The ***OFFICIAL*** Sammy is coming back THREAD let's talk about the weaponz we can add with our top picks

[32EBoozer]

36 minutes ago, The Crusher said:

OMG I would karate fight you so bad right now. 

[jetswinbaby!]

Sam Darnold... Franchise QB...

 

[Waka Flocka Flacco]

8 minutes ago, MykePM said:

That's one hell of a conspiracy theory.  Are you actually suggesting that Douglas thinks that Darnold needs to go, but his agent is talking him out of it?  And Douglas is willing to risk his own job to do Sexton a solid?  Sexton is Gase's agent too.  Did that save him?

The first year payout of Darnold's extension is going to be more than Gase's and Douglas's entire contracts put together. What part of this are you having difficulty with exactly?

[Beerfish]

When your team just won 2 games and has little talent all across the broad it is CRITICAL you get  new QB THIS YEAR! 

Better to make a poor use of resources than stick with the QB we hate!

This team is not close to being mediocre let alone good.

Build some semblance of a team with the new coaching staff and then get an upgrade at QB.

[rayzor]

5 hours ago, joewilly12 said:

In 2018 the motto was       SUCK FOR SAM 

In 2021 the motto will be   SUCK WITH SAM 

You can take it one step further:

In 2021 the motto will be  SUCK FOR SAM WITH SAM

Sam Howell that is.

[Paradis]

Pitts

[Charlie Brown]

 

Look Watson is the best QB in the NFL outside of Mahomes...Period!

I really like Sam but if the Jets can get WATSON at a reasonable price they MUST GET HIM!!!

SO STOP THIS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  

[Irktusk1957]

7 hours ago, T0mShane said:

:Darnold takes the snap and drops back as Penei Sewell pancakes his man and Jaylen Waddle is running five yards behind the CB covering him. Darnold, for some reason, starts shuffling his feet, finally running to his right looking for Jamison Crowder, who is no longer on the roster. Waddle is standing alone in the end zone as Darnold flips the ball meekly into the turf with a sidearm, frisbee-throwing motion. Back in the huddle, Darnold apologizes to the team for the 26th play in a row, claiming he’s “seeing ghosts” again. As it turns out, “ghosts” are the product of smoking weed resin out of a repurposed Gerber baby food jar the night before.:

Now you're just trying too hard

[CanadienJetsFan]

I too think Sam was handed a raw deal by given the displeasure of all that is Gase and hope he’s given another chance. but his game is riddled with poor decision making and fatal fundamental flaws so correcting him might take just as long as drafting a rookie with good legs and a rifle for an arm.

Plus, moving on from Sam gives JD and Saleh a chance to start off on a clean slate. 
So there’s more arguments that one can make to moving on than to keeping Sam.

and for that I say

[jetstream23]

Trade down twice.  Once with Atlanta so they can take Wilson.  Then again with Carolina or Detroit so they can take someone like Trey Lance.

Try to stay in the Top 15.  Draft either the OLineman Rashawn Slater, TE Kyle Pitts, or a dominant Edge rusher.

Come back with at #23 with weapon (ex. WR like Bateman or even Touney) if you didn't take Pitts.  Go with an Edge rusher or OT if you got a weapon earlier.

Round 2 looks good for CBs, interior OLine, and/or WR.

[freestater]

36 minutes ago, Charlie Brown said:

 

Look Watson is the best QB in the NFL outside of Mahomes...Period!

I really like Sam but if the Jets can get WATSON at a reasonable price they MUST GET HIM!!!

SO STOP THIS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  

Oh...I'm all in on getting Deshaun Watson. All in. Thought he was going to be ours in '17. Alas, an idiot was in charge. I'd be willing to give up 3 1sts for him. But none of that matters. Read the tea leaves. The wheels are being greased to bring Sammy back for one more run. Its gonna happen. As Dr. Moga might say, lay some serious coin on it. So, with reality giving a good cold hard slap...who ya want at #2?

[pointman]

8 hours ago, joewilly12 said:

Actually looking forward to seeing this just as excited as I was when they drafted Sam Darnold. 

Load the team up surround him with talent offensive playmakers and see what he can do. 

Improve the D. 

He's only 23 so hoping like hell he is that franchise QB. 

Spoiler alert*

 

He's not. 

[oatmeal]

6 minutes ago, freestater said:

Oh...I'm all in on getting Deshaun Watson. All in. Thought he was going to be ours in '17. Alas, an idiot was in charge. I'd be willing to give up 3 1sts for him. But none of that matters. Read the tea leaves. The wheels are being greased to bring Sammy back for one more run. Its gonna happen. As Dr. Moga might say, lay some serious coin on it. So, with reality giving a good cold hard slap...who ya want at #2?

Shame we about to get Hackenberg’ed... AGAIN ???????

[freestater]

9 minutes ago, oatmeal said:

Shame we about to get Hackenberg’ed... AGAIN ???????

[Shockwave]

8 hours ago, Grandy said:

Doesnt this make the whole preserve picks to build thing redundant because at the end of the day, we need to use capital to move up just in the future? Which based on past trends of top picks could very well warrant 3 first round picks which is the same as a Deshaun mock?

Really the best post of the thread.

[Chrebetfan80]

8 hours ago, PepPep said:

So I've been thinking a lot about the Rd. 1/Early Rd. 2 prospects in this class. 

I love Pitts but I think you have to think about these top needs in THIS order (depending on FA of course). I'm just going to assume the Jets bring back Maye. I can't imagine them letting him get away with the cap room they have: 

1. QB 

2. Edge

3. O-line

4. WR

5. CB 

I had CB a lot higher but when Saleh came on board that changed. I think his zone scheme protects the CBs we have and their skill set and focuses mostly on pass rush. 

So #1 is taken care of. We are going to run it back with Sam. This is problematic in SO MANY WAYS, IMO. His contract, his regression, his injuries, our unique position to draft a Franchise QB, our unique position to trade for a FQB, etc. But I digress...Let's assume the new coaching regime is in love with Sam and believe they can win with him. 

Stay At #2

First lets look at sticking at #2. I don't see any other player worth taking #2 other than Sewell. Look. I get it. He's a LT and will want LT money eventually, he sat out all year- which is concerning, the Jets need weapons and Pitts, Chase and Smith are all elite receivers. But the bottom line is that Sewell is by all accounts a 'generational' talent at OT- as far as that term gets thrown around. He is easily the top LT/RT/OT this year and frankly a top 5 prospect pretty much any year. If you have to pick at #2 and you're not taking a QB, you have to take Sewell. Becton has shown he is not the most reliable player. Sewell can probably step right in and start at OG if you ask him. Or you can plug him in at RT and have one of the most talented pair of bookends in the NFL. It's kind of a no-brainer. You can even keep Fant, but I would probably cut or trade him because he has an out in his contract this year.

At 23, once you've taken Sewell, it's a no-brainer. You go after the EDGE position. Sure, you can take best available WR or a top tier OG and completely revamp the O-line, or a CB to help the secondary. But if Saleh has his guy, who fits his system at EDGE in sights at 23, you gotta pull the trigger if you are JD. It's long overdue.   

Rd. 2: This is where you take a WR for Sam. And let's be real, the Jets may not get Smith or Bateman or even Marshall will be there. But this is very high 2nd round pick. You never know. You could get an explosive weapon like R.Moore, you should be able to get Toney. If somehow there is a run on WRs early and the value is simply not there I think it would be prudent to take a CB. As much as I want to hope that our CB group is going to get better and look better under Saleh, the talent is far from elite. I have no problem with a guy like Asante Samuel at this spot and then looking for better value at WR in Rd. 3.  

Trade Down

The best move would obviously be to trade down. I think a realistic move would be to trade down with the Falcons so they can go up and get Fields- home town Georgia boy who they can groom behind Ryan. At #4 we could get our choice of WR (assuming Dolphins take Sewell- which they will) or Pitts. However, the ideal scenario would be to trade down again and let another team go after Wilson. The Lions come to mind at #7. The Panthers come to mind at #8. Having accumulated a bevy of picks, this is where I would target that TOP TIER weapon for Darnold. Pitts, Chase, Waddle, Smith- one of those guys should be there at 7. I'd want Pitts just because he is such a unique talent. 

Would it be easy to trade down twice like this? I dunno. Maybe. Maybe not. 

At #23 I'm looking for the best available EDGE. Like I said Saleh needs his edge guy for his defensive scheme to work, so this would be a priority and the guy would have to fit Saleh's system and I'm not sure exactly what type of player he would want considering the Jets have a lot of D-linemen already. But Ossai and Z.Collins come to mind. I think both guys can fit that LEO role. If not and the right guy is rated lower (Rd. 2 maybe) then the Jets need to go after O-line. OT or OG I don't care (I don't think we need to take a top C)- just bring in a blue chip prospect who can step in and potentially upgrade G or RT immediately. G- W.Davis, Brown, T.Smith, Vera-Tucker (OT/OG) or OT- Leatherwood, Darrisaw, Slater, Cosmi. Even if the Jets decide to hold onto Fant there's nothing wrong with drafting a future starter at RT now. Did we not see what happened when both Fant and Becton got nicked up and the Jets were forced to start McDermott and Edoga at OT. It was a disaster. 

Assuming the Jets trade down they should have multiple 2nd rounders. Having gotten a top tier receiver (or Pitts) and let's assume an Edge. Rd. 2 would be nec. to address O-line and CB. If the Jets took Pitts early that would have been a luxury pick because of the trade down and now they would also need a WR.  OT's like Mayfield, Radunz, Eichenberg or Carman should be available. Some of these guys are projected to move to OG at the NFL level. I know a lot of them I don't view as NFL LTs but rather NFL RTs as silly as that may sound. But that is actually good b/c the Jets have a LT (baring injury). At CB they could get A.Samuel Jr., G.Newsome, maybe Stokes. And then a WR- Ty Wallace, Elija Moore, St.Brown, Maybe R.Moore, Maybe even Marshall Jr. slides. 

This has been my exact feeling on things, and my strategy when posting mocks in the draft forum lately. 

Pitts makes too much sense for this offense, they need a real weapon at TE that fills that Kittle role here and Pitts is that kind of player, having him and if Herndon can become a player again helps tremendously.  ( especially considering they will be adding 1 wrs most likely in FA it makes it less pressing to pass on a talent like Pitts for a WR).  

23 seems like a sweet spot so far in a lot of mocks for Edge players.  Jets need one bad and committing premium resources in the first round to one is a good move.  I agree though if one is unavailable that they like i could see them going OL or trading down again even as a possiblitiy. 

Round 2 i would look at WR maybe OL depending who was there, and probably LB.  I know we need secondary help, but currently we really dont have many LBs that fit a 4-3 so it makes it a more pressing need there.  Although if Samuel is sitting there in round 2 I do like him for this defense. 

 

[Prodigal Syndicate]

Pretty amazing how many chances you get with the right complexion and an aw shucks good ole boy act in the media.

[Bugg]

This is smoke and mirrors.  Douglas is not going to devalue a trade asset. And he is not giving Darnold a big ass contract for his 5th season to a guy who is hot garbage juice on a July day. Don' t pretend to know if that means a trade for Watson or a draft pick, but Darnold is done here. 

[joewilly12]

3 hours ago, The Crusher said:

Is that really necessary Joe?

No but @T0mShane out of nowhere attacks me all the time. 

I even sent him a warm winter coat and a monetary donation for necessities. 

[heymangold]

9 hours ago, DetroitRed said:

Kittle is a key piece to this offense in SF.  And yes, he turned out to be a player that has been worth a top 10-20 selection.   The TE will probably be more important than the receivers

Sorry but kittle was a 5th round pick.  Kelce was a 3rd. 

[The Crusher]

20 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

No but @T0mShane out of nowhere attacks me all the time. 

I even sent him a warm winter coat and a monetary donation for necessities. 

That’s honestly very nice 

[Jetsfan80]

2 hours ago, Beerfish said:

When your team just won 2 games and has little talent all across the broad it is CRITICAL you get  new QB THIS YEAR! 

Better to make a poor use of resources than stick with the QB we hate!

This team is not close to being mediocre let alone good.

Build some semblance of a team with the new coaching staff and then get an upgrade at QB.

I don't understand why some believe that building up the roster this offseason somehow doesn't include trying to find a QB of the future this offseason.  

A QB is part of the roster.  The Jets have the # 2 pick.  Teams with high picks need QB's and usually take QB's.  

Build the roster and find a QB.  Both very possible, not mutually exclusive goals.

[Lurker89]

Am I the only one who doesn't really want anything to do with Pitts.

[Beerfish]

4 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

I don't understand why some believe that building up the roster this offseason somehow doesn't include trying to find a QB of the future this offseason.  

A QB is part of the roster.  The Jets have the # 2 pick.  Teams with high picks need QB's and usually take QB's.  

Build the roster and find a QB.  Both very possible, not mutually exclusive goals.

100% totally valid IF you love wilson or fields.  If you love them so much they are really a good bet to be a franchise guy you pick them, end of story.

Do you think those guys are true franchise QBs?

Many a team has thought that mitch trubisky, blaine gabbert, blake bortles, even toss in sam darnold were the guy.

So you look at it and say hmmm, we could trade down get a great player in the 1st round and other assets.

Or you take a Qb you are not sure about and commit to him for at least 3 years.

[Beerfish]

Just now, Lurker89 said:

Am I the only one who doesn't really want anything to do with Pitts.

I like the player but I think he will be overdrafted and I still give him a black mark due to sitting out the bowl game. (and then posting a jamal like rawraw thing to his teammates that was played on tv during the game.

[King P]

Hoping to drop down to the 7th/8th pick and grab Jamarr Chase or Devonta Smith if either or still available

[Jetsfan80]

15 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

100% totally valid IF you love wilson or fields.  If you love them so much they are really a good bet to be a franchise guy you pick them, end of story.

Do you think those guys are true franchise QBs?

Many a team has thought that mitch trubisky, blaine gabbert, blake bortles, even toss in sam darnold were the guy.

So you look at it and say hmmm, we could trade down get a great player in the 1st round and other assets.

Or you take a Qb you are not sure about and commit to him for at least 3 years.

 

And the uncertainty with rookie QB's is exactly why I'm advocating so strongly to get Watson, even if an "overpay" is necessary. 

You say that the Jets can trade down now and then trade up another year for the "right QB".  Well the same uncertainty that exists with Fields and Wilson will exist with any future draft class QB's. 

There's absolutely no way to know if someone is the "right QB" until you have them under center in real NFL games.  It doesn't matter how much you fall in love with him.  The Jets were absolutely smitten with Sanchez and Darnold and we see how that played out.

[Lurker89]

31 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

I like the player but I think he will be overdrafted and I still give him a black mark due to sitting out the bowl game. (and then posting a jamal like rawraw thing to his teammates that was played on tv during the game.

I'm with you in that I like the player not the cost .... Adding to that the top two TEs were 2nd and 4th round picks.

[batman10023]

3 hours ago, MykePM said:

That's one hell of a conspiracy theory.  Are you actually suggesting that Douglas thinks that Darnold needs to go, but his agent is talking him out of it?  And Douglas is willing to risk his own job to do Sexton a solid?  Sexton is Gase's agent too.  Did that save him?

By the way, if Sexton was looking out for Darnold's interest, he'd be influencing Joe D. to trade him, not keep him.  I'm not saying that Darnold can't turn it around with the Jets, but I think the odds would go up if he got a fresh start with another team.

Agree.   Oatmeal post was silly in my view 

[Waka Flocka Flacco]

2 minutes ago, batman10023 said:

Agree.   Oatmeal post was silly in my view 

Money can be used to buy goods and services.

[NYJetsDaddy]

I’m stating the obvious here but...this is going to be such a long offseason ? 

[nycdan]

There are SO many permutations to free agency that speculating on the draft feels pointless to me right now.

But we have the cap room to bring in two premium Free agents.  If we get Robinson or Godwin, then WR at the top of round 1 doesn't feel urgent, although the talent certainly lines up there with Smith, Chase and Waddle.  I think the CB talent in the draft feels very strong at #34 with a lot of good names likely to still be there.  But if we can pry Lattimore from the Saints, then that isn't a strong need either.  We need an OG but we might be able to land Thuney or Scherff.  My hope is we solve two of those problems before the draft.  Edge would be nice, but I'm not sure the answer is going to be out there.  

So once the dust settles on Free Agency, this will all be much clearer.  I think we'll have a substantially stronger roster at that point, still with holes, but far less than we have now.   And that will give us the luxury of making strategic decisions if we do end up not getting Watson.  And that brings us to the #2 pick.

Your choice *could* be something like this:

a) Fields or Wilson

b) trade down, say CAR with #8, #39, 2022 1st, 2022 3rd, 2023 2nd.  I think that's maybe a bit conservative but let's go with it.  That could net us something like Chase or Waddle at #8, followed by picks at #23, #34, #39, #66, #86.  So something like a WR, Edge, CB, TE, RB, OT all in the first 3 rounds where you hope for starters.  Plus the free agents. 

Maybe Sam isn't 'they guy', but talk about a one-year turnaround.  This is what it could very well look like.  Add in the hopefully MUCH improved coaching staff, and I think even with Sam, this could be a competitive team next year if JD hits on half of his picks.

[DetroitRed]

2 hours ago, heymangold said:

Sorry but kittle was a 5th round pick.  Kelce was a 3rd. 

Never said he wasn’t 

[MykePM]

5 hours ago, Waka Flocka Flacco said:

The first year payout of Darnold's extension is going to be more than Gase's and Douglas's entire contracts put together. What part of this are you having difficulty with exactly?

Maybe I’m dense, but I’m not sure if the theory is that Sexton is coercing Joe Douglas to...

1. Just talk Darnold up, to increase his value

2. Hold onto Darnold and hand him the starting job on a silver platter, whether he’s earned it or not

3. Ultimately sign Darnold to a lucrative extension, whether he’s earned it or not

#1 might be in the Jets interest, if it somehow increases the return from trading Sam (although that’s a stretch), but #2 and #3 would be detrimental to the Jets and Douglas’s career if Sam continues to perform poorly.  So is Sexton’s influence so strong over Douglas that Joe D. would sabotage his own job to earn Sexton some extra money?  Or is the theory that Sexton would share the wealth with Douglas, and perhaps Robert Saleh too, as he’s speaking highly of Sam also?

Please spell this out directly, without innuendo, as if I were a child, because it makes no sense at all to me.

 

[BurnleyJet]

I want to trade back a few spots, build this team. No point having Watson with no team to build round him. I really think he ends up in Miami no income tax and Sun all year round.