Daniel Jeremiah on Darnold's Trade Value

[SAR I]

2 hours ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

I agree with DJ.  The NFL is a QB league.  I think GMs will see the value in acquiring a 23 year old potential-FQB (who clearly has been severely mishandled by this incompetent organization) for a relatively cheap price. 

See, this is the only benefit the Jets have right now.  

The perception of being a franchise so inept that we ruined him.  Get Sam out of here quick before someone has the chance to look at film and learns the awful truth.  Getting a first for Darnold would be highway robbery, I’d extend Gase and Douglas on the spot. 

SAR I

[SomebodytoAnybody47]

2 hours ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

I agree with DJ.  The NFL is a QB league.  I think GMs will see the value in acquiring a 23 year old potential-FQB (who clearly has been severely mishandled by this incompetent organization) for a relatively cheap price. 

For the record, I still want him here unless we can draft Trevor.

They should just watch his rookie tape to realize what he can do. 

....and give us a first. 

[TuscanyTile2]

44 minutes ago, SAR I said:

See, this is the only benefit the Jets have right now.  

The perception of being a franchise so inept that we ruined him.  Get Sam out of here quick before someone has the chance to look at film and learns the awful truth.  Getting a first for Darnold would be highway robbery, I’d extend Gase and Douglas on the spot. 

SAR I

Don't ever change!  lol

[peekskill68]

2 hours ago, JiF said:

Fair and I guess none of those teams need him right now. 

But what if he continues to sh*t the bed and losses his supposed 1st round value?   If they're obviously moving on from him so why not maximize his value and build around a FA until you can find your next franchise Qb in the draft?  

If he keeps seeing ghosts, Sam will "reinjure" his shoulder and be shut down to protect his trade value...

[GreenFish]

If we can get a 1st, it’s a no brainer. Darnold might be a good QB some day. I’m convinced it’ll never be with the Jets.

There’s at least 3 QBs I’d be happy with the Jets drafting in the top 10 (Lawrence, Wilson and Fields). I’m anxiously awaiting to see the film breakdowns from some of the QB gurus. Trade Darnold and build around the QB properly for everyone’s sake.

[varjet]

1 hour ago, SAR I said:

See, this is the only benefit the Jets have right now.  

The perception of being a franchise so inept that we ruined him.  Get Sam out of here quick before someone has the chance to look at film and learns the awful truth.  Getting a first for Darnold would be highway robbery, I’d extend Gase and Douglas on the spot. 

SAR I

Mark Sanchez in 2009 and 2010 brought the Jets to the AFCCG.  That is 1/16 teams every year.  

Sam Darnold on an excellent team could get close to that.

That is why NFL teams open the doors every day.  Darnold could drop into the Steelers and get them to the playoffs if BR retires. 

[ZachEY]

2 hours ago, Skeptable said:

Did you think they would get (2) 1sts, a 3rd, and a S for Adams and a future 4th?... If not then maybe you are not as privy to the market as you think you are

In fairness, Adams wasn’t a bottom 3 player at his position though.

[Matt39]

Would Gardner Minshew get the Jags a first round pick?

[DoubleDown]

The Jets should be able to fetch a first round pick for Darnold if trading with a team in the bottom third of the round.

He has the raw talent, he's flashed enough potential, and he's young enough for a team to feel he is salvageable as a franchise quarterback. He has been the most mismanaged quarterback for the past three seasons. He needs a change of scenery and a stable organization where he can sit for a year and reset. The Steelers, Saints, and even a team like the Bucs make alot of sense.

[jeremy2020]

QBs drafted in the top ten and don't succeed...DO NOT go on to have success on other teams. NFL GMs are aware of this.. a 1st for Sam is a pipe dream and if there is a 1st being offered and JD hasn't taken it and run then he's clearly been killed and Adam Gase is wearing him as a suit

[jamaicanjetfan]

19 minutes ago, jeremy2020 said:

QBs drafted in the top ten and don't succeed...DO NOT go on to have success on other teams. NFL GMs are aware of this.. a 1st for Sam is a pipe dream and if there is a 1st being offered and JD hasn't taken it and run then he's clearly been killed and Adam Gase is wearing him as a suit

Ryan Tannehill says hi

[jeremy2020]

9 minutes ago, jamaicanjetfan said:

Ryan Tannehill says hi

We can save the argument of whether he was/wasn't successful and just say you found the 1 exception to prove the rule. Hell, I'll even throw in Alex Smith and say you got two over...50 years of Football.  

I'm definitely off base on that one. I mean, there hasn't even been THAT many QBs drafted in the top ten in the last 50 years. 

You're a quick one. Good thing we have you here.

[Sperm Edwards]

12 hours ago, jeremy2020 said:

QBs drafted in the top ten and don't succeed...DO NOT go on to have success on other teams. NFL GMs are aware of this.. a 1st for Sam is a pipe dream and if there is a 1st being offered and JD hasn't taken it and run then he's clearly been killed and Adam Gase is wearing him as a suit

Tannehill was a UFA anyone could have had for $5MM. Former #8 overall pick.

Switching teams aside, Alex Smtih was a bust who then became a non-bust in his 7th season.

I don’t think the narrow prerequisites for a list is a fair question. Agree it’s uncommon, but it’s also uncommon for a QB to come out of college with Darnold’s hype in the first place. Also the Jets are so terrible it’s not far-fetched for a team to decide/rationalize that we are the reason why Darnold failed, rather than Darnold himself. FFS half the Jets fans seem to still believe this.

Besides, all it takes is one team to believe. A second team - let alone a 3rd, 5th, or more - is not needed. No one was coughing up a 1st & a 3rd for Adams until Seattle jumped in and offered a pair of 1s. No one was offering a 1st rounder for Revis until TB came in with their #13 overall pick. No one was offering much for Sheldon before Seattle rescued us from keeping him for 1 more year before letting him go, as they offered their 2nd rounder when perhaps no one else was offering any day 2 pick at all. No one was offering more than a day 3 pick for Leonard Williams, the way he was playing in his 5th yr option season, yet the Giants came in and rescued us. And these are only some Jets trades within the past decade alone, just off the top of my head. 

It happens. 

[peebag]

14 minutes ago, jamaicanjetfan said:

Ryan Tannehill says hi

He's out having lunch with Jim Plunkett

[SomebodytoAnybody47]

1 hour ago, Matt39 said:

Would Gardner Minshew get the Jags a first round pick?

No. Darnold sucks with more potential. 

[DoubleDown]

10 minutes ago, jeremy2020 said:

We can save the argument of whether he was/wasn't successful and just say you found the 1 exception to prove the rule. Hell, I'll even throw in Alex Smith and say you got two over...50 years of Football.  

I'm definitely off base on that one. I mean, there hasn't even been THAT many QBs drafted in the top ten in the last 50 years. 

You're a quick one. Good thing we have you here.

How about our very own Vinny Testaverde?

Steve Young was drafted 11th overall.

There are also others like Brett Favre and Drew Brees who were drafted relatively high and went on to great success with other teams.

"Top 10" is pretty arbitrary.

[ljr]

12 minutes ago, jeremy2020 said:

We can save the argument of whether he was/wasn't successful and just say you found the 1 exception to prove the rule. Hell, I'll even throw in Alex Smith and say you got two over...50 years of Football.  

I'm definitely off base on that one. I mean, there hasn't even been THAT many QBs drafted in the top ten in the last 50 years. 

You're a quick one. Good thing we have you here.

 

lol ... without looking into it, but just from our own history ... how about Vinny T ?

[DJF71]

13 minutes ago, Samtorobby47 said:

No. Darnold sucks with more potential. 

The Jets suck with no hope.

[Wonderboy]

5 hours ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

I agree with DJ.  The NFL is a QB league.  I think GMs will see the value in acquiring a 23 year old potential-FQB (who clearly has been severely mishandled by this incompetent organization) for a relatively cheap price. 

For the record, I still want him here unless we can draft Trevor.

@Jetsfan80 just fainted. 

[Maxman]

Trevor and two additional first rounders. Let's go.

[SAR I]

5 hours ago, varjet said:

Mark Sanchez in 2009 and 2010 brought the Jets to the AFCCG.  That is 1/16 teams every year.  

Sam Darnold on an excellent team could get close to that.

That is why NFL teams open the doors every day.  Darnold could drop into the Steelers and get them to the playoffs if BR retires. 

Comparing Sam Darnold to Mark Sanchez is a terrible thing to do to Mark Sanchez.

Compare Sam Darnold to Geno Smith.

SAR I

[Jet Nut]

12 hours ago, JiF said:

Fair and I guess none of those teams need him right now. 

But what if he continues to sh*t the bed and losses his supposed 1st round value?   If they're obviously moving on from him so why not maximize his value and build around a FA until you can find your next franchise Qb in the draft?  

Well if teams still think he has the talent and tools everyone saw 3 years ago and believe his problems are due to a lack of talent, why would they suddenly go from blaming that lack of talent to blaming Sam entirely?  

His values not changing from now until after the draft is set.  

[JustInFudge]

1 hour ago, Jet Nut said:

Well if teams still think he has the talent and tools everyone saw 3 years ago and believe his problems are due to a lack of talent, why would they suddenly go from blaming that lack of talent to blaming Sam entirely?  

His values not changing from now until after the draft is set.  

Ummm, yeah sorry but like, no.  That's not how life works.

Sam's value isnt jarred up in a bottle and preserved no matter what!  That's just asinine.  If he is currently worth a 1st which I highly highly doubt to be true and he continues to go out and miss wide open WR's and throw picks - his value will decrease.   That's just simple free trade market logic, if your product sucks and continues to suck worse than it did when it first sucked, it doesnt maintain value.  Cant believe Im' having to explain that to a grown adult. 

[JustInFudge]

10 hours ago, peekskill68 said:

If he keeps seeing ghosts, Sam will "reinjure" his shoulder and be shut down to protect his trade value...

If he truly is a 1st round value right now (he's not) but if he was, I would 100% shut him down and not let him go ruin that opportunity for you.   You know he's not getting better so his play alone is going to hurt his value but what about a real injury too? 

 

[section314]

A change of scenery for a guy who has zero pocket presence, can’t read a defense, and consistently throws into double coverage is not going to help. 

[jgb]

8 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Tannehill was a UFA anyone could have had for $5MM. Former #8 overall pick.

Switching teams aside, Alex Smtih was a bust who then became a non-bust in his 7th season.

I don’t think the narrow prerequisites for a list is a fair question. Agree it’s uncommon, but it’s also uncommon for a QB to come out of college with Darnold’s hype in the first place. Also the Jets are so terrible it’s not far-fetched for a team to decide we are the reason why Darnold failed, rather than Darnold himself. FFS half the Jets fans seem to still believe this.

Besides, all it takes is one team to believe. A second team - let alone a 3rd, 5th, or more - is not needed. No one was coughing up a 1st & a 3rd for Adams until Seattle jumped in and offered a pair of 1s. No one was offering a 1st rounder for Revis until TB came in with their #13 overall pick. No one was offering much for Sheldon before Seattle rescued us from keeping him for 1 more year before letting him go, as they offered their 2nd rounder when perhaps no one else was offering any day 2 pick at all. No one was offering more than a day 3 pick for Leonard Williams, the way he was playing in his 5th yr option season, yet the Giants came in and rescued us. And these are only some Jets trades within the past decade alone, just off the top of my head. 

It happens. 

There is still a not-insignificant minority who believe this about Sanchez and Geno. We can all look forward to a raging debate for the next 7-10 years at every up and down of his career no matter where he ends up. Just like when Geno made a spot start for Giants in 2018 and Sanchez popped back up for the Eagles a couple years ago.

Peoole are way to invested in being right about Darnold and will argue they were right and he is an elite-QB-in-hiding every time he completes a pass for the rest of his career.

[JustInFudge]

3 minutes ago, section314 said:

A change of scenery for a guy who has zero pocket presence, can’t read a defense, and consistently throws into double coverage is not going to help. 

I was actually going to pose this question; how often is a total bust who sucks, saved simply by a change of scenery? And has it ever happened in the history of the NFL that the worst starting QB in the league garnered a 1st round pick in a trade?  

I'm going to go out an a limb and say there is less than 0% chance of either of these things playing out.

[nyjunc]

It depends on if we get the top pick. If we do they'll either lol to get a haul for the pick or look to move Sam.

[Butterfield]

12 hours ago, SAR I said:

See, this is the only benefit the Jets have right now.  

The perception of being a franchise so inept that we ruined him.  Get Sam out of here quick before someone has the chance to look at film and learns the awful truth.  Getting a first for Darnold would be highway robbery, I’d extend Gase and Douglas on the spot. 

SAR I

Hi Adam.  

[section314]

16 minutes ago, JiF said:

I was actually going to pose this question; how often is a total bust who sucks, saved simply by a change of scenery? And has it ever happened in the history of the NFL that the worst starting QB in the league garnered a 1st round pick in a trade?  

I'm going to go out an a limb and say there is less than 0% chance of either of these things playing out.

Rick Mirer is taking calls.?   You see Zuniga activated?

[Fantasy Island]

12 hours ago, pointman said:

There is literally almost no chance we win. 

They told Broadway Joe that once.....

I hope we do

[BCJet]

14 hours ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

I agree with DJ.  The NFL is a QB league.  I think GMs will see the value in acquiring a 23 year old potential-FQB (who clearly has been severely mishandled by this incompetent organization) for a relatively cheap price. 

For the record, I still want him here unless we can draft Trevor.

So Sam is worth a first and Rosen was put on waivers?  Im not saying their careers are close, but it seems like a first is a lot for a team to give up.  I also agree with the above, unless its Trevor Id rather see Sam compete with a rookie with both having the benefit of a good coach.

Ive been as ardent a Sam supporter as there is but his struggles this year are very much on him continuing to not see the field, force bad picks and struggle with things that should have been corrected by now.  Would he improve with Daboll or Arthur Smith over Gase, of course.  Im just not sure he can get to the level we want as a franchise QB.

[KINGDIRK]

1 hour ago, JiF said:

I was actually going to pose this question; how often is a total bust who sucks, saved simply by a change of scenery? And has it ever happened in the history of the NFL that the worst starting QB in the league garnered a 1st round pick in a trade?  

I'm going to go out an a limb and say there is less than 0% chance of either of these things playing out.

Have we ever seen a 23 year old so mismanaged? How many coaches in 2 and half years? How many OCs? Bottom 3 OL his entire career so far. And the worst coach in football to top it off?

If a team with an aging QB is picking in the 20s (Colts, Steelers etc), it makes complete sense to roll the dice on Darnold for that first round pick. From a risk reward standpoint it’s a pretty clear choice. 

[Sonny Werblin]

14 hours ago, Icer said:

A 1st round pick would be highway robbery, highly doubt that would happen

A lot of teams will rely heavily on their draft evaluation of Darnold believing that the Jets dealt the young man a disastrous hand -- a terrible O line, little talent around him, and a Coach who is clueless. 

I think Pitt would trade their late first round pick on Darnold in a heartbeat. Darnold actually has a lot of similarities to Ben in that the strongest part of both of their games is making off schedule plays. And Ben is no rocket scientist or football savant. The Steelers patiently relied heavily on the run game and play action in his first few seasons and it took years for Ben to truly understand reading his keys and making pre-snap decisions as to where to go with the ball.

The Colts might make the trade just because it will mean that they ultimately traded their 2021 first round pick for 2 2018 first round picks (Darnold at 3 and Quinten Nelson at 6) and 3 second round picks that they horse traded to get 4 picks who ended up being Tackle Braden Smith, DE Kemoko Turay, RB Jordan Wilkins and CB Rock Ya-Sin. Nelson is an All-Pro; Smith is a starter; Ya-Sin is a starter; Turay is injured but has 5.5 sacks in 18 games; and Wilkins is back-up RB who gets significant playing time in his 3.5 seasons he has 140 rushes with a 5.3 average per rush. So, if they get Darnold for their mid round 2021 first round pick this turns into a truly mind boggling return if it turns out that Darnold is not a bust. 

 

[Jetster]

I've said this all along! Jets cant wait on Darnold because of his upcoming contract. But, traded to SF, Indy, many teams he'd likely be a backup learning & getting a total reset. 

A late or Mid 1st is a crapshoot anyway, we all know that. Calvin Pryor, Darron Lee, I mean seriously, this IS a QB league. And there are a LOT of aging QBs. I've said this B4, it's not horrible to be replaced by a kid with Trevor Lawrence pedigree.