Gabriel Davis Vs James Morgan

[jago]

2 hours ago, kmnj said:

morgan will be sitting next to hackenberg in two years-another great qb pick

you dont build your team around a back up QB you build your team around skill players

 

 

but unlike hack, morgan's presence won't prevent the jets from drafting a top qb.

[FidelioJet]

2 hours ago, rangerous said:

a lot has been said about the morgan pick.  first off the 4th round isn't one of those must perform draft choice levels so it's not like it's a critical pick position.  another point is maybe douglas was trying to prepare for a team without darnold.  he may have seen something or heard something that didn't entirely sell him on darnold.  if many fans can see darnolds flaws then so should a football guy.  and then there's the whole thing about getting a good back up.  we saw nothing from falk less from semian so maybe morgan is being groomed for back up.  or maybe he's being considered for starter.  one last thing is a developing a guy may make him an attractive trade candidate so it's possible the jets can recoup the pick with something in future drafts.

So, the theory is....draft someone in the 4th round this year - with the slight hope of trading him for a 3rd round pick in 3 or 4 years?

This team is devoid of talent everywhere - our genius GM needs to hit on a few 4th rounders if we're going to turn this around.  Throwing them away on someone that is either potential trade bait or at best a back-up is insane at this point.

[Gastineau Lives]

22 minutes ago, Scott Dierking said:

First of all, you somehow slipped through the filter of requirements for posters on this site.  That must have been some sort of Max compromise.

Secondly, we are all smarter post-draft, near the end of first year.

Third, is anyone making the claim that Macc was a good GM?

Whether Mac is a good GM or not has nothing to do with what you posted and what I'm responding to unless your point was that Douglass is a good GM.

Second, there are plenty of us who had a problem with the Morgan pick as soon as it was made.

 

[dcJet]

JD's first draft is not looking good so far.  It doesn't mean we hate JD to point that out.

 

[Scott Dierking]

3 minutes ago, Gastineau Lives said:

Whether Mac is a good GM or not has nothing to do with what you posted and what I'm responding to unless your point was that Douglass is a good GM.

Second, there are plenty of us who had a problem with the Morgan pick as soon as it was made.

 

On Douglas, he is, in a short lens, the best GM that the Jets have had in over a decade. For me, this stems from his background and pedigree, and the pattern that he seems to be in process of building this team. Again, that is a very short view, I understand, and I may be projecting hopefulness. Forgive me if that is the case. For the first time, in seemingly forever, someone at the Jet GM position seems to have the big picture in mind, rather than quick fix bandaids, which in my opinion have taken us to where we are today.

I refuse to get upset over a draft or free agency period conducted 8 months ago, because it is only one piece. History will give me a much clearer vie won that in 2 years or so. I know for the "quick take" of opinions that is a sissy way to approach things, but I am sorry. It just seems the most logical, rather than knee jerking back and forth.

I hope that explains my position more clearly.

 

[Savage69]

6 minutes ago, Gastineau Lives said:

Whether Mac is a good GM or not has nothing to do with what you posted and what I'm responding to unless your point was that Douglass is a good GM.

Second, there are plenty of us who had a problem with the Morgan pick as soon as it was made.

 

There have always been plenty of posters who had a problem with every pick if it wasn't the one they wanted.. They go on the premise only they know who will be a great player.

[TheClashFan]

I was not thrilled with the Morgan pick, and said so at the time (others did, too). However, I don't think it was necessarily a "bad" pick.  If anything, I think Joe may have screwed up in the 3rd round, going for guys with lots of talent but also lots of risk (one guy very raw, the other injury prone). He opted for a sort of "draft a little bit of everything" approach.

I was all for the first four picks being, in some order, OL, WR, OL, WR.  I think JD should have double dipped at OL and WR in the third round.  There was plenty of depth in the draft at both of those positions, and major need on the team. The need is still there. If the Jets get Lawrence, they need to build around him immediately.

I'm still hopeful about JD. I think he has the right plan in place, and his first two picks look to be very promising.  This year, after QB with the first, he needs the next 2 picks for sure to be OL (C, please) and Weapon (WR, TE, RB). I'd argue the next 3 picks should be all offense.  Also, keep taking at least 2 OL every year.

[Gastineau Lives]

2 minutes ago, Scott Dierking said:

On Douglas, he is, in a short lens, the best GM that the Jets have had in over a decade. For me, this stems from his background and pedigree, and the pattern that he seems to be in process of building this team. Again, that is a very short view, I understand, and I may be projecting hopefulness. Forgive me if that is the case. For the first time, in seemingly forever, someone at the Jet GM position seems to have the big picture in mind, rather than quick fix bandaids, which in my opinion have taken us to where we are today.

I refuse to get upset over a draft or free agency period conducted 8 months ago, because it is only one piece. History will give me a much clearer vie won that in 2 years or so. I know for the "quick take" of opinions that is a sissy way to approach things, but I am sorry. It just seems the most logical, rather than knee jerking back and forth.

I hope that explains my position more clearly.

 

I agree with everything you said. I just think we should have at least tried to draft another receiver in a very deep class rather than draft a small school quarterback that we hope never sees the field.

[68JET11]

One can make the argument that it was a bad pick, especially this year that we've seen what GASE has not done with the offense, But on the other hand, if we do somehow get a very good OC and QB coach, if he turns out to be a great late round pick up and starting for the rest of his career are you guys still going to be saying the same thing. I get we needed another WR... but until JD starts really failing at his job to pick the right players we need to have some confidence that someone on this team actually knows what they are doing.

We don't know if he's sold on GASE, and he could already be formulating behind the scenes with CJ or WJ to get GASE out of here.

[Gastineau Lives]

4 minutes ago, Savage69 said:

There have always been plenty of posters who had a problem with every pick if it wasn't the one they wanted.. They go on the premise only they know who will be a great player.

Which is the opposite of what I'm saying. You can disagree with the overall method without fancying yourself Mel Kiper Jr.

 

[Paradis]

28 minutes ago, 56mehl56 said:

While many on this sight employ green colored glasses while evaluating our talent , myself included many times . There are just as many here who want to continually bash everything that is Jets and constantly under rate our players ,especially in hindsight. No that offensive lineup was not a murderers row, but its not as bad as you want to make it out to be.  Darnold is not regressing because he lacks guys to throw to, he's regressing because he doesn't know who to throw to and has no clue how to read a blitz or simple cover

Darnold failing to make use of the ppl he has had - is it's own conversation. 

My evaluation of those players is not a reflection of my jaded/roses glasses. That's just a real take. We're setting ourselves for problems by relying on Perriman and a rookie. I can at least see what they were expecting to get out of the TE position. They were kind of handcuffed to Bell.... but the WR situation (as everyone has acknowledged) displayed a concerning lack of foresight and urgency.

[Scott Dierking]

Just now, Gastineau Lives said:

I agree with everything you said. I just think we should have at least tried to draft another receiver in a very deep class rather than draft a small school quarterback that we hope never sees the field.

I knew we were fairly well aligned. Maybe in 2 years (I hope not) and with the value of hindsight your take will be clearly right. I also believe that WR position is a position that in case of need, you can grab every year. QB's, maybe not so much. Again, time will tell.

As @Defense Wins Championships has tried to tell me, my opinions here are not popular. I guess that is a thing in some minds. 

[Savage69]

1 minute ago, Gastineau Lives said:

I agree with everything you said. I just think we should have at least tried to draft another receiver in a very deep class rather than draft a small school quarterback that we hope never sees the field.

We did pick up that position as UDFA as other FA we signed and some here are still crying over a former UDFA that went to the Panthers..

[Gastineau Lives]

Just now, Savage69 said:

We did pick up that position as UDFA as other FA we signed and some here are still crying over a former UDFA that went to the Panthers..

Are there no small school back up qbs available as UDFA?

[Paradis]

53 minutes ago, Gastineau Lives said:

No one is saying they are better than Douglass 

[Savage69]

5 hours ago, Gastineau Lives said:

Are there no small school back up qbs available as UDFA?

There are but if they go to NE they make them W/R's.. Except for Kurt Warner

[Paradis]

37 minutes ago, Defense Wins Championships said:

No but it just makes you a bad talent evaluator (what you like to criticize others for). 

 

2012 man, really? 8 years without a single day of liked content? 

You should spend more time talking football rather than mocking others who do...

one of your less than prudent posts.

there's a quality over quantity argument somewhere in here - being that Scott typically posts what's needed and nothing more on the subject - and often without hyperbole and being absolute... He gets the concept of "economy of words".  Bad fight to pick. 

[Biggs]

1 hour ago, Beerfish said:

This guy is never seeing the filed.

If darnold is toast we are using our 1st pick in next years draft on a QB.

The thing we don't know at all is if he is actually good enough to play in a game.  Adam Gase would rather have 35 year old joe flacco as he back up.

 

He's being protected unlike Darnold who was thrown into the deep end and sank.

[Beerfish]

2 minutes ago, Biggs said:

He's being protected unlike Darnold who was thrown into the deep end and sank.

When do you expect him to ever take a snap?

Mike White and him are the same guy essentially.

Teams like vet backups.

The QB the jets draft next year will be thrown into the deep end.

[rangerous]

36 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

So, the theory is....draft someone in the 4th round this year - with the slight hope of trading him for a 3rd round pick in 3 or 4 years?

This team is devoid of talent everywhere - our genius GM needs to hit on a few 4th rounders if we're going to turn this around.  Throwing them away on someone that is either potential trade bait or at best a back-up is insane at this point.

c'mon.  i suspect you know better than that.  the theory is draft players who can help the team.  it doesn't necessarily mean they help in their drafted year but in the near future.  the morgan pick can go a number of different ways.  i'm not an nfl talent evaluator.  that's douglas and his scouts get paid to do.  and i really wouldn't be that surprised if morgan was picked to replace darnold.  obviously douglas thought this team wouldn't have any shot of getting the top pick.  the expectations changed and so too must the plan. 

[varjet]

If Douglas thought Darnold was the long-term answer, Morgan over the other picks was just a terrible pick.  Really not excusable, particularly when letting go of Robby as well.  

If Douglas thought the Jets would moving on from Darnold, given the OL and WR needs on the team generally, and the fact that WRs often take a year or more to develop, passing over them for Morgan was also not good, but not as bad if Douglas was actually trying to work with Darnold. 

[Anthony Jet]

8 hours ago, Gastineau Lives said:

I agree with everything you said. I just think we should have at least tried to draft another receiver in a very deep class rather than draft a small school quarterback that we hope never sees the field.

I have no dog in the race here. But this is the best reasoning I have seen against the Morgan pick. 
For reasons stated more than once in this thread alone, I’m am very optimistic about the job JD is doing, doesn’t mean he’s batting a 1000
 

[Jetsbaby93]

James Morgan is there for when Trevor says I don’t wanna come to the jets and then we pick Sewell instead for protection 

[JetBlue]

6 minutes ago, Anthony Jet said:

I have no dog in the race here. But this is the best reasoning I have seen against the Morgan pick. 
For reasons stated more than once in this thread alone, I’m am very optimistic about the job JD is doing, doesn’t mean he’s batting a 1000
 

Folks on here refuse to admit that AS OF NOW, the Morgan pick was a bad pick.  In two or three years if Morgan gets on the field and shows some promise and we can flop him for a 4th round pick it will be a wash.  As of now?  On a team with this many needs, it was a bad pick.  No way to really argue this point.   I also didn't like trading away our 6th round pick for that Indy cornerback who has done absolutely nothing.   That pick could have been Donovan Peoples Jones...    That said, overall I am okay with the job JD is done but he is not above some criticism.  

[Defense Wins Championships]

I was frustrated over the selection of Morgan too and even created a thread about to in order to voice my opinion on it. 

However, I'm no longer upset about it. 

Not bringing back Robby. Drafting Morgan. Trading away Jamal Adams (for a Khalil Mack type of haul). Joe Flacco. Releasing Bell. Frank Gore. So many different FA on 1 year contracts.

Etc etc.  

It's now more than obvious that even in 2020 that JD has been planning ahead for 2021's offseason in order to build around Trevor Lawrence (because he's obviously never believed in Sam Darnold as a QB he was forced to inherit). 

[Jet_Engine1]

11 hours ago, Thai Jet said:

I'm wondering how many Pats fans started a similar thread t when they "wasted" a #6 on Brady ? Just sayin......

That was pre internet. Nobody complained about things back then....

?

[playtowinthegame]

We're 3 games away from Trevor Lawrence, and we sitting here talking 'bout missing out on Gabriel Davis. Lol

[Beerfish]

Elated we have james morgan instead of donovan peoples jones

[playtowinthegame]

6 minutes ago, Jet_Engine1 said:

That was pre internet. Nobody complained about things back then....

?

[Jet_Engine1]

Just now, playtowinthegame said:

I miss those days..

[Lizard King]

Do the math... not only did he draft a quarterback, he let Robby go... must think the world of Sam

[Jetsbaby93]

50 minutes ago, Lizard King said:

Do the math... not only did he draft a quarterback, he let Robby go... must think the world of Sam

But he also drafted drafted a LT then a WR so you can do the math both ways. Why just blame the front office why not Sam not improving on reading defenses limiting mistakes improving his overall game. Or is that Jordan palmers fault 

[Beerfish]

15 minutes ago, Jetsbaby93 said:

But he also drafted drafted a LT then a WR so you can do the math both ways. Why just blame the front office why not Sam not improving on reading defenses limiting mistakes improving his overall game. Or is that Jordan palmers fault 

The fact that Douglas chose not to double dip at WR in a super deep wr draft when that was a huge need has not one thing to do with Sam Darnold.

I mean I know it is the in thing to blame Darnold for everything but it's hardly his fault the Gm made a mistake.

[Jetsbaby93]

7 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

The fact that Douglas chose not to double dip at WR in a super deep wr draft when that was a huge need has not one thing to do with Sam Darnold.

I mean I know it is the in thing to blame Darnold for everything but it's hardly his fault the Gm made a mistake.

No it’s not but you always can’t just blame one without blaming the other. Crowder Mims Perriman Herndon. No reason to double dip because we didn’t know what was gonna happen 

[JetBlue]

17 minutes ago, Jetsbaby93 said:

No it’s not but you always can’t just blame one without blaming the other. Crowder Mims Perriman Herndon. No reason to double dip because we didn’t know what was gonna happen 

Crowder, Mims and Perriman along another developmental receiver like DPJ or Quez Watkins in the 6th round and no one is complaining.  That is how deep the talent at wide out went.   Perriman and Crowder both have significant injury histories.  Taking just just one WR in the deepest class in a decade or more was a mistake.  All things considered, he has still done more good than bad but that was a mistake on his part.  Plenty of other teams double dipped and are set at wr for years to come.  Hell the Raiders not only drafted two receivers, they also signed Nelson Agholor.  Denver took Jeudy and Hamler just to name a few.