Sam Darnold looking good in camp

[munchmemory]

45 minutes ago, Ghost420 said:

This place sucks without camp updates

and/or the Hot Chicks Thread. @Jetsfan80

[GreenCow]

29 minutes ago, TheMo said:

A 300 yard game doesn't result in the QB losing. You infer causality in that statement. You are wrong. 

Actually, I didn’t infer anything.

I said QB’s that throw for 300 yards often end up losing the game.

That is an absolute fact.

What to try again with a different post?

[GreenCow]

33 minutes ago, TheMo said:

Ok so do you think they are wrong or right about the MVP potential?

I think MVP is too far.

But I think it shows that people (outside of Jet-homer land) are high on him.

Not to mention, him making the top 100 list. Which means his peers are high on him too.

[Mogglez]

16 minutes ago, GreenCow said:

I think MVP is too far.

But I think it shows that people (outside of Jet-homer land) are high on him.

Not to mention, him making the top 100 list. Which means his peers are high on him too.

Blake Bortles threw for 4,000 yards and made the top 100 in 2015. That list is absolutely meaningless.  The utter atrocity that it was this year only reinforces that.

[GreenCow]

7 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

Blake Bortles threw for 4,000 yards and made the top 100 in 2015. That list is absolutely meaningless.  The utter atrocity that it was this year only reinforces that.

It’s just 1 data point.

There are many other data points that point to people (outside of Jets homer land) believing in him as well.

[Jetsfan80]

2 minutes ago, GreenCow said:

It’s just 1 data point.

There are many other data points that point to people (outside of Jets homer land) believing in him as well.

That's nice.  Lots of people believing in Allen will surely make him an accurate passer and good decision maker.  

[GreenCow]

2 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

That's nice.  Lots of people believing in Allen will surely make him an accurate passer and good decision maker.  

Maybe not.

But it shows that many people believe he will.

[Jetsfan80]

1 minute ago, GreenCow said:

Maybe not.

But it shows that many people believe he will.

[SOJ]

On 8/8/2020 at 10:28 AM, Trolly McTrollface said:

There’s something you have to realize about the internet, and message boards like this.

We don’t know each other personally, and know very little, if anything about each other’s personal lives. We’ve pm’ed each other about a few things so I’ll tell you this...

I lost my mother last weekend, and drove up to Long Island immediately. My family buried her earlier this week. When I finally logged back on here, I saw about 40 notifications. Most of them were juvenile quotes or reacts to my supporting Jamal Adams, and not being as crazy about his trade as others.

I simply wasn’t in the mood to reply, but after reading most of them, I felt like returning the favor, so to speak. What’s the easiest way to do it? Question Sam Darnold.

i got to release some steam, watch a bunch of homers implode, and laugh at their reactions. Basically just what the doctor ordered. It gave me a few hours to forget my sorrow, and laugh at the childish feelings of grown men who are way too invested in a 23 year old QB.

.and oh yeah. I’d take any of those QBs over Darnold. I’ve seen two years of him, and guys like Jones (who had a way better rookie year on just as bad a team), Tua and Burrow can’t do any worse.

Sorry for your loss... your entitled to your opinion regardless if it is right or wrong...

[Jet Nut]

 

2 hours ago, GreenCow said:

Can you quote the exact post where I incorrectly used correlation?

Also, I never said Allen is an MVP candidate. The MVP bettors did.

Every time you posted, over and over, the number of games where the losing QB threw for over 300 yards

Mo used a nicer way of calling your logic failed, he said you incorrectly used the correlation to defend Allen

I said it was the ass backwards way to look at 300 yard games

Same idea

 

[Jet Nut]

1 hour ago, GreenCow said:

It’s just 1 data point.

There are many other data points that point to people (outside of Jets homer land) believing in him as well.

Many data points?

Start a list, dont including his running ability and size.  How many is many?

LOL

[GreenCow]

6 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Many data points?

Start a list, dont including his running ability and size.  How many is many?

LOL

I think you’re confused.

Were talking about sources that are high on Allen.

[Grandy]

I don't think people are hyping Allen up because he's going to be some QB wiz like Rodgers/Mahomes, I expect that it's more so due to the fact that he has tremendous athletic ability while having an absolute cannon. With intangibles like his it's no wonder why there's hype. Though he's far from a polished passer and I'm not certain of him ever becoming that, he's still exciting. 

However I think Kyler Murray is just a better version of that strong-armed scrambler prototype, and he's my dark horse MVP pick. 

[GreenCow]

17 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

 

Every time you posted, over and over, the number of games where the losing QB threw for over 300 yards

Mo used a nicer way of calling your logic failed, he said you incorrectly used the correlation to defend Allen

I said it was the ass backwards way to look at 300 yard games

Same idea

 

Mo (and now you too) have still not shown a single post where the correlation was incorrect.

My statement was that 300 yard passers more often than not, lose the game.

That statement remains true. No matter how much you dislike it.

15 of the last 20 Super Bowl winning QB’s also threw for less than 300 yards.

[GreenCow]

5 minutes ago, Grandy said:

I don't think people are hyping Allen up because he's going to be some QB wiz like Rodgers/Mahomes, I expect that it's more so due to the fact that he has tremendous athletic ability while having an absolute cannon. With intangibles like his it's no wonder why there's hype. Though he's far from a polished passer and I'm not certain of him ever becoming that, he's still exciting. 

However I think Kyler Murray is just a better version of that strong armed scrambler prototype, and he's my dark horse MVP pick. 

I like Kyler too.

I know that probably makes me a Cardinals fan too now, but there is something exciting about him.

There is an intangible “IT” factor that some QB’s have. I can’t describe it. But both Allen and Murray have it.

[Bowles Movement]

4 hours ago, GreenCow said:

Yes sir.

It was the same in 2019 too.

“...last season there were 132 300-yard passing games in the NFL. The combined record of those 300-yard passers was sub-.500 – 64-66-2. And if you subtracted NFL MVP Patrick Mahomes’ 8-2 mark, those 300-yard passers won a paltry 46.7 percent of their games.” link

This has actually been going on for a while. If a QB throws for over 300 yards, more often than not it means the team lost the game.

For example, Matt Ryan went 1-5 in his first 6 starts last year while throwing for 300+ in every one of them.

I wonder what the record is of teams losing at halftime when their qb doesnt throw for 300 yds?   You think its better than teams losing at halftime where the qb does throw for 300 yds?

[Jetsfan80]

17 minutes ago, GreenCow said:

I like Kyler too.

I know that probably makes me a Cardinals fan too now, but there is something exciting about him.

There is an intangible “IT” factor that some QB’s have. I can’t describe it. But both Allen and Murray have it.

 

Kyler Murray completed 64.4 % of his throws and just added DeAndre Hopkins.  The excitement is legitimate.

[GreenCow]

10 minutes ago, Bowles Movement said:

I wonder what the record is of teams losing at halftime when their qb doesnt throw for 300 yds?   You think its better than teams losing at halftime where the qb does throw for 300 yds?

I don’t think throwing for 300 yards makes a team lose.

Throwing for 300+ yards is simply a symptom of a team that is already losing, and therefore needs to throw more to attempt to come back.

Which is why it’s silly to judge a QB based on that.

[GreenCow]

6 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

Kyler Murray completed 64.4 % of his throws and just added DeAndre Hopkins.  The excitement is legitimate.

Do you think that someone who checks down less will naturally have a higher amount of incompletions?

[FidelioJet]

27 minutes ago, GreenCow said:

I think you’re confused.

Were talking about sources that are high on Allen.

Josh Allen stinks. I’m sorry but he’s not a good QB and won’t be a long term solution for the Bills. 

[Bowles Movement]

1 minute ago, GreenCow said:

I don’t think throwing for 300 yards makes a team lose.

Throwing for 300+ yards is simply a symptom of a team that is already losing, and therefore needs to throw more to attempt to come back.

Which is why it’s silly to judge a QB based on that.

Im not arguing that point, but your argument that good qbs dont need to throw for 300 yds is silly.    Would you rather have Neal Allen or Drew Brees if you were losing at halftime?  Do you prefer Tannyhill to Mahomes?

You are avoiding the question I posed

When you are behind at the half, what is winning percentage of teams that throw for 300 yds vs teams that dont?

[Jetsfan80]

5 minutes ago, GreenCow said:

Do you think that someone who checks down less will naturally have a higher amount of incompletions?

Certainly.  But Allen's horrific career YPA of 6.6 fleshes that out to be a silly defense.  

[GreenCow]

3 minutes ago, Bowles Movement said:

Im not arguing that point, but your argument that good qbs dont need to throw for 300 yds is silly.   

I literally never said that. Where are you getting that from?

[GreenCow]

8 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Certainly.  But Allen's horrific career YPA of 6.6 fleshes that out to be a silly defense.  

Glad you agree (I mean, it would be stupid not to agree that checkdowns make a difference in completion percentage).

Here is the top 10 list of LEAST checkdowns by NFL QB.

The next closest QB has thrown nearly DOUBLE the amount of checkdowns as Allen. Note: Kyler’s stat looks low because he has only played 1 year. His 2 year projection would be 44.

 

[Jetsfan80]

2 minutes ago, GreenCow said:

Glad you agree (I mean, it would be stupid not to agree that checkdowns make a difference in completion percentage).

Here is the top 10 list of LEAST checkdowns by NFL QB.

The next closest QB has thrown nearly DOUBLE the amount of checkdowns as Allen.

 

 

Again.  Yards per Attempt fleshes that out.  Checking down drops your YPA.  

For Allen, he thus has no excuse for his poor YPA.  

[GreenCow]

8 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

Again.  Yards per Attempt fleshes that out.  Checking down drops your YPA.  

For Allen, he thus has no excuse for his poor YPA.  

You’re going to have to explain to me how YPA correlates to checkdowns when it comes to analyzing whether checkdowns are part of the reason why a QB has a low completion %... 

Are you aware of how YPA is calculated?

[Jetsfan80]

Just now, GreenCow said:

You’re going to have to explain to me how YPA correlates to checkdowns in your scenario.

Are you aware of how YPA is calculated?

Yes.  Yards divided by attempts.  

Chad Pennington, Mr Checkdown Charlie himself, would routinely complete 65+ % of his throws, but his YPA would hover around 6.8-7.2 because he couldn't push the ball down the field.

You would expect Allen, with his deep ball prowess, to be hitting 7.5+ YPA.  But because he's so wildly inaccurate, it sits at 6.6.

Back to you, Greencow, and your condescending posts!

[Jet Nut]

2 hours ago, GreenCow said:

It’s just 1 data point.

There are many other data points that point to people (outside of Jets homer land) believing in him as well.

 

55 minutes ago, GreenCow said:

I think you’re confused.

Were talking about sources that are high on Allen.

No Im not confused, you just keep spinning 

[Jet Nut]

55 minutes ago, GreenCow said:

 

My statement was that 300 yard passers more often than not, lose the game.

 

Except you tried to make the correlation into 300 yard games arent important because historically most 300 yard games occur in losses.

Totally wrong way to decide that 300 yard passing games are meaningless

You can bullshlt all you want but thats what you were going with 

[GreenCow]

2 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Except you tried to make the correlation into 300 yard games arent important because historically most 300 yard games occur in losses.

Totally wrong way to decide that 300 yard passing games are meaningless

You can bullshlt all you want but thats what you were going with 

Show me the post where I said any of that?

I said that I don’t care about 300 yard games for a QB because most of the time, that’s a losing game.

So if Allen or Murray or Sam or anyone doesn’t have 300 yard games, but they win, it doesn’t matter to me.

[GreenCow]

5 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

 

No Im not confused, you just keep spinning 

Are you confused too?

He thought we were discussing data points for why Allen is great. 

We weren’t.

We we’re discussing data points of people who believe in him.

Lets review the comment again:

“There are many other data points that point to people (outside of Jets homer land) believing in him as well”

Reading comprehension is key.

[Jet Nut]

2 minutes ago, GreenCow said:

Show me the post where I said any of that?

I said that I don’t care about 300 yard games for a QB because most of the time, that’s a losing game.

Right after @Mogglez made the comment that allen has somehow never thrown for 300 yards and went off defending it

[Jet Nut]

2 minutes ago, GreenCow said:

We we’re discussing data points of people who believe in him.

So now its the people who believe in him

Thats now a data point?

LOL

[GreenCow]

22 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Yes.  Yards divided by attempts.  

Chad Pennington, Mr Checkdown Charlie himself, would routinely complete 65+ % of his throws, but his YPA would hover around 6.8-7.2 because he couldn't push the ball down the field.

You would expect Allen, with his deep ball prowess, to be hitting 7.5+ YPA.  But because he's so wildly inaccurate, it sits at 6.6.

Back to you, Greencow, and your condescending posts!

No offense, but that doesn’t make any sense.

YPA simply divides a QB’s total yardage, by their attempts.

YOA doesn’t “flesh out” anything to do with checkdowns and how they relate to completion percentage.

For example:

Allen threw BY FAR the least amount of checkdowns last year and the year before. The next closest QB threw almost 2x more checkdowns.

So, if Allen had thrown just the league average of checkdowns, (instead of throwing it deep and trying to make things happen), his completion percentage would have went from 58.8% to 61%.

61%.

Does that number sound familiar? That’s because that was Sam’s completion % last year.

10 checkdowns make the difference between 58.8% and 61%.

Now back to your funny YPA argument.

Assuming the checkdown only goes for a couple yards - it’s a checkdown after all - his YPA would be exactly the same as it is right now (technically it would go from 6.71 to 6.74).

His completion percentage would go up, and his YPA would stay the same. 

The exact dang same.

Simply put, your YPA argument makes no logical sense.

[GreenCow]

1 minute ago, Jet Nut said:

Right after @Mogglez made the comment that allen has somehow never thrown for 300 yards and went off defending it

Yeah, read my posts. I never said what you think I said. Ever. You made some fantasy up in your mind.

Its all there. In black and white. Read it.