mosely and Avery back. We'll begin to gain clarity on the defensive backfield situation with the myriad of CBs we have back there. There is a process happening that you don't seem to be paying attention to. You sprinkle in the couple necessary high priced FAs when you have a clearer picture of the team as built and make sure they are the right people at the right position.

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We have a nice young core with some good vets mixed in.  We also have elite talent at quarterback, left tackle and wide receiver.  Now we have 4 number 1 picks over the next two seasons and 5 picks in first few rounds next season to add to this group.  We are sitting decently regarding cap space as well.  JD has proven to be rather shrewd and has pulled off two tremendous trades in two years.  He was farsighted enough to draft Adams replacement (how does that Ashtyn Davis pick look now?) I don't see how any Jet fan can not be optimistic right now.  We finally have someone in charge who seems to know what he is doing.  

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On 7/28/2020 at 3:08 PM, FidelioJet said:

I think we agree on just about everything you stated.

I will disagree though on one thing - I believe the OL has taken a slight step back - upgraded at center, downgraded at T - Guards are pretty flat. 

But otherwise, yes - we plugged in JAG type, short term fixes to hold down roster spots during the rebuild.   The complete and fundamental lack of understanding how to build an NFL roster in the past has caused this to happen - so we agree....

But two things need to stated....

1) Most Jets fans, particularly on this board, won't admit it - for some reason have a hard time accepting we're in full-on rebuild mode.  This team isn't trying to win this year.

2) We still know little about JD's ability to build a team - all we know is he's capable of taking one apart.  Hopefully he's as good as building as he is at dismantling.

I think Thuney was going to be on our FA list prior to getting tagged. I fully expect us to target Allen Robinson or Juju and Thuney in Free Agency this year. Then use our 2 firsts on an Edge Rusher and a CB. Or at least that would be the approach I hope we take.

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Trading away someone who plays one of the most unimportant positions, and has 2 picks in 3 years away for 2 firsts is not tanking. He's never intercepted a starting quarterback as a safety for goodness sake. 
We were 0-9 in games where Jamal played, but we were missing our starting QB and 7-6 with Darnold last year. Could you even recall the 2 games Jamal missed?
And another person that does not understand that oi is for a lb/as meaning very little.

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I honestly don't want to go back and forth over little things but I'm mostly disappointed they didn't do enough for Sam.
Not paying Robby was silly, where is all this money going? At some point you have to pay someone.  I would certainly rather paid Robby $2mm more a year than giving Fant $10mm and kept Beachum.
I had hoped JD would make a strong push to heavily upgrade the OL - he didn't.  found a solid, middle of the pack, center - but the rest was no better than the garbage we had - there were players out there b- we, again, chose not to pay.  This off season should have been all about Sam.  It wasn't and that was disappointing.
I think Sam Darnold has top 5 QB talent - he has all the tangible and intangibles to be successful, and this franchise has handled him as if we're in the Bizzaro world.  Allocating resources in all the wrong places.
With that said,  I like Mims a lot (steal of the draft as far as I'm concerned) I like Zuniga a lot, super explosive player that can and I hope will be very productive in the NFL.  I'm simply not sure what else you're universally excited about.
You want to say we're planning for the future, so be it.  I get it.  But we've been rebuilding for a decade straight right now - at some point you have to at least make an attempt to win.
Robby just isn't that good... He is an avg we with limited skills.

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this is a really really dumb article.  i'm sure most people know the differences between the teams talent and recordwise.  jackson lucked into a team that was ready for primetime and a coach and front office that were able to take advantage of his talents.  buffalo gearing up for a playoff run?  weren't they just there?  maybe they're gearing up to win the division.  that would be an improvement.  mayfield?  he's had a pretty bad first two seasons.  the browns apparently built up their offensive line and have brought in some pretty talented receivers so we'll see how it goes.

the jets?  how can anyone not see how the player talent has improved over last season.  adams is a very good player but he also plays a low priority position and it looks like the jets have replaced him with macdougald.  this is going to be a good team.

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Took the whole "a great defense helps the offense" to far when he gave too much credit to Adams for the D he was a part of and by making it too important to a QB.  

 

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There's NO doubt that the Jets are not interested in winning this year. You have to consider they are trading their very best player AFTER the draft. So the Jets have no opportunity to start to redesign the roster. They are stuck with a team where their defense revolved around Jamal Adams. Now that Adams in gone? There is going to be a tremendous learning curve for this defense to get back in the swing. So the writer has pegged the Jets when he says they are not interested in winning this season. The Jets roster is still GARBAGE. They still have, very little talent. ALL of the players that you might think are decent players came in through FA or trade. The Jets drafting had sucked for so long that you can't possibly win like that.

Assuming Joe Douglas actually knows what he's doing, it still won't be for at least a few years until can be competitive. Jamal Adams was an excellent player on a roster full of nobodies.

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On 7/27/2020 at 6:24 PM, T0mShane said:

Can someone link me to Tanier’s column where he lambasts the Vikings for trading the exponentially more impactful Stephon Diggs? 

His hot take on the Texans unloading Deandre Hopkins for wads of used tape and recyclable bottles and cans because....really there's not a single rational explanation that comes close to explaining that. For a team that was ahead 21-0 in the AFC title game in January. 

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