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Hearing more and more - if you want a premiere head coach, they have to have final say over the roster. The GM works for the HC, more or less. We can get technical about the roster and the draft but fact of the matter is, if you want a premiere HC, Joe Douglas needs to allow that HC to have final say over the roster.  Otherwise, we are taking a chance on 2nd tier candidate.

The win/loss record goes on the HC resume, so the premiere candidates want to make their own decision.  

Should the Jets be offering final say over the roster to prospective candidates in order to lure a bigger fish?  Or should Joe Douglas retain that control and look for the next up & comer?  

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7 minutes ago, Reprisalizer said:

Hearing more and more - if you want a premiere head coach, they have to have final say over the roster. The GM works for the HC, more or less. We can get technical about the roster and the draft but fact of the matter is, if you want a premiere HC, Joe Douglas needs to allow that HC to have final say over the roster.  Otherwise, we are taking a chance on 2nd tier candidate.

The win/loss record goes on the HC resume, so the premiere candidates want to make their own decision.  

Should the Jets be offering final say over the roster to prospective candidates in order to lure a bigger fish?  Or should Joe Douglas retain that control and look for the next up & comer?  

Please list the "Premiere" Head Coaches for whom this applies.

Before I answer your question, I'd like to know who these "Premiere" Coaches are, specifically.

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6 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Please list the "Premiere" Head Coaches for whom this applies.

Before I answer your question, I'd like to know who these "Premiere" Coaches are, specifically.

Bill Belicheck? lol

wouldnt it be amazing if he came here after all the years of not speaking to Mangini for leaving to coach us 

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1 minute ago, Rhg1084 said:

There’s no Bill Parcells or Belichick type of candidate out there that would demand that type of power. Douglas will continue to be the GM 

BTW Douglas had a better draft in year 1 than any GM not named Mike Tennenbaum has had in the last 20 years. I would also go out on a limb and say that the OL has been improved, which is not easy to do in 1 year. Fant has been very ok as has McGovern as has Bechton.

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Yeah, no thanks. HC's are willing to sell out tomorrow and the day after for a shot at glory today (Parcells comes to mind). GMs have to worry about today and tomorrow (sustained success). What you need is a GM that hires a good coach so that they are both on the same page as opposed to the shotgun wedding which the Dicks seem so found of for whatever reason (Yeah, sure, other teams use this set up too... Well it isn't working for the Jets regardless of what other teams are doing). Plus, essentaily being the GM and HC is way too much responsibility. The coaches that have been both generally haven't done too well. You see it often with HCs that still try to be a coordinator too.

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Re: - too much work for the HC - in many of these instance, there is a GM who does the daily grind and scouting but they advise the HC.  Mike Mayock for Gruden & the Raiders.

Tough to find exactly who has what control but from what I have read - 

HC w/ final authority over the roster: Reid, Belechick, Payton, Carrol, Payton, Rivera, Gruden, O'Brien (did), Quinn (did), Rhule, 

HC w/o final say - Harbaugh, Tomlin, McVay, Pederson, McCarthy, Lynn, Reich, Nagy, Fangio, Taylor, Marrone, Gase, Patricia, Stefanski, Judge, Arians, Kingsbury, Flores, LaFleur, Vrabel, Zimmer, Shanahan, McDermott

I used this article among others to try to piece this together: 

https://ftw.usatoday.com/lists/2020-nfl-gm-rankings-bill-belichick-patriots

It is pretty clear that "premier" HC (big names) have final say.  Doesn't mean there are not good HC's who do not have final say - but most of those guys were "chances" taken by the franchise that hired them as 1st timers.  

Candidates this year who may/can demand final say as a condition of their employment: John Harbaugh, Pat Fitzgerald, maybe Brian Daboll, Matt Cambell & Eric Bienemy (over the final roster at least), Lincoln Riley.  

Candidates this year who cannot command any final say authority: Joe Brady, Arthur Smith, Dave Toub, Matt Eberflus or Chuck Pagano (NOOOOOO!). 

 

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24 minutes ago, k-met57 said:

BTW Douglas had a better draft in year 1 than any GM not named Mike Tennenbaum has had in the last 20 years. I would also go out on a limb and say that the OL has been improved, which is not easy to do in 1 year. Fant has been very ok as has McGovern as has Bechton.

Belichick sucks as a GM also. Look at his draft history 

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1 hour ago, Reprisalizer said:

Hearing more and more - if you want a premiere head coach, they have to have final say over the roster. The GM works for the HC, more or less. We can get technical about the roster and the draft but fact of the matter is, if you want a premiere HC, Joe Douglas needs to allow that HC to have final say over the roster.  Otherwise, we are taking a chance on 2nd tier candidate.

The win/loss record goes on the HC resume, so the premiere candidates want to make their own decision.  

Should the Jets be offering final say over the roster to prospective candidates in order to lure a bigger fish?  Or should Joe Douglas retain that control and look for the next up & comer?  

They work on a consensus approach. If a HC wanted someone for the roster, he'd have to convince JD it was the correct move. And the reverse is true too. JD wouldn't give a HC a player he does not want or need. This is why it is important for JD to hire the HC. They have to share a vision. 

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The HC in charge of contracts loses all "good guy" cred with his players. He can get someone to perform by saying he'll see to it & do everything in his power that the player is rewarded with an extension / raise / etc. without the team committing to this verbal promise. 

In a conventional setup, the HC wouldn't be a liar if the GM (even with HC consent behind the scenes) goes in another direction, should a better situation present itself.

In a scenario where the HC has built a bond with a particular player, it's harder to cut (or fail to re-sign) him.

A new HC could lose a locker room fast that way just 1 season later as the departed player can still say to teammates don't trust HC ____. 

It's good for a HC to have this separation. He has final say on the roster spots at the end of the summer, and who's active from week to week. That's enough. Beyond that is only a problem if the GM and HC are very poorly matched. 

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6 hours ago, Rhg1084 said:

There’s no Bill Parcells or Belichick type of candidate out there that would demand that type of power. Douglas will continue to be the GM 

what's funny.. both of these guys where terrible at constructing rosters. Both should have stuck to coaching only.

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4 minutes ago, Morrissey said:

what's funny.. both of these guys where terrible at constructing rosters. Both should have stuck to coaching only.

Absolutely - Belichick has destroyed that New England roster with his inept drafting over the years. That team will be a disaster for a long time 

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6 hours ago, jetstream23 said:

mad tablet GIF

Get us this guy!

 

his final say in offesnive players has been, offensive...

A LOSER w/o Brady. Staright up LOSER. W/ a winning %age about Mangini...  JAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAAJAJAJAJAJA!!!!!!!

Lucked into 2 dominat HOFers. Taylor and Brady.

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7 hours ago, Reprisalizer said:

Hearing more and more - if you want a premiere head coach, they have to have final say over the roster. The GM works for the HC, more or less. We can get technical about the roster and the draft but fact of the matter is, if you want a premiere HC, Joe Douglas needs to allow that HC to have final say over the roster.  Otherwise, we are taking a chance on 2nd tier candidate.

The win/loss record goes on the HC resume, so the premiere candidates want to make their own decision.  

Should the Jets be offering final say over the roster to prospective candidates in order to lure a bigger fish?  Or should Joe Douglas retain that control and look for the next up & comer?  

No what works best is when the HC respects and trusts the GM and vice versa.  HC “I need to upgrade the CB position this year badly”. GM “understood we can do X in FA or X in the draft let me know what you think”.

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