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Jets HC Search Already in Trouble (Matt Miller)


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3 hours ago, Adoni Beast said:

As per Matt Miller:

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2912333-jets-falcons-cant-be-patient-in-2020-nfl-hiring-cycle-after-bill-obrien-fired

The Jets, though, who knows with them because they've literally mangled every decision since Todd Bowles and Mike Maccagnan were given extensions [December 2017]."

Another factor that plays into this: some coaches will not want to coach for certain owners or in certain situations. Said the agent: "There are places I don't want my guys to go. Like, I'm not sending anyone to the Jets this offseason. There's no way I want my guy getting his first [head coaching] job with that organization. You only get so many chances at these things, so you need a good fit."

This doesn't bode well for the Jets, who have an unstable ownership situation and a general manager in Joe Douglas who isn't receiving rave reviews around the league for his decisions since taking the job in June 2019.

fake news

 

as if an agent has the power to send or not send a client somewhere. give me a break

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6 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Hiring Jim Caldwell and Jameis Winston would, I think, result in fans literally burning MetLife to the ground. 

Caldwell was 8 games above .500 with the Detroit Lions. Bill Parcells is the only coach who has ever accomplished that with the Jets who are actually a historically more successful franchise.

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If a coach has options the Jets most likely won’t be their preferred destination.   Same as the next free agent class.  Players with options will go elsewhere unless vastly over paid by the Jets.   Who was the last head coach the Jets hired that was actually “in demand” and had options?    

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3 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Hiring Jim Caldwell and Jameis Winston would, I think, result in fans literally burning MetLife to the ground. 

Jim Caldwell had a losing record once in four years with the Lions.  The Lions.  Took them to the playoffs twice.  The Lions.

Winston is keeping the seat warm for Fields.   You can sell that, put up a ton of points, get the offense primed for Fields, entertain, get out of the basement, build the foundation.  You can sell that while you court the future in Matt Campbell.

Long term vision.  You cant sell this rebuild to anything worthwhile.  Beggars cant be choosers.

I'm available if JD needs me.

 

 

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4 hours ago, Philc1 said:

The Johnsons are a disaster.  They meddle in football decisions.  Not my opinion it’s the opinion of people through the nfl

 

The Jets are becoming a dumpster fire disaster similar to the Raiders during Al Davis’s last 10 years

 

What has CJ meddled in?

You say whatever comes into you head, without an ounce od fact behind it.

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19 minutes ago, JiF said:

Here is what I do;

Step 1: Fire Gase and Loggains right now.  The timing is perfect.  You risked the "long term future" cough cough by putting Sam back out there when clearly he wasnt healthy.  Same with Becton.  This type of negligence is a perfect way to explain "why now"? and you instantly gain credibility back that you are clearly losing by continuing to endorse Gase and the product on the field.

Step 2: Promote Williams, let Vit runs the defense and Cooter run the offense.  

The Jets dont need the next up and coming hot shot coordinator, they need a gritty grizzled veteran HC who's been dragged through the mud and proven he can overcome the ineptitude of the organization.  Someone who has overseen transition, someone who has overcome historic losing.  They need a transition coach that can build the foundation, bring respect to the organization and while you keep your eye on the next hot shot because you have made the organization more appealing. 

I present to you;

Step 3: Jim Caldwell.  He will take this job, turn the culture around, partner with Douglas to bring stability and respect.   Get this team to around 8-8/9-7 like he did in Detroit and then pass the torch.

Bring in Jameis Winston, trade Darnold, draft Fields and let Jim Bob Cooter go yolo with Winston like he did with Stafford in Detroit while you build and groom a roster around the franchise QB.

Step 4: Let me run the drafts and then we let Douglas go after Matt Campbell in 2022/23 when he's ready to leave and show him the job is much better than when Big Mac was selling him a bill of goods.

Boom!  Super Bowl. 

 

Winston would be entertaining, you would just need the QB coach to be in Fields ear while watching the game telling him “see that, don’t try that”.  “See that throw, don’t throw it there”.   “when there are 3 defenders on the WR, don’t throw it to him”.  

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4 minutes ago, sec101row23 said:

If a coach has options the Jets most likely won’t be their preferred destination.   Same as the next free agent class.  Players with options will go elsewhere unless vastly over paid by the Jets.   Who was the last head coach the Jets hired that was actually “in demand” and had options?    

Bowles

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11 minutes ago, HighPitch said:

fake news

 

as if an agent has the power to send or not send a client somewhere. give me a break

And will turn down a contract with the commission that goes along with it.

I always remember Shotty Jr.  Turned down the fins because he didnt want to go there.  Where was his next HC offer?  

 

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7 minutes ago, sec101row23 said:

If a coach has options the Jets most likely won’t be their preferred destination.   Same as the next free agent class.  Players with options will go elsewhere unless vastly over paid by the Jets.   Who was the last head coach the Jets hired that was actually “in demand” and had options?    

Bowles and (almost) Rhule

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1 minute ago, sec101row23 said:

Who else was going to hire him? 

Atlanta.  Was said he would get an offer and the jets jumped in quickly before he was gone.  Bowles and Quinn were the two hot coordinators at the time, Atlanta wound up with Quinn.

And a trip to the SB that Quinn and Shanahan screwed up

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Some miscellaneous thoughts based on the above:

  • There was a list of coaches and a note that most were hired in 2017 or after.  Several of them hired before 2017 have been fired already (O'Brien) or should be fired this year (Quinn).  It would be nice to have a long term coach here, but the Jets have not been terrible with coach turnover.  Its the mismatch between coach and GM which is bad.  
  • Like Mangini was fired for "embarrassing" the organization despite the Favre fiasco, Gase should be fired for his management of the medical situation and putting out an embarrassingly poor product.  At this point the medical is on him.  Douglas should get more time with better medical.  I think Gase may have been unofficially fired, or he knows he will be fired.  He will make decisions to build his resume that are not in the interests of the team.  He has to go.  I think they did the same thing with Bowles in his last year.  
  • The Jets had their good run because Woody wanted to sell PSLs-Woody wanted to win, desperately.  He was able to team with Tannenbaum to mortgage the future and build a winner.  Chris is not doing that.  Maybe the plan is to do that next year.
  • It seems like the successful QBs lately are generally more athletic/college style.  Big, tall, drop back passer is not necessarily successful.  Don't know where Trevor Lawrence falls into that.  
  • For coaches and top QB draft picks, turning down a team is a tough call.  The Mannings with their family money and connections did it twice.  For most QBs, that first contract is the Holy Grail, and they will take that and roll the dice on the future.  Darnold and Leinart.  Most coordinators earn less than half what the HC makes.  Maybe Trevor Lawrence is willing to tell the Jets he will sit out.  Based on the Watson contract, he should  For many HCs, taking the Jets job and the 4 year x $4mm/year contract that Gase likely got is enough money for them for life-they take it and try their luck.  Matt Rhule was not going to do that.  I also think Rhule ended up getting from the Panthers much more than he was going to accept from the Jets and what he thought he would make.  Others will also think about that.  That is also why the Jets are thinking hard about formally firing Gase.  But Bienemy would likely jump at that, and that helps the Jets and the NFL in other ways.  I think that is when we all check out, but I don't see him being any good.  
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7 minutes ago, JiF said:

Jim Caldwell had a losing record once in four years with the Lions.  The Lions.  Took them to the playoffs twice.  The Lions.

Winston is keeping the seat warm for Fields.   You can sell that, put up a ton of points, get the offense primed for Fields, entertain, get out of the basement, build the foundation.  You can sell that while you court the future in Matt Campbell.

Long term vision.  You cant sell this rebuild to anything worthwhile.  Beggars cant be choosers.

I'm available if JD needs me.

 

 

I actually think the Caldwell/Winston/Fields idea is great and could work.

Caldwell is a poor man's McCarthy in a way.  

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17 minutes ago, UntouchableCrew said:

This is one of those picks that actually makes a ton of sense but would be reviled by the fanbase.

I don't really see a point in hiring a HC you aren't confident will be the long term guy, however.

Only because he's 65 and you need to stay fresh.  Again, we're talking in a thread about how nobody is interested in this job.  Caldwell would be and he's up for the task.

The fanbase (the wise ones) were outraged by Gase.  They still did it. 

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26 minutes ago, Samtorobby47 said:

I think there’s gonna have to be a connection to Douglas. That’s why I think Roman or Martindale will be a possibility. Other then them, no idea. 

Roman would be a good hire for sure. Martingale, he’s a good DC but unless convinced otherwise that he would be a CEO type that will hire a good staff and be a program builder, I’d hope we’d pass.

Not really looking all that exciting of an offseason for us. 

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9 minutes ago, sec101row23 said:

Winston would be entertaining, you would just need the QB coach to be in Fields ear while watching the game telling him “see that, don’t try that”.  “See that throw, don’t throw it there”.   “when there are 3 defenders on the WR, don’t throw it to him”.  

lol - exactly!  I'm not saying you're bringing in Winston to groom Fields.   You're bringing him in so you can be competitive while you develop Fields.  Have a little fun, get out of this rut of the worst offensive teams in the league that has plagued this franchise for 10 years. 

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7 minutes ago, JiF said:

Jim Caldwell had a losing record once in four years with the Lions.  The Lions.  Took them to the playoffs twice.  The Lions.

Winston is keeping the seat warm for Fields.   You can sell that, put up a ton of points, get the offense primed for Fields, entertain, get out of the basement, build the foundation.  You can sell that while you court the future in Matt Campbell.

Long term vision.  You cant sell this rebuild to anything worthwhile.  Beggars cant be choosers.

I'm available if JD needs me.

w/ all this GAse is the worst coach in the hx of the galaxy nonsense getting spewed around here by the Ignoranti, i was mentioning how Patricia took a middling club and drove it directly into the mud of the Detroit River....

Caldwell, while pretty bland, is defo a decent feller w/ a solid background

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15 minutes ago, JiF said:

Jim Caldwell had a losing record once in four years with the Lions.  The Lions.  Took them to the playoffs twice.  The Lions.

Winston is keeping the seat warm for Fields.   You can sell that, put up a ton of points, get the offense primed for Fields, entertain, get out of the basement, build the foundation.  You can sell that while you court the future in Matt Campbell.

Long term vision.  You cant sell this rebuild to anything worthwhile.  Beggars cant be choosers.

I'm available if JD needs me.

 

 

Down with Caldwell meh on Winston, let dark pls keep the seat warm and if he plays well then we have 2 young qbs with trade value 

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2 minutes ago, CTM said:

Down with Caldwell meh on Winston, let dark pls keep the seat warm and if he plays well then we have 2 young qbs with trade value 

Darnold?  lol  - he's done dude

idk - the other factor is, what if Winston a year on the bench behind Brees got some osmosis type sh*t and cut the turnovers down but still threw 30 TD's and 5K yards?   This place would be a circle jerk of epic portions and I really really would enjoy an epic circle jerk.  Tough to find these days with social distancing. 

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10 minutes ago, JiF said:

lol - exactly!  I'm not saying you're bringing in Winston to groom Fields.   You're bringing him in so you can be competitive while you develop Fields.  Have a little fun, get out of this rut of the worst offensive teams in the league that has plagued this franchise for 10 years. 

Is your Fields narrative based on preferring him to Lawrence or the likelihood that we somehow win enough games not to have a shot at him?

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11 minutes ago, JiF said:

Darnold?  lol  - he's done dude

idk - the other factor is, what if Winston a year on the bench behind Brees got some osmosis type sh*t and cut the turnovers down but still threw 30 TD's and 5K yards?   This place would be a circle jerk of epic portions and I really really would enjoy an epic circle jerk.  Tough to find these days with social distancing. 

i doubt it, JN would spin it that Darnold was capable of same and we gave up on him, betrayed the GWH

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40 minutes ago, UntouchableCrew said:

Caldwell was 8 games above .500 with the Detroit Lions. Bill Parcells is the only coach who has ever accomplished that with the Jets who are actually a historically more successful franchise.

Caldwell isn't a great HC or anything but he would at least stabilize the franchise.  If we can't do any better, he'd be a perfectly reasonable fallback option.  

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21 minutes ago, Losmeister said:

w/ all this GAse is the worst coach in the hx of the galaxy nonsense getting spewed around here by the Ignoranti, i was mentioning how Patricia took a middling club and drove it directly into the mud of the Detroit River....

Caldwell, while pretty bland, is defo a decent feller w/ a solid background

So what is Gase in your opinion?  I'm not saying he's the "worst coach in the history of the galaxy" but what has he done that makes you think he's any good?

So far, his career highlight is that he got a recommendation from Peyton Manning.  Is that worthy of making you forget that he's lost by double-digits in 10 of his first 20 games as HC of the NYJ?

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The few Lions fans I know did not speak glowingly of Caldwell's in-game decision and seemed to not have a huge issue when he was canned, that being said the Jets could do far worse at the HC spot.

Winston I want NO part of. He's a better FF QB than a real life QB. Just braindead decisions, both on and off the field.

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2 minutes ago, Skeet Ulrich said:

The few Lions fans I know did not speak glowingly of Caldwell's in-game decision and seemed to not have a huge issue when he was canned, that being said the Jets could do far worse at the HC spot.

Winston I want NO part of. He's a better FF QB than a real life QB. Just braindead decisions, both on and off the field.

Mangini would probably jump at the chance to get back into the NFL.  I know many on here would hate it but I wouldn't be among that group.

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1 minute ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

Mangini would probably jump at the chance to get back into the NFL.  I know many on here would hate it but I wouldn't be among that group.

I always thought Mangini would be better at GM than HC - he's proven he can't be a leader of men. Good eye for talent, though.

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2 hours ago, Barry McCockinner said:

Would you consider Rhule a top guy? He came in and interview but the dopey owners wouldn't let him pick his coordinators.

Exactly. Rhule would have gone back to college before he coached the Jets and waited for another job. The top candidates know there will be other jobs. Same reason you can't force Darnold on the next coach. It's going to turn candidates who have choices away. The situation with Woody/Chris is going to turn guys away. If Chris picks someone and Woody comes back, what happens? There's a lot of factors and the worse the owners, the more likely top candidates say, "Thanks, but I'll keep looking."

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31 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

So what is Gase in your opinion?  I'm not saying he's the "worst coach in the history of the galaxy" but what has he done that makes you think he's any good?

So far, his career highlight is that he got a recommendation from Peyton Manning.  Is that worthy of making you forget that he's lost by double-digits in 10 of his first 20 games as HC of the NYJ?

Gase was 23-25 with the Dolphins and was really only getting fired by Ross because he shot his way out of there.

He made the playoffs his first year and was 10-6.  

No one thought this was a disasterous hire at the time.  We were unenthusiastic, but we were hopeful that a former HC/QBC would work with Darnold.

It has been highlighted that Gase's injury history and inability to get along with and relate to his players may have be the reason he went below .500 his last two seasons with Miami, and he looks far worse with the Jets than he ever did with Miami.  

Gase needs to go.  

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A few things; 

  1. The Jets have always been in trouble. This changes nothing. 
  2. Matt Miller is an absolute joke. 
  3. The Jets job is going to be no less desirable than its been in the past. 
  4. As much as we as fans are upset with the Johnson's (especially Chris), I don't find truth in league-wide animosity towards Woody. He's made a lot of stupid moves to spur PR in the past, and a lot of criticism stemmed from his unwillingness to let the Jets go through a proper "rebuild", as he always sought to overcompensate on losing seasons to ensure the team was successful the following year (Woody has never had back-to-back losing seasons). Much of the mocking of Woody in particular stems from the abrupt exits of Belichick/Groh/Parcells, but our former coaches and execs were given long leashes. Yes- he made horrible moves in arranged marriages and forced FA signings, but you can't say that the position is so undesirable because the Jets have awarded their coaches some time... 
  • Herm Edwards: 5 years. 3 postseason, 39-41 record 
  • Eric Mangini: 3 years, 1 postseason, 23-25 record 
  • Rex Ryan: 6 years, 2 postseasons, 46-50 record 
  • Todd Bowles: 4 years, 0 postseasons, 24-40 record* (first 2 years were under Woody) 

 

The feeling I get is this: "The night is darkest just before the dawn. And I promise you, the dawn is coming." 

I know this comes off as some overly optimistic message, but here's my logic.

First, I firmly believe the Jets have the right GM in charge, and he's a widely respected one throughout the NFL. Between his contract length and Woody's preference to stick with GM's over the long haul, I think he'll be here to stay.

Second, the Jets do have assets. The team lacks talent, but it's not nearly as bad as it has looked on the field. Whether the Jets are looking to replace Sam or not (foolish), they're guaranteed to have a talented young QB. They have payroll flexibility in a year where the majority of teams will struggle to meet the reduced salary cap. They have draft picks.

Third, a few of the high-profile candidates are from New Jersey, which does play a role in luring the right people here.

Fourth, the Jets have among the highest coaching payrolls in the league. 

 

What's holding the Jets back now won't hold them back for long. This is years and years of bad drafting and mismanagement all colliding together at the same time. It reminds me of the 2003-2010 San Francisco 49ers, where the teams ineptitude masked some of the progress they were making on the roster front. Trent Baalke slowly started making his imprints on the roster felt, then they hired the right coach in Jim Harbaugh and turned things around overnight. The volatile relationship between Harbaugh-Baalke did them in, but the opportunity to kick-start this team is there. Here, Woody was gone at the perfect time: it allowed the Jets to recalibrate and start the rebuilding process. Again, whether it is Sam or someone else, we will have a "franchise" QB - so we don't have to worry about him giving a billion dollars to Drew Brees or something. And finally, Woody is likely headed back at the perfect time: the team needs a fire lit under them, and like it or not, Woody was more authoritative than Chris has been and is far less tolerant of losing. 

 

Ultimately, I expect Joe Douglas to lure Greg Roman--a guy who is itching to be a HC, is from New Jersey, and loves it here--who I believe will be a very good head coach. People know him for his exotic rushing offenses, but what they don't know is how deep Roman's football knowledge runs, his philosophical approach to the game, and how he is capable of maximizing a player's strengths. Will Greg have other opportunities? Sure. But those opportunities won't come with Joe Douglas, won't come with draft picks, won't come with money for player and coaching personnel, and won't come with an owner who will generally allows 3+ years for a coach to prove himself. 

The last half-decade has been a disaster, but for the reasons outlined above, I think we will ultimately head in the right direction. 

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Money talks. As a season ticket holder, I've been gouged for years between ticket prices, PSLs and concessions. All for luxury of watching games in arguably the ugliest stadium built in the NFL in the last 20 years. Whoever the hell the Jets (hopefully Douglas) decide to target, blow him out of the water with a $$$ offer. This godforsaken organization can afford it.

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