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2 huge moves that have made Douglas a great GM


Rhg1084
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2 hours ago, Alka said:

I feel that you can not judge the pick for Morgan in the 4th round, until you get him on the field and see his level of play. After Flacco is gone, I hope that Morgan is groomed to be the backup for the starting qb for next year and beyond.  When Morgan gets his opportunity, then we will know if the Morgan pick was the right one or not.

Are you kidding me?

The Jets have less talent on this roster than an expansion team. They were the LAST team in the league that should've wasted that pick on a guy they MIGHT be able to develop (because Lord knows, when you think Jets, you think QB development) into a backup.

Douglas wasted that pick, and has gotten little to nothing out of most of his others. Lets not even bring up Robbie, or the FA's he brought in.

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The guy has had 1 draft & 1 free agent season (in a very poor free agent season mind you). Baby steps boys, unless you want him to go full blown Tanny/Macc again! 

Not 1 free agent brought in by Macc has helped this team other than Crowder. Macc had HUGE MISSES on Trumaine Johnson, Le'veon Bell & CJ Mosely. 

Its looking more & more like Sam Darnold was a whiff & that whiff my fellow Jet fans cost us 3 second round draft picks. So a multitude of failed VERY EXPENSIVE free agents, whiffs everywhere in the draft. 2020 for the Jets is like Bruce Springsteens song One step up- and two steps back. 

Cutting TJ, trading Adams, cutting Bell, all necessary steps to begin a new future. I've laid out paths to turning this thing around & JD has the ammunition to do it. So while the lay people who really know nothing about how badly the Jets were run while under Idzik/Macc, basically the last 10 years, football people like Jeremiah & others I'm sure applaud the tear down this team needed so badly to be able to build it back up again. 

I'm personally glad JDs the man that was chosen to do it & instead of saving face for a 4 win season he's just ripped that bloody bandaid right off of that gaping wound. He's trying to stop the bleeding for all of us. He's a pragmatic guy, I don't think he's flashes. 

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We don't know what JD is yet.  From my perspective there are two base scenario's...

  • The was an entire tear-down year, there was no expectation of winning - and he just wanted to clear out everything and legitimately start the rebuild next year.  Note - I'm not talking about tanking but just cleaning house and ready to start over.  Winning or losing was irrelevant.

or 

  • He honestly thought he had upgraded the roster.  And those OL. RB and WR moves would make this team better.

Also...

  1. His draft is too early to tell - Bechton's been good (but so has Wrifs) otherwise it hasn't been good so far, but obviously very yearly and way to soon to make any judgments.
  2. His FA's signings have been almost entirely bad (but that can be part of the tear-down plan)
  3. He got a good haul for Adams but otherwise any other trades he's made are pedestrian - but nothing bad either.

Bottom line...

  • If he thought he was upgrading the roster and building a competitive team than he's in way over his head and will most certainly be disaster going forward.  We are in for another 4 years of awfulness.
  • If he was honestly cleaning house and understood this team would be awful than I'm pretty confident in him.  He has the foresight and balls to go all-in and do this the right way.  No way to know if he can rebuild properly but so far he would be doing things the right way.  I'm bullish on him here.
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3 hours ago, kevinc855 said:

Not many smart people had Wirfs before Becton but ok....

Not true at all. Almost everyone had Wirfs ahead, just not by much.  He was thought to have the higher floor and Becton the higher ceiling but also the greater bust potential. 

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4 hours ago, Paradis said:

lol, put away the Cialis poncho... A+ because we needed a LT and they drafted on consensus top LT?

He faired better (already) than the last 2 combined. Yes... but that bar is so low you could throw darts blindfold at a draft board and do better... Mims is going to be a stud, but after that - it's pretty sketchy outside of Bryce Hall.

Sometimes it's who you pass on - and this draft was well stoked in rounds 3-4... we had FOUR picks.

  1. A Davis
  2. J. Zuniga
  3. L Perine
  4. J Morgan

That's mostly sh*t - and that's where the A+ GMs show their stuff. Those are the rounds you have to win. Not the gimmes in 1-2

Solid crit but it's too early to make that judgement as Zuniga has just started playing due to injury, Davis was raw coming in but has shown flashes, Perine has also shown flashes but is being coached by an imbecile would rather continue to give the majority of carries to 37 year old.  The one pick I am pissed about is the Morgan selection that was truly a "luxury" pick as back up quarterbacks are a dime a dozen and didn't need to be drafted in the 4th round.   I don't know if Tyler Biadse (can't spell that name) the C/G was still on the board but he did go in the 4th round to the Cowboys and is playing extremely well.  I would have been perfectly happy adding another interior lineman with that pick. 

The most glaring mistake was to come out of the WR rich draft with only one receiver.  That is practically unforgivable. 

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21 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

We don't know what JD is yet.  From my perspective there are two base scenario's...

  • The was an entire tear-down year, there was no expectation of winning - and he just wanted to clear out everything and legitimately start the rebuild next year.  Note - I'm not talking about tanking but just cleaning house and ready to start over.  Winning or losing was irrelevant.

or 

  • He honestly thought he had upgraded the roster.  And those OL. RB and WR moves would make this team better.

Also...

  1. His draft is too early to tell - Bechton's been good (but so has Wrifs) otherwise it hasn't been good so far, but obviously very yearly and way to soon to make any judgments.
  2. His FA's signings have been almost entirely bad (but that can be part of the tear-down plan)
  3. He got a good haul for Adams but otherwise any other trades he's made are pedestrian - but nothing bad either.

Bottom line...

  • If he thought he was upgrading the roster and building a competitive team than he's in way over his head and will most certainly be disaster going forward.  We are in for another 4 years of awfulness.
  • If he was honestly cleaning house and understood this team would be awful than I'm pretty confident in him.  He has the foresight and balls to go all-in and do this the right way.  No way to know if he can rebuild properly but so far he would be doing things the right way.  I'm bullish on him here.

He knew this team wasn’t competing this year. Whether he thought it’d be this bad is a different story. But it’s not like he got us into bad long term contracts or anything like that. He has all the draft picks and cap space in the world. This should be a quick rebuild for Douglas

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3 hours ago, UntouchableCrew said:

I think the "Becton was the obvious pick" stuff is way overblown. Clearly two other guys went ahead of him, and many preferred Wirfs. It was a great pick that deserves credit.

That said, the rest of the draft has a lot to prove. Def gets an incomplete rating due to injuries and what have you but right now the Davis pick is the one I'm most unhappy with.

The best thing about Douglas has been his ability to trade -- getting great comp for Adams, good comp for Williams, moving down to acquire picks, etc. I think his big picture strategy is very good. Just needs to hit on these picks.

Agree with your last point, Douglas certainly has shown an ability and willingness to manoeuvre and maximise draft capital which we have been maddeningly poor at forever(aside from Tannenbaum who went too far the opposite way). That was a pleasant surprise on draft day and we ought to have come away with a lot of talent from all those picks. The trouble is we just have no idea at this point as there’s not enough on-field evidence to go on. 

When you are as desperately poor talent wise as we are then it’s tough to make proper evaluations on anyone because as much as people like to insist it’s about ‘difference-makers’ it is still ultimately a team game and if the guys either side of you are good and capable of doing their job then the chances are your performance will benefit too.


Some of these guys MIGHT be good, but until they can get on the field consistently AND we surround them with a functioning team capable of playing to a basic level of competence then we may never know. The problem for Douglas is that he has to shoulder his share of the blame for that up to this point.
 

it’s great having all that draft capital but we are some way off definitive proof that Douglas knows what he’s doing with it.

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3 minutes ago, Rhg1084 said:

He knew this team wasn’t competing this year. Whether he thought it’d be this bad is a different story. But it’s not like he got us into bad long term contracts or anything like that. He has all the draft picks and cap space in the world. This should be a quick rebuild for Douglas

I agree with this, I was under the impression all off-season about this plan.  I believe he had already moved on from Sam and he was basically the sacrificial lamb this year.  Signing basically one-year deals, clearing out cap space and acquiring draft capital.  With the resources we have, if we hit on the QB and he's smart about it, this can be a very quick rebuild.

 

With that said, last week, hearing him speak, scared the heck out of me because he did sincerely sound like he thought this team was going to be competitive.  And that he thought he truly upgraded the roster.   Now, I'm sure he wasn't expecting a playoff team but he did sound like he thought this roster was heavily upgraded.  Now, that is GM speak and I get it but to me it sounded quite sincere.  

 

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If you look at the upcoming free agent period there are a few teams in some serious cap trouble. 

Teams to look at: 1- Saints- Marshon Lattimore (Cap hit 10 million) 2- Steelers ( Bud Dupree/UFA) 

Giving players hope that you can turn this mess around quickly will be imperative to bringing in a few top notch guys. 

If you look at this team we need to solidify the Guard/Center spots on the Oline & add a stud WR & another RB. I love the idea of adding Allen Robinson & Thuney or Scherff. 2 spots filled. Draft the QB (TL or Fields) and maneuver in the draft to get either Creed Humprey or Josh Myers. Now you've added 2 more studs (Thuney or Scherff + a Center) you can move McGovern to Guard (great depth if your Center is injured) and let Clark & McGovern fight it out. Clark was drafted for his toughness so he could beat McGovern out. 

Those are 2 free agent moves that are not at all far fetched. Plus TL or Fields plus a stud Center in the draft are not far fetched. Trading Sam Darnold I believe will bring a mid to late #1 or a high #2 which still leaves us with 4 more picks in the top 80. Jets could maybe land Etienne or Harris? 

With Macc gone, this is gonna be a really interesting offseason in free agency & the draft. Great year to be sitting where the Jets are with Cap space, a bunch of draft picks, 2 stud, maybe 3 stud QBs coming out, and the draft lining up with their need, 2 stud Centers, 2 stud RBs, a few stud WRs, maybe Devonta Smith? (saves us 10.5 million cutting Crowder). Win, win if you could cut Crowder & use his money for a pass rusher or CB. 

I used Lattimore as a trade option to relieve Saints salary cap, (but only if he signs long term). They are all in this year. Cap hell in 2021. 

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4 hours ago, Rhg1084 said:

I mean show me a draft where a team hits on every pick? Lol if you can get 2 starters from one draft that’s a success. Let alone if one of them is an All Pro LT

What i'm reading is the jaded view of a Jets fan...

Yes, 32/32 teams will miss on picks. It's impossible to hit on 7 year in and out.. but you are mistaken about 2 starters being passable indicator of success. 

PIT, CIN, GB, BAL, IND and others consistently rank amongst the lowest teams in FA spending - because they cook at home. They hit on more picks than not. They don't pass on Cook for Maye. They don't fall for Leonard Williams'.. they take Diontae Johnson while we take Polite. 

Becton and Mims - YES... but you have to do better in rnds 3-4... Have to. 

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2 hours ago, Trolly McTrollface said:

Are you kidding me?

The Jets have less talent on this roster than an expansion team. They were the LAST team in the league that should've wasted that pick on a guy they MIGHT be able to develop (because Lord knows, when you think Jets, you think QB development) into a backup.

Douglas wasted that pick, and has gotten little to nothing out of most of his others. Lets not even bring up Robbie, or the FA's he brought in.

Agreed.  How very Jet like to worry more about a back up QB than finding an answer at the starting QB.  

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8 minutes ago, sec101row23 said:

Agreed.  How very Jet like to worry more about a back up QB than finding an answer at the starting QB.  

4th round QB's can, and have, become starters in this league.  I don't understand the continued hand-wringing about using a midround pick on a QB when we pretty clearly, with hindsight included, didn't have ANY QB's worth a damn on the roster.

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2 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

So 5 straight awful drafts by Mike Maccagnan, the worst GM in NFL history, has nothing to do with the 2020 roster.  It's all on JD.

Got it.

And meanwhile, shooting for the # 1 pick is better than shooting for 5-11.  Once Adams was traded and Mosley opted out, and then injuries started piling up....what direction would you have preferred?

Question for you guys..what year do we stop blaming maccagnan? Serious question by the way 

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11 minutes ago, Paradis said:

What i'm reading is the jaded view of a Jets fan...

Yes, 32/32 teams will miss on picks. It's impossible to hit on 7 year in and out.. but you are mistaken about 2 starters being passable indicator of success. 

PIT, CIN, GB, BAL, IND and others consistently rank amongst the lowest teams in FA spending - because they cook at home. They hit on more picks than not. They don't pass on Cook for Maye. They don't fall for Leonard Williams'.. they take Diontae Johnson while we take Polite. 

Becton and Mims - YES... but you have to do better in rnds 3-4... Have to. 

It’s premature to say none of his other picks will materialize. 

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5 hours ago, Scott Dierking said:

I am really not feeling pain from the Robby Anderson non-signing. His numbers continue to diminish as this season goes on, 

He's 3rd in the league in receptions (60) and 4th in receiving yards (751).

And we're now heading into week 10. 

Nice try. 

And Carolinas #2 WR? Don't lie. 

Robby Anderson leads all Carolina WRs in receptions with 60 and it's not even close. 

Carolina's 2nd and 3rd leading receivers have 38 and 35 receptions (73 combined) lol. 

Nice try (again).

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11 minutes ago, Defense Wins Championships said:

He's 3rd in the league in receptions (60) and 4th in receiving yards (751).

And we're now heading into week 10. 

Nice try. 

And Carolinas #2 WR? Don't lie. 

Robby Anderson leads all Carolina WRs in receptions with 60 and it's not even close. 

Carolina's 2nd and 3rd leading receivers have 38 and 35 receptions (73 combined) lol. 

Nice try (again).

Who is the receiver for Carolina that can break the lid off of coverage? That would be DJ Moore, averaging 18.3 yards per reception (to Robbies pedestrian 12.5-nice try).

Again, Robbie has 1 TD reception (Hardly a gamebreaker- nice try).

In the future, would I want Robbie to be the Jets #1? No, I wouldn't. I am not heartbroken not having him on the Jets right now. He would not be a difference maker for them. 

 

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49 minutes ago, Paradis said:

What i'm reading is the jaded view of a Jets fan...

Yes, 32/32 teams will miss on picks. It's impossible to hit on 7 year in and out.. but you are mistaken about 2 starters being passable indicator of success. 

PIT, CIN, GB, BAL, IND and others consistently rank amongst the lowest teams in FA spending - because they cook at home. They hit on more picks than not. They don't pass on Cook for Maye. They don't fall for Leonard Williams'.. they take Diontae Johnson while we take Polite. 

Becton and Mims - YES... but you have to do better in rnds 3-4... Have to. 

This times a million. It’s all going to be based on how he drafts from here on out as well as the ultimate plan at QB. 

Free agency has largely been bad ever since they signed those TV deals since the cap has expanded every year and teams no longer had to worry about cap hell as well as the franchise tag still being a thing. So it makes sense that good teams largely just pinpoint value adds in free agency and just re-sign their good players. 

Two a year may seem great for Jets fans since we’ve had nothing but awful drafts, but the Jets need to maximize every pick to actually turn this around. 
 

 

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6 hours ago, Rhg1084 said:

Sure he’s had some missteps along the way. Not resigning Robby, drafting a QB in round 4. 
 

However these 2 moves alone have cemented him a great GM.

1) Drafting Mekhi Becton. This guy is an All Pro LT for next 12 years.

2) Trading Jamal for two 1s and a 3. What an absolute haul. Not to mention saving the $16m in cap space we’d have to use on him. Jamal having a lot of problems in Seattle 

Douglas is the best GM this team has had in awhile. He will make us a contender soon. 

I am amazed how the word "great" is used around here, actually in many places.

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There is too much hyperbole either way about JD in my opinion. I feel that he has a good approach in place, has shown to be a shrewd negotiator, seems to have the right positional priorities for building a team, and seems to be valuing athletic traits in players. 

That being said, he’s also made a number of mistakes and I think it’s perfectly valid to criticize him for those. Not what Kevin is irrationally doing all day long, but also not what people seem to be giving him a pass for either. 

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48 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

4th round QB's can, and have, become starters in this league.  I don't understand the continued hand-wringing about using a midround pick on a QB when we pretty clearly, with hindsight included, didn't have ANY QB's worth a damn on the roster.

Because he’s never going to play.  

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50 minutes ago, Embrace the Suck said:

Clearly you haven't been paying any attention whatsoever... Do we really need to break out the Benny Hill music and recap rounds 1 and 2 for the last few decades...

Learn Social Studies GIF by Awkward Daytime TV

Take a seat, tony. 

If your GM can't consistently hit on rounds 1-2, then he's not very good at his fcking job. 

The possibility to bust exists from the 1st pick, to the last.... but the propensity increases significantly per round. 

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6 hours ago, Paradis said:

lol, put away the Cialis poncho... A+ because we needed a LT and they drafted on consensus top LT?

He faired better (already) than the last 2 combined. Yes... but that bar is so low you could throw darts blindfold at a draft board and do better... Mims is going to be a stud, but after that - it's pretty sketchy outside of Bryce Hall.

Sometimes it's who you pass on - and this draft was well stoked in rounds 3-4... we had FOUR picks.

  1. A Davis
  2. J. Zuniga
  3. L Perine
  4. J Morgan

That's mostly sh*t - and that's where the A+ GMs show their stuff. Those are the rounds you have to win. Not the gimmes in 1-2

we still dont know what these players may become...

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To be clear - i'm still on board with JD.  I need to some adjustments made to his strategy, but no one's perfect out of the gate. There's been enough good to continue this experiment.

Hard to really feel confident in assessing his ability while he's only 50% in control of the team.

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