Trade Down.... But for Trey Lance

[Jet Nut]

19 hours ago, joewilly12 said:

Agree he was put in a bad place has been his entire NFL career. 

Adam Gase was the worst HC in the NFL coached him for 2 years. 

Im judging him by what he can control dumb decisions and INT's. 

Understand me I hope he turns it all around here. 

We should be building a winning team at this point and not still searching for a QB. 

 

He didnt have talent around him in all of his 3 seasons.  

He had the worst HC in the NFL for his 2nd and 3rd seasons.  Didnt exactly have McVay or Reid in his first.

So how many were dumb plays, how many were he was pressing and forced it?  How many of those throws would he have left, wouldnt have attempted if they had moved the ball a few times, if they weren't struggling just to make 1st downs and not go 3 and out every time.  

Put Darnold in games where things work out, the GB and Dallas type games and he doesnt ever seem to force it and make dumb decisions 

 

[Jet Nut]

10 minutes ago, Biggs said:

Luck actually went No. 1.  Two teams ahead of us who both needed a QB passed on Sam Darnold.  
 

The same GM, Dorsey, who moved up to take Mahomes took a midget with a tude over Darnold. 
 

USC hype doesn't make it true.  

The Giants didnt want a QB, they rolled the dice with Eli

None of this makes a difference.  

Wasnt USC hype, thats nonsense. 

[Joejet]

1 hour ago, joewilly12 said:

How come many other rookie first year QB's do quite well but never any for the NY Jets. 

Most recently Joe Burrow and Justin Herbert. 

Immediately if you become a NY Jet the excuses start. 

It didn’t hurt Patrick Mahommes to sit a year.

[joewilly12]

Just now, Jet Nut said:

The Giants didnt want a QB, they rolled the dice with Eli

None of this makes a difference.  

Wasnt USC hype, thats nonsense. 

Do you think the NY Giants today would trade Barkley for Darnold. 

[joewilly12]

1 minute ago, Joejet said:

It didn’t hurt Patrick Mahommes to sit a year.

No it didn't. 

[Jet Nut]

Just now, Jet Nut said:

The Giants didnt want a QB, they rolled the dice with Eli

If Luck went 15th that draft they still would be saying the best since Luck, what's the point?

None of this makes a difference.  If Darnold developed or does as predicted the Browns were wrong, Baker isnt a given, the story hasnt been written yet.  

Wasnt USC hype, thats nonsense. 

 

[Jet Nut]

1 minute ago, joewilly12 said:

Do you think the NY Giants today would trade Barkley for Darnold. 

Who cares what the Giants want.  What is Barkley, a sometimes RB who hasnt helped his team win anything.  What are we talking here.  If Sam develops and Sequan plays like he was supposed to play and hasnt played I take the QB every time out.  

[joewilly12]

6 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Who cares what the Giants want.  What is Barkley, a sometimes RB who hasnt helped his team win anything.  What are we talking here.  If Sam develops and Sequan plays like he was supposed to play and hasnt played I take the QB every time out.  

You mentioned the NY Giants rolling the dice with Eli.

Thats where the Giants talk came into this. 

 

[Philc1]

18 minutes ago, Joejet said:

It didn’t hurt Patrick Mahommes to sit a year.

Ditto for Brady, Aaron Rodgers

[Philc1]

22 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

He didnt have talent around him in his all of 3 seasons.  

He had the worst HC in the NFL for his 2nd and 3rd seasons.

So how many were dumb plays, how many were he was pressing and forced it?  How many of those throws would he have left, wouldnt have attempted if they had moved the ball a few times, if they weren't struggling just to make 1st downs and not go 3 and out every time.  

Put Darnold in games where things work out, the GB and Dallas type games and he doesnt ever seem to force it and make dumb decisions 

 

Put any other 2018 qb in Sam’s putrid situation here and they suck too

[Biggs]

22 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

The Giants didnt want a QB, they rolled the dice with Eli

None of this makes a difference.  

Wasnt USC hype, thats nonsense. 

Are you actual suggesting that if Andrew  Luck was sitting there the Giants wouldn't have taken him?  
 

The fact that Mayfield and Barkley went ahead of him on two teams that both needed a QB says not Luck type of prospect.  
 

The Giants don't pass on a QB when they needed one if they believed there was an elite QB on the board. 
 

Sam was massively hyped for years. 

[Jet Nut]

15 minutes ago, Biggs said:

Are you actual suggesting that if Andrew  Luck was sitting there the Giants wouldn't have taken him?  
 

The fact that Mayfield and Barkley went ahead of him on two teams that both needed a QB says not Luck type of prospect.  
 

The Giants don't pass on a QB when they needed one if they believed there was an elite QB on the board. 
 

Sam was massively hyped for years. 

Im suggesting just that, they didnt want to bring in a QB.  100%.  Yes, Mara was protective of Eli, was said over and over again.  

The fact that youre saying because Barkley or even Baker went ahead of Sam means you think it says he wasnt the best since Luck is saying nothing.  The Giants weren't drafting a QB, have no idea why youre repeating this, twice now.   Luck and Darnold are QBs.  

Yeah, in fact every highly rated QB is massively hyped.  Have no idea what that means, Sam wasnt hyped he was the highest rated QB.  Only to a few does that become hype

[Charlie Brown]

20 hours ago, Joejet said:

It didn’t hurt Patrick Mahommes to sit a year.

Thank you!

Andy Reid specifically said that Mahomes was raw and needed guidance and should sit.  

Darnold, Sanchez and Smith weren't as GOOD as Mahomes when they came out but the Jets INSISTED on starting them...

Makes Zero Sense!

[Joejet]

2 hours ago, Philc1 said:

Ditto for Brady, Aaron Rodgers

The reason I didn’t include them was the “this is a totally different nfl now” crew.

[Charlie Brown]

More Lance discussion.....

 

 

[Jet Nut]

Lances pro day is going to be huge for him.  I think 4 QBs go high this draft, he could pass a one or more if he wows when he gets in front of teams.

[doitny]

13 hours ago, Joejet said:

It didn’t hurt Patrick Mahommes to sit a year.

i bet anything if Sam Darnold was the Chiefs QB instead of Alex Smith , Mahomes would have started day 1

[Biggs]

17 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

Im suggesting just that, they didnt want to bring in a QB.  100%.  Yes, Mara was protective of Eli, was said over and over again.  

The fact that youre saying because Barkley or even Baker went ahead of Sam means you think it says he wasnt the best since Luck is saying nothing.  The Giants weren't drafting a QB, have no idea why youre repeating this, twice now.   Luck and Darnold are QBs.  

Yeah, in fact every highly rated QB is massively hyped.  Have no idea what that means, Sam wasnt hyped he was the highest rated QB.  Only to a few does that become hype

I'm saying the Giants and the Browns would have taken Luck and they didn't take Darnold.  The idea that if Andrew Luck was in that draft and the Giants would have taken Barkley is insane.  

[bla bla bla]

17 hours ago, Biggs said:

Are you actual suggesting that if Andrew  Luck was sitting there the Giants wouldn't have taken him?  
 

The fact that Mayfield and Barkley went ahead of him on two teams that both needed a QB says not Luck type of prospect.  
 

The Giants don't pass on a QB when they needed one if they believed there was an elite QB on the board. 
 

Sam was massively hyped for years. 

Are you suggesting that had Baker made it past the Browns, that the Giants would have taken him?

I think that logic is flawed, the Giants wanted to try and ride it out with Eli. They weren't taking any QB that year. 

[Biggs]

Just now, bla bla bla said:

Are you suggesting that had Baker made it past the Browns, that the Giants would have taken him?

I think that logic is flawed, the Giants wanted to try and ride it out with Eli. They weren't taking any QB that year. 

No Baker was not Luck.  Baker was not the No. 1 player on everyone draft board.  He probably wasn't the No. 1 player on the Browns draft board, Barkley probably was.  I'm suggesting that Sam wasn't a Luck type of prospect.  He was not the No. 1 player on every NFL teams draft board.  He may have been No. 3 on our draft board.  Luck would have been No. 1 on every draft board including the Giants who did need a QB but took the No. 1 player on their board.

[bla bla bla]

9 minutes ago, Biggs said:

I'm saying the Giants and the Browns would have taken Luck and they didn't take Darnold.  The idea that if Andrew Luck was in that draft and the Giants would have taken Barkley is insane.  

We had this discussion with Lawrence this year. There are like 5 teams in the league that would pass on him. Comparing Sam to Luck feels like apples to oranges given the pre-draft hype about each.

[bla bla bla]

Just now, Biggs said:

No Baker was not Luck.  Baker was not the No. 1 player on everyone draft board.  He probably wasn't the No. 1 player on the Browns draft board, Barkley probably was.  I'm suggesting that Sam wasn't a Luck type of prospect.  He was not the No. 1 player on every NFL teams draft board.  He may have been No. 3 on our draft board.  Luck would have been No. 1 on every draft board including the Giants who did need a QB but took the No. 1 player on their board.

Okay, I think I probably missed some context a page or two back then haha I'm just very confused on how this conversation went from the Browns and Giants needed a QB and passed on Sam but they wouldn't pass on Luck.

[Biggs]

1 minute ago, bla bla bla said:

We had this discussion with Lawrence this year. There are like 5 teams in the league that would pass on him. Comparing Sam to Luck feels like apples to oranges given the pre-draft hype about each.

That's what I was responding to.  The idea that Sam was a once in a lifetime QB prospect coming into the draft like Luck is simply nonsense.  

[Biggs]

5 minutes ago, bla bla bla said:

We had this discussion with Lawrence this year. There are like 5 teams in the league that would pass on him. Comparing Sam to Luck feels like apples to oranges given the pre-draft hype about each.

I agree I don't see Lawerence as a Luck type of prospect but he may be No. 1 on every one draft board?  Hard to know.  Luck was a fantastic NFL prospect.  He was a fantastic NFL QB.  It was a huge loss for the league that he took the beating he took and decided to get out.  If Sam was anything like Luck we wouldn't be having this conversation.  

[Jet Nut]

40 minutes ago, Biggs said:

I'm saying the Giants and the Browns would have taken Luck and they didn't take Darnold.  The idea that if Andrew Luck was in that draft and the Giants would have taken Barkley is insane.  

You do realize the comment was "best since Luck", not better than Luck?

I have no idea what who or where he was drafted has to do with it.  

[Biggs]

7 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

You do realize the comment was "best since Luck", not better than Luck?

I have no idea what who or where he was drafted has to do with it.  

You do realize best since Luck is complete BS.  

[Jet Nut]

12 minutes ago, Biggs said:

You do realize best since Luck is complete BS.  

Really?  How do you figure.  McShay said it clearly during the  OSU-Clemson game.  Luck was a 99, Lawrence was a 97 and Darnold was a 95.  Up until Lawrence, Darnold received his highest ranking since Andrew Luck.  Had this and the numbers on screen.  

Im not trying to prove anything, say anything or even hint that its etched in stone.  Just that he along with others had Darnold the highest rated prospect since Luck.  

What I dont understand is why this simple comment, that just illustrates how some viewed Darnold at the time of his draft is so bothersome.  Doesnt mean he is the best NFL QB since Luck.  Doesnt mean you have to stop hating him and wanting him traded or dumped.  

[Dunnie]

I like the idea of trading down and taking Wilson,Lance or Fields. And gain more picks.

Sent from my SM-G950U1 using JetNation.com mobile app

[Biggs]

41 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Really?  How do you figure.  McShay said it clearly during the  OSU-Clemson game.  Luck was a 99, Lawrence was a 97 and Darnold was a 95.  Up until Lawrence, Darnold received his highest ranking since Andrew Luck.  Had this and the numbers on screen.  

Im not trying to prove anything, say anything or even hint that its etched in stone.  Just that he along with others had Darnold the highest rated prospect since Luck.  

What I dont understand is why this simple comment, that just illustrates how some viewed Darnold at the time of his draft is so bothersome.  Doesnt mean he is the best NFL QB since Luck.  Doesnt mean you have to stop hating him and wanting him traded or dumped.  

McShay had Darnold going to Cleveland No. 1.   He has us drafting Wilson at 2.  FYI Here is where he ranked Sam before the 2018 draft.  He had him behind Mark Sanchez and Blaine Gabbert as a prospect.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/draft2018/story/_/id/23115321/todd-mcshay-nfl-draft-grades-every-first-round-qb-2008-plus-2018-top-qbs

[Philc1]

21 hours ago, Joejet said:

The reason I didn’t include them was the “this is a totally different nfl now” crew.

Oh right.

[Warfish]

23 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

He didnt have talent around him in all of his 3 seasons.  

He had the worst HC in the NFL for his 2nd and 3rd seasons.  Didnt exactly have McVay or Reid in his first.

So how many were dumb plays, how many were he was pressing and forced it?  How many of those throws would he have left, wouldnt have attempted if they had moved the ball a few times, if they weren't struggling just to make 1st downs and not go 3 and out every time.  

Put Darnold in games where things work out, the GB and Dallas type games and he doesnt ever seem to force it and make dumb decisions 

 

Sounds like you're supportive of retaining him as out #1 QB.

Is that accurate?

[Jet Nut]

5 hours ago, Biggs said:

McShay had Darnold going to Cleveland No. 1.   He has us drafting Wilson at 2.  FYI Here is where he ranked Sam before the 2018 draft.  He had him behind Mark Sanchez and Blaine Gabbert as a prospect.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/draft2018/story/_/id/23115321/todd-mcshay-nfl-draft-grades-every-first-round-qb-2008-plus-2018-top-qbs

Just to help this along because its turned into nonsense and youre not making a point, Sanchez was drafted 3 years before Luck.  Gabbert the year before Luck, have no idea what youre trying to say about those two being the best since Luck.  

 

[Jet Nut]

1 hour ago, Warfish said:

Sounds like you're supportive of retaining him as out #1 QB.

Is that accurate?

If they feel that way, I'm fine with it.  

He needs to be in a competent offense with capable players around him and coaching before I'm ready to make the call on Sam

[Warfish]

13 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

If they feel that way, I'm fine with it.  

He needs to be in a competent offense with capable players around him and coaching before I'm ready to make the call on Sam

I don't mean to be rude, but I wasn't asking what they felt, I was asking what you felt.

So let me ask it another way:  What is YOUR preferred choice at QB for 2021, of all the available choices?

[Jet Nut]

4 minutes ago, Warfish said:

I don't mean to be rude, but I wasn't asking what they felt, I was asking what you felt.

So let me ask it another way:  What is YOUR preferred choice at QB for 2021, of all the available choices?

I hear you.  But I'm saying that if theyre still high on him, keep him.  No one at QB after Lawrence is a sure fire pick IMO, why I'm going more to the trade down, grab Lance and let him develop.  If possible.

I dont see what the draftees can do that Darnold cant do.