Joe Douglas must share in the blame for this Jets debacle

[Adoni Beast]

Joe D definitely deserves some blame, because I do believe this intent was to punt on this season and get rid of Gase.

I think he legitimately liked Sam enough and wanted to keep him safe/upright by prioritizing on the OL this offseason, but wanted no reasons to have Gase come back. 

Now he has a chance to possibly draft his own QB (which I think the Jamal trade was all about - ammo for trading up) if Sam doesn’t solidify himself as the guy. 

I don’t think Joe D expected us to lose our way to the #1 pick, but definitely a top 5 scenario. Now he has us in line to change the entire team this offseason anyway he sees fit. He has given himself a plethora of options to choose from, without having to be saddled with any former players / big contracts / coaches / etc.

It’s Joe’s team now.

[TheMo]

5 hours ago, kevinc855 said:

Yes let’s beat our heads against the wall for 3 more years. Sounds great 

Yes let's pull the rip cord 4 games into his first draft and off-season. This board sometimes resembles the delusional surgeons I work with from time to time. 

"The patient went into cardiac arrest when you have them some Ativan... So we can still do our hip surgery right?"

[Losmeister]

6 minutes ago, TheMo said:

Yes let's pull the rip cord 4 games into his first draft and off-season. This board sometimes resembles the delusional surgeons I work with from time to time. 

"The patient went into cardiac arrest when you have them some Ativan... So we can still do our hip surgery right?"

Close to %70 percent here are actually horribly unfitto make any comment about football.

they would not even make it to the adult table at Thanksgiving. It depressing af. 

[Waka Flocka Flacco]

6 minutes ago, Losmeister said:

Close to %70 percent here are actually horribly unfitto make any comment about football.

they would not even make it to the adult table at Thanksgiving. It depressing af. 

Anybody who thinks that somebody other than Sam Darnold bears primary responsibility for Sam Darnold is horribly unfit to make any comment about anything.

[pdxgreen]

9 minutes ago, Losmeister said:

Close to %70 percent here are actually horribly unfitto make any comment about football.

they would not even make it to the adult table at Thanksgiving. It depressing af. 

[SAR I]

44 minutes ago, BROOKLYN JET said:

Glen Sather is gone, Jeff Gorton and John Davidson are running things now.

He's not gone.  Glen Sather is still a senior advisor to the team and is the person who kept the Rangers competitive for a decade, the point of my post.  Gorton has been a great apprentice and Davidson has gotten it done elsewhere.  The Rangers attract strong executive talent because they have decades of strong senior management.

Should also be pointed out that Sather held the role for 19 years and if the fans had their way he would have been run out of town in 2010 when they held a hate rally.  And all we did was go to multiple conference finals and a Stanley Cup final thereafter.

SAR I  

[Losmeister]

33 minutes ago, Waka Flocka Flacco said:

Anybody who thinks that somebody other than Sam Darnold bears primary responsibility for Sam Darnold is horribly unfit to make any comment about anything.

it's about one's relationship with reality

[BROOKLYN JET]

26 minutes ago, SAR I said:

He's not gone.  Glen Sather is still a senior advisor to the team and is the person who kept the Rangers competitive for a decade, the point of my post.  Gorton has been a great apprentice and Davidson has gotten it done elsewhere.  The Rangers attract strong executive talent because they have decades of strong senior management.

Should also be pointed out that Sather held the role for 19 years and if the fans had their way he would have been run out of town in 2010 when they held a hate rally.  And all we did was go to multiple conference finals and a Stanley Cup final thereafter.

SAR I  

Sather had his ups and downs with the Rangers, he's still an advisor because Dolan loves him. That's also why he lasted so long. The Ranges success you mentioned has more to do with Henrik Lundqvist than anybody else. Give him credit for having a good overseas scouting staff and a great goalie coach, but the fact that they didn't win a cup with an all world goaltender is an indictment of the job Sather did, not an endorsement. Make no mistake, John Davidson is running the show now.

[SAR I]

7 minutes ago, BROOKLYN JET said:

Sather had his ups and downs with the Rangers, he's still an advisor because Dolan loves him. That's also why he lasted so long. The Ranges success you mentioned has more to do with Henrik Lundqvist than anybody you else. Give him credit for having a good overseas scouting staff and a great goalie coach, but the fact that they didn't win a cup with an all world goaltender is an indictment of the job Sather did, not an endorsement. Make no mistake, John Davidson is running the show now.

Sather did it all.  Including the drafting of Lundqvist.  The players play the games, but without a smart and experienced guy at the top pulling all the strings you go nowhere.  On a team like the Jets, without that smart guy in the front office, we draft poorly and we can't attract top talent.  We can't hire a guy like Sather, Cashman, or Lamorello because no one with that level of experience and pedigree would ever come here.  So we have to go the rookie route.  And that's what the Jets problem is.  We didn't build off of Parcells.  We tried to, but failed.

SAR I

[Gastineau Lives]

1 hour ago, SAR I said:

The Yankees rebuild took about a year and the Rangers rebuild is years ahead of schedule.  You have to respect what the Islanders are doing.

You need a Top 10 GM, you need a little luck, and you need money.  The Jets are a wealthy franchise, have been very unlucky, and keep investing in high-risk bottom-of-the barrel executive talent.  We don't have Brian Cashman, Glen Sather, or Lou Lamoriello.  Or maybe we do.  It's Joe Douglas' first year.

SAR I

If the media had their way, you'd only GET a year or two to show if you are a top ten GM

[BROOKLYN JET]

17 minutes ago, SAR I said:

Sather did it all.  Including the drafting of Lundqvist.  The players play the games, but without a smart and experienced guy at the top pulling all the strings you go nowhere.  On a team like the Jets, without that smart guy in the front office, we draft poorly and we can't attract top talent.  We can't hire a guy like Sather, Cashman, or Lamorello because no one with that level of experience and pedigree would ever come here.  So we have to go the rookie route.  And that's what the Jets problem is.  We didn't build off of Parcells.  We tried to, but failed.

SAR I

I hear you, but if you're going to give Sather credit for everything, than you have to fault him for never having enough scoring or the right coach to win it all with one of the best goalies the world has ever seen.

[jgb]

Should be obvious that JD did not think highly enough of Darnold to invest around him. Smart man. A+ off season.

[kevinc855]

7 hours ago, CanadaSteve said:

Yeah....okay.

Prove me wrong...who is helping us win games 

[Augustiniak]

52 minutes ago, jgb said:

Should be obvious that JD did not think highly enough of Darnold to invest around him. Smart man. A+ off season.

Hey we’re building for the future.  Building.  Future.  

[jetstream23]

4 hours ago, BROOKLYN JET said:

Sather had his ups and downs with the Rangers, he's still an advisor because Dolan loves him. That's also why he lasted so long. The Ranges success you mentioned has more to do with Henrik Lundqvist than anybody else. Give him credit for having a good overseas scouting staff and a great goalie coach, but the fact that they didn't win a cup with an all world goaltender is an indictment of the job Sather did, not an endorsement. Make no mistake, John Davidson is running the show now.

There’s one true MVP on our Rangers right now. ?

[jgb]

9 minutes ago, Augustiniak said:

Hey we’re building for the future.  Building.  Future.  

And a future can't be build on a foundation of shifting California sand.

[NYJ1]

On 10/3/2020 at 10:53 AM, joewilly12 said:

Joe Douglas must share in the blame for this Jets debacle

By Brian Costello

October 3, 2020 | 2:05am

 

 

The list of culprits in this Jets debacle is a long one.

You can start with head coach Adam Gase, if you like, and it now feels inevitable that he will pay with his job at some point. You can cast blame on owner Christopher Johnson, who picked or stuck with the decision-makers who got the Jets to this point. You can blame quarterback Sam Darnold for continuing to look like he is spinning his wheels and not progressing. You can blame former general manager Mike Maccagnan for being terrible at procuring talent. You can blame the players for playing dumb football.

All of that is fair.

Just don’t forget one person who has largely escaped blame this season, but deserves some — Joe Douglas. No one expected Douglas to work miracles when he was hired in June 2019. Douglas has a long-term rebuilding project on his hands. He got a scholarship year last season because he was hired after free agency and the draft. This year, the expectation was for moderate improvement to the roster, filling some of the holes on the team and putting together a respectable group.

The early returns have not been good.

Enlarge Image

Douglas’ rebuilt offensive line does not look better than the group that played in the second half of last season. On Thursday night, Darnold was sacked six times. The Broncos entered the game with four sacks in their first three games. Beyond the pass protection, there are no holes for the running backs. If you remove Darnold’s rushing yards, the Jets averaged 2.5 yards per carry Thursday.

Douglas took a calculated risk in free agency this year. He stayed away from the big-money players, choosing instead to shop for discounts to stock his offensive line. He signed George Fant, Greg Van Roten and Connor McGovern at discount prices. Douglas’ philosophy is one he took from his mentor, Ozzie Newsome, with the Ravens — “right player, right price.” It means rarely spending big. It is a sound strategy that creates cap-space flexibility in the future, but you had better get your player evaluations right. At the moment, it feels Douglas overestimated on the line, particularly with Van Roten and McGovern.

Then, you look at wide receiver. Douglas let Robby Anderson walk in free agency, which has really hurt Darnold and the offense. No one is confusing Anderson with Jerry Rice, but he is an effective receiver who rarely misses games. Anderson already has two 100-yard receiving games for the Panthers, who signed him to a reasonable two-year, $20 million contract. That is a deal the Jets should have matched. Instead, they signed Breshad Perriman on the cheap ($6.5 million) and they’ve gotten what they paid for, because Perriman has missed two games and most of a third. He has just five catches so far.

 

Another of Douglas’ free-agent signings who had an eventful night Thursday is cornerback Pierre Desir, whom the Jets signed for $3.75 million. Desir allowed two touchdowns and had two interceptions, one returned for a touchdown. Despite those plays, Desir has been a liability in coverage so far.

 

 

 

These roster shortcomings have left the Jets with no margin for error. They need to play near-perfect football to win. If they commit too many penalties, as they did Thursday, they’re doomed. If they drop passes, they’re screwed. If they stall in the red zone, it will bite them in the butt.

 

No one is arguing that Gase is doing a good job. But anyone looking at this objectively can see he has been entered into a gun battle with a water pistol. Gase was asked Friday if this team has enough talent. He said he expects a lot of players back from injured reserve this week to help.

“And our guys, they have to do a good job of sticking together and blocking out any outside noise and getting better every day in practice,” Gase said. “I talked to all those guys today about [how] fracturing is not an option. We’re four games in, we’ve got to do a good job of putting our head down, going to work, correcting the mistakes, fixing the stuff that’s absolutely non-talent based and doing those things right first, and then your outcome is going to be different.”

Plenty of people have their fingerprints on this 0-4 start, from the players to ownership and everyone in between — including Douglas.

The article is correct. Joe Douglas is definitely negligent in this mess, but I don't think he should be paying any price from it besides say some criticism? There just wasn't any way he can fix all of the talent issues with this team in one off-season. I'm just rather alarmed at what little he did do to get this roster pointed in the right direction. His FA moves at least so far are shaky at best. His draft choices are a no-show. Besides Becton, they're flat out garbage so far. It looks like we're watching from Denzel Mims on.......  DEE MILLINER, and his brother DEE, and his other DEE, and so on. It's an old 80's sitcom with how pathetic this team is.

We, as Jets fans, as much as it pains me to say, are kind of used to this dingbat show. But, in this case, this is a special kind of BAD. I have personally never watched a season where knew beyond a shadow of a doubt, that the Jets front office in fact RUINED a very promising young QB. A QB that I honestly never thought could be ruined? Honestly, I thought if anything, Sammy would win in spite of the coaching staff because he had such good instincts as a QB. Well, this season it's obvious that this coaching staff has in fact made Sammy REGRESS by not holding up their end of the bargain. When you draft a good QB there's automatically a higher responsibility that goes with it? You MUST surround said player with weapons and good protection and TIME IS OF THE ESSENCE. Said QB doesn't remain a very promising athlete forever. There's a shelf life there. You don't have any time to lolligag around and choose to play games with KMART BLUE LIGHT SPECIAL type players. You must build the kid's confidence and Mac and so far JOE DOUGLAS, have done NOTHING to build Sammys confidence. We know JD has the best intentions by recognizing deficiency where Mac didn't give a sh*t in the OL, but these players he added are a JOKE.

[STLuLu]

On 10/3/2020 at 10:15 AM, FidelioJet said:

Share the blame?

He's almost 100% to blame.

I'm sorry but this is an 0-4 team with any coach.  Even without the injuries this is the least talented team in the league.   He replaced our garbage with other teams garbage and got rid of our two best, and only good players.

I'm just holding out hope that he understands what he's doing.  As far as I'm concerned the key things that he must have recognized.

1) He had to have already moved on from Darnold.  If he had any faith in him he needed to build a team around him, not downgrade the roster.

2) He must have plans and key targets in FA next year.   Having all that money he saved on only signing other teams garbage - he must have a plan to spend next year and must have key targets that he's willing to overpay for.

3) He must understand this team is tanking and be fully prepared to draft a QB with our first draft choice.

If all of that wasn't part of his plan then I am very worried that he's in way over his head. 

Lastly, If he thought he was putting a competitive team on the field, something that even resembled an NFL roster than CJ should cut his losses and move on right now. 

I agree with everything you said. I'm just curious if you're Gase with a mask on. 

[kevinc855]

6 hours ago, Adoni Beast said:

Joe D definitely deserves some blame, because I do believe this intent was to punt on this season and get rid of Gase.

I think he legitimately liked Sam enough and wanted to keep him safe/upright by prioritizing on the OL this offseason, but wanted no reasons to have Gase come back. 

Now he has a chance to possibly draft his own QB (which I think the Jamal trade was all about - ammo for trading up) if Sam doesn’t solidify himself as the guy. 

I don’t think Joe D expected us to lose our way to the #1 pick, but definitely a top 5 scenario. Now he has us in line to change the entire team this offseason anyway he sees fit. He has given himself a plethora of options to choose from, without having to be saddled with any former players / big contracts / coaches / etc.

It’s Joe’s team now.

“He has us in line” for an 0-16 team. One QB ain’t turning around this team.

It has holes everywhere

[jgb]

We finally have a GM who can tank correctly. Baby steps, people.

[kmnj]

our one trick pony had another nice game

good thing we have perriman instead

painful watching teddy b play well too

[jgb]

1 minute ago, kmnj said:

our one trick pony had another nice game

good thing we have perriman instead

painful watching teddy b play well too

If only there were some people here who wanted to keep Teddy and Robbie....

Oh right, those people were called "idiots" which is a synonym for "absolutely correct" here.

[bgivs21]

He does but if Mims hits, along with Becton playing the way he has, a lot of people around hear will change their tune and sing the guys praises 

[Waka Flocka Flacco]

1 hour ago, NYJ1 said:

The article is correct. Joe Douglas is definitely negligent in this mess, but I don't think he should be paying any price from it besides say some criticism? There just wasn't any way he can fix all of the talent issues with this team in one off-season. I'm just rather alarmed at what little he did do to get this roster pointed in the right direction. His FA moves at least so far are shaky at best. His draft choices are a no-show. Besides Becton, they're flat out garbage so far. It looks like we're watching from Denzel Mims on.......  DEE MILLINER, and his brother DEE, and his other DEE, and so on. It's an old 80's sitcom with how pathetic this team is.

We, as Jets fans, as much as it pains me to say, are kind of used to this dingbat show. But, in this case, this is a special kind of BAD. I have personally never watched a season where knew beyond a shadow of a doubt, that the Jets front office in fact RUINED a very promising young QB. A QB that I honestly never thought could be ruined? Honestly, I thought if anything, Sammy would win in spite of the coaching staff because he had such good instincts as a QB. Well, this season it's obvious that this coaching staff has in fact made Sammy REGRESS by not holding up their end of the bargain. When you draft a good QB there's automatically a higher responsibility that goes with it? You MUST surround said player with weapons and good protection and TIME IS OF THE ESSENCE. Said QB doesn't remain a very promising athlete forever. There's a shelf life there. You don't have any time to lolligag around and choose to play games with KMART BLUE LIGHT SPECIAL type players. You must build the kid's confidence and Mac and so far JOE DOUGLAS, have done NOTHING to build Sammys confidence. We know JD has the best intentions by recognizing deficiency where Mac didn't give a sh*t in the OL, but these players he added are a JOKE.

sammy

[HessStation]

On 10/3/2020 at 11:12 AM, Untouchable said:

Douglas can immediately reach God status if he lands a wideout like JuJu, Robinson or Golladay in the offseason and walks away from the 1st round with something like a Trevor Lawrence/Wyatt Davis combo.

Not to mention the further added picks we could land in a potential Darnold trade.

This team could actually do things the right way this time if Douglas plays his cards right over the next 2 years and we land at least a competent HC.

Most important he did ply his cards right over his first FIRST offseason/year. Didn’t piss money away on the wrong FA and seemed to have a really good draft unless you want to blame him for injuries 

[Jetster]

11 minutes ago, jgb said:

If only there were some people here who wanted to keep Teddy and Robbie....

Oh right, those people were called "idiots" which is a synonym for "absolutely correct" here.

So we finish 4-12 with Robbie, the defense is a horror show. Smart to burn it down. Looks like JD unlike many of us, myself included wasn’t wearing green lenses. All the 1 year contracts, trading Adams, he probably surmized correctly that it was worse than he thought when he took the job. He knew you don’t park a brand new Cadillac in the driveway of a falling down shack.

[jgb]

2 minutes ago, Jetster said:

So we finish 4-12 with Robbie, the defense is a horror show. Smart to burn it down. Looks like JD unlike many of us, myself included wasn’t wearing green lenses. All the 1 year contracts, trading Adams, he probably surmized correctly that it was worse than he thought when he took the job. He knew you don’t park a brand new Cadillac in the driveway of a falling down shack.

See now, that's a different argument--whether to burn it down. But the debate then was whether Ted was better than Darnold (confirmed) and whether Robbie was a player (also confirmed). And, as usual, those disagreeing with the Jets moves used logic and evidence while those defending the Jets used personal attacks.

[Pac]

Nothing Douglas has done makes you think he's the guy or he should be fired.  He's had some big mistakes but the team would look a lot different if not for the sickening rash of injuries.

What's concerning is he's supposed to be an o line wizard and the only true upgrade I've seen in 2 years is 77.  Other than Becton there have been a series of lateral moves and/or downgrades.  No bueno.

[kevinc855]

17 minutes ago, Pac said:

Nothing Douglas has done makes you think he's the guy or he should be fired.  He's had some big mistakes but the team would look a lot different if not for the sickening rash of injuries.

What's concerning is he's supposed to be an o line wizard and the only true upgrade I've seen in 2 years is 77.  Other than Becton there have been a series of lateral moves and/or downgrades.  No bueno.

Agreed. He deserves more time but man he’s off to a  very very questionable start for all the hype...

[joewilly12]

What did JD do to help Sam Darnold be a better QB our WR's are trash. 

[T0mShane]

Ryan Neal replaced Jamal Adams today in the Seahawks lineup and had six tackles, 2 PDs and an INT. Last week, he also had a PD and an INT, giving him two INTs on the season, matching Jamal Adams’ career total for INTs. 

[Jetsfan80]

Ryan Neal replaced Jamal Adams today in the Seahawks lineup and had six tackles, 2 PDs and an INT. Last week, he also had a PD and an INT, giving him two INTs on the season, matching Jamal Adams’ career total for INTs. 

Yeah but how many supportive tweets did Adams send out?

[Mogglez]

6 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Ryan Neal replaced Jamal Adams today in the Seahawks lineup and had six tackles, 2 PDs and an INT. Last week, he also had a PD and an INT, giving him two INTs on the season, matching Jamal Adams’ career total for INTs. 

I said to myself today that this stretch of games without Jamal should tell Seattle that maybe trading away what they did for Strong Safety that can’t cover, is only elite against the run, and is going to want 18-20 million per year was probably a bad idea.

If they are smart, they’ll also realize that giving him the aforementioned contract is also a comically bad idea and try and trade him to recoup their loss as soon as they possibly can.

[joewilly12]

Seattle trades him to Dallas for first round pick in the 2021 NFL Draft 

[BROOKLYN JET]

2 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

Yeah but how many supportive tweets did Adams send out?

 

If they keep that up, he'll be deleting them from his Twitter.