Mike Tannenbaum and Bart Scott advocate on "get up" to roll it back with Sam Darnold for 2021

[LisbonJet]

I'm not ready to give up on Sam yet, just get him weapons and decent coaching and see what you get. Drew Brees' first 3 seasons were below average, a turnover machine, SD even drafted Rivers! And then he became a pro-bowler, future HOF! It might hapen again...
Too optimistic? Well, it's hard to let go

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[FidelioJet]

7 minutes ago, slats said:

No, he doesn't. All the pressure would be on Darnold in that scenario, not the rookie, which is what you'd want. 

It wouldn't be a productive environment for the rookie.  

I'll say it again, if you're drafting a QB in the first round you need to do EVERYTHING you can to develop him.  Keeping Sam around doesn't serve that purpose.

[ZachEY]

38 minutes ago, Big Snell said:

      To this, I'll invite you to look up Alex Smith's first 3 years in the league. Similar age, similar surrounding cast, similar results. I'll take a Kansas City Chiefs version of Alex Smith any day of the week. I get your point, and your frustration, but when you surrounding cast gets worse rather than better in your time with the team, and there should be no argument there, what do you expect? There's a lot more things wrong with this team than the QB. The definition of insanity , is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. Since the Todd Bowles era, we've been watching insanity week after week.

There’s a reason why late stage Alex Smith continues to be replaced.  If Darnold’s upside is hold the fort, even though they are very different players, then he’s also a guy you move on from.

[ZachEY]

39 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Hes played three seasons without any support whatsoever.  He has played three seasons without a competent CS.

That the Jets also sucked 7 seasons before his being drafted has nothing to do with whether he can turn it around with an infusion of decent talent and a CS that doesnt have its head up its ass

And, if he was something other than the worst QB in the league, you might have a point.  But Darnold is looking up at bad, with no on the field reasons to believe it will ever get better.  Just hopes that the next coaching staff will make the bad players good.

[Wonderboy]

14 hours ago, Spoot-Face said:

Sign that beast!

[Wonderboy]

13 hours ago, Young Jetty said:

If the Jets are not high on Justin Fields, trade the pick to Dallas for the farm and give Sam another go.

 

Not even Jerry Jones is THAT Stupid

[Jet Nut]

6 minutes ago, TeddEY said:

And, if he was something other than the worst QB in the league, you might have a point.  But Darnold is looking up at bad, with no on the field reasons to believe it will ever get better.  Just hopes that the next coaching staff will make the bad players good.

Or the point could just as easily be made that he played with one of the worst group of offensive players in the history of the league with some of the worst coaching imaginable that why would anyone expect any QB, especially one just learning to play in the NFL do play differently? 

 

[JetsFan1986]

2 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Or the point could just as easily be made that he played with one of the worst group of offensive players in the history of the league with some of the worst coaching imaginable that why would anyone expect any QB, especially one just learning to play in the NFL do play differently? 

 

Absolutely.  Look we all agree Sam has issues he must clean up if he wants to become a real good QB.  However it’s also true that he has had one of the worst coaches and worst supporting casts a young QB could possibly have.  That’s no excuse that’s a pure fact 

[Jet Nut]

14 minutes ago, TeddEY said:

There’s a reason why late stage Alex Smith continues to be replaced.  If Darnold’s upside is hold the fort, even though they are very different players, then he’s also a guy you move on from.

The Alex Smith example is to show that under similar circumstances a QB can improve, not that Darnold will become a hold the fort QB like Smith is imagined to be.  Being shipped off in a trade so that a Mahomes can take the position isnt a black mark on a QBs resume.  

[NamathToCaster]

Sam will struggle today with the Cleveland defense.  They are coming after him since they are playing for playoff position and their offense will be weakened with players missing due to Covid.   Jacksonville is beating Chicago in sunny Florida today and by 5:00 pm today we will have the first pick in the 2021 draft.

[Jet Nut]

1 minute ago, NamathToCaster said:

Sam will struggle today with the Cleveland defense.  They are coming after him since they are playing for playoff position and their offense will be weakened with players missing due to Covid.   Jacksonville is beating Chicago in sunny Florida today and by 5:00 pm today we will have the first pick in the 2021 draft.

All sounds good but the predictions were exactly the same a week ago

 

[Sonny Werblin]

To be fair Tannenbaum did not say roll with darnold. He said bring in Winston snd have them compete.

[ZachEY]

9 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Or the point could just as easily be made that he played with one of the worst group of offensive players in the history of the league with some of the worst coaching imaginable that why would anyone expect any QB, especially one just learning to play in the NFL do play differently? 

 

No, that point can’t just as easily be made because it’s based on magical thinking.  Not what we are seeing.

Sam Darnold doesn’t see open WRs all of the time.  He throws off target to his WRs all the time.  He throws off his back foot frequently.  He throws YOLO balls frequently.  His arm is sub par.  None of these things are relevant to whether the WRs names are Braxton Berrios or Julio Jones.

He’s the worst QB in the league who had one good game 2 years ago in a loss.

[dcJet]

I think we're keeping Darnold next year.  There's no decent trade market for him and we need Sam to play while we groom our new rookie QB.  

I think Sam starts the season and we gadget up some plays for Fields, like Philly did for Hurts.   Then, when Sam is 3-9 and the 30th rated QB, we start our rookie and plan for our "REAL" season - the 2022 draft with another top 6 pick.

This crap show is not turning around in one year.

[Wonderboy]

13 hours ago, Creepy Lurker said:

Outside the board is ALWAYS WRONG and behind on everything, literally everything so this just proves that Sam needs to go. 

Darnold has regressed.  You'd feel better if he had shown some sort of improvement, even minimal, year to year.  And of course, you have that contract looming on the horizon kicking in soon.  The table is SET to trade Sam NOW.  Head coaching change in 2 weeks. Premium draft picks available. Numerous QB's in the upcoming draft. Numerous vet QB's changing teams to allow a rookie QB to sit and learn for a year if needed. FA cash to spend.  This opportunity is not going to present itself next year.  JD is entering his 3rd year of a 6 year contract. He cannot make the same mistake Macc made by waiting to long to get a QB.  You trade Darnold and get what you can now. JD hires a HC and brainstorms what QB you want to go with.  Any new HC is going to be skeptical walking into a new HC job with a ruined QB like Darnold.  You move on. You sign a vet QB not named Flacco and draft one of the rookies.  This is JD's turning point. 

[joewilly12]

If we keep Darnold and don't draft a QB at 2 we need to sign Winston and let them battle  it out in camp. 

Yes its been awhile that theres been a QB controversy in NY Jets land. 

[Jet Nut]

9 minutes ago, TeddEY said:

No, that point can’t just as easily be made because it’s based on magical thinking.  Not what we are seeing.

Sam Darnold doesn’t see open WRs all of the time.  He throws off target to his WRs all the time.  He throws off his back foot frequently.  He throws YOLO balls frequently.  His arm is sub par.  None of these things are relevant to whether the WRs names are Braxton Berrios or Julio Jones.

He’s the worst QB in the league who had one good game 2 years ago in a loss.

Please, that he didnt see an open WR while running to the sideline that was visible from and overhead view and indicates a problem is mind numbing.  As is the back foot throw all the time and all the other nonsense we debate.  All QBs throw off their back foot, they have to.  When its results in a negative play we scream about it, surprise.  

And once again, anyone who sees a sub par arm should not talk about magical thinking.  

If the FO believes he still has all the attributes put on him coming out of USC and that he hasnt developed is on the supporting cast he'll be on the team in 2021.  If not Fields or someone else will be.  It wont be decided on a message board 

[ZachEY]

2 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

If we keep Darnold and don't draft a QB at 2 we need to sign Winston and let them battle  it out in camp. 

Yes its been awhile that theres been a QB controversy in NY Jets land. 

Winston would destroy Darnold in any fair QB completion.  They have the same downside but Winston had far more upside. 

[joewilly12]

Just now, TeddEY said:

Winston would destroy Darnold in any fair QB completion.  They have the same downside but Winston had far more upside. 

Agree that's why we sign him as a free agent. 

[ZachEY]

1 minute ago, Jet Nut said:

Please, that he didnt see an open WR while running to the sideline that was visible from and overhead view and indicates a problem is mind numbing.  As is the back foot throw all the time and all the other nonsense we debate.  All QBs throw off their back foot, they have to.  When its results in a negative play we scream about it, surprise.  

And once again, anyone who sees a sub par arm should not talk about magical thinking.  

When it happens as frequently as it does with Darnold, it is a problem.  And his arm is absolutely sub par for an NFL QB.

Look, you’re one of the boards biggest homers, which is total fine to be as a fan, but maybe let’s just leave it at that rather than pretending it’s anything resembling objective analysis.

[ZachEY]

3 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

Agree that's why we sign him as a free agent. 

That’s why we won’t.  Cant have your reclamation project getting embarrassed by a journeyman in camp.

[joewilly12]

2 minutes ago, TeddEY said:

That’s why we won’t.  Cant have your reclamation project getting embarrassed by a journeyman in camp.

Depending on who the HC is that mindset may change around here. 

[ZachEY]

1 minute ago, joewilly12 said:

Depending on who the HC is that mindset may change around here. 

Unfortunately, the mindset may precede, and ultimately, limit the HC.

[joewilly12]

1 minute ago, TeddEY said:

Unfortunately, the mindset may precede, and ultimately, limit the HC.

Hopefully the Johnson and JD if hes part of it realize they need to CLEAN HOUSE and throw away that damn playbook where we run a draw play on 4th and long or throw a 2 yard pass when we need 15 yards. 

[SomebodytoAnybody47]

9 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Please, that he didnt see an open WR while running to the sideline that was visible from and overhead view and indicates a problem is mind numbing.  As is the back foot throw all the time and all the other nonsense we debate.  All QBs throw off their back foot, they have to.  When its results in a negative play we scream about it, surprise.  

And once again, anyone who sees a sub par arm should not talk about magical thinking.  

If the FO believes he still has all the attributes put on him coming out of USC and that he hasnt developed is on the supporting cast he'll be on the team in 2021.  If not Fields or someone else will be.  It wont be decided on a message board 

He has a TON to fix. It's a legit hail mary of a project. He doesn't feel pressure, he doesn't navigate the pocket well, he bails often when he doesn't have to. He throws flat footed when he doesn't have to. The back foot thing is a legit issue. His deep ball accuracy is still something he struggles with. 

I'm not really sure what he does well at this point. Short to intermediate throws I guess? I would say also being able to make something out of nothing but more often then not he's doing that when he doesn't have to. And often makes bad decisions from that.

It's a huge project and not sure why a new HC would want to take that on when they first come here when they could just start fresh with a talented rookie. UNLESS the coach and JD agree, we need a lot to build out this roster, let's get that underway and we'll make it work with Sam for now.

[hungry jackson]

14 hours ago, JTJet said:

False.

Some of us wanted Trevor IF it happened, but by no means have given up on Sam. We are the minority, but we are definitely on the board. 

Sam has one ok game. We win the one game.

So Sam gets a pass on one win.

 

We have some naive fan base.

[ZachEY]

8 minutes ago, Samtorobby47 said:

He has a TON to fix. It's a legit hail mary of a project. He doesn't feel pressure, he doesn't navigate the pocket well, he bails often when he doesn't have to. He throws flat footed when he doesn't have to. The back foot thing is a legit issue. His deep ball accuracy is still something he struggles with. 

I'm not really sure what he does well at this point. Short to intermediate throws I guess? I would say also being able to make something out of nothing but more often then not he's doing that when he doesn't have to. And often makes bad decisions from that.

It's a huge project and not sure why a new HC would want to take that on when they first come here when they could just start fresh with a talented rookie. UNLESS the coach and JD agree, we need a lot to build out this roster, let's get that underway and we'll make it work with Sam for now.

The answer is nothing.  He does nothing well at this point.  Anything you’d point to isn’t an absolute strength, but rather a relative one.

He’s not a top QB at short to intermediate throws, and he’s not a top QB at going off script.  They’re just better than the terrible that is everything else.  And the “off script” stuff is just his way of limiting the field so he doesn’t have to think like an actual QB.

[Jet Nut]

9 minutes ago, TeddEY said:

When it happens as frequently as it does with Darnold, it is a problem.  And his arm is absolutely sub par for an NFL QB.

Look, you’re one of the boards biggest homers, which is total fine to be as a fan, but maybe let’s just leave it at that rather than pretending it’s anything resembling objective analysis.

Sorry I dont agree his arm is absolutely far from sub par for an NFL QB just as it was listed as a strength coming out of USC.  Sorry I dont agree and few if any would agree with you.  

I'm saying this because I'm a homer?  Yeah thats why your analysis goes against what people who do this for a living keep saying, what was said of Sam coming out of school, when many had him ranked higher than any QB since Luck.  Repeating this makes me a homer?  And your thread ridiculing Darnold makes you the model of objectiveness.  LOL, OK

[Big Snell]

1 hour ago, TeddEY said:

There’s a reason why late stage Alex Smith continues to be replaced.  If Darnold’s upside is hold the fort, even though they are very different players, then he’s also a guy you move on from.

Do you think that after almost nearly losing a leg you're skills might erode ? It's a tribute to him that he can even fight back enough to step on the field. I highly suggest if you haven't seen his documentary, that you watch it. As the football fan that you seem to be, I think you'd really enjoy it.

[ZachEY]

2 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Sorry I dont agree his arm is absolutely far from sub par for an NFL QB just as it was listed as a strength coming out of USC.  Sorry I dont agree and few if any would agree with you.  

I'm saying this because I'm a homer?  Yeah thats why your analysis goes against what people who do this for a living keep saying, what was said of Sam coming out of school, when many had him ranked higher than any QB since Luck.  Repeating this makes me a homer?  And your thread ridiculing Darnold makes you the model of objectiveness.  LOL, OK

I made threads ridiculing Pennington.  I made threads ridiculing Sanchez.  Those worked out okay for me.  As will these.

And yes, some people who do this for a living may think Darnold may still be saved.  What do you do for a living?  Does anyone you work with suck at their jobs?  And for that matter, we know what some people who talk about this for a living think, but not what very many who do it think.  And those who talk about it are doing their job by saying things that get responses, not by making informed football decisions.

Repeating some of his college scouting reports may or may not make you a homer, but I’d say that burying your head in the sand like the last 4 years doesn’t matter certainly does.  As for the best prospect since Luck, obvious nonsense and hyperbole as he wasn’t QB1 and was passed on by a QB needy team at two.  You think that happens this year with the “best prospect since Luck?”  What odds do you think Fields goes 1 and then the Jets draft Ettine?  Hell, FO gave him a 50% bust rate.  I was happy we got him, but his play shouldn’t surprise anyone.  Especially since you need to close your eyes and pretend a lot of football didn’t happen between the Rose Bowl and today to think this is a competent QB in waiting.

[ZachEY]

4 minutes ago, Big Snell said:

Do you think that after almost nearly losing a leg you're skills might erode ? It's a tribute to him that he can even fight back enough to step on the field. I highly suggest if you haven't seen his documentary, that you watch it. As the football fan that you seem to be, I think you'd really enjoy it.

I have nothing against Alex Smith.  His career is remarkable.  I do have an issue going into year 4 and beyond hoping that, at best, that’s what Sam Darnold can become.

[dbatesman]

I cannot ******* believe we’re doing “maybe [terrible Jets QB] will magically become not terrible with better coaching and a new offensive line” again. This fanbase deserves every bad thing that happens to it

[JTJet]

33 minutes ago, hungry jackson said:

Sam has one ok game. We win the one game.

So Sam gets a pass on one win.

 

We have some naive fan base.

If only the world were as black and white as you fantasize that it is. 

Yes. One game, that's all Sam's supporters see. That's it. Just one.... massive eye roll. 

And you call us naive? Lol

[ScarletKnight89]

3 hours ago, C Mart said:

Why is it all we read here is that Gase is the worst ever HC/OC yet those same people want to run the QB out?  Especially considering the QB looked a helluva lot better the 2nd half of his rookie year then the past 2 yrs. 

Why does the QB looked damn good the first series of each game to then regress as the game goes on?  Yes, he deserves some blame but why does this happen practically each game the past 2 yrs? 

Because if you believe in a QB in this draft not named Trevor Lawrence he is going to be staring at you right in the face at pick 2. If you're the GM, are you really going to pass on that player for a what if scenario with Sam?

And I agree, the final month of Sam's rookie season was the best he ever looked as a pro. His games against Houston and Green Bay were terrific. But the fact still remains that Sam is the one out there playing and throwing the football. Not Gase. Yes Gase stinks. But it brings me back to my first point, if you have a chance to draft a QB you believe in, you're not going to pass up on him for Sam.

[RutgersJetFan]

31 minutes ago, dbatesman said:

I cannot ******* believe we’re doing “maybe [terrible Jets QB] will magically become not terrible with better coaching and a new offensive line” again. This fanbase deserves every bad thing that happens to it

Well, it’s Groundhog’s Day. Again.