Should CJ Fire Gase Before the Season Ends?

[Drums]

I had some faith in CJ but he has lead this team to looking worse than I’ve seen it in my lifetime. First time in a while we didn’t improve after hiring a new coach and in fact got worse. Even Bowles almost made the playoffs in his first year. Gase gave this team no juice at all. I tried to give him a chance but he’s gotta go asap. 

[JustInFudge]

5 minutes ago, Bruce Harper said:

I think he is doing as terrible job but I think it depends on who is available to take his place  Are we really better off with an interim guy off this staff and Loggins as a real OC?  I'm not convinced.

Promote Williams to HC, promote Bush to DC and promote Cooter or Jefferson to OC.   Sends Loggins worthless ass out the door with Gase.

This team should be playing like it has nothing to lose and instead it plays uninspired, gutless, no heart, coward Football. 

 

 

[Augustiniak]

Just now, JiF said:

Promote Williams to HC, promote Bush to DC and promote Cooter or Jefferson to OC.   Sends Loggins worthless ass out the door with Gase.

This team should be playing like it has nothing to lose and instead it plays uninspired, gutless, no heart, coward Football. 

 

 

It has a familiar feeling, when the players know the HC is a goner and the team can’t score.  The only potential difference is that douglas seems to have made good on his promise to improve the OL.  Maybe with better wrs and a new HC we’d see more points.

[JustInFudge]

4 minutes ago, Biggs said:

I can't get into Douglas or Gase's state of mind or what they actually think.  I think they came into a very bad situation.  That doesn't mean they can fix it either.  I'm just not a fan of second guessing everything and thinking firing them and letting Howard or Gabby Johnson hire the next two tools to run the organization is a fix.  It's a lottery ticket that only guarantees you lost the money you paid to get the ticket with.  

FWIW - I'm not advocating firing JD. 

100% I'd send Gase packing though.

[slimjasi]

5 minutes ago, Augustiniak said:

Douglas seems like a very calm, calculating patient man.  Seems to know that gase will at some point irk the johnsons enough and they’ll fire him.  Meanwhile all douglas needs to show is that most of his draft picks seem good and that he didn’t waste money on high priced free agents to maintain he’s on the path to a rebuild.  If by week 8 we’re watching mims, perine and Zuniga play decent, we’ll all be thrilled with what douglas has done in limited opportunity and the only remaining question will be not if gase will go, but when, and whether darnold can be saved.

I agree with a lot of this, but I think the bolded is a bit too simplistic. As the GM, he's fully responsible for the roster. So, in addition to his draft picks, he's on the hook for things like Perriman's performance (relative to Anderson's performance in Carolina).

The other issue is, let's actually see Mims and Zuniga get on the field (Perine at least got on the field yesterday, which was a nice positive). 

Also, as one of the most important leaders in the organization, he is on the hook for helping get rid of Gase as quickly as possible. I'd argue that Gase is so lost right now, that we would get a better evaluation of Darnold if we dumped him right now. Get rid of Gase and the hobbit and let Jim Bob Cooter (who has years of NFL OC experience) call the plays for the rest of the season. 

[JustInFudge]

2 minutes ago, Augustiniak said:

It has a familiar feeling, when the players know the HC is a goner and the team can’t score.  The only potential difference is that douglas seems to have made good on his promise to improve the OL.  Maybe with better wrs and a new HC we’d see more points.

I'm not saying it will have the same effect but look what happened in Cleveland when they fired the proven loser 2 weeks into the season.  Their rookie QB went on to break the rookie TD record and it just so happens the same interim HC is on this team.

 

 

[y2k8]

18 minutes ago, Bruce Harper said:

I think he is doing as terrible job but I think it depends on who is available to take his place  Are we really better off with an interim guy off this staff and Loggins as a real OC?  I'm not convinced.

I would bet a large sum of money that if Gregg Williams stepped up to interim HC and Loggins became the OC and play caller the offense would be better. 

Gase's playbook is not the problem. Gase calling plays and being the HC is the problem.

Fire one guy and you solve two problems.

It's addition by subtraction

[slimjasi]

9 minutes ago, Biggs said:

I can't get into Douglas or Gase's state of mind or what they actually think.  I think they came into a very bad situation.  That doesn't mean they can fix it either.  I'm just not a fan of second guessing everything and thinking firing them and letting Howard or Gabby Johnson hire the next two tools to run the organization is a fix.  It's a lottery ticket that only guarantees you lost the money you paid to get the ticket with.  

Douglas is not getting fired, he's the guy who who is going to be allowed to fix this mess. But I just think he isn't doing himself any favors stickup up for Gase. Make the dumb owner realize that this guy is in over his head and move on sooner than later. 

[Augustiniak]

2 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

I agree with a lot of this, but I think the bolded is a bit too simplistic. As the GM, he's fully responsible for the roster. So, in addition to his draft picks, he's on the hook for things like Perriman's performance (relative to Anderson's performance in Carolina).

The other issue is, let's actually see Mims and Zuniga get on the field (Perine at least got on the field yesterday, which was a nice positive). 

Also, as one of the most important leaders in the organization, he is on the hook for helping get rid of Gase as quickly as possible. I'd argue that Gase is so lost right now, that we would get a better evaluation of Darnold if we dumped him right now. Get rid of Gase and the hobbit and let Jim Bob Cooter (who has years of NFL OC experience) call the plays for the rest of the season. 

It’s clear douglas didn’t spend as much as he could - but for all we know this directive came from CJ so that would only give him more support from ownership.  Yes, at this point, gase is lost, that 4th and 1 hand off said it all.  Then you see another sick darnold highlight at the end on that berrios pass, and you wonder what a real OC could do to unlock this all game.  

[Waka Flocka Flacco]

37 minutes ago, JiF said:

They = whoever is finding a talent.  JD and his team or JD and Gase.  Idk how that works.  I thought the entire OL was signed to multi year deals, with Fant being one they could get out of next year?  And didnt Griffin sign a multi year deal? 

To be fair, I do think they did upgrade the OL.  Granted, last year was historically bad so that wasnt really a challenge but they do look better and Becton looks great.  We havent seen Mims/Perine/Clark, so maybe the draft has produced more than we think 2 weeks into these rookies careers.

 

 

 

Lewis and Van Roten have outs after a year too. McGovern after two. I would assume Griffin is a series of options also and Andrews probably just got veteran minimum. Perriman, one year. Desir, one year. Jenkins, one year.

Clark, Mims, Hall, and Zuniga behind these guys are all next year picks. Davis and Perine in advance of Adams and Bell leaving are next year picks. Morgan obviously is a next year pick.

This stuff you cite as evidence that they believed they had upgraded seems more like proof that they knew they had to field a team this season but weren't especially enthusiastic about the idea.

[jgb]

4 hours ago, Fantasy Island said:

@#$% Lawrence, I want us to build around Sam.  Get some WR's . Fire the HC and training staff.  Try, just effing try to make progress.  Tired of waiting for next year.  Win Now!!!!!

Keep throwing good money after bad.

[Jetsfan80]

1 hour ago, slimjasi said:

Douglas is not getting fired, he's the guy who who is going to be allowed to fix this mess. But I just think he isn't doing himself any favors stickup up for Gase. Make the dumb owner realize that this guy is in over his head and move on sooner than later. 

Douglas talked up Jamal Adams until he traded him.  Granted, part of that was obviously an attempt to keep his value high; no such incentive exists in talking up Adam Gase.  But I still wouldn't put much stock into what he says.  

[slimjasi]

12 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Douglas talked up Jamal Adams until he traded him.  Granted, part of that was obviously an attempt to keep his value high; no such incentive exists in talking up Adam Gase.  But I still wouldn't put much stock into what he says.  

I don't necessarily put that much stock in what he says, but I do think he hurts himself the longer sticks by a loser/lame duck coach, even if it is only in public. Gase is a pariah of the highest magnitude right now and is never going to survive this mess. At the very least, Douglas should already be whispering to the owner about possible replacements. He wants to end his association with Gase as quickly and seamlessly as possible, in every way. 

I would go so far as to say that it may even be worth it to dump Gase as part of his plan to fully evaluate Darnold (and the rest of the young players on the roster). You still have 14 game left (most of a season) and I just think the building needs a jump right now - the team is dead with Gase. 

As much as I sh*t on him yesterday, maybe dumping Gase for Williams and letting WIlliams run the team for the rest of the season (giving his share of rah rah speeches to psyche the team up along the way) may be the way to go. Then, see if Darnold shows improvement without Gase, particularly after he gets Crowder and Mims back on the field. 

The only reasonable counterargument to this is to let Gase complete the tank and go for Trevor Lawrence. The problem with this is that you and I both know the Jets will figure out a way to miss out on Trevor Lawrence. 

 

[GREENBEAN]

On 9/20/2020 at 8:16 PM, Philc1 said:

JD at some point has to know his own job is at stake.  I don’t care if he has a 6 year contract this roster is underperforming like crazy with Gase and it makes JD look bad

That's my point. I don't think JD, the next big name in GM's that year, was coming here if he didn't get full control.  I just don't buy it. Jamal is a fantastic example.  I would be blown away if JD doesn't fire Gase should this suck fest continue. Injuries or not.  He's not hitching his sled to Gase. No way in hell. 

[pdxgreen]

I think it's very conceivable that Douglas has rmade up his mind about Sam.  He promised to protective him as well as he could and he's don'e that. But he's holding onto all his picks and cap space for the future.  And If you fire Gase you risk the change of bringing in a interim coach with a few more brain cells than Gase.  Who can rally you the troops and take you out of contention for the first pick.  Think about it.  Douglas has to know Gase is toast now.  He just has to.  He'll have four more years on that contract and he'll want a shot at getting Lawrence going forward.  A coach he can wait on but he has to make sure that the top pick offers him the chance at a generational talent.