Rapoport: Carson Wentz next QB domino to drop. Colour me terrified.

[GreekJet]

Wow! If Wentz goes for that package the Jets might actually be able to get a first for Darnold. 

[HawkeyeJet]

Im not a cap guy, how would the swap of contracts work?  Is it just as simple as Foles remaining money just offsets some of Wentz's? 

[Lith]

12 minutes ago, HawkeyeJet said:

Im not a cap guy, how would the swap of contracts work?  Is it just as simple as Foles tensing money just offsets some of Wentz's? 

I think it would free up about $20 million for Eagles.  Each team assumes base salary plus (I think) any roster bonus not yet paid.  Wentz is due $15 mil base and $10M roster bonus in March, which would be picked up by Bears..  Foles has $4mil base and Cohen is $1.4M base which would be assumed by Philly.  Net $20M savings to the Eagles.

At least thats how I think it would work, for this season.  And considering the Bears are over the cap right now, they would have a lot of work to do to fit Wentz.  Maybe restructure Wentz and Mack.  

[RogerVick1980]

This is good for the Jets.. Gotta figure a team like the Colts are desperate  for a Qb now and  maybe the Steelers would also be involved.

Thought the rumors of getting a first for Darnold were crazy but now I think they’res  a chance.. 

[RogerVick1980]

I just don’t get the Bears giving up a first and a player for Wentz..

 

I get they were desperate for a Qb but who were they bidding against? Wentz should cost a second rounder and Foles.. not a first 

[JH Jet Fan]

Not hard to figure out...QB is the most important position in sports.  It's why they created the franchise tag and why they protect them from getting injured.  The demand far outweighs the supply.  Other than Watson...there are no sure things...whether it's a FA, draft pick, or change of scenary scenario.

A lot of people here have been not only quick to give up on Sam, but also selling him short as far as his value to other teams.

This is a defining moment in Jet history and JD should not rush into it without exploring all options. 

The worst thing JD, or any GM for that matter, can do is improperly evaluate what you already have in the building.  That is fact.  That's quickest way to end up unemployed.

He did not request a trade like Watson, Stafford, or Wentz.  He wants to be here.  He's only 23 and didn't start playing QB until he was a senior in HS.  He's also still on his first contract.  He also was in an offensive system that was QB unfriendly and inflexible as far as taking advantage of skillset of tje players on the roster.

Any deal for Sam should be unique and factor all this in.  I don't care if it's 2021, 2022, or even 2023.  The going rate for QBs under normal circumstances is 2 1sts.  Any deal should protect the Jets in the event, he not only finds success elsewhere, but eventually lands a huge contract befitting a franchise QB with team that trades for him.

This isn't fantasy football where you're trying to fleece your pals...teams make deals to benefit one another.  That's it.  Should Sam become a Franchise QB, which I personally believe is very possible, there isn't a team in the NFL that would not gladly pay the price of 2 1sts.

 

[32EBoozer]

Trade expected to be announced this week according to Louis Reddick of ESPN. I’m expecting to see a mid 1st rd. pick this year and a player going each way. Cap relief player going from Eagles and a cheap quality player coming back to Eagles as well 

[dcJet]

Philly opens the path for Hurts.  Troy Aikman was full of bullcrap.

 

[dcJet]

No way we get a first for Sam.  Wentz is way better.

 

[Skeet Ulrich]

I don't get trading for Foles, the toothpaste is out of the tube at this point. Should've never traded him after the 2018 season but that time has passed now.

[JH Jet Fan]

43 minutes ago, dcJet said:

No way we get a first for Sam.  Wentz is way better.

 

Hmm...I'm tempted to take that bet.

Wentz is also way older, way more spoiled, way worse a teammate, and carries a pretty hefty salary, to go with reconstructed knee.

And Sam has shown flashes of brilliance just like Wentz has.  I know this...Wentz was god awful this year.  Not even Sam played that poorly.

All it takes is two teams to believe they can bring best out in Sam.  Maybe it's swapping #12 for #34 this year or a 1st in 2022 or conditional 1st in 2023.

[Shockwave]

51 minutes ago, dcJet said:

No way we get a first for Sam.  Wentz is way better.

 

Sam is definitely more valuable. So much cheaper. 6 years younger. Still Fixable. Whatever Wentz gets we should be able to get for Sam. 

If Chicago gives a first for Wentz - Indy should be offering their first for Sam. Indy's First round pick is prob the trade that happens for Sam at some point if this goes down. 

[JH Jet Fan]

Cause Howie Roseman is just one step above Jack Easterly as far as football executives go.  He's a number cruncher like Mr. T and Idzik were.

That said, Foles is a true professional.  He'd be good to have around for Hurts or a rookie QB.  They will have #6 and #20...that's probably a good start if they fall in love with a QB and want to jump up to #2.

[JH Jet Fan]

4 minutes ago, Shockwave said:

Sam is definitely more valuable. So much cheaper. 6 years younger. Still Fixable. Whatever Wentz gets we should be able to get for Sam. 

If Chicago gives a first for Wentz - Indy should be offering their first for Sam. Indy's First round pick is prob the trade that happens for Sam at some point if this goes down. 

Absolutely agree with this take.

[Beerfish]

If Philly are semi committed to Hurts they are making a grave mistake on a short piece of work imo.

[JH Jet Fan]

3 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

If Philly are semi committed to Hurts they are making a grave mistake on a short piece of work imo.

Do you mean in trading Wentz?  Cause I think like Watson, he's made clear he wants out no matter what.

I don't necessarily means they're committed to Hurts but we're definitely going to find out.  Howie did trade up for Wentz.  In fact, he traded up twice for Wentz.  Once with Dolphins and once with another team I can't remember.  Titans or Browns, maybe.

[GreekJet]

2 hours ago, JH Jet Fan said:

Absolutely agree with this take.

Wentz has accomplished significantly more than Darnold in his career. He’s really only one season removed from behind an above average QB. Plus the Bears are desperate. This is why you fire people in the NFL. Nagy and Pace are making a reckless decision based on self-preservation (hoping they catch lightning in a bottle with Wentz). 
 

With that said I find it odd that Goff essentially got Brock Osweillere’d if Wentz is worth a first round pick +. 
 

 

[Anthony Jet]

5 hours ago, GreekJet said:

 

With that said I find it odd that Goff essentially got Brock Osweillere’d if Wentz is worth a first round pick +. 
 

 

This has me scratching my head also, 

[32EBoozer]

9 hours ago, dcJet said:

Philly opens the path for Hurts.  Troy Aikman was full of bullcrap.

 

What did Aikman say?

[dcJet]

1 hour ago, 32EBoozer said:

What did Aikman say?

Aikman said Pederson was fired for wanting to go with Hurts while management and owner wanted Wentz.

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/troy-aikman-says-eagles-doug-pederson-firing-due-to-coach-preferring-jalen-hurts-over-carson-wentz/#:~:text=Troy Aikman says Eagles' Doug,over Carson Wentz - CBSSports.com

 

[dcJet]

10 hours ago, JH Jet Fan said:

Hmm...I'm tempted to take that bet.

Wentz is also way older, way more spoiled, way worse a teammate, and carries a pretty hefty salary, to go with reconstructed knee.

And Sam has shown flashes of brilliance just like Wentz has.  I know this...Wentz was god awful this year.  Not even Sam played that poorly.

All it takes is two teams to believe they can bring best out in Sam.  Maybe it's swapping #12 for #34 this year or a 1st in 2022 or conditional 1st in 2023.

Good post except for bolded.  It's not even close.  Wentz has played at an MVP level.  Sam's flashes were barely twinkles in comparison. 

Good points about the age, personality, salary and health but Wentz beats Sam on past performance and potential which trumps all those.

Wentz has a better chance of regaining, than Sam has of ascending.

 

[dcJet]

10 hours ago, Shockwave said:

Sam is definitely more valuable. So much cheaper. 6 years younger. Still Fixable. Whatever Wentz gets we should be able to get for Sam. 

If Chicago gives a first for Wentz - Indy should be offering their first for Sam. Indy's First round pick is prob the trade that happens for Sam at some point if this goes down. 

I disagree on Wertz vs Sam.  If they offer a first or second, we should grab it immediately.

If I was Indy, I'd re-sign Brissett and draft Mac or Trey before I'd give up a first for Sam.  

We'll see.

[Integrity28]

17 minutes ago, dcJet said:

I disagree on Wertz vs Sam.  If they offer a first or second, we should grab it immediately.

If I was Indy, I'd re-sign Brissett and draft Mac or Trey before I'd give up a first for Sam.  

We'll see.

This.

The only logic for the Colts acquiring Sam is from biased Jets fans. Otherwise, it makes very little sense.

The Colts have traded first round picks twice (as far as I recall) under current GM. 1st was to us to swap picks and they loaded up. 2nd was for Deforest Buckner. 

Seems to me they only part with a 1 if the return is proven or value. Sam is neither.

[JH Jet Fan]

8 hours ago, GreekJet said:

Wentz has accomplished significantly more than Darnold in his career. He’s really only one season removed from behind an above average QB. Plus the Bears are desperate. This is why you fire people in the NFL. Nagy and Pace are making a reckless decision based on self-preservation (hoping they catch lightning in a bottle with Wentz). 
 

With that said I find it odd that Goff essentially got Brock Osweillere’d if Wentz is worth a first round pick +. 
 

 

 

32 minutes ago, dcJet said:

Good post except for bolded.  It's not even close.  Wentz has played at an MVP level.  Sam's flashes were barely twinkles in comparison. 

Good points about the age, personality, salary and health but Wentz beats Sam on past performance and potential which trumps all those.

Wentz has a better chance of regaining, than Sam has of ascending.

 

GreekJet & dcJet:

You're both right.  Wentz has accomplished more than Darnold.  My flashes of brilliance comment wasn't meant to be a statistical comparison of the two.

Wentz did play at an MVP level, got hurt, and Eagles won SB without him.  Doesn't that speak more to the level of players around him?

Obviously can't make apples to apples comparison here, but as Eagles Oline and Skilled Players declined, so did Wentz' performance.

The Jets have literally done nothing to help Sam.  They have zero gamebreakers.  No one a DC has to gameplan against.  Not a single one.  Their Oline, specifically the interior, has been brutal.  How many times has it appeared right off snap, there's a jailbreak and Sam is running for his life.  They haven't been able to run the ball and keep defenses honest.  And Gase's offenses have never, ever been committed to doing so.  I've said this before I believe...Gase truly is an offensive genius.  His schemes do get people wide open.  The problem is it is too QB unfriendly.  Darnold & Tannenhill together don't have the experience Peyton did.  In 2021, you gotta maximize talents of players you have and whether it's through presnap motion, rollouts to make half field easier reads, or committing to run where play action is actually a threat.  Gase did no e of this.  He saw how his vision for an offense can be executed properly by a HOF QB and three times now, including Chicago, it did not work.

 

[Philc1]

11 hours ago, Beerfish said:

If Philly are semi committed to Hurts they are making a grave mistake on a short piece of work imo.

Eagles are the latest team to fall into the Brad Smith trap

[JH Jet Fan]

Only two teams rumored to be hot & heavy for Wentz are Bears and Colts who have ties to his great season when John DeFilippo was his QB Coach & Frank Reich his OC.

We are talking about the 20th & 21st picks in the draft.  I know why Bears are doing it...Pace & Nagy are desperate and have one last chance or they're gone.  If Colts do pass, and then pursue Darnold with #21.  That says a lot about Wentz vs Darnold as far as I'm concerned.

[JH Jet Fan]

38 minutes ago, Integrity28 said:

This.

The only logic for the Colts acquiring Sam is from biased Jets fans. Otherwise, it makes very little sense.

The Colts have traded first round picks twice (as far as I recall) under current GM. 1st was to us to swap picks and they loaded up. 2nd was for Deforest Buckner. 

Seems to me they only part with a 1 if the return is proven or value. Sam is neither.

Problem with that is...they aren't getting a proven QB for just pick #21.  The value of QBs is unlike any other position in the NFL.  The return is always more than the casual fan expects.

[Philc1]

The Stafford trade ruined the market

[JH Jet Fan]

5 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

The Stafford trade ruined the market

Not for us it didn't.  This is working out perfectly for us.  

Not sure it ruined it though, Cutler went for 2 1s.  Palmer went for a 1.  Even Sam Bradford went for a 1.  As I said before, QB is most important position in sports thus prices should be higher than every other non-QB deal and they always have.  Even Rosen, who was terrible, garnered a 2 & 5.

[deucebag]

16 minutes ago, JH Jet Fan said:

Not for us it didn't.  This is working out perfectly for us.  

Not sure it ruined it though, Cutler went for 2 1s.  Palmer went for a 1.  Even Sam Bradford went for a 1.  As I said before, QB is most important position in sports thus prices should be higher than every other non-QB deal and they always have.  Even Rosen, who was terrible, garnered a 2 & 5.

Even Richard Todd garnered a 1.

[joewilly12]

13 hours ago, dcJet said:

Troy Aikman was full of bullcrap.

Always is him and Joe Buck are the 2 worst announcers also. 

[JH Jet Fan]

18 minutes ago, deucebag said:

Even Richard Todd garnered a 1.

That's right!!!  Forgot about that.

[deucebag]

Here's what I could see happening.  

1)  Jets Trade Darnold and a #3 to the Niners for their #1

2) Niners cut Jimmy G.   NE signs Jimmy G

3) Jets trade down from #2 with Cincinnati who wants Sewell and also get a second rounder.

4) Jets select Trey Lance at #5

5) Jets sign either Bethard or Mullens to start in 2021.

6) Jets select TE Kyle Pitts at 12

7) Jets select Travis Etienne at #23.

8)  Jets grab Jayson Oweh and Creed Humphrey in Round 2.

[JH Jet Fan]

18 minutes ago, deucebag said:

Here's what I could see happening.  

1)  Jets Trade Darnold and a #3 to the Niners for their #1

2) Niners cut Jimmy G.   NE signs Jimmy G

3) Jets trade down from #2 with Cincinnati who wants Sewell and also get a second rounder.

4) Jets select Trey Lance at #5

5) Jets sign either Bethard or Mullens to start in 2021.

6) Jets select TE Kyle Pitts at 12

7) Jets select Travis Etienne at #23.

8)  Jets grab Jayson Oweh and Creed Humphrey in Round 2.

Respectfully disagree with #3 and #7.  

Highly rare for team to trade into top 3 for a non-QB.  Don't think Cindy can afford to give up a 2nd for Sewell when Slater is still there for them.  And besides, the teams looking for a QB will blow that offer out of the water.

I like Etienne and Harris but truly a waste to invest 1st round pick in a RB in the Shanahan Offense.  Been proven for over two decades now.

And I definitely see Beathard.  He's UFA.  Think Mullins is RFA.  Could be wrong though.

[Greensleeves]

33 minutes ago, deucebag said:

Here's what I could see happening.  

1)  Jets Trade Darnold and a #3 to the Niners for their #1

2) Niners cut Jimmy G.   NE signs Jimmy G

3) Jets trade down from #2 with Cincinnati who wants Sewell and also get a second rounder.

4) Jets select Trey Lance at #5

5) Jets sign either Bethard or Mullens to start in 2021.

6) Jets select TE Kyle Pitts at 12

7) Jets select Travis Etienne at #23.

8)  Jets grab Jayson Oweh and Creed Humphrey in Round 2.

If we trade Darnold we must end up with Watson or Wilson. Take that extra #1 and use it in a package for Watson. You can still have 1 #1 this year, a #2, two 3s to build around Watson. If not, grab Wilson and use the other two #1s and the rest of the picks to build around him. I really think Wilson is going to be a legitimate star in the NFL. The way he looks off of safetys, scans the field, has incredible accuracy and touch but also an extremely live arm illustrates that he has all the key traits to be a great QB.