Cimini on Status of Sam Darnold

[Untouchable]

2 minutes ago, derp said:

Pre-draft visits have historically been limited to 30 so that would be a monumental waste of an important resource if they’re not planning on taking a quarterback, particularly since they have draft capital spread around.

We’ve also seen literally every single year the Jets and every other team in the league set up pre-draft visits with players that they pass on multiple times in multiple rounds.

I don’t buy into much of anything pre-draft between February and late April.

[Paradis]

Emotions are still leading conversations. We’ll see what the brass thinks after a few weeks of reviewing 2020 film both of Sam and NCAA prospects... everyone in that building knows Sam’s misfortunes are largely a result of poor management/coaching.  There’s some dying sense of responsibility to fix him... time will tell if they can move on. 

[derp]

7 minutes ago, Untouchable said:

We’ve also seen literally every single year the Jets and every other team in the league set up pre-draft visits with players that they pass on multiple times in multiple rounds.

I don’t buy into much of anything pre-draft between February and late April.

Yes, teams do that with players - that’s kind of inevitable with 30 visits per team and roughly 8-9 picks per team - but not so much with positions. They tend to cluster them with when they’re interested in addressing the position. It’s not a hard and fast rule, but it works more often than it doesn’t and you can usually glean something from it.

[jetsons]

2 hours ago, 32EBoozer said:

Jets are open for business at #22. Let all come with hat in hand and a large dowry

. 

#2 ?

[32EBoozer]

1 minute ago, jetsons said:

#2 ?

Yes, I realized after your reaction that I double hit the 2. Thanks 

[Jet Nut]

5 hours ago, More Cowbell said:

If Schefter says it and says like he knows it as he did in that video, I give it a lot of weight. The fact that others are jumping on board just means they agree with him because of his solid record  on this stuff. 

I get what youre saying but he said it before we hired Saleh.  JD said the HC will be in on the decision.  Schefter knew nothing, there wasnt a leak, he was taking an educated guess

Schefter said it again the night Saleh's hiring was announced.  Schefter didnt get any inside info at 10:30 on Thursday night.

I would bet anything the decision hasnt been finalized at this point.  

[Untouchable]

1 minute ago, derp said:

Yes, teams do that with players - that’s kind of inevitable with 30 visits per team and roughly 8-9 picks per team - but not so much with positions. They tend to cluster them with when they’re interested in addressing the position. It’s not a hard and fast rule, but it works more often than it doesn’t and you can usually glean something from it.

Most of these teams already have their profiles for these guys in place.

Yeah, you might be able to learn a little more about a guy with a 4 hour personal visit instead of a 20-30 minute combine interview...but really, how much more?

I don’t give two sh*ts if this guy prefers pizza over tacos.

Watch the film, get a grasp of their personality (which no one is giving you a full glimpse of in a job interview, regardless of profession) and go from there.

[derp]

9 minutes ago, Untouchable said:

Most of these teams already have their profiles for these guys in place.

Yeah, you might be able to learn a little more about a guy with a 4 hour personal visit instead of a 20-30 minute combine interview...but really, how much more?

I don’t give two sh*ts if this guy prefers pizza over tacos.

Watch the film, get a grasp of their personality (which no one is giving you a full glimpse of in a job interview, regardless of profession) and go from there.

Yeah, they do have the profiles in place. And you can joke around about the value of the visits all you want - maybe teams even make mistakes because of them.

But regardless of your perspective on the importance of the visits, teams have historically valued them, which was the initial point you disagreed with.

[MykePM]

1 hour ago, Untouchable said:

It’s possible, but I highly doubt it.

I still say the Jets are either A.) Rolling with Darnold and trading down or B.) Taking Wilson/Fields at #2 and trading Darnold to the highest bidder.

Another possibility that could play out would be the best of both worlds - trade down and still have a shot at Wilson or Fields.  If the Jets trade down with the Falcons at 4 or the Bengals at 5, they could get some nice picks in return and one of the two might still be on the board when it's time to turn in their card.  If they think highly enough of the QB that's available, they could pivot their plans and take him, and still have time to trade Darnold before round 2 or 3, having already gotten the extra picks.  

The only question in this scenario would be whether they'd be inclined, if they had the opportunity, to trade down again to a QB-needy team to accrue even more picks, and keep their plans to hold onto Sam.  A nice quandary to have, I guess.

[football guy]

1 hour ago, maury77 said:

2 things that I have learned about Douglas so far: the organization has less leaks than in the past (so I doubt anyone outside the building knows much)

It’s a good thing I laid the good pipe when I did 

 

you’re right on the rest though. He’s not making any explicit commitments but based on film study it sounds like he’s not impressed enough to take either of these guys before Darnold nor has he been convinced that either was a better prospect. 

I think the biggest thing they will do these next 2 months is study Darnold and try to figure out what he may have missed in his original eval/what his ceiling is/what his value is.

 

as I said a week or so ago, I think there’s a better chance they trade Darnold and still trade down from #2 than trade Darnold and take a QB at #2. These things can change and the coach has a say, but that’s just what I heard as of last week

[addage]

3 hours ago, Dcat said:

Everyone at 1 Jets Drive will be talking up Darnold for the next 2 months for obvious reasons.  You all really have to temper the enthusiasm for his staying.   Anyone who reads too much into any Darnold praise from them via guys like Schefter...  well just maybe you need to realize that he is being fed stuff for a reason.   Blink.  Darnold could be gone just like that.

Look, all of these options are viable so any can be what eventually plays out.

But I don't think I hear all that much praise for Darnold.  It's been a very bad year.  I hear respect for him personally but no real endorsement of his play.  Potential doesn't count.

The debate is over the order in which the necessary steps are taken.  QB first or general roster building first.  We have draft capital, but we have many more holes.

So, do you leverage the #2 pick for additional top 100 picks this year or next?  Do you swing for the fences by drafting a QB now?  

JD and team will resolve all that in time.  I'm sure they are shaking their heads saying that you can't make these decisions for another couple of months and that there will be much more info available then.  So relax and enjoy the process.

[56mehl56]

1 hour ago, Untouchable said:

Zach Wilson was considered to be a 3rd round pick until a couple of months ago and has since shot up draft boards.

Identical to Mayfield during his last season at Oklahoma.

Fields has always been considered big time, but if those games against Indiana and Northwestern (as well as the Natty, despite being banged up) didn’t leave a bad taste in your mouth, well, I don’t know what to tell you.

Some of you guys just seem so desperate to move on from Darnold that you’ll seemingly buy into nearly any of these guys as the franchise savior.

There is even a contingent that wants Trey Lance for Christ sake. A dude with less than 20 starts for a Div II powerhouse. And unless you live in Fargo, I doubt anyone has seen much if anything of the kid outside of YouTube highlights.

Fields was rated just as high as Lawrence going into college.

People are bashing him for a mediocre game against Indiana where he accounted for 3 tds and his team won. They bash him for a NW game where Fitzgerald and staffs gameplan was to stop the pass at all costs , so much so that they let an OSU rb run for over 300+ yards. And finally they bash him for the championship game where he played against a juggernaut Bama team and played the game with bad ribs/hip. 

On the flip side no one questions Lawrence's performance against OSU thus year or LSU last year.

And to your Lance point. No one knows him like no one knew Josh Allen. 

[Untouchable]

23 minutes ago, 56mehl56 said:

Fields was rated just as high as Lawrence going into college.

People are bashing him for a mediocre game against Indiana where he accounted for 3 tds and his team won. They bash him for a NW game where Fitzgerald and staffs gameplan was to stop the pass at all costs , so much so that they let an OSU rb run for over 300+ yards. And finally they bash him for the championship game where he played against a juggernaut Bama team and played the game with bad ribs/hip. 

On the flip side no one questions Lawrence's performance against OSU thus year or LSU last year.

And to your Lance point. No one knows him like no one knew Josh Allen. 

Yes, I know that Fields has been only #2 to Lawrence dating back to their HS days.

But Lawrence has literally every trait that you could want. If you were designing a QB in a laboratory, Lawrence is who you’d end up with.

6’6, rocket arm, fantastic anticipation and awareness, elite level leadership qualities, elite level work ethic and drive, only two losses dating back to middle school...what more do you want?

At the very least, you’re talking about the best QB prospect since Andrew Luck, far surpassing Darnold who I was head over heels with 3 years ago.

Yet some want to pretend that guys like Fields and Wilson are on the same tier...lol.

Please.

As for Lance and Allen, there were certainly more Wyoming games broadcast than NDSU games.

Everyone besides myself and a select few others like @LAD_Brooklyn wanted to piss all over the kid because of a lackluster completion percentage, but some of us saw those batsh*t insane, drop your jaw physical traits that were literally once in a lifetime if you could get him to put it all together.

People routinely told us daily that we were nuts for preferring him over a goofy douchebag like Mayfield.

Now?

I might take Allen over any QB in the league not named Patrick Mahomes longterm. 

[Lith]

1 hour ago, addage said:

So, do you leverage the #2 pick for additional top 100 picks this year or next?  Do you swing for the fences by drafting a QB now? 

Answer to this question, imo, depends solely on what you think of the QBs.  If you believe in Fields/Wilson, think either guy has potential to be a top 10 NFL QB, then take the QB and build around him.  If you don't like the QBs, then don't reach.  Trade back, build the team and figure out the QB position later. 

[ryu79]

2 hours ago, football guy said:

It’s a good thing I laid the good pipe when I did 

 

you’re right on the rest though. He’s not making any explicit commitments but based on film study it sounds like he’s not impressed enough to take either of these guys before Darnold nor has he been convinced that either was a better prospect. 

I think the biggest thing they will do these next 2 months is study Darnold and try to figure out what he may have missed in his original eval/what his ceiling is/what his value is.

 

as I said a week or so ago, I think there’s a better chance they trade Darnold and still trade down from #2 than trade Darnold and take a QB at #2. These things can change and the coach has a say, but that’s just what I heard as of last week

I'll take this as true AND still think this is open ended still because Douglas strikes me as the type that will do his hw - meet and work out all these kids and seriously consider Saleh and Lafleur's input on it. 

This is me, for once, believing in the professionalism of our mgmt.

[Wonderboy]

5 hours ago, football guy said:

That’s because you’re ignorant

You didn't put a period after your sentence. Now that's ignorant!  Obviously, you're not an English major.

[bitonti]

5 hours ago, 56mehl56 said:

So what's worse Orlando Pace or Deshaun Watson/Mahomes ? No one but you even brings up Pace , most Jet fans point out missing on the Qb's - Why ?    Because its the most important position on the field. 

If Fields and Wilson are really Mahomes / Watson then the Jets can trade down to 10 or 12 where guys like that go 

This is a value discussion. I like those dudes. Not at 2. It's a super premium pick. 

 

[Dcat]

8 hours ago, addage said:

Look, all of these options are viable so any can be what eventually plays out.

But I don't think I hear all that much praise for Darnold.  It's been a very bad year.  I hear respect for him personally but no real endorsement of his play.  Potential doesn't count.

The debate is over the order in which the necessary steps are taken.  QB first or general roster building first.  We have draft capital, but we have many more holes.

So, do you leverage the #2 pick for additional top 100 picks this year or next?  Do you swing for the fences by drafting a QB now?  

JD and team will resolve all that in time.  I'm sure they are shaking their heads saying that you can't make these decisions for another couple of months and that there will be much more info available then.  So relax and enjoy the process.

When Sheffield reports that Saleh is leaning towards keeping Darnold and when others say things like "perfect fit" for Darnold... that eminates from the Jets, no doubt.  All I'm saying is that you can expect much more drivel like that from the press because that's what the jets will feed them to boost Darnold's value.  It has already begun. 

[ScouserJet]

Still think it’s a smokescreen to try and get some picks, hoping someone will bite desperate for Sewell.

You drum up interest and now “we don’t want a QB”... Sewell, Chase suitors May force their hand, maybe even QB3 admirers.

[ZachEY]

17 hours ago, football guy said:

I don’t know why this is so hard for fans to understand. The Jets are open minded about how to approach the QB position. The front office and coaching staff are aligned in thinking that Sam Darnold is a legitimate QB who has the potential to be an upper enchelon quarterback. They feel the system is a terrific fit for him, and they love his upside. At the same time, they acknowledge they’re in position to take the 2nd best QB in the draft and have him under contract cheaply for 4 years. 

What they will decide is what is better for the TEAM: QB Darnold + value of #2 (trade) OR QB #2 + value of Darnold (trade). 

I’d say there’s a 75% chance they determine bringing Darnold back and trading the pick will be the best way to build the team for a variety of reasons I’ve outlined the past month—some having to do with Darnold but most not.

I think you may be confusing difficulty in understanding with disappointment in this particular outcome.

That the front office and coaching staff are aligned in believing that Sam Darnold, the performance-based, worst QB in the NFL after 3 years, is “a legitimate QB with the potential to be an upper echelon QB” is extremely believable.  In fact, as Jets fans for a long time, the team passing on upgrading the QB position because of the misguided belief that our terrible current QB is actually good, should be the most believable outcome.

Still, not going to be any less upset about now, nor hopeful something will change, than when they did it with Pennington or Sanchez or Smith or Hackenberg.

But sure, yeah, this time the bad QB will be good, because of the 2017 Rose Bowl  or that one pretty good game in a loss over two years ago.

[pajet]

18 hours ago, Jetlife33 said:

Yeah, I can’t blame you. Nothing is guaranteed with this franchise. 

Disagree....disappointment is guaranteed.

[slats]

20 hours ago, football guy said:

I don’t know why this is so hard for fans to understand. The Jets are open minded about how to approach the QB position. The front office and coaching staff are aligned in thinking that Sam Darnold is a legitimate QB who has the potential to be an upper enchelon quarterback. They feel the system is a terrific fit for him, and they love his upside. At the same time, they acknowledge they’re in position to take the 2nd best QB in the draft and have him under contract cheaply for 4 years. 

What they will decide is what is better for the TEAM: QB Darnold + value of #2 (trade) OR QB #2 + value of Darnold (trade). 

I’d say there’s a 75% chance they determine bringing Darnold back and trading the pick will be the best way to build the team for a variety of reasons I’ve outlined the past month—some having to do with Darnold but most not.

I'm on board with this. 

I understand the very real possibility that they don't see any of the QBs as an obvious upgrade to Darnold, and that neither Douglas nor Saleh would be very excited to hitch their wagon to a young signal caller they don't completely buy in to. Joe Douglas can trade down from #2 (and potentially add extra first rounders in the 2022 & 2023 drafts), draft the building blocks for the team he and Saleh plan to build, and have Saleh's first year be more about building his program than developing another rookie QB. 

I say that believing that there's no way I think they'll head into the season without a viable Plan B at QB. I like Winston for the role because he's the anti-Darnold tossing the ball downfield, possession be damned! I don't need Sam learning new ways to throw interceptions, but I do like the way Winston always intends to move the football. 

*One caveat: I have not yet ruled out the possibility that the Jets strong belief in Sam Darnold is just a ploy to keep his trade value as high as possible, and to disguise their plans in the draft. 

[C Mart]

Jets notes: Robert Saleh and presumptive OC Mike LaFleur have watched a lot of Sam Darnold tape and they believe he has untapped potential...Hearing former Jags and Bills LB Paul Posluszny is being considered for a staff position — a Saleh favorite from JAX days...No word on DC. Frank Bush, Jets' interim DC, worked with Saleh in HOU, but a reunion doesn't seem likely. It'll be interesting to see if Saleh calls the defensive plays. It's a possibility, I'm told.

Rich Cimini, ESPN Staff Writer

[Matt39]

1 minute ago, C Mart said:

Jets notes: Robert Saleh and presumptive OC Mike LaFleur have watched a lot of Sam Darnold tape and they believe he has untapped potential...Hearing former Jags and Bills LB Paul Posluszny is being considered for a staff position — a Saleh favorite from JAX days...No word on DC. Frank Bush, Jets' interim DC, worked with Saleh in HOU, but a reunion doesn't seem likely. It'll be interesting to see if Saleh calls the defensive plays. It's a possibility, I'm told.

Rich Cimini, ESPN Staff Writer

Untapped potential isnt a thing once you're in the NFL. Especially 3 years in. I hate this word but the Jets are gaslighting us here.

[Augustiniak]

1 minute ago, Matt39 said:

Untapped potential isnt a thing once you're in the NFL. Especially 3 years in. I hate this word but the Jets are gaslighting us here.

We are going to get a major sell job on darnold up until the moment he’s traded in April.  And there’s nothing wrong with this.

[section314]

13 hours ago, football guy said:

It’s a good thing I laid the good pipe when I did 

 

you’re right on the rest though. He’s not making any explicit commitments but based on film study it sounds like he’s not impressed enough to take either of these guys before Darnold nor has he been convinced that either was a better prospect. 

I think the biggest thing they will do these next 2 months is study Darnold and try to figure out what he may have missed in his original eval/what his ceiling is/what his value is.

 

as I said a week or so ago, I think there’s a better chance they trade Darnold and still trade down from #2 than trade Darnold and take a QB at #2. These things can change and the coach has a say, but that’s just what I heard as of last week

Interesting.  I still think that James Morgan is a much bigger part of the future of this team than most people believe. That, or they think that a QB they really like will drop.

[Warfish]

20 hours ago, football guy said:

I don’t know why this is so hard for fans to understand. The Jets are open minded about how to approach the QB position. The front office and coaching staff are aligned in thinking that Sam Darnold is a legitimate QB who has the potential to be an upper enchelon quarterback. They feel the system is a terrific fit for him, and they love his upside. At the same time, they acknowledge they’re in position to take the 2nd best QB in the draft and have him under contract cheaply for 4 years. 

What they will decide is what is better for the TEAM: QB Darnold + value of #2 (trade) OR QB #2 + value of Darnold (trade). 

I’d say there’s a 75% chance they determine bringing Darnold back and trading the pick will be the best way to build the team for a variety of reasons I’ve outlined the past month—some having to do with Darnold but most not.

I'll echo my friend @TeddEY, I don't think it's a lack of understanding at all, but an issue of disagreement and disappointment. 

We all have issues like this that just rile us up.  For example, if we spend both 2021 first round picks on Defense, I will likely explode on the forum in a furious fusilade of fury.  I would "understand" why JD/Saleh might do that, but I would very strongly disagree and be very disappointed if they did.

Today, Sam Darnold is unquestionably the worst starting QB in the NFL.  This isn't a debate, really.  Now, JD and Saleh might think he can recovered, the old adage of "oh, that was the last guys fault, I CAN FIX IT!" has always been a thing in the NFL.  And probably always will be.  

But it's also the words on many a fired Head Coach's professional tombstone "Here lies X's career, he thought he could fix the bad QB".

With all that said......

I tend to think on this like @slats above on this topic.  Quoting the important bits:

Quote

 

I understand the very real possibility that they don't see any of the QBs as an obvious upgrade to Darnold, and that neither Douglas nor Saleh would be very excited to hitch their wagon to a young signal caller they don't completely buy in to. Joe Douglas can trade down from #2 (and potentially add extra first rounders in the 2022 & 2023 drafts), draft the building blocks for the team he and Saleh plan to build, and have Saleh's first year be more about building his program than developing another rookie QB. 

I say that believing that there's no way I think they'll head into the season without a viable Plan B at QB. 

*One caveat: I have not yet ruled out the possibility that the Jets strong belief in Sam Darnold is just a ploy to keep his trade value as high as possible, and to disguise their plans in the draft. 

 

I agree with all of this.  You'll note I've removed his "Plan B" at QB, as I have alternate preferences (In my case, I would not trade or sign a Veteran, I would likely prefer to spend a mid-round pick on a player such as Trask, and let Danold, Trask and Morgan all compete in a fair, open competition in camp 2021.  But I hate signing castoff veterans more than most people do, in fairness).

Arguing the Pro-Darnold idea is going to be unpopular.  This site is full of homers who bought in 100% to Sam the Savior, Suck for Sam, etc., and how they feel like idiots and (as they always do) have sung 180 degrees to pretend they never likes Sam and never wanted him and think he's the worst ever.  And Sam's doubters from the start clearly haven't seen much to buy in.  So you have most of the fanbase against Sam Pt. 4, and wanting something else.  Arguing the (perhaps right, perhaps logical) "keep Sam" side will be an uphill battle. 

Even if it is possibly the right call at this moment.

[Scott Dierking]

3 minutes ago, Warfish said:

I'll echo my friend @TeddEY, I don't think it's a lack of understanding at all, but an issue of disagreement and disappointment. 

We all have issues like this that just rile us up.  For example, if we spend both 2021 first round picks on Defense, I will likely explode on the forum in a furious fusilade of fury.  I would "understand" why JD/Saleh might do that, but I would very strongly disagree and be very disappointed if they did.

Today, Sam Darnold is unquestionably the worst starting QB in the NFL.  This isn't a debate, really.  Now, JD and Saleh might think he can recovered, the old adage of "oh, that was the last guys fault, I CAN FIX IT!" has always been a thing in the NFL.  And probably always will be.  

But it's also the words on many a fired Head Coach's professional tombstone "Here lies X's career, he thought he could fix the bad QB".

With all that said......

I tend to think on this like @slats above on this topic.  Quoting the important bits:

I agree with all of this.  You'll note I've removed his "Plan B" at QB, as I have alternate preferences (In my case, I would not trade or sign a Veteran, I would likely prefer to spend a mid-round pick on a player such as Trask, and let Danold, Trask and Morgan all compete in a fair, open competition in camp 2021.  But I hate signing castoff veterans more than most people do, in fairness).

Arguing the Pro-Darnold idea is going to be unpopular.  This site is full of homers who bought in 100% to Sam the Savior, Suck for Sam, etc., and how they feel like idiots and (as they always do) have sung 180 degrees to pretend they never likes Sam and never wanted him and think he's the worst ever.  And Sam's doubters from the start clearly haven't seen much to buy in.  So you have most of the fanbase against Sam Pt. 4, and wanting something else.  Arguing the (perhaps right, perhaps logical) "keep Sam" side will be an uphill battle. 

Even if it is possibly the right call at this moment.

I understand everything you say, but if they went defense with the first 2 picks, and then the team proceeded to go 10-6 in year 1, would you still be "furious"?

Bottom line of this is, there are many different ways to build a team. Just because the people in charge do not see it the same way any one of us individually do, does not mean it is the wrong plan.

[Joe W. Namath]

14 minutes ago, section314 said:

Interesting.  I still think that James Morgan is a much bigger part of the future of this team than most people believe. That, or they think that a QB they really like will drop.

This is very interesting.  How do any of us know what douglas thinks of Morgan?

I too have a feeling this kid is going to play some qb for us next year.

[32EBoozer]

14 minutes ago, Scott Dierking said:

I understand everything you say, but if they went defense with the first 2 picks, and then the team proceeded to go 10-6 in year 1, would you still be "furious"?

Bottom line of this is, there are many different ways to build a team. Just because the people in charge do not see it the same way any one of us individually do, does not mean it is the wrong plan.

Agreed. I think Saleh and JD believe you start in the trenches. That said, if we Are moving to a 43 defense we need an edge badly. We also need a lock down CB badly. 
 

On offense, we have a franchise left tackle a pretty good right tackle and nothing in the middle. We need a starting center in the draft. We also need another starting wide receiver from the draft.

I believe this will be the focus in FA and the draft. Sprinkle in some offensive weapons and we could be a 6-8 win team next year.
Depressing- Yes: Progress- Yes

Predictor of our future success? IDK

Edited January 17, 2021 by 32EBoozer

[Warfish]

17 minutes ago, Scott Dierking said:

I understand everything you say, but if they went defense with the first 2 picks, and then the team proceeded to go 10-6 in year 1, would you still be "furious"?

I'd be quite happy with the result, but I'd also need to know where our Offense finished up to really judge.

#5 Defense with #31 offense, a single successful year is luck, not a well-built long-term consistent competitor.  

But yeah, I'd love 10-6 at this point.  But I'd like a 10-6 with a top 15 Offense AND top 15 Defense supporting it.

Quote

Bottom line of this is, there are many different ways to build a team. Just because the people in charge do not see it the same way any one of us individually do, does not mean it is the wrong plan.

I believe the "build around an elite Defense" is an outdated concept, the same way "build around an elite Running Back and Running Attack" is generally an outdated concept.

And to be very clear:  There are no objective "right or wrongs" in this, there is only subjective beliefs and cold, hard results.

[section314]

1 minute ago, Joe W. Namath said:

This is very interesting.  How do any of us know what douglas thinks of Morgan?

I too have a feeling this kid is going to play some qb for us next year.

There is just something odd about the way his first year went. Never heard boo about him in practice. Contrast that with Hack. Even though the team kept saying Hack wasn't ready for game action yet, it didn't stop the stuff coming out from "unnamed " sources or beat writers on just how terrible he looked in practice. Never heard a peep like that last year about Morgan. Only thing I even remember was Gase saying that because of Covid, lack of practice, and no preseason, that it wouldn't be fair to put him in.  I've heard that Morgan fits the bill for what JD looks for in QB's.....Good pocket passer, strong arm, smart, quick on his progressions, and low turnover prone. Think his last two years he was 40tds, 12 Int's. Also. I remember on Movin the Chains last year, right before the draft. Pat Kirwin had Morgan as his offensive sleeper gem in the draft. Said he'd go anywhere from late 3rd to 5th round, and other than the big 3( Burrow, Tua and Herbert) was the best QB in the draft.

[Warfish]

I'd caution my friends from reading too much into Captain Morgan.  He's a mid/late-round project QB. 

He's not a secret-Brady just waiting to be unleashed.

Well, the odds very strongly say he's not that. 

I'm looking forward to seeing him play in camp and preseason, but any idea that he's a possible #1 in 2021.....lets not get ahead of ourselves.

[section314]

26 minutes ago, Warfish said:

I'll echo my friend @TeddEY, I don't think it's a lack of understanding at all, but an issue of disagreement and disappointment. 

We all have issues like this that just rile us up.  For example, if we spend both 2021 first round picks on Defense, I will likely explode on the forum in a furious fusilade of fury.  I would "understand" why JD/Saleh might do that, but I would very strongly disagree and be very disappointed if they did.

Today, Sam Darnold is unquestionably the worst starting QB in the NFL.  This isn't a debate, really.  Now, JD and Saleh might think he can recovered, the old adage of "oh, that was the last guys fault, I CAN FIX IT!" has always been a thing in the NFL.  And probably always will be.  

But it's also the words on many a fired Head Coach's professional tombstone "Here lies X's career, he thought he could fix the bad QB".

With all that said......

I tend to think on this like @slats above on this topic.  Quoting the important bits:

I agree with all of this.  You'll note I've removed his "Plan B" at QB, as I have alternate preferences (In my case, I would not trade or sign a Veteran, I would likely prefer to spend a mid-round pick on a player such as Trask, and let Danold, Trask and Morgan all compete in a fair, open competition in camp 2021.  But I hate signing castoff veterans more than most people do, in fairness).

Arguing the Pro-Darnold idea is going to be unpopular.  This site is full of homers who bought in 100% to Sam the Savior, Suck for Sam, etc., and how they feel like idiots and (as they always do) have sung 180 degrees to pretend they never likes Sam and never wanted him and think he's the worst ever.  And Sam's doubters from the start clearly haven't seen much to buy in.  So you have most of the fanbase against Sam Pt. 4, and wanting something else.  Arguing the (perhaps right, perhaps logical) "keep Sam" side will be an uphill battle. 

Even if it is possibly the right call at this moment.

It's something that seems to be innate in every coach's DNA.

[Warfish]

3 minutes ago, section314 said:

It's something that seems to be innate in every coach's DNA.

Ego.

You don't rise to that level in Sports, as a player or as a coach, without a massive type-A personality, competitive "I'm better than the last guy" attitude and Ego.