Anyone else NOT want Watson?

[MaxAF]

58 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

On this years POS team, with its POS HC he would have beaten the Broncos, Pats 2Xs the Raiders and who know how many other games.   4-12? 

That’s purely speculative. But everyone has their opinion. Whatever the Jets do is fine by me. I’m sure they have a better perspective than the fickle fan base. 

[Jet Nut]

10 hours ago, Snell41 said:

He’s acting like Jamal Adams, do we really want a QB who acts like Jamal Adams?


Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

Hes acting nothing like Jamal adams.  

He hasnt insulted his owner.

He hasnt insulted his GM

He hasnt insulted his HC.

He hasnt said anything to insult any one in fact and more importantly, he hasnt said a word publicly, not on Twitter or anywhere.

Big difference

[Jet Nut]

18 minutes ago, MaxAF said:

That’s purely speculative. But everyone has their opinion. Whatever the Jets do is fine by me. I’m sure they have a better perspective than the fickle fan base. 

Nonsense

Those were close enough games that we're at least a 5 win team

Not any more speculative that your posting 4-12 as if it pertains to us

[Jetsfan80]

18 hours ago, #27TheDominator said:

Who are "you guys?"  The fact is, if draft capital doesn't pay off, we are ****ed, with Watson or without.  Draft capital paid off in 2009 and 2010.   Back when that fat **** was running the franchise and under Walt Michaels.  

I assume you're including Ferguson, Mangold, Revis and David Harris as part of that draft capital?  Because the fat f**k had nothing to do with that.  We saw what happened with the draft capital when he was "running the franchise".  

[Jets Voice of Reason]

1 minute ago, Jetsfan80 said:

I assume you're including Ferguson, Mangold, Revis and David Harris as part of that draft capital?  Because the fat f**k had nothing to do with that.

Scotty McKnight, John Conner, Quinton Coples, and Tajh Boyd baby.

[Jetsfan80]

16 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

All’s fair in love and penis. 

Especially symbolic ones.  @TeddEY

[slimjasi]

1 minute ago, Jets Voice of Reason said:

Scotty McKnight, John Conner, Quinton Coples, and Tajh Boyd baby.

The terminator!

[Jetsfan80]

17 hours ago, section314 said:

That’s not the point. The question was who do you think are better?

So you think Trevor Lawrence is better than Deshaun Watson???

I can absolutely accept someone saying that, if they were starting a franchise today, they'd take Lawrence over Watson.  But no one can say Lawrence is better than a current top 5 NFL QB until he starts playing NFL games.

[dcJet]

2 hours ago, MaxAF said:

That’s purely speculative. But everyone has their opinion. Whatever the Jets do is fine by me. I’m sure they have a better perspective than the fickle fan base. 

That's not true Max.

The fickle fans have been better than the Jets. 

Hopefully JD reads this forum and listens!

[Jetsfan80]

13 hours ago, Snell41 said:

He’s acting like Jamal Adams, do we really want a QB who acts like Jamal Adams?

No, he absolutely is not acting like Jamal Adams.  Not remotely.  Requesting a trade doesn't automatically make one a narcissistic diva. 

Pretty much no one who knows Adams actually likes Jamal Adams.  Not one teammate gave two sh*ts about Adams here after he was traded, or had anything nice to say about him during or after the process of him getting traded.  Meanwhile, everyone who knows Deshaun Watson loves him.  Everyone in the know understands this is about the Texans being the problem, not Watson.

[Jetsfan80]

19 hours ago, MaxAF said:

You could have a great QB and still go 4-12. Just saying. Jets have too many holes to fill. 

So what?  Watson would be 26 by then.  We'd have another decade of contending years ahead even if the team goes 4-12 next season (which it would not; we're not nearly the dumpster fire Houston has become).

This isn't about "What can Watson do immediately for the Jets"?  Which will still be a lot.  I think this team would make the playoffs in year 1 under him.  It's about how Watson is a top 5 QB just entering his prime, and will only get better.  Let Douglas worry about the other holes on the roster.  Fix the QB position for the first time in 5 decades, please.

[Jetsfan80]

20 hours ago, bgivs21 said:

Except for the fact that we have zero talent and people want to trade up to 4 picks plus our best player in Quinnen. 

It's going to be incredibly hard building a team around Watson. A realistic take is we'd be able to compete in 5-6 years if we hit on a couple later round picks, but thats incredibly hard.

This fairy tale you spun about Mahomes is just that. The team was already in place and loaded with talent when he took over for Alex Smith. The Chiefs put themselves in that position to be able to spend those resources (similar to the Rams and Stafford). 

Also Watson is not the 2nd best QB under 30 IMO, but no one can deny his talent. 

 

So in 5-6 years, Watson will be.....30-31.  Younger than Russell Wilson is right now.  

And no, it won't take that long to rebuild.  It never does in the NFL.  2 years, max.  We're not going to sit on that pile of cap space with Watson on board.  FA's will be clamoring to come here.  And we'd still have a lot of picks to work with, just not as many 1st rounders as we'd like.  Big deal. 

Denzel Mims will be a true WR1 when paired with Watson, and the Offensive Line will look great.  We just won't be able to grab a potential high-end EDGE or CB to help the defense out.  That's all we'll miss out on.

[Jetsfan80]

20 hours ago, Averagejetsfan1421 said:

Hey maybe we can even give them a jetsfan80 to there message board as well

* their

[Philc1]

3 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

Hes acting nothing like Jamal adams.  

He hasnt insulted his owner.

He hasnt insulted his GM

He hasnt insulted his HC.

He hasnt said anything to insult any one in fact and more importantly, he hasnt said a word publicly, not on Twitter or anywhere.

Big difference

We could just sign Marco Mariota 

[Philc1]

8 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Whatever they demand, the top offer (from us or from anyone) will be the top offer.

They can demand 6 first round picks for all I care if it makes them feel better about themselves, but no one’s going to pay it. 

That’s because we have all the leverage.  

[Philc1]

10 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

So in 5-6 years, Watson will be.....30-31.  Younger than Russell Wilson is right now.  

And no, it won't take that long to rebuild.  It never does in the NFL.  2 years, max.  We're not going to sit on that pile of cap space with Watson on board.  FA's will be clamoring to come here.  And we'd still have a lot of picks to work with, just not as many 1st rounders as we'd like.  Big deal. 

Denzel Mims will be a true WR1 when paired with Watson, and the Offensive Line will look great.  We just won't be able to grab a potential high-end EDGE or CB to help the defense out.  That's all we'll miss out on.

Watson had Fuller, Cooks, David Johnson and a better OL and head coach last season and won 2 more games

 

you can spend the remaining $35 million left in cap room after Watson’s $10 mil hit, the $20 million cap decrease, and signing the picks we do have left and we still have a roster maybe almost as good as the one he just went 4-12 with

[nycdan]

20 hours ago, bgivs21 said:

Except for the fact that we have zero talent and people want to trade up to 4 picks plus our best player in Quinnen. 

It's going to be incredibly hard building a team around Watson. A realistic take is we'd be able to compete in 5-6 years if we hit on a couple later round picks, but thats incredibly hard.

This fairy tale you spun about Mahomes is just that. The team was already in place and loaded with talent when he took over for Alex Smith. The Chiefs put themselves in that position to be able to spend those resources (similar to the Rams and Stafford). 

Also Watson is not the 2nd best QB under 30 IMO, but no one can deny his talent. 

First of all, nobody outside of the Houston fan forum 'wants' to trade 4 picks plus Quinnen for Watson.  That is a pipe dream over there.  Any deal with the Jets won't even come close to that.

Second, Watson really is the 2nd best QB under 30.  I can't even guess who else you are considering behind Mahomes unless you are fully on the Allen train.  Not entirely unreasonable, but I think the vast majority of people around the league would disagree with that.

[T0mShane]

5 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

We could just sign Marco Mariota 

[#27TheDominator]

46 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

I assume you're including Ferguson, Mangold, Revis and David Harris as part of that draft capital?  Because the fat f**k had nothing to do with that.  We saw what happened with the draft capital when he was "running the franchise".  

The fat **** was 1998.  We were riding that wave through Herm.  Rex was fat, but he was more of an ass than a ****.

[nycdan]

1 minute ago, Philc1 said:

Watson had Fuller, Cooks, David Johnson and a better OL and head coach last season and won 2 more games

 

you can spend the remaining $35 million left in cap room after Watson’s $10 mil hit, the $20 million cap decrease, and signing the picks we do have left and we still have a roster maybe almost as good as the one he just went 4-12 with

Your cap numbers are way off.  We are maybe $63M under right now (as per overthecap).  Watson's $10M hit will likely be offset by Darnold's $10M savings.  And I fully expect Henry Anderson to be gone adding $8M more.  So that puts us over $70M which is twice your number.

As to talent, David Johnson is pretty much done.  And just for sake of argument, if we signed one of the two big name OGs and either Robinson or Godwin at WR, we would have a better roster than HOU had last year, which isn't saying much, but at least there would be star power.  One fair question is how much of their offense was due to Fuller and Cooks being more talented than our guys versus how much of it was just Watson making those guys look better than they are.  I'd love to find out by comparing how he plays here next season .  The reason I think this is a question is that Watson didn't really lose a step when he lost Hopkins.  And that genuinely surprised me.

 

[Philc1]

4 minutes ago, nycdan said:

Your cap numbers are way off.  We are maybe $63M under right now (as per overthecap).  Watson's $10M hit will likely be offset by Darnold's $10M savings.  And I fully expect Henry Anderson to be gone adding $8M more.  So that puts us over $70M which is twice your number.

As to talent, David Johnson is pretty much done.  And just for sake of argument, if we signed one of the two big name OGs and either Robinson or Godwin at WR, we would have a better roster than HOU had last year, which isn't saying much, but at least there would be star power.  One fair question is how much of their offense was due to Fuller and Cooks being more talented than our guys versus how much of it was just Watson making those guys look better than they are.  I'd love to find out by comparing how he plays here next season .  The reason I think this is a question is that Watson didn't really lose a step when he lost Hopkins.  And that genuinely surprised me.

 

The cap is still decreasing by $20-30 million 

[nycdan]

4 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

The cap is still decreasing by $20-30 million 

Jason is using a number of $176M for his calculations which already reflects that.  Everything I've seen said the NFL has mostly agreed not to take it lower than that.

[MaxAF]

1 hour ago, dcJet said:

That's not true Max.

The fickle fans have been better than the Jets. 

Hopefully JD reads this forum and listens!

Some of us. Yes, I agree

[MaxAF]

3 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

Nonsense

Those were close enough games that we're at least a 5 win team

Not any more speculative that your posting 4-12 as if it pertains to us

All I’m saying is the Jets need more than a QB to be competitive. And what I’ve read so far is the Texans want 2 1sts, 2 2nds and 2 players. Too steep my my rational instincts. If JD can work out a reasonable trade, I’m all in.

[Sperm Edwards]

59 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

That’s because we have all the leverage.  

Up to a point. If we were the only ones who'd put in an offer then we'd have all the leverage.

Given the expected amount of interested teams, Houston has plenty of leverage of their own. The only thing that kills it a little bit is Watson's veto power, but we'd have to see him exercise it before that's considered a handicap. 

Also let's see if they actually start inviting/receiving formal offers first. 

[#27TheDominator]

13 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Up to a point. If we were the only ones who'd put in an offer then we'd have all the leverage.

Given the expected amount of interested teams, Houston has plenty of leverage of their own. The only thing that kills it a little bit is Watson's veto power, but we'd have to see him exercise it before that's considered a handicap. 

Also let's see if they actually start inviting/receiving formal offers first. 

BUT WHAT IF JON GRUDEN WANTS HIM!!!  WE HAVE TO GIVE UP OUR NEXT 7 FIRST ROUDNERS TO BEAT THAT!  What QB woudln't want to play for Gruden?  I mean the guy absolutely made the careers of Jeff George, Brad Johnson, Chris Simms, Brian Griese, Bruce Gradkowski, Jeff Garcia and Derek Carr. 

[CTJetsFan]

My answer to the OP's question is: not at the price being "speculated" (4 picks, 2 players).

The wild card in this whole equation is we don't know the value JD & Houston put on the #2 pick. Yes, it's just 1 pick, but it is the #2 pick in the draft. Take Lawrence out of the equation (assuming he's going to Jax.....but stranger things have happened).

a) Is there someone HOU loves at #2?

b) Does Houston want #2 to trade back and amass more trade capital?

c) Does HOU see any value in Darnold?

My line in the sand would be the 2021 #2 pick, the higher of the 2 2022 #1s and 1 more pick (a 2023 #1, a future 2 or 3 this year) and Darnold (if they want him). The Rams gave up 2 future (not 2021) #1 picks for Stafford (valued as 2nd rounders today) and are a team that should be picking lower than the Jets next year.

The value of the #2 pick this year (and to some extent, the perceived value of Darnold by others...not @Jetsfan80's value lol) is the wild card in this whole equation.

[#27TheDominator]

ALL the cards are wild!

[Savage69]

11 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Whatever they demand, the top offer (from us or from anyone) will be the top offer.

They can demand 6 first round picks for all I care if it makes them feel better about themselves, but no one’s going to pay it. 

I bet there are some on this board would..

[Biggs]

3 hours ago, Philc1 said:

Watson had Fuller, Cooks, David Johnson and a better OL and head coach last season and won 2 more games

 

you can spend the remaining $35 million left in cap room after Watson’s $10 mil hit, the $20 million cap decrease, and signing the picks we do have left and we still have a roster maybe almost as good as the one he just went 4-12 with

David Johnson stopped producing the day he was paid.  

[section314]

4 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

So you think Trevor Lawrence is better than Deshaun Watson???

I can absolutely accept someone saying that, if they were starting a franchise today, they'd take Lawrence over Watson.  But no one can say Lawrence is better than a current top 5 NFL QB until he starts playing NFL games.

The only reason anybody on this board gives a crap about Watson is because we blew the chance to get Lawrence. If the Texans called Jacksonville and offered Watson straight up for the first pick, the Jags would laugh in their face. Even Dabo wouldn't make that trade.

[Savage69]

4 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

No, he absolutely is not acting like Jamal Adams.  Not remotely.  Requesting a trade doesn't automatically make one a narcissistic diva. 

Pretty much no one who knows Adams actually likes Jamal Adams.  Not one teammate gave two sh*ts about Adams here after he was traded, or had anything nice to say about him during or after the process of him getting traded.  Meanwhile, everyone who knows Deshaun Watson loves him.  Everyone in the know understands this is about the Texans being the problem, not Watson.

If Watson didn't like Houston he shouldn't have signed the contract..

[TheMo]

On 2/2/2021 at 2:58 PM, munchmemory said:

I know folks think we're insane.  But I could probably live with this.  If Watson lives up to the expectations, we'll be lauding and toasting that deal as what finally jump started our franchise toward the SB win.

But as beerfish has mentioned what exactly is different about us vs the Texans at some point. The reason they suck is trading away their firsts for people in the first place. The only cluster that I would hope JD doesn’t replicate is the Hopkins one. But otherwise you’re in the same situation that only had Watson winning 4 games. And you won’t be able use a 1st improve the team around him. I guess if you’re arguing for three years down the line you might have a point. 

[Savage69]

4 minutes ago, TheMo said:

But as beerfish has mentioned what exactly is different about us vs the Texans at some point. The reason they suck is trading away their firsts for people in the first place. The only cluster that I would hope JD doesn’t replicate is the Hopkins one. But otherwise you’re in the same situation that only had Watson winning 4 games. And you won’t be able use a 1st improve the team around him. I guess if you’re arguing for three years down the line you might have a point. 

Watson at that time would be demanding a trade and the cycle continues.. LOL

[TheMo]

40 minutes ago, Savage69 said:

If Watson didn't like Houston he shouldn't have signed the contract..

Right so you sign a contract and then the situations becomes unprofessional and the guy running it is basing stuff off of things that make you personally uncomfortable. 

A modified example:

I sign a contract as an anesthesiologist at a hospital. Then several months later the chair of the department is a man with only a religious background who begins passive aggressively texting me and my colleagues over things. He then texts someone’s mother and back stabs others in the organization. Despite being told that the faculty would be represented we are cut out and the CEO is busy praying with the new dude while ignoring external consultants who were hired to solve the problem. Also a long standing respected colleague goes to the local paper and sounds the alarm. I now let it be known that I want to be released from my contract due to these major cultural issues within the org.

am I really a malcontent? I tend to think not.