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Just now, SAR I said:

I'm no longer in the business of defending Gase but we don't know that to be true.  The Jets are Siberia for NFL head coaches.  We ruined Pete Carroll and chased Bill Belichick away, we hired people like Herm Edwards and Rex Ryan, we're not exactly the best judge of NFL head coaching talent.

SAR I

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Jets fans are always "right" because the guy that gets fired never has a decent enough roster to succeed.  Not talking about Gase, talking about them all.  For once I'd love us to have a plan and stick to it no matter what happens.  Saleh is an energetic rah rah guy, but if he opens 0-4 or the team goes 2-14 I have no expectation that this fanbase will sit by quietly.  They never do.
SAR I

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13 minutes ago, SAR I said:

Jets fans are always "right" because the guy that gets fired never has a decent enough roster to succeed.  Not talking about Gase, talking about them all.  For once I'd love us to have a plan and stick to it no matter what happens.  Saleh is an energetic rah rah guy, but if he opens 0-4 or the team goes 2-14 I have no expectation that this fanbase will sit by quietly.  They never do.

SAR I

They might with a rookie QB.  As long as the rookie looks good he'll have a solid grace period.  Even if they don't win they'll be reason for optimism.

Now, if they stick with Darnold and start out slow - look out!

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I'm no longer in the business of defending Gase but we don't know that to be true.  The Jets are Siberia for NFL head coaches.  We ruined Pete Carroll and chased Bill Belichick away, we hired people like Herm Edwards and Rex Ryan, we're not exactly the best judge of NFL head coaching talent.
SAR I

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11 minutes ago, SAR I said:

I'm no longer in the business of defending Gase but we don't know that to be true.  The Jets are Siberia for NFL head coaches.  We ruined Pete Carroll and chased Bill Belichick away, we hired people like Herm Edwards and Rex Ryan, we're not exactly the best judge of NFL head coaching talent.

SAR I

This is correct.

Our GM's awfulness have heavily outweighed our HC's awfulness.

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2 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

They might with a rookie QB.  As long as the rookie looks good he'll have a solid grace period.  Even if they don't win they'll be reason for optimism.

Now, if they stick with Darnold and start out slow - look out!

firesaleh.com is available.

SAR I

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2 hours ago, SAR I said:

LOL.  The fanbase that started flying planes and buying billboards after their head coach here less than a month lost his quarterback to mono and half his roster to soft tissue injuries.  Yeah, they're down for a lethargic rebuild.  Sure.  Definitely.

SAR I

Didnt happen, even though it should have looking back.  

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44 minutes ago, SAR I said:

I'm no longer in the business of defending Gase but we don't know that to be true.  The Jets are Siberia for NFL head coaches.  We ruined Pete Carroll and chased Bill Belichick away, we hired people like Herm Edwards and Rex Ryan, we're not exactly the best judge of NFL head coaching talent.

SAR I

Agreed. We always end up with sloppy second and sloppy thirds.   I was shocked reading that article of why Saleh pick the Jets. Like wut?  We finally get to date the prom queen, lets see if it works. 

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5 minutes ago, The Crusher said:

Agreed. We always end up with sloppy second and sloppy thirds.   I was shocked reading that article of why Saleh pick the Jets. Like wut?  We finally get to date the prom queen, lets see if it works. 

Well the prom queen was apparently not thinking straight and probably intoxicated. 

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6 minutes ago, The Crusher said:

Agreed. We always end up with sloppy second and sloppy thirds.   I was shocked reading that article of why Saleh pick the Jets. Like wut?  We finally get to date the prom queen, lets see if it works. 

My fingers have never been crossed harder.

What vexes me is, if Gase was as bad as people say, why aren't we committing to Darnold and letting Saleh and LaFleur rehabilitate him?  If we take it to be 100% true that Adam Gase is one of the worst offensive minds in the history of the sport, why is it therefore not 100% true that all Sam Darnold needs is competent NFL coaching to restore him to greatness?

SAR I

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1 hour ago, Beerfish said:

We just have to trade the farm for a QB and we are in the playoffs.....or so i have been told.

Don't forget the CB!  Never mind the entire cap space we have would be used by these two players in year.  

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39 minutes ago, SAR I said:

My fingers have never been crossed harder.

What vexes me is, if Gase was as bad as people say, why aren't we committing to Darnold and letting Saleh and LaFleur rehabilitate him?  If we take it to be 100% true that Adam Gase is one of the worst offensive minds in the history of the sport, why is it therefore not 100% true that all Sam Darnold needs is competent NFL coaching to restore him to greatness?

SAR I

Because not every can be rehabilitated.  Sometimes a change of scenery is the only thing that might work.  

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10 hours ago, PepPep said:

JD is signed for another 5 seasons and Saleh signed a 5 year deal. A lot of Jet fans are talking about a slow re-build, trading down, adding draft picks, building through the draft, punting on a QB until next year or the year after that. I'm not so sure that's what we will see. I think we will see JD aggressively re-build so this team can compete ASAP. Drafting a QB THIS year at #2 or attempting a trade for Watson. Either way, they'll have a potential FQB for the next 5 seasons. 

I think JD will spend more in FA than people think and we should expect a sense of urgency, and positions like QB, O-line and Edge WILL be addressed long term sooner than later. If not this offseason then by next offseason. 

I would expect the Jets to attempt to build a contender in the next two offseasons and attempt to push for a title in the next 5. Otherwise, it's time to re-build again.

*Sidenote: Of course, JD and Saleh can get extensions. But you can imagine, if they don't put together a winning product, they be brought back.   

This is why it also makes sense to a QB (cough WILSON cough) this year.

Wilson will be in the 5 year rookie deal (4 plus the option) and within that time we can build around him without the QB megadeal.

GM • HC • QB all on the same timeline.

If it works, extend them all!

If it fails, all gone at once. No past baggage.

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5 hours ago, Joe W. Namath said:

They have 5 years but need to win now????????  This makes zero sense.  Having 5 means means they can be super patient and do this the right way....... 

Until they realize after 3 years the plan isn’t working out the way they hoped and we go full FA route to try and get another 5 year contract by going 9-6 but heavily leveraged. Get your QB (preferably one who has already proven himself in the NFL) and build quickly through the draft and targeted FA acquisitions 

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6 hours ago, Joe W. Namath said:

They have 5 years but need to win now????????  This makes zero sense.  Having 5 means means they can be super patient and do this the right way.

No one is waiting 5 years for this team to win nor does any rebuild take 5 years. If it takes 5 years you didn’t rebuild anything till year 3 or 4. Unacceptable 

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With the flexibility & options at the GM's disposal, this team should be in the playoffs by the 2022 season. Only acceptable reasons otherwise are just repeated bad luck at the end of 2-3 games and/or an impossible string of injuries.

This is a stupid notion that, because the Jets were 2-14 with horrid trash QBing and such a string of injuries, that therefore the realistic expectations should be incremental improvements to 5 (+/-1) wins in 2021 and 8 (+/-1) wins in 2022, and finally the playoffs with 11 (+/-1) wins in 2023. 

Who writes off the upcoming 2 seasons - 2 whole football seasons - as rebuilds? Sitting on our hands, because spending half of the $80MM in cap room we'll have (which will grow to nearly double that next year with the roster we'll start with in March 2021), is not the "smart" way of rebuilding. I can actually sympathize because that's the mentality this team has instilled, so while I'll mock it I don't fully blame the fans loyal to this trash heap. 

The only truly stupid band-aids (without the benefit of hindsight)? Spending like crazy with pretty much all of it on a combination of never-was younger players who happened to reach FA when we had cap room, and last-leg/about-to-be-has-been players whose best years are certainly behind them. In other words, exactly what "GM of the Year" Maccagnan did in 2015, where he created a 1-year window for 2+ years of spending, and did so without a good QB on the roster in the first place. 

What's ok is finding starters today who still have a realistic shot of still starting even in 2023, where if they don't the guaranteed $ will be up by then and we'll have made more than enough draft picks to confidently release them if needed. The way that works is, whichever ones are not worth keeping in year 3, you can cut ties to get that cap relief back (few non-QB UFAs get a fully guaranteed 3rd season). Since 2023 is the cowardly goal some feel is acceptable for the Jets, well hey -- by then most will be cuttable if they're no longer holding up so what's really lost? In the meantime we'll get to watch a competitive team who just might catch lightning sooner than expected.

I love draft picks, accumulating more draft picks, and am a big believer in building through the draft. But if any of you think we're realistically putting >10 good starters on the field from the upcoming 2 drafts, you're kidding yourselves. Never mind it'd be a decent idea if each had to beat out more than an obvious backup player to earn that starting job in the first place. Building through the draft doesn't therefore mean: sign nobody until Douglas has drafted another class or two. Nobody successful does that, and rightfully so. Just don't do that combo build with players who have 1 good season left in them if you're lucky.

A playoff/championship team needs veterans, too -- on the field, not just old "mentor" types who don't play much anymore unless enough children starters are injured. 

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16 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

If they draft a QB at 2 they'll buy themselves another year to get this thing going.  Next year is a young QB learning the ropes..5 to 6 wins.

Year after they go to the playoffs.

You know it would be great if they made the playoffs in year 1 of the saleh period but sometimes that’s self defeating because it impacts the draft position of the following year. Obviously we don’t want to see another 2-14 season or even something south of 7-9 or 8-8.

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23 minutes ago, rangerous said:

You know it would be great if they made the playoffs in year 1 of the saleh period but sometimes that’s self defeating because it impacts the draft position of the following year. Obviously we don’t want to see another 2-14 season or even something south of 7-9 or 8-8.

7-9 or 8-8 with a rookie QB would be an amazing year.  With Watson it would be a bad year.  

 

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On 1/26/2021 at 8:11 AM, PepPep said:

*Sidenote: Of course, JD and Saleh can get extensions. But you can imagine, if they don't put together a winning product, they be brought back.

If they don't have a winning product, they won't see year 5

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15 hours ago, SAR I said:

My fingers have never been crossed harder.

What vexes me is, if Gase was as bad as people say, why aren't we committing to Darnold and letting Saleh and LaFleur rehabilitate him?  If we take it to be 100% true that Adam Gase is one of the worst offensive minds in the history of the sport, why is it therefore not 100% true that all Sam Darnold needs is competent NFL coaching to restore him to greatness?

SAR I

Maybe because darnold has shown enough bad traits to think he’s not going to relearn how to play anytime soon? I guess you can always argue that darnold can be renovated but that assumes there’s a ton of time available.  The jets pretty much need their guy for next season and beyond very soon.  They haven’t committed but they also haven’t recommitted at least without a complete assessment.

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36 minutes ago, rangerous said:

Maybe because darnold has shown enough bad traits to think he’s not going to relearn how to play anytime soon? I guess you can always argue that darnold can be renovated but that assumes there’s a ton of time available.  The jets pretty much need their guy for next season and beyond very soon.  They haven’t committed but they also haven’t recommitted at least without a complete assessment.

I agree with all of that, and I'm no longer a Darnold fan, I see all his flaws.

But that said, NFL history is ripe with examples of quarterbacks thought to be trash who turned out to be great and they were all much older than Darnold and none of them had a coach and offensive mind as bad as Gase.  I guess I just can't correlate those who hated Gase for all the right reasons and don't want Sam to get the benefit of that which they lobbied for.

SAR I

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3 minutes ago, SAR I said:

I agree with all of that, and I'm no longer a Darnold fan, I see all his flaws.

But that said, NFL history is ripe with examples of quarterbacks thought to be trash who turned out to be great and they were all much older than Darnold and none of them had a coach and offensive mind as bad as Gase.  I guess I just can't correlate those who hated Gase for all the right reasons and don't want Sam to get the benefit of that which they lobbied for.

SAR I

I get that. The team had issues beyond gase and it would be wise for Douglas and saleh to take a thorough look at everything. Maybe darnold stays but that should be after the assessments.

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3 hours ago, rangerous said:

You know it would be great if they made the playoffs in year 1 of the saleh period but sometimes that’s self defeating because it impacts the draft position of the following year. Obviously we don’t want to see another 2-14 season or even something south of 7-9 or 8-8.

This logic is only one of a Jets fan.....Playoffs or best possible draft position.

How about as a fan base we just root for the team to win and stop losing our sh*t in November on whether will be the 11th or 16th pick as if that really even matters. 

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22 hours ago, Joe W. Namath said:

They have 5 years but need to win now????????  This makes zero sense.  Having 5 means means they can be super patient and do this the right way.

Exactly 

If you're jd and Saleh this is a free year with darnold. They can blame Mac if /when darnold stinks, load the team in other ways and take the rookie in year 4, earn playoff extensions and go from there

If they take a QB high year 1 and that player stinks they won't make it to year 4

It's not checkers or 3d chess, it's poker. The ante is low the blinds are small it's Rd 1 of the tournament. Pushing all in like a maniac is not the ideal strategy. There will be a time enough for many coin flips. 

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23 minutes ago, kevinc855 said:

This logic is only one of a Jets fan.....Playoffs or best possible draft position.

How about as a fan base we just root for the team to win and stop losing our sh*t in November on whether will be the 11th or 16th pick as if that really even matters. 

i think you miss my point.  if the team is to get over the hump it will need good players.  right now they could easily plateau in 8-8 hell where the key players they need won't be available to them in the draft.  of course if douglas does his job then this doesn't become much of an issue. many teams seems to be able to finish with decent records and have to pick at the low end of the draft rounds.

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On 1/26/2021 at 9:30 AM, section314 said:

The thing that troubles me the most is that Woody is back. In the past, he has tried to make the "big splash," Tebow, bringing back Revis, etc. He's one who never looks past the last headlines. Ironically, the Jets are now getting the best press they have, really, since hiring Parcells. I hope that Chris can convince him that JD has a definite plan, and to allow it to unfold. I can just see Woody telling JD that we have to get Watson, no matter the cost.

maybe not that bad, because Woody can make the big free agent signing with Robinson or Thuney or even Fournette. JD can then draft Justin Fields.

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4 hours ago, bitonti said:

Exactly 

If you're jd and Saleh this is a free year with darnold. They can blame Mac if /when darnold stinks, load the team in other ways and take the rookie in year 4, earn playoff extensions and go from there

If they take a QB high year 1 and that player stinks they won't make it to year 4

It's not checkers or 3d chess, it's poker. The ante is low the blinds are small it's Rd 1 of the tournament. Pushing all in like a maniac is not the ideal strategy. There will be a time enough for many coin flips. 

I think a lot of people misinterpreted what I meant when I said 'sense of urgency'. I didn't mean 'pushing all in like a maniac'. Not what I meant at all. I just meant he will have much more of a sense of urgency than many fans think, including bringing in a rookie QB this year. Along the same lines JD would be more open to trading for Watson than a lot of fans think.

As far as the timeline. It's a 5 year window but JD will need to put together a contender in the next 2 maybe 3 years. So this idea that they can waste time with Darnold and 'hope' they have a shot to draft a Franchise a QB next year or the year after that is just not accurate- IN MY OPINION. Most QBs only hit their stride in year 3, right?  

We saw JD take a slow approach in FA last year as he was clearing the roster and I do believe he will continue to build the team through the draft but I think this year we will see him more aggressive in FA. 

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Jets fans?  Patience?
LOL.  The fanbase that started flying planes and buying billboards after their head coach here less than a month lost his quarterback to mono and half his roster to soft tissue injuries.  Yeah, they're down for a lethargic rebuild.  Sure.  Definitely.
SAR I

demonstrating that jet fans are prescient if not patient.
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