Why is Trevor Lawrence a "Generational QB Prospect"?

[More Cowbell]

17 minutes ago, Samtorobby47 said:

I just watched YouTube highlights. He’s good. Fields too. We’re good to go with replacing Sammy. 

Watch Darnolds college highlights. You might feel different about him. Highlight videos are all well highlights.

[UntouchableCrew]

13 minutes ago, JTJet said:

Trigger warning.....

Just presenting factual evidence here so everyone understands the comparison. 

Sam Darnold was a better QB than Trevor Lawrence his freshman year, and he did it against way better competition. 

Darnold beat Lawrence in every statistical category that matters except for INTs their first years. 

This is a direct 1 to 1 of their regular college seasons, minus bowl games (Sam had 1/Trev had 2) so I removed them from the stats for the sake of keeping it as directly comparable as possible. 

Their sophomore years were close, I will post those momentarily. 

Those aren't Lawrence's freshman numbers... (And Lawrence was a true freshman while Darnold wasn't)

Career Stats

See All

STATS
2020
2019
2018

CMP	ATT	CMP%	YDS	AVG	TD	INT	LNG	RTG
30	37	81.1	519	14.0	4	0	54	234.6
268	407	65.8	3,665	9.0	36	8	87	166.7
259	397	65.2	3,280	8.3	30	4	74	157.6

[Jimmy 2 Times]

2 minutes ago, JTJet said:

Stop. You are fully aware that's a reach. 

They were both 19 years old when they laid those numbers out.

 

I don't know about you, but sophomore year in college was A LOT different from my first fall as a freshman. 

Just knowing the campus.  The comfort level.  

It's not a reach.  Your entire premise is a reach. 

[Jet_Engine1]

3 minutes ago, JTJet said:

Stop. You are fully aware that's a reach. 

They were both 19 years old when they laid those numbers out.

Darnold wasn't half the prospect Lawrence is. Lawrence would be the consensus #1 Overall pick in every draft since 2012. Not even close. 

[Greenseed4]

7 minutes ago, JTJet said:

Trigger warning.....

Just presenting factual evidence here so everyone understands the comparison. 

Sam Darnold was a better QB than Trevor Lawrence his freshman year, and he did it against way better competition. 

Darnold beat Lawrence in every statistical category that matters except for INTs their first years. 

This is a direct 1 to 1 of their regular college seasons, minus bowl games (Sam had 1/Trev had 2) so I removed them from the stats for the sake of keeping it as directly comparable as possible. 

Their sophomore years were close, I will post those momentarily. 

Sam also had 20 fumbles over his two years (14 lost), added to his 22 interceptions, that makes 36 turnovers in 27 games played. 
 

Trevor has 4 fumbles lost, 12 interceptions. 16 turnovers in 32 games played. 

[JTJet]

20 minutes ago, Jet_Engine1 said:

LOL. Yep, there's NO difference between dominating ACC and SEC teams and playing against the PAC-12.

Bro. 

Seriously? 

This was the schedule for each guy... 

By every objectionable measure, the schedule on the left would be considered harder. 

Darnold crushed Lawrence in stats that first year, AND that was with him not starting the first couple games. 

 

[Beerfish]

14 minutes ago, Defense Wins Championships said:

He's a better college QB at every statistical category than Sam was coming out. More TDs. Less ints. Better QB Rating. Better completion percentage. More rushing yards etc etc and he's also bigger stronger more athletic much better arm etc. 

And he's in a better conference destroying better defenses than Sam did. 

I'm an FSU fan and he's absolutely destroyed us every time. He destroyed Alabama during championship game too. 

He's for real. 

And he got flattened by LSU and was not overly impressive vs Ohio State.  Also Clemson has vastly more talent in most areas than usc.  (Also FSU is no big benchmark for flattening.)

If Lawrence is generational then what is joe burrow?

[UntouchableCrew]

1 minute ago, JTJet said:

Seriously? 

This was the schedule for each guy... 

By every objectionable measure, the schedule on the left would be considered harder. 

Darnold crushed Lawrence in stats that first year, AND that was with him not starting the first couple games. 

Dude what are you talking about. Darnold didn't even play in the Alabama or Stanford games, two of the toughest USC played all year.

Clemson dusted Notre Dame and Alabama in the playoffs. 

 

[UntouchableCrew]

Just now, Beerfish said:

And he got flattened by LSU and was not overly impressive vs Ohio State.  Also Clemson has vastly more talent in most areas than usc.  (Also FSU is no big benchmark for flattening.)

If Lawrence is generational then what is joe burrow?

What did Joe Burrow do without Joe Brady? He looked like every other LSU QB ever.

[Mogglez]

7 hours ago, Warfish said:

I don't follow college (minor league) football, as most know.

I usually only get to know prospects late, via reading about them and watching vids.

I do not know Trevor Lawrence yet.  I just know a goodly number of jets Fans are staking their entire future on him, and using (IMO) many of the same descriptive once reserved for, say, Sam Darnold.  

So this question is for the College Fans:  Tell me why Trevor Lawrence is so special, so great, "best prospect since Manning", etc, etc, etc.

What does he do, or what physical traits down he have, to warrant such fluffery?

Educate me.

Elite pocket awareness.

Elite arm strength.

Elite accuracy, touch, and ball placement.

Elite size.

Advanced blitz recognition.

Dual threat athlete.

Fantastic mechanics.

The National Championship from last year was the first game he’s lost since Pop-Warner.

Has lived up to his astronomical expectations from High School.

Barring injury, he will finish college with 3 full years of experience and 3 full years where he has improved every year as a starter.

Great leader.

That’s as short of a list as I can make.  I know you don’t watch a ton of college ball, but pay close attention to him this year if you can.  He’s special, and it shows up on the film.

The biggest negative I have against him and something I’d like to him improve on is the fact that he sometimes trusts his arm strength a little too much.  That said, he doesn’t turn the ball over much because he has fantastic decision making abilities.  It’s hard to give him a real pro comparison, but if Elway were 6’6 that’s where I’d go.

[Greenseed4]

14 minutes ago, UntouchableCrew said:

He's big, athletic, great arm talent. Strong arm, accurate, great instincts. Good decision maker, very few turnovers. Great runner.

Was the number one recruit in the nation in high school (was a "LeBron type" legendary prospect who received national attention while he was still in HS.)

Stepped in and dominated as a true freshman. Undefeated season and thrashed Alabama's previously dominant defense in the national title game. Followed up with another undefeated regular season before losing in the national title game to LSU.

TL:DR -- he has elite physical traits and has performed at an elite level both statistically and in terms of W/L record despite absurd expectations. His game has no obvious flaws or weaknesses. My only concern is that he hasn't had to overcome a ton of adversity because he (and his teams) have been so much better than the competition... 

But it really needs to be stressed for people who keep saying "that's what they said about Sam Darnold" that that's completely untrue. He's not really in the same league as a prospect as Darnold. Darnold was a nothing recruit out of high school. He's smaller with a weaker arm and always had turnover issues. No prospect is "can't miss" but Lawrence is as close to it as you can get.

Your TL:DR summary was longer than what you were summarizing ?

[JTJet]

2 minutes ago, UntouchableCrew said:

Dude what are you talking about. Darnold didn't even play in the Alabama or Stanford games, two of the toughest USC played all year.

Clemson dusted Notre Dame and Alabama in the playoffs. 

 

You clearly didn't read that post, and missing the point.

I said he didnt start the first couple games. 

But if you had to play one of those schedules for the year, nobody would want to play the schedule on the left, especially in that order. 

[Larz]

Who cares he’ll probably be a Giant

[CTM]

31 minutes ago, JTJet said:

Their sophomore years were close, I will post those momentarily

No they weren't 

[Jet_Engine1]

ANYONE that tries to make the case that Darnold as a prospect is anywhere near Lawrence is just embarrassing themselves. 

[Jet_Engine1]

19 minutes ago, JTJet said:

You clearly didn't read that post, and missing the point.

I said he didnt start the first couple games. 

But if you had to play one of those schedules for the year, nobody would want to play the schedule on the left, especially in that order. 

JUST....no

[JTJet]

Just now, Jet_Engine1 said:

Stop.  Its just silly at this point. 

Continuously saying something is silly doesnt mean it is true. 

Compare those two schedules. Which would you rather have ahead of you? 

Your answer is already wrong, so stop. 

[Darnold Schwarzenegger]

5 hours ago, Warfish said:

I don't follow college (minor league) football, as most know.

I usually only get to know prospects late, via reading about them and watching vids.

I do not know Trevor Lawrence yet.  I just know a goodly number of jets Fans are staking their entire future on him, and using (IMO) many of the same descriptive once reserved for, say, Sam Darnold.  

So this question is for the College Fans:  Tell me why Trevor Lawrence is so special, so great, "best prospect since Manning", etc, etc, etc.

What does he do, or what physical traits down he have, to warrant such fluffery?

Educate me.

He's peyton manning with legs

[Jet_Engine1]

2 minutes ago, JTJet said:

Continuously saying something is silly doesnt mean it is true. 

Compare those two schedules. Which would you rather have ahead of you? 

Your answer is already wrong, so stop. 

Saying Darnold was anywhere near Lawrence as a prospect is moronic to the point of nonsense. 

 

Not 1 legit Scout, recruiter, recruiting service, sports analyst, College program, NFL team, agent, coach, Former QB, Knowledgeable talk radio guy, bartender, henhouse, outhouse, or boathouse agrees with your very hot and very wrong take. 

 

Nobody. 

[Darnold Schwarzenegger]

 

Arch Manning is going to be the next generational QB 

[JTJet]

1 minute ago, Jet_Engine1 said:

Saying Darnold was anywhere near Lawrence as a prospect is moronic to the point of nonsense. 

 

Not 1 legit Scout, recruiter, recruiting service, sports analyst, College program, NFL team, agent, coach, Former QB, Knowledgeable talk radio guy, bartender, henhouse, outhouse, or boathouse agrees with your very hot and very wrong take. 

 

Nobody. 

Yep. Those Furman, Georgia southern, Duke squads. Powerhouses right there. 

Lawrence had worse stats against lesser teams. 

Seems legit. 

[Lurker89]

Look at you guys trying to get excited about something again.

[Ecuadorian Jet]

2 hours ago, LAD_Brooklyn said:

He's a grest story. The number one high school Prospect comes in his freshman year and leads his teams to a national title. For the next two years of eligibility that player is going to be a media darling. Not only that but ESPN and the ACC Network have to market their games.

Definitely has a promising NFL potiential but in no way a generational talent. If another team wants this guys I have no problem shipping him off. 

 

Every college prospect can be a generational talent, in the right environment with coaching and management that helps you exploit your potential.

To make a comparison, every responsible loving parent knows that.

[UntouchableCrew]

59 minutes ago, JTJet said:

Yep. Those Furman, Georgia southern, Duke squads. Powerhouses right there. 

Lawrence had worse stats against lesser teams. 

Seems legit. 

This is just baffling. It's a flat out lie that he had worse stats. He did not. That's factually incorrect. Even if we operate under the assumption that the 2018 ACC was worse than the 2016 Pac-12 (it probably was, but not by much) he throttled Notre Dame and CRUSHED Alabama in the National Title game.

You want to talk competition? The only time Sam Darnold played a real powerhouse in his college career was in the 2017 Fiesta Bowl and Ohio State dominated him in every facet.

[playtowinthegame]

1 hour ago, Defense Wins Championships said:

He's a better college QB at every statistical category than Sam was coming out. More TDs. Less ints. Better QB Rating. Better completion percentage. More rushing yards etc etc and he's also bigger stronger more athletic much better arm etc. 

And he's in a better conference destroying better defenses than Sam did. 

I'm an FSU fan and he's absolutely destroyed us every time. He destroyed Alabama during championship game too. 

He's for real. 

Beating Florida State in football now is like beating Wake Forrest. I remember when they were loaded with talent and had a staff of Bobby Bowden (HC), Mickey Andrews (DC), and Mark Richt (OC). It's amazing how far they've fallen as a program.

[JTJet]

6 minutes ago, UntouchableCrew said:

This is just baffling. It's a flat out lie that he had worse stats. He did not. That's factually incorrect. Even if we operate under the assumption that the 2018 ACC was worse than the 2016 Pac-12 (it probably was, but not by much) he throttled Notre Dame and CRUSHED Alabama in the National Title game.

You want to talk competition? The only time Sam Darnold played a real powerhouse in his college career was in the 2017 Fiesta Bowl and Ohio State dominated him in every facet.

Prove it then. Show me what's factually incorrect then. "Show me the receipts" as the kids say. Because I have my proof in hard numbers right here and you choose to just deny. You're like a flat Earther. 

These are the regular season stats for both players (13 game season), without the bowl games, as I said before. Darnold has better stats and he did so in less games as a starter, as the first few he only played sparingly. 

By all mathematical reasoning that exists to mankind, if a player has more TDs, more passing yards, more rushing yards, more rushing TDs, better completion percentage, and he accomplishes that in less playing time. Against better competition, that means he did better. 

And the competition was different by a LOT, dont lie to save face. Furman? Georgia Southern? Wake Forest? Duke? Syracuse? That's half of Clemsons schedule that year. Laughable. 

Now... if you want to compare Bowl games, sure, Lawrence beat Darnold there, no question. But that doesnt change the rest of how they matched up during their regular seasons. 

[SomebodytoAnybody47]

47 minutes ago, Lurker89 said:

Look at you guys trying to get excited about something again.

Best time for jet fans! Looking forward to next to the unknown future!

[Beerfish]

2 hours ago, UntouchableCrew said:

What did Joe Burrow do without Joe Brady? He looked like every other LSU QB ever.

Come on, did you not actually watch the guy play?

Also you can start by using that same formula for every big talent high profile school including lawrence at clemson.

[Zerovoltz]

Wow....A LOT of you guys are really into box score analysis.  Raw box score stats only tell you so much.  You can find QB's in air raid systems that always put up big numbers no matter what kind of pro prospect they are....a big part of what made people mis-diagnose Mahomes was that they saw his stats as a product of the system and didn't bother to actually consider his other traits.  Mahomes big stats WERE a product of the air raid, but if you took a closer look, you'd find a guy with elite arm strength, mobility....and the really important parts....pocket presence...eyes ALWAYS downfield even as pressure was coming or moving out of the pocket....always eyes downfield with an aim to pass first.  accuracy off platform.  accuracy rolling both directions.  Improvement in Cmp PTC year over year...and turnover rate.  I never understood the knock on Mahomes as a potential turnover machine...he had a very low TO rate in college.  Anyhow...Lawrence has the tools....many QB do....watch and see if he keeps his eyes downfield....makes reads and progressions....watch when he is in the pocket.....does he keep looking downfield when there is a collapsing pocket?  Does he naturally have a feel for when to slide or step up....and not abandon good pockets? 

Brady was the master and just standing in a pocket and moving a step or two or stepping up, keeping his eyes on his targets....and making the right choice....Mahomes does that very very well also.  I haven't spent enough time looking at TL...but that's what you should watch for....does he operate with his eyes remaining at all times, on targets, downfield even in chaos?  It's huge.  If he does...then the physical gifts combined with that....you'd have to take the guy if you could. 

[Mogglez]

6 hours ago, UntouchableCrew said:

What did Joe Burrow do without Joe Brady? He looked like every other LSU QB ever.

He currently doesn’t have Joe Brady and looks pretty friggin’ good.

[predator_05]

43 minutes ago, Zerovoltz said:

Wow....A LOT of you guys are really into box score analysis.  Raw box score stats only tell you so much.  You can find QB's in air raid systems that always put up big numbers no matter what kind of pro prospect they are....a big part of what made people mis-diagnose Mahomes was that they saw his stats as a product of the system and didn't bother to actually consider his other traits.  Mahomes big stats WERE a product of the air raid, but if you took a closer look, you'd find a guy with elite arm strength, mobility....and the really important parts....pocket presence...eyes ALWAYS downfield even as pressure was coming or moving out of the pocket....always eyes downfield with an aim to pass first.  accuracy off platform.  accuracy rolling both directions.  Improvement in Cmp PTC year over year...and turnover rate.  I never understood the knock on Mahomes as a potential turnover machine...he had a very low TO rate in college. 

Would Mahomes be the player he is today on a different team? 

[Scoop24]

8 hours ago, New York Mick said:

I remember when Luck was going to be the greatest QB to step on the field. That worked out real good. How many generational talents can there be in one generation. 

Luck was a top flight QB from day 1. His oline was sh*t he had 1 legit WR in TY , and still performed at high level .  He didnt need  a perfect roster and book worth of excuses like a certain other QB needs.

one thing for sure scouts dont miss on generational QB prospects. Elway, Peyton, Luck all legit

[Scoop24]

8 hours ago, JTJet said:

Trigger warning.....

Just presenting factual evidence here so everyone understands the comparison. 

Sam Darnold was a better QB than Trevor Lawrence his freshman year, and he did it against way better competition. 

Darnold beat Lawrence in every statistical category that matters except for INTs their first years. 

This is a direct 1 to 1 of their regular college seasons, minus bowl games (Sam had 1/Trev had 2) so I removed them from the stats for the sake of keeping it as directly comparable as possible. 

Their sophomore years were close, I will post those momentarily. 

Trevor shreds Alabama for championship as a True freshman .
 

Sam biggest game come back win vs texas. In which he played pretty bad in that 1st half. 

 

they are not Same. 

[Scoop24]

8 hours ago, Beerfish said:

And he got flattened by LSU and was not overly impressive vs Ohio State.  Also Clemson has vastly more talent in most areas than usc.  (Also FSU is no big benchmark for flattening.)

If Lawrence is generational then what is joe burrow?

A 5th Year senior QB who before he got to LSU and had the magical year.  Wasn’t going to be high Draft Pick. 

[heymangold]

listen, i like sam and had hope for him.  it's just a shame that coaching let him down.  if you have the chance to pick Lawrence, you do it.  here are their stats compared to the "great" andrew luck.