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35 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

So the thought process is - I would draft a QB at 6-15 to commit my team to three years of this QB - make him the face and future of my franchise..

but not at 2?

Honestly, any first round QB you take, you’re all in on....Doesn’t matter where in the round you take him.  Take him at 2 and don’t look back.  You don’t mess around with the QB position, you don’t roll the dice.  You don’t hope you get lucky.

You trust your GM, Scouts and coaches and pick the guy you think has the best chance to become a FQB.

I wasn't outlining a process for picking QB's in the 1st round, i was specifically talking about Wilson.

IMO, he does not look like he is worthy of that selection. Going from Lawrence at 1, to Wilson at 2 is a massive drop off. Kid has some talent but the injuries scare me and he has a small frame, he needs to add some mass or else he will get hurt again sooner than later. If your comfortable taking that at 2 cool, but to me the risk of picking Wilson at 2 is much higher than taking Fields, trading for Watson, trading back or rolling with Sam for another year. JD doesn't strike me like the type to take that risk in his 2nd draft.

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If Zach Morris were a QB, it would be this guy. Go Bayside!  Beat Valley!

He looks like a prepubescent Dolph Lundgren.

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32 minutes ago, nycdan said:

I seriously cannot believe the level to which the 'Cult of Wilson' has risen on this board.  One-year wonder in a lesser conference and that one year was in a COVID-impacted season.  The toughest opponent he faced was Sun Belt powerhouse (yes that's sarcastic) Coastal Carolina and they made him look pedestrian.

This kid has tools, but he could be a complete mirage.  What has he done that we didn't see from guys like Geno Smith.  And before you get all uppity about that comp, go back and look at Geno's last year in college.  And Geno actually had 3 good years to Wilson's one. 

There is no way I consider Wilson over Fields based on the sample size.

And there is the problem with evaluating QB's.

You take QB's based on their skill-sets - you need to block out all the other noise.  How does their skill-set translate to the NFL.

I'm not sure why Geno has anything to do with Wilson but they are completely different prospects.

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2 hours ago, nycdan said:

I seriously cannot believe the level to which the 'Cult of Wilson' has risen on this board.  One-year wonder in a lesser conference and that one year was in a COVID-impacted season.  The toughest opponent he faced was Sun Belt powerhouse (yes that's sarcastic) Coastal Carolina and they made him look pedestrian.

This kid has tools, but he could be a complete mirage.  What has he done that we didn't see from guys like Geno Smith.  And before you get all uppity about that comp, go back and look at Geno's last year in college.  And Geno actually had 3 good years to Wilson's one. 

There is no way I consider Wilson over Fields based on the sample size.

I believe it’s more of a, moving on from the worst qb to a young talented one, sort of thing. Not a cult. There’s a reason he’s being talked about at #2 and not the 2nd round like Geno was. 

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4 hours ago, MindOverMatter said:

Ideally anywhere from 6-15.

If JD manages a trade back to lets say around 6-7 and the board falls in the Jets favor with Wilson sitting there, i'd be cool with drafting him. But not at 2, no thanks.

I heard this story before. Only it was about Mahomes and the Jets sitting at 6. Maybe a trade back, they said.

im not a scout or pretend to be by watching YouTube clips but if JD and ML believe in this kid you pick him at #2 and don’t look back. 

 

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7 hours ago, shuler82 said:

I heard this story before. Only it was about Mahomes and the Jets sitting at 6. Maybe a trade back, they said.

im not a scout or pretend to be by watching YouTube clips but if JD and ML believe in this kid you pick him at #2 and don’t look back. 

 

I heard this story before too, comparing Wilson to Mahomes of all people is laughable. Wilson is like a super poor mans version of Mahomes, and you want to draft him at 2....

I'll take Fields, trade for Watson, trade back, or ride it out with Sam for another year before i draft Wilson at 2. The Jets most valuable asset right now is the 2nd overall pick, we can't F it up by drafting a QB with two Labrum surgeries already.

PASS.

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13 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

Of course it’s a highlight reel - but to come away with - I’m worried because he made good plays that wouldn’t work in the NFL - isn’t being fair.

Don’t look at the TD’s but look at the things that can’t change regardless of highlight reel or competition....

look at his feet 

look at his release

look at his arm strength

 look at the way he’s almost never locked in on a receiver.  He seems to be always looking another way before he turns his head and fires.

To a lesser degree his accuracy - yes guys being open can effect that but the ball does seem to be going exactly where he wants.

The guy is a legitimate top NFL prospect.  You can agree with that or not but we should stop pretending that taking him at 2 would be some type of joke.

Not only that but he’s not surrounded by amazing talent, if anything he’s making a lot of throws to WR’s who are not open which is probably why those throws look risky. You can say those are risky throws that get picked off in the NFL or you can marvel at his ability to make throws that only an NFL calibre QB can make. 

There is some stat out there on him that he only threw 5 passes in 2020 that were considered ‘interceptable’ ....that’s extraordinary.....and of the 3 picks he did throw the Coastal Carolina pick was on an end of half deflected hail-mary!

The knock on him playing for BYU is often that he’s playing against a lower level of comp, but that also ignores the truth that he’s playing WITH a lower level of player. He’s having to pull rabbits out of hats with guys who largely won’t be troubling the NFL draft ever....his TE looks like a really interesting prospect but other than that it’s not like he’s throwing to Tee Higgins or DeVonta Smith with an All-America offensive line blocking for him or Travis Etienne/ Najee Harris piling up the yards on the ground.

He’s not a blemish free prospect, I want to hear more about the shoulder and whether it’s a genuine concern and I want to see how he checks in size wise but if those concerns can be allayed then I’d see no reason why he isn’t a top 5  pick in April.

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I don’t want any of these guys 

We’ve already lost out on the grand prize that was Trevor Lawrence.

So unless you’re going to bring in Watson...just stick with Darnold, move down from #2 to further add to the stockpile of picks over the next two years and build up the rest of the roster.

People are acting like Fields/Wilson are the last chance the Jets will ever have to draft a QB. It’s goofy.

If Darnold falls flat on his face in a system that fits him like a glove with an improved supporting cast, then we could be headed into next year with up to 3 1st round picks and dudes like Howell, Rattler, etc declaring for the draft.

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5 minutes ago, Untouchable said:

I don’t want any of these guys 

We’ve already lost out on the grand prize that was Trevor Lawrence.

So unless you’re going to bring in Watson...just stick with Darnold, move down from #2 to further add to the stockpile of picks over the next two years and build up the rest of the roster.

People are acting like Fields/Wilson are the last chance the Jets will ever have to draft a QB. It’s goofy.

If Darnold falls flat on his face in a system that fits him like a glove with an improved supporting cast, then we could be headed into next year with up to 3 1st round picks and dudes like Howell, Rattler, etc declaring for the draft.

We need a QB...if you don't have one you have to take one.  

It really is that simple.  Your logic is how we missed on Watson and Mahomes and ended up with Hackenberg and Geno.  Half-assing the QB position is not how you win in the NFL...  

You can't throw away another year by kicking the QB can down the road again.  Right now we don't have a QB, which means you take your highest rated QB in the draft.

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14 hours ago, Gibby said:

Omg!! Some of those throws scare me. Mainly because they’d be picked for sure in the NFL. Throwing late to the opposite side of the field? No way

Always found this amusing.  Why would they become INTs in the NFL?  Because the corners are better?  But arent the WRs better and offset each other compared to college?  

I really didnt see passes that scared me.  You make a highlight tape and can say the same thing about a lot of the passes into tight coverage. Whether its ZWilson or a Mahomes

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2 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

We need a QB...if you don't have one you have to take one.  

It really is that simple.  Your logic is how we missed on Watson and Mahomes and ended up with Hackenberg and Geno.  Half-assing the QB position is not how you win in the NFL...  

You can't throw away another year by kicking the QB can down the road again.  Right now we don't have a QB, which means you take your highest rated QB in the draft.

And your logic is how teams end up with Blake Bortles, Christian Ponder, etc.

You can absolutely kick the can down the road if you’re not sold on these QB’s.

Taking one just for the sake of taking one is stupid. Especially when you have a paper thin roster like we do.

Ever since we lost out on Lawrence, Jets fans have gone into total desperation mode and are now trying to convince themselves that there are 5 additional franchise QB’s in this draft. 

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13 hours ago, MindOverMatter said:

Ideally anywhere from 6-15.

If JD manages a trade back to lets say around 6-7 and the board falls in the Jets favor with Wilson sitting there, i'd be cool with drafting him. But not at 2, no thanks.

He'll be long gone by 6-15. 

You see a QB you think can lead your team, one you would take at six but say hard no at two?  You need a QB, you like one and your attitude is lets pass and if the board falls our way cool, draft him

Really?  LOL

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4 minutes ago, Untouchable said:

And your logic is how teams end up with Blake Bortles, Christian Ponder, etc.

You can absolutely kick the can down the road if you’re not sold on these QB’s.

Taking one just for the sake of taking one is stupid. Especially when you have a paper thin roster like we do.

Ever since we lost out on Lawrence, Jets fans have gone into total desperation mode and are now trying to convince themselves that there are 5 additional franchise QB’s in this draft. 

Who said take one of the QBs even if youre not sold on one?  Of course they have to believe that either Fields or Wilson can become a FQB if theyre going to pick one at 2.  

But if you believe you cant ignore him because you pick 2nd.  Either one Is an acceptable pick at the 2nd spot. 

Mahomes was risky at 10, especially trading up and using assets.  If you believe you go for it.  Every player is a risk

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Nope, you need a QB.  Obviously you don't take a QB without the skill-set to be a FQB.  But there are 2 maybe 3 prospects that fall into the FQB skill-level prospects.

Wilson tops that list.  I haven't found a single, not one expert that says he's not a top prospect.  It's not like there's some secret prospect in next years draft that we're waiting on.  

You don't play games with your QB.

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5 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Who said take one of the QBs even if youre not sold on one?  Of course they have to believe that either Fields or Wilson can become a FQB if theyre going to pick one at 2.  

But if you believe you cant ignore him because you pick 2nd.  Either one Is an acceptable pick at the 2nd spot. 

Mahomes was risky at 10, especially trading up and using assets.  If you believe you go for it.  Every player is a risk

The Jaguars talked themselves into believing that Bortles was worth the 3rd pick. The Vikings talked themselves into believing that Ponder was worth the 12th pick. The list goes on and on. Desperate teams do stupid things.

Plenty of guys who know much more about this stuff than you or I or anyone else on this board have repeatedly said that the Jets should stick with Darnold over taking one of these lesser QB prospects 2nd overall. And that was before we committed to a Shanahan system that is essentially tailor made for the 23 year old QB already on our roster.

Many fans are just automatically assuming that the Jets are going to land the top WR set to hit the market, the top interior OL set to hit the market, etc.

We could be sitting here a month from now with guys like Robinson, Godwin, Golladay, Thuney, Scherff, etc all being retained by their current teams and not even sniffing FA.

Then what are you doing? Marching the next young QB into just about as sh*tty of a situation as we’ve saddled Darnold with.

We’ve even had dudes with inside info like @Mogglez and @football guy say that the most likely scenario is the Jets sticking with Darnold and continuing to build the roster. That the FO isn’t as keen on the Wilson’s, Fields’, or Lance’s as the fanbase. Many of which have never even really watched these guys outside of a handful of YouTube highlight videos.

If Douglas and Co. are sold on a Justin Fields or Zach Wilson, then of course they’ll take one of them.

But if you take one of these guys and they bust, then Douglas and Saleh’s tenures are already done for.

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9 minutes ago, Untouchable said:

The Jaguars talked themselves into believing that Bortles was worth the 3rd pick. The Vikings talked themselves into believing that Ponder was worth the 12th pick. The list goes on and on. Desperate teams do stupid things.

Plenty of guys who know much more about this stuff than you or I or anyone else on this board have repeatedly said that the Jets should stick with Darnold over taking one of these lesser QB prospects 2nd overall. And that was before we committed to a Shanahan system that is essentially tailor made for the 23 year old QB already on our roster.

Many fans are just automatically assuming that the Jets are going to land the top WR set to hit the market, the top interior OL set to hit the market, etc.

We could be sitting here a month from now with guys like Robinson, Godwin, Golladay, Thuney, Scherff, etc all being retained by their current teams and not even sniffing FA.

Then what are you doing? Marching the next young QB into just about as sh*tty of a situation as we’ve saddled Darnold with.

We’ve even had dudes with inside info like @Mogglez and @football guy say that the most likely scenario is the Jets sticking with Darnold and continuing to build the roster. That the FO isn’t as keen on the Wilson’s, Fields’, or Lance’s as the fanbase. Many of which have never even really watched these guys outside of a handful of YouTube highlight videos.

If Douglas and Co. are sold on a Justin Fields or Zach Wilson, then of course they’ll take one of them.

But if you take one of these guys and they bust, then Douglas and Saleh’s tenures are already done for.

So Bortles too high is the target, Mahomes at 10 isnt?  

Shocking, QBs picked high and low fail.  Most of the time.  A high percentage, even the ones who are picked to go high.  So?  You dont pick one then?  

None of this changes if they like Darnold enough to stick with him.  If not and theyre drafting a new QB it happens with the 2nd pick, not a trade down and keep your fingers crossed.  If by the draft you've decided to move on two gives you the pick of all the QBs not named Lawrence

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2 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

So Bortles too high is the target, Mahomes at 10 isnt?  

Shocking, QBs picked high and low fail.  Most of the time.  A high percentage, even the ones who are picked to go high.  So?  You dont pick one then?  

None of this changes if they like Darnold enough to stick with him.  If not and theyre drafting a new QB it happens with the 2nd pick, not a trade down and keep your fingers crossed.  If by the draft you've decided to move on two gives you the pick of all the QBs not named Lawrence

KC was already one of the most stacked teams in the league. They came to the conclusion that their functional yet limited QB was what was holding them back. So they took a swing on a high upside kid with every tool you could ask for and let him develop on the bench for a year under the tutelage of maybe the greatest offensive mind the league has seen since Bill Walsh.

How does that compare to the Jets present situation?

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Draft at 2 or is that ridiculous? How many spots would you drop to safely draft him
Wasn't there an article that said he a patriot fan and his entire family are fans of the pats? Is it worth the risk that he trys to pull an eli on us? I think to invest the number 2 pick on him you would really have to do the proper due diligence. You can argue that players will do whatever for the spotlight and the money trump's what team you grew up loving but pair that with the fact we hired a defensive head coach (well respected), have a terrible track record of developing quarterbacks (see darnold, geno, sanchez, ect.) Don't have great weapons or a fantastic offensive line (yet? Becton is a good start) and have the longest playoff drought in the league. It is hard to think that we would be a desirable place for a guy who grew up hating our team.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using JetNation.com mobile app

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51 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

He'll be long gone by 6-15. 

You see a QB you think can lead your team, one you would take at six but say hard no at two?  You need a QB, you like one and your attitude is lets pass and if the board falls our way cool, draft him

Really?  LOL

Good let him be someone else's failure. I never said i like him. I don't see a QB that can lead the Jets. Drafting him at 2 would be asinine, 2 major shoulder surgeries already, not to mention the kid looks like he's 15 and that's who we are rolling with? You guys are losing your minds. So many options at QB this year and this is who you latch onto? No thanks.

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1 minute ago, Untouchable said:

KC was already one of the most stacked teams in the league. They came to the conclusion that their functional yet limited QB was what was holding them back. So they took a swing on a high upside kid with every tool you could ask for and let him develop on the bench for a year under the tutelage of maybe the greatest offensive mind the league has seen since Bill Walsh.

How does that compare to the Jets present situation?

KC was a playoff team.  They used assets to move to #10 and risk it on a kid from a small school, running a gimmick offense.  

After you get past that part of your post and get to the QB holding the team back etc, etc, whats different if the Jets believe in one of the QB's?  It totally compares, I'm not passing on a potential FQG that I like because we may not contend until the next season.  

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Just now, Jet Nut said:

KC was a playoff team.  They used assets to move to #10 and risk it on a kid from a small school, running a gimmick offense.  

After you get past that part of your post and get to the QB holding the team back etc, etc, whats different if the Jets believe in one of the QB's?  It totally compares, I'm not passing on a potential FQG that I like because we may not contend until the next season.  

The difference is one is Mahomes the other is Wilson. Even without the hindsight of knowing how Mahomes turned out, he's still the superior prospect in almost every way.

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1 minute ago, MindOverMatter said:

Good let him be someone else's failure. I never said i like him. I don't see a QB that can lead the Jets. Drafting him at 2 would be asinine, 2 major shoulder surgeries already, not to mention the kid looks like he's 15 and that's who we are rolling with? You guys are losing your minds. So many options at QB this year and this is who you latch onto? No thanks.

Or not.  I hate the absolutes that some throw out there as fact as in its asinine to draft him at 2.  Hey, lets even exaggerate and claim hes had two major shoulder surgeries.  Ot that he looks 15, wow, there's a fact that usually only gets found out at the combine.  

What are all these QB options that are out there?  Sam, Fields or Wilson.  A dream trade with Houston?  And then?  

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1 minute ago, MindOverMatter said:

The difference is one is Mahomes the other is Wilson. Even without the hindsight of knowing how Mahomes turned out, he's still the superior prospect in almost every way.

Really?  No he wasnt, he had more than a few questions about his game.  Without the hindsight of how Mahomes turned out you would never make that comment.  

 

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3 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Or not.  I hate the absolutes that some throw out there as fact as in its asinine to draft him at 2.  Hey, lets even exaggerate and claim hes had two major shoulder surgeries.  Ot that he looks 15, wow, there's a fact that usually only gets found out at the combine.  

What are all these QB options that are out there?  Sam, Fields or Wilson.  A dream trade with Houston?  And then?  

You just named them. All are better options than drafting Wilson at 2. JD does not seem like a risk taker in my opinion. I would love Watsn but dont see that happening either, which leads me to believe that Wilson may get some consideration but wont be the pick.

Wilsons competition in college was laughable. Had all day to throw, only game i saw with decent pressure in his face was Coastal Carolina and he didnt look very impressive in that game. I said he looks 15 because he does and he better add some muscle or those cute scrambles he takes are going to get him killed. He has talent, but drafting him at 2 would be a mistake and would lead me to question JD as a GM.

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6 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Really?  No he wasnt, he had more than a few questions about his game.  Without the hindsight of how Mahomes turned out you would never make that comment.  

 

Cleaner medical evaluation, better competition, more athletically gifted.

In what way is Wilson a better prospect? Enlighten me.

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Like the Adams Deal...

The QB decision will be based on offer.

• What are teams offering for Darnold?

• What are they offering for #2?

• Measure those offers against your Wilson & Fields evals.

It’s going to be a fluid process.

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