The ***OFFICIAL*** Sammy is coming back THREAD let's talk about the weaponz we can add with our top picks

[Beerfish]

The bad news is the Jets have holes all over the roster.

The good news is come draft day we can pick anyone one of about 6 or 7 different position and feel we are getting the bpa at the position.

I very much want to trade down. 

[Wonderboy]

9 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

:Darnold takes the snap and drops back as Penei Sewell pancakes his man and Jaylen Waddle is running five yards behind the CB covering him. Darnold, for some reason, starts shuffling his feet, finally running to his right looking for Jamison Crowder, who is no longer on the roster. Waddle is standing alone in the end zone as Darnold flips the ball meekly into the turf with a sidearm, frisbee-throwing motion. Back in the huddle, Darnold apologizes to the team for the 26th play in a row, claiming he’s “seeing ghosts” again. As it turns out, “ghosts” are the product of smoking weed resin out of a repurposed Gerber baby food jar the night before.:

Robbie: So props to Shane yo say it homie. Somebudy gotta set sheet straight yo

[Integrity28]

52 minutes ago, Samtorobby47 said:

If Sammy is back:

Trade down to 6 or 8 take Chase or Pitts.

C/G at 23 or trade that down.

Sign Godwin or Robinson.

Dominate. 

 

 

Agree with the trade back, and targets. Love both players.

At 23 I think I address OT. Leatherwood seems to be a popular tackle in mocks around there. I’m signing a better center and kicking McGovern to guard.

With whatever we get in the trade down I’m looking for best secondary or LBer available, unless there’s a blatant slide by a good prospect.

Top of R2 in taking Trey Lance.

Signing Godwin, Robinson or Golladay is a must.

[Untouchable]

I know most don’t want to hear it, but I think if we trade down into that 6-10 range, a CB like Surtain or Farley is more likely than a WR.

I’d probably give the edge to Surtain as he’s a better fit for the Cover 3 zone scheme that Saleh is sure to implement.

I fully expect the Jets to add a wideout in FA like Samuel and maybe re-sign Perriman.

Mims, Samuel, Crowder and Perriman as your Top 4 wideouts is pretty solid if you ask me.

[PepPep]

11 minutes ago, freestater said:

It's official. 

The thread that is. But common....we all know the jets are bringing back Sammy and are going to surround him with as much talent as they can get. Pitts maybe, depending on how far we trade back. Chase is still my top WR, Smith definitely a 1a. I'd really like an interior lineman at 23 or 34. Who else ya got?

So I've been thinking a lot about the Rd. 1/Early Rd. 2 prospects in this class. 

I love Pitts but I think you have to think about these top needs in THIS order (depending on FA of course). I'm just going to assume the Jets bring back Maye. I can't imagine them letting him get away with the cap room they have: 

1. QB 

2. Edge

3. O-line

4. WR

5. CB 

I had CB a lot higher but when Saleh came on board that changed. I think his zone scheme protects the CBs we have and their skill set and focuses mostly on pass rush. 

So #1 is taken care of. We are going to run it back with Sam. This is problematic in SO MANY WAYS, IMO. His contract, his regression, his injuries, our unique position to draft a Franchise QB, our unique position to trade for a FQB, etc. But I digress...Let's assume the new coaching regime is in love with Sam and believe they can win with him. 

Stay At #2

First lets look at sticking at #2. I don't see any other player worth taking #2 other than Sewell. Look. I get it. He's a LT and will want LT money eventually, he sat out all year- which is concerning, the Jets need weapons and Pitts, Chase and Smith are all elite receivers. But the bottom line is that Sewell is by all accounts a 'generational' talent at OT- as far as that term gets thrown around. He is easily the top LT/RT/OT this year and frankly a top 5 prospect pretty much any year. If you have to pick at #2 and you're not taking a QB, you have to take Sewell. Becton has shown he is not the most reliable player. Sewell can probably step right in and start at OG if you ask him. Or you can plug him in at RT and have one of the most talented pair of bookends in the NFL. It's kind of a no-brainer. You can even keep Fant, but I would probably cut or trade him because he has an out in his contract this year.

At 23, once you've taken Sewell, it's a no-brainer. You go after the EDGE position. Sure, you can take best available WR or a top tier OG and completely revamp the O-line, or a CB to help the secondary. But if Saleh has his guy, who fits his system at EDGE in sights at 23, you gotta pull the trigger if you are JD. It's long overdue.   

Rd. 2: This is where you take a WR for Sam. And let's be real, the Jets may not get Smith or Bateman or even Marshall will be there. But this is very high 2nd round pick. You never know. You could get an explosive weapon like R.Moore, you should be able to get Toney. If somehow there is a run on WRs early and the value is simply not there I think it would be prudent to take a CB. As much as I want to hope that our CB group is going to get better and look better under Saleh, the talent is far from elite. I have no problem with a guy like Asante Samuel at this spot and then looking for better value at WR in Rd. 3.  

Trade Down

The best move would obviously be to trade down. I think a realistic move would be to trade down with the Falcons so they can go up and get Fields- home town Georgia boy who they can groom behind Ryan. At #4 we could get our choice of WR (assuming Dolphins take Sewell- which they will) or Pitts. However, the ideal scenario would be to trade down again and let another team go after Wilson. The Lions come to mind at #7. The Panthers come to mind at #8. Having accumulated a bevy of picks, this is where I would target that TOP TIER weapon for Darnold. Pitts, Chase, Waddle, Smith- one of those guys should be there at 7. I'd want Pitts just because he is such a unique talent. 

Would it be easy to trade down twice like this? I dunno. Maybe. Maybe not. 

At #23 I'm looking for the best available EDGE. Like I said Saleh needs his edge guy for his defensive scheme to work, so this would be a priority and the guy would have to fit Saleh's system and I'm not sure exactly what type of player he would want considering the Jets have a lot of D-linemen already. But Ossai and Z.Collins come to mind. I think both guys can fit that LEO role. If not and the right guy is rated lower (Rd. 2 maybe) then the Jets need to go after O-line. OT or OG I don't care (I don't think we need to take a top C)- just bring in a blue chip prospect who can step in and potentially upgrade G or RT immediately. G- W.Davis, Brown, T.Smith, Vera-Tucker (OT/OG) or OT- Leatherwood, Darrisaw, Slater, Cosmi. Even if the Jets decide to hold onto Fant there's nothing wrong with drafting a future starter at RT now. Did we not see what happened when both Fant and Becton got nicked up and the Jets were forced to start McDermott and Edoga at OT. It was a disaster. 

Assuming the Jets trade down they should have multiple 2nd rounders. Having gotten a top tier receiver (or Pitts) and let's assume an Edge. Rd. 2 would be nec. to address O-line and CB. If the Jets took Pitts early that would have been a luxury pick because of the trade down and now they would also need a WR.  OT's like Mayfield, Radunz, Eichenberg or Carman should be available. Some of these guys are projected to move to OG at the NFL level. I know a lot of them I don't view as NFL LTs but rather NFL RTs as silly as that may sound. But that is actually good b/c the Jets have a LT (baring injury). At CB they could get A.Samuel Jr., G.Newsome, maybe Stokes. And then a WR- Ty Wallace, Elija Moore, St.Brown, Maybe R.Moore, Maybe even Marshall Jr. slides. 

[genot]

Lol. Im glad people are realizing what i have been saying for months. Sam, the fans, the team has been crapped on and in limbo for the last two years When Saleh talks about Darnolds unbelievable talent,  (as he describes it), he's not lying. It's why he was drafted at three. Has Sam's mental processing been done irreparable harm. In a system,more tailored to his skills and an inproved o-line make his footwork flaws easier to correct. I can''t say for sure. It's pretty clear that the Jet's new brass thinks so.

[Pac]

Keeping Sam, trading back, and surrounding him with premium draft picks and real coaching means the Jets never have to play the what if game or watch him suddenly prosper for another team.

He's on a 1 year audition.  If he fails then we'll have plenty ammunition to get next years flash in the pan supposedly awesome QB.

If he succeeds we'll be set for a decade.

[Mike135]

Yup.  If Watson doesn't come here, this is the play.

If Sam doesn't perform well with a better team around him, we're in a great position for 2022.

Have two 1st rounders to move up for a QB in that draft.  And that young QB comes into a better team than one would this year.

Basically we would get two tries with young QBs on a "good" team.  Instead of going for the rookie QB now with a below average team.

[Grandy]

1 minute ago, Mike135 said:

Yup.  If Watson doesn't come here, this is the play.

If Sam doesn't perform well with a better team around him, we're in a great position for 2022.

Have two 1st rounders to move up for a QB in that draft.  And that young QB comes into a better team than one would this year.

Basically we would get two tries with young QBs on a "good" team.  Instead of going for the rookie QB now with a below average team.

Doesnt this make the whole preserve picks to build thing redundant because at the end of the day, we need to use capital to move up just in the future? Which based on past trends of top picks could very well warrant 3 first round picks which is the same as a Deshaun mock?

[Waka Flocka Flacco]

6 minutes ago, Integrity28 said:

Top of R2 in taking Trey Lance.

No, you're not. If you're taking Lance at 34 you have to pay the freight to move up and get the fifth year option.

[RedBeardedSavage]

1 hour ago, freestater said:

It's official. 

The thread that is. But common....we all know the jets are bringing back Sammy and are going to surround him with as much talent as they can get. Pitts maybe, depending on how far we trade back. Chase is still my top WR, Smith definitely a 1a. I'd really like an interior lineman at 23 or 34. Who else ya got?

Love the trade down, although I'm also OK with taking Sewell or Chase @ 2. Pitts on a trade down is great too.

23 is interesting; 

• if Darrisaw or Slater fell, I feel like they fit the 'lineman that can move' scheme
• Kadarius Toney? Terrace Marshall Jr?
• And I absolutely love Jeremiah Owusu-Koramoah as a player, I just wonder if he's more of a luxury pick
• Also, if Vera-Tucker fell to 23, I think that'd be a great pick too

34

• Obviously any of the above mentioned if they fell
• Nico Collins is interesting
• Greg Newsome II or Adebo @ corner could be in play depending on athletic testing
• Baron Browning, Chazz Surratt or another super athletic 4-3 LB prospect

Round 3 and beyond

• Michael Carter UNC - I prefer him over JaVonte or any other mid-round RB
• Shi Smith had a really nice week at the Senior Bowl practice

In free agency, I like that a lot of people have mentioned Curtis Samuel. Dude fits this scheme and could run those jet-sweeps, be a dangerous player in space. I think those top tier WR's aren't coming here without Watson, so I'm going to temper my expectations there. I'd prefer to avoid RB's altogether in free agency and rely on the draft. Jonnu Smith or Gerald Everett could make a lot of sense at TE.

[Mike135]

1 minute ago, Grandy said:

Doesnt this make the whole preserve picks to build thing redundant because at the end of the day, we need to use capital to move up just in the future? Which based on past trends of top picks could very well warrant 3 first round picks which is the same as a Deshaun mock?

Well Watson is just a golden opportunity you HAVE to take if it's there.

But if Watson is out...

Wouldn't you rather have two young QBs (Sam and a 2022 rookie QB) be playing with better teams around them from our full complement of draft picks this year?

Instead of drafting a rookie QB this year, and facing the same old BS of being on a bad team.  Perhaps ruining the kid already.

Rolling with Sam also has the benefit of using all of 2022's picks on supporting cast if he succeeds.

[Savage69]

10 minutes ago, Pac said:

Keeping Sam, trading back, and surrounding him with premium draft picks and real coaching means the Jets never have to play the what if game or watch him suddenly prosper for another team.

He's on a 1 year audition.  If he fails then we'll have plenty ammunition to get next years flash in the pan supposedly awesome QB.

If he succeeds we'll be set for a decade.

Is that another way of saying generational?? 

[genot]

6 minutes ago, Pac said:

Keeping Sam, trading back, and surrounding him with premium draft picks and real coaching means the Jets never have to play the what if game or watch him suddenly prosper for another team.

He's on a 1 year audition.  If he fails then we'll have plenty ammunition to get next years flash in the pan supposedly awesome QB.

If he succeeds we'll be set for a decade.

Its at a gamble very much worth taking. Hopefully a team falls in love with one of tbe draftable QB's and we can get a huge haul. My dream scenario is trading down with the Pantbers. We night be able to get picks and Brian Burns. That would solve one of our two big issues on defense. The other being a #1 corner.

[Grandy]

Rolling back with Darnold just pushes back the inevitable QB upgrade that will require the precious capital people want to preserve.

Some people hold out hope that Darnold becomes good, but as mentioned before the only QB in modern history to ever succeed with such a bad statistical profile  early on is Alex Smith. He's good and well respected, but might not be the type of player we need to win a SB, and he's the ceiling based on the trend.

I would love for Darnold to be great but to me it seems like foolish hope.

[PepPep]

3 minutes ago, Untouchable said:

I know most don’t want to hear it, but I think if we trade down into that 6-10 range, a CB like Surtain or Farley is more likely than a WR.

I’d probably give the edge to Surtain as he’s a better fit for the Cover 3 zone scheme that Saleh is sure to implement.

I fully expect the Jets to add a wideout in FA like Samuel and maybe re-sign Perriman.

Mims, Samuel, Crowder and Perriman as your Top 4 wideouts is pretty solid if you ask me.

Everything depends on FA. Sure if the Jets bring back Perriman and sign Samuel that would make sense. But if they sign Sherman and/or Witherspoon, two vets to help teach and implement his system. Then its the complete opposite. I would assume the Jets would want to hold on to their current young CBs and see how they can adapt in the new system with Sherman and Williams on board rather than bring in a top new prospect to take away a roster spot by default. 

IMO- if the Jets trade down to the 6-10 range they take Pitts (if available). He is a unique talent at TE and Saleh has seen first hand what an impact a top tier TE can make (albeit Pitts is not the same type of TE as Kittle).

If the Jets DON'T go WR in this scenario, I can also see them taking Rousseau, Paye or Parsons. But yeah, a CB would also be a possibility if they made no effort to address the position in FA.     

[Grandy]

With what he's shown, Darnold is the riskiest option at QB. Probably even more of a risk than Trey Lance.

[Stark]

26 minutes ago, Waka Flocka Flacco said:

Things the Jets care about:

1. Samuel is CAA

2. Samuel went to Erasmus Hall

Things the Jets don't care about:

(left as an exercise to the reader)

Samuel is JAG. 
do better in FA

[Spoot-Face]

1 hour ago, freestater said:

It's official. 

The thread that is. But common....we all know the jets are bringing back Sammy and are going to surround him with as much talent as they can get. Pitts maybe, depending on how far we trade back. Chase is still my top WR, Smith definitely a 1a. I'd really like an interior lineman at 23 or 34. Who else ya got?

[peekskill68]

12 minutes ago, Mike135 said:

Yup.  If Watson doesn't come here, this is the play.

If Sam doesn't perform well with a better team around him, we're in a great position for 2022.

Have two 1st rounders to move up for a QB in that draft.  And that young QB comes into a better team than one would this year.

Basically we would get two tries with young QBs on a "good" team.  Instead of going for the rookie QB now with a below average team.

This is a good point.  Are you better off putting Fields or Wilson into a bad team in 2021 vs. giving Sam one last chance with "weaponz" to turn it around knowing you have the ammo to draft next year's Fields or Wilson into a much better situation while you reset the QB rookie clock...

[FidelioJet]

1 hour ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

If Sam Darnold is the starting QB in 2021, it will be time to discuss the replacement for Joe Douglass. 

Of course.  And JD knows this. 

No way Sam comes back.  

[Greensleeves]

1 hour ago, Samtorobby47 said:

If Sammy is back:

Trade down to 6 or 8 take Chase or Pitts.

C/G at 23 or trade that down.

Sign Godwin or Robinson.

Dominate. 

 

 

Why would Robinson or Godwin want to come here? If we keep Sam we'll have to draft a #1 receiver. The only way we get Godwin or Robinson is if Watson is the QB. I really think keeping Sam is option C at this point. We HAVE to try to get Watson or we could be in the cellar for another decade if he goes to Miami. That's reason enough as Boomer said yesterday. You simply cannot let him go to Miami. And if we get Watson, JD will have to do it early enough so he can sign Robinson or Godwin.

[playtowinthegame]

1 hour ago, T0mShane said:

why do this why

[slimjasi]

No 

[football guy]

Just now, Greensleeves said:

Why would Robinson or Godwin want to come here? If we keep Sam we'll have to draft a #1 receiver. The only way we get Godwin or Robinson is if Watson is the QB. I really think keeping Sam is option C at this point. We HAVE to try to get Watson or we could be in the cellar for another decade if he goes to Miami. That's reason enough as Boomer said yesterday. You simply cannot let him go to Miami. 

This is a weak take. First off, find a player who criticizes Sam. They're few and far between. Secondly, money. 

[football guy]

For those who want to better understand why the Jets will avoid drafting a QB this year, read this article: 

https://www.newyorkjets.com/news/jets-personnel-department-believes-the-reese-s-senior-bowl-is-more-significant-t

[PepPep]

14 minutes ago, Pac said:

Keeping Sam, trading back, and surrounding him with premium draft picks and real coaching means the Jets never have to play the what if game or watch him suddenly prosper for another team.

He's on a 1 year audition.  If he fails then we'll have plenty ammunition to get next years flash in the pan supposedly awesome QB.

If he succeeds we'll be set for a decade.

It's not that simple. Sam would have to make a MASSIVE leap to play even close to on par with Watson. I just don't see it. Ok. Let's say he improves. In fact, I know he will improve. Let's say he improves considerably. Now the Jets need to re-sign him. So lets say they DO re-sign him. Now Sam is OUR guy. Are we convinced he will continue to improve? Improve enough to be a FQB? Enough to actually win in the playoffs? I don't see it. And I certainly don't think we will know after one season, even if you trade down and add a bunch of talented rookies around him. That's the rub.   

If you take a QB at #2 at least you are starting from scratch and you don't have to 'fix' a QB or hope he turns things around. Sure, he may be a bust but you have him on a rookie deal. And you can mold him. Sam is shell shocked. At least to a degree. 

If you trade for Watson, that's really the best case scenario. That accelerates your rebuild. now you have the QB position solved. Boom. Done. A FQB in his prime. And you still have plenty of draft capital to work with, you still have plenty of cap space to work with. This assumes the Jets give up three first rounders for him.  

[dcJet]

40 minutes ago, Jimmy 2 Times said:

I think taking the quarterback is more dangerous to his job than passing on them.

He can keep pushing the QB back a year or two while he builds the roster, but once he picks a QB high, he's on borrowed time. 

That's what Macc did until he was forced to take a QB.  Macc got 5 years out of that strategy and we still don't have a QB.

[JustInFudge]

I love the idea of building around the worst starting QB in the NFL!!!!!  It's so exciting!!!  Cant wait to play golf every Sunday next season!!!

[WestCoastOffensive]

This thread is why I don't wear rainbows, on my back. The man asked a question. I find the static confusing. What will we do to SUPPORT SAM?

 

[Waka Flocka Flacco]

12 minutes ago, football guy said:

This is a weak take. First off, find a player who criticizes Sam. They're few and far between. Secondly, money. 

Warner and Sherman were openly making fun of him on Collinsworth's podcast this week. The secret is out and you're just plain lying.

[playtowinthegame]

Would Sam even beat out James Morgan? Not sure....I think we'd have a new Captain at quarterback.

[dcJet]

37 minutes ago, Pac said:

Keeping Sam, trading back, and surrounding him with premium draft picks and real coaching means the Jets never have to play the what if game or watch him suddenly prosper for another team.

He's on a 1 year audition.  If he fails then we'll have plenty ammunition to get next years flash in the pan supposedly awesome QB.

If he succeeds we'll be set for a decade.

The odds of Sam succeeding are way lower than the odds of Wilson or Fields succeeding.

But we can play both bets.  We can still take a QB at 2 and start the season with Sam.  I he becomes Josh Allen, we'll have a nice problem.  If he Genos it, we put in the rookie.

[Savage69]

4 minutes ago, playtowinthegame said:

Would Sam even beat out James Morgan? Not sure....I think we'd have a new Captain at quarterback.

From what I heard from Pat fans in 2001 their 2000 6th rd pick was looking good in training camp.. Could the Rum name sharing QB get jet fans drunk with glee??

[Integrity28]

47 minutes ago, Waka Flocka Flacco said:

No, you're not. If you're taking Lance at 34 you have to pay the freight to move up and get the fifth year option.

Fair point.