You are complicating the draft; what to do with the 2nd pick

[Fantasy Island]

8 hours ago, Joe Willie White Shoes said:

Really. Just take anybody that happens to be left whenever the Jets pick comes up?  It doesn't matter who?  What if 5-6 QBs go before the Jets pick? Then just take the next QB on the board?  At the most important position on the field?  So if the Jets have Sewell and Becton as bookends then QB doesn't matter?  Fields and Wilson are not worth the #2 pick, but anybody who is left warrants a late first round pick.  That is just absurd.  

You draft qbs til you find one that sticks, Morgan was a wasted pick 

[ID.]

[Lurker89]

I just want this stupid @$$ draft to come and go. We ****** up not getting the #1 pick and have turned this opportunity into a dilemma. Take who we take and move on.

[slats]

12 hours ago, Warfish said:

So you say the cannot pay two elite Tackles.

I'll just ask....why not?  Specifically?

I'm pretty sure an NFL team "could" pay a Punter 20 million a season if they WANTED to do so.  

You could argue investing in two elite Tackles at high cost may be dumb.  You could argue that JD is unlikely to do it.

I don't believe you can argue that it "cannot" be done.  It can.  Like everything cap space management wise, it's a choice of priorities.

Don't misunderstand:  I (if I were GM) would either trade down or pick the Tackle.

I do not expect J.D. to do so.  I expect him to reach for a QB, and that QB to be just that, a reach pick who busts.  If I had to bet money, today, on the outcome, that is my bet.

Despite my personal feelings on the issue, as a mod here, I really try to stay away from calling people's arguments "dumb," so although you've given me the go-ahead, I'll just say that paying two OTs premium LT money would be in the vicinity of paying your punter $20M as far as intelligent roster building is concerned. I firmly believe that there's no way JD takes Sewell. 

IMHO, what he does with the pick will be primarily based on his evaluation of his top non-Lawrence QB vs. what he's being offered for the pick in a trade. 

[Sperm Edwards]

13 hours ago, Waka Flocka Flacco said:

7 sacks, 7 penalties, 70% of the snaps and you're worried about Becton's second contract?

The Chiefs took Eric Fisher first overall in 2013 after taking college left tackles in the second and third round in 2012. All with Branden Albert already on the roster. That's what it looks like when a competent organization treats something like it's important.

I agree that the pick has to be a quarterback if Douglas isn't in the tank for Darnold, but it sure seems like it would be Sewell otherwise.

As a rookie LT, with substandard coaching, in a covid season, without the help from having a good LG or TE, blocking for a QB who holds the ball too long? Yes I'd be planning on keeping Becton for a long time, not just the duration of a rookie contract, and build the team with that in mind.

KC 2014 isn't exactly apples to apples to the 2021 Jets. It's a poor comparison imo:

• What Reid did before using a high 1st rounder on a second tackle was he first acquired a QB.
• Also he had the 1st pick in a uniquely weak-up-top 2013 draft, where T was the only value pick at pick 1.1 and trading down yielded crappy returns.
• Also he only had Albert on a franchise tag for the year, not locked up for at least 3 more like the Jets with Becton.
• Also dumped Albert the next season without even getting a pick back by trading him; just a 3rd round comp pick in 2015. Fans here would be livid if we did that.
• Fisher is currently the only 1st round pick on KC's OL (like many if not most playoff teams).

A string of crap Jets years that coincided with treating OL prospects as afterthoughts in the draft, on top of the hindsight romance of drafting Ferguson & Mangold in round 1 in '06, there seems to be a real misperception that most smart/playoff teams owe their success to them keep hitting OL with their 1st round picks. It's simply not true.

Invest amply in the OL? Yes, and I'm a big believer in doing so. Over-invest in it with the team's top draft picks while there are like 10 holes all over the team? No. The prize is for building the best team, not the best pair of OTs. I'd welcome having the best pair of tackles, but not at the price of using the #2 overall pick after Becton's rookie season.

[Be_a_Jet]

Really hope Texans win so dolphins don’t end up with basically the best non-QB prospect in draft. 
 

maybe we can trade down to 5 with Bengals and let them take Sewell while we take Fields/Wilson at 5 

[Philc1]

1 minute ago, Be_a_Jet said:

Really hope Texans win so dolphins don’t end up with basically the best non-QB prospect in draft. 
 

maybe we can trade down to 5 with Bengals and let them take Sewell while we take Fields/Wilson at 5 

Or we can simply draft Sewell at 2 and let the Phish waste the 3rd pick overall on their next bust QB Justin Fields

[Philc1]

17 hours ago, Sturdi11 said:

Is anyone concerned that Sewell hasn't even played this year?

No. He sat out due to Covid19 

[Mackman55]

4 minutes ago, Be_a_Jet said:

Really hope Texans win so dolphins don’t end up with basically the best non-QB prospect in draft. 
 

maybe we can trade down to 5 with Bengals and let them take Sewell while we take Fields/Wilson at 5 

This is critical for setting up the draft if JD wants to move down. Not having at Miami to auction off the 3rd pick in the draft makes the Jets #2 much more valuable. 

[CanadaSteve]

10 hours ago, Fantasy Island said:

You draft qbs til you find one that sticks, Morgan was a wasted pick 

We should wait and see if when he plays, don't you think?

 

[Warfish]

3 hours ago, slats said:

Despite my personal feelings on the issue, as a mod here, I really try to stay away from calling people's arguments "dumb," so although you've given me the go-ahead, I'll just say that paying two OTs premium LT money would be in the vicinity of paying your punter $20M as far as intelligent roster building is concerned. I firmly believe that there's no way JD takes Sewell. 

We can agree to disagree.  Also, if you think i'm being dumb, you can tell me that.  We're friends (I like to think), I won't be offended.  On this I simply think you're wrong, building an elite O-line with two great players is worth the cost.  

3 hours ago, slats said:

IMHO, what he does with the pick will be primarily based on his evaluation of his top non-Lawrence QB vs. what he's being offered for the pick in a trade. 

On this we agree.  If he grades or values a Fields, or Wilson, or whomever very highly, we should presume (till shown otherwise) that J.D. will in fact select a QB at #2.  What we can't know as yet is how he (J.D.) graded Darnold as of now vs. these other guys, and if he (J.D.) feels any 'pressure' by fans, media or ownership to dump Sam for someone new, even if he (J.D.) thinks Darnold is a better QB than these new kids.  Just no way to know.

[slats]

9 minutes ago, Warfish said:

We can agree to disagree.  Also, if you think i'm being dumb, you can tell me that.  We're friends (I like to think), I won't be offended.  On this I simply think you're wrong, building an elite O-line with two great players is worth the cost. 

I wouldn't say you're being dumb, I would say that you have a prejudice favoring the OL that's clouding your judgement on this one - as a lot of people here do. We've been posting together for a while now. I don't do the cocksure thing very often. It just so happens that on this one, I'm extremely confident he won't take Sewell. It's just poor roster management. You can build an elite OL with using the #2 pick there this year, and that's what he'll be looking to do. 

9 minutes ago, Warfish said:

On this we agree.  If he grades or values a Fields, or Wilson, or whomever very highly, we should presume (till shown otherwise) that J.D. will in fact select a QB at #2.  What we can't know as yet is how he (J.D.) graded Darnold as of now vs. these other guys, and if he (J.D.) feels any 'pressure' by fans, media or ownership to dump Sam for someone new, even if he (J.D.) thinks Darnold is a better QB than these new kids.  Just no way to know.

His opinion on Darnold is an interesting wildcard. He probably likes him a lot more than this forum, but I don't know if that'll be enough. The speculation is all over the place right now but things should (hopefully) come a little more into focus once we see who the new head coach is, and what kind of offense he wants to run. 

I could make the argument either way on taking a QB at #2. The new coach could come in and absolutely love one of these prospects and want to take him, and if Douglas hired the guy, that's what he'll do: take the QB. If the coach and GM don't love the QBs, and the coach thinks there might be something salvageable about Sam, they could go into next year with Darnold and a legitimate starting QB to push/replace him. If that's the move, then trading down is also the move. The QB would still likely be an issue the following year, and he'll want the extra picks in 2022 (and possibly 2023) to address it if he needs to. 

[Fantasy Island]

1 hour ago, CanadaSteve said:

We should wait and see if when he plays, don't you think?

 

Normally yes, but the painful memory of Hackenberg still resides.

[Rangers9]

I wouldn't draft a Qb unless if for some crazy reason Lawrence is on the board at 2 (and he won't be). I'd try to trade down if not take Sewell or Devota Smith. Not sure Qb hungry teams are willing to give up that much to trade up for one of the other Qbs. At Qb in 2021 I'd stick with Darnold. 

[CanadaSteve]

1 hour ago, Fantasy Island said:

Normally yes, but the painful memory of Hackenberg still resides.

COMPLETELY understand.  There are many, many painful memories of GM QB choices for this franchise.  

Lets hope JD is different.  At least he used a 4th on a guy who was thought of quite highly as a later round prospect (estimated between 3rd - 5th round by most things I read), rather than taking a QB with a 2nd round pick who some were considering a UFA.

[Wonderboy]

1 hour ago, slats said:

His opinion on Darnold is an interesting wildcard. He probably likes him a lot more than this forum, but I don't know if that'll be enough. The speculation is all over the place right now but things should (hopefully) come a little more into focus once we see who the new head coach is, and what kind of offense he wants to run. 

I could make the argument either way on taking a QB at #2. The new coach could come in and absolutely love one of these prospects and want to take him, and if Douglas hired the guy, that's what he'll do: take the QB. If the coach and GM don't love the QBs, and the coach thinks there might be something salvageable about Sam, they could go into next year with Darnold and a legitimate starting QB to push/replace him. If that's the move, then trading down is also the move. The QB would still likely be an issue the following year, and he'll want the extra picks in 2022 (and possibly 2023) to address it if he needs to. 

I hope JD likes Darnold as much as he did Jamal Adams. Gave him false hope he'd make him a Jet for life.  He's spouted how he will get Darnold the protection he needs. He's working on that. Doesn't guarantee anything.   JD is a riveboat gambler and doesn't show his cards. Cant believe a thing he says. JD doesn't have to take a QB @ 2. HE could trade back with Atlanta or Cincy (maybe even with both) and pass on this QB class.  Problem would be he'd end up wasting picks, ala Macc, in next year's draft if he sticks with Darnold and cuts ties with him in 2022. 

[dcJet]

Taking Sewell is Macc'ish.  

It's taking the low-risk, sure-starter, low-bust-potential, consensus-BPA-so-I-can-save-my-ass-pick-at-a-non-premium-position.

And we crucified Macc when he made those kind of picks and rightly so.

 

[Philc1]

17 minutes ago, dcJet said:

Taking Sewell is Macc'ish.  

Interesting considering Mac never used a first or second rd pick on offensive line

[Fantasy Island]

1 hour ago, CanadaSteve said:

COMPLETELY understand.  There are many, many painful memories of GM QB choices for this franchise.  

Lets hope JD is different.  At least he used a 4th on a guy who was thought of quite highly as a later round prospect (estimated between 3rd - 5th round by most things I read), rather than taking a QB with a 2nd round pick who some were considering a UFA.n

Not playing him this year of all years speaks volumes IMO

[Fantasy Island]

42 minutes ago, dcJet said:

Taking Sewell is Macc'ish.  

It's taking the low-risk, sure-starter, low-bust-potential, consensus-BPA-so-I-can-save-my-ass-pick-at-a-non-premium-position.

And we crucified Macc when he made those kind of picks and rightly so.

 

OT not DT, big difference