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That O-line performance ups the odds that Darnold returns


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Turns out the injuries on the O-line for KC were the difference maker in the game.  Mahomes looked pedestrian with the revolving doors on the line.  And Wisniewski coming back from the scrap heap to play. 

That game ups the argument that the Jets would be wiser to use their capital to build pieces around Darnold for this year, including a superior offensive line.  They have 2 draft picks next year and could leverage those to get a QB if it doesn't work.  But judging by the teams that are bidding on Darnold, I suspect his upside at 24 years old with a good offensive line, 3 years of experience in the NFL, and a system to match his skills gets us much further toward the playoffs than taking a QB at 2 and starting over.

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I don’t think JD or Saleh want to build their legacy around a QB they didn’t draft... Sam showed some flashes in year one... but has not inspired anyone since, and I like Sam... this breakdown says it all...the good bad and very ugly...

 

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Just now, BCJet said:

And that offensive line with Jameis Winston, Ryan Tannenhill or Sam Darnold would have had their season end 3 weeks ago.

Nope, their oline was down to 2 starters for the SB. Not the same group that played well together most of the year.

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I watched that game and I watched Mahomes repeatedly put the ball on guys hands while being dragged to the turf after spinning around a dozen times to let guys get open.  I don't recall seeing that happen when the Jets had the ball. 

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2 minutes ago, Patriot Killa said:

Nah, Darnold just stood there and took sacks, threw into double coverage out of confusion and desperation to get the ball out and never did he once make an actual play out of any of those drop backs.

and then i would come here and still read that it was the OL, wrs and gms' faults.

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5 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

I watched that game and I watched Mahomes repeatedly put the ball on guys hands while being dragged to the turf after spinning around a dozen times to let guys get open.  I don't recall seeing that happen when the Jets had the ball. 

He put the ball in guys hands...the other teams hands

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1 minute ago, Patriot Killa said:

Nah, Darnold just stood there and took sacks, threw into double coverage out of confusion and desperation to get the ball out and never did he once make an actual play out of any of those drop backs.

Folks still defending the Darnold myths.   He needs to go for whatever we can get for him in return.  And if it means releasing Darnold outright with zero compensation rather than seeing him as our QB next season?   I'm totally fine with that.  Actually, I'd be ecstatic.

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3 minutes ago, Augustiniak said:

and then i would come here and still read that it was the OL, wrs and gms' faults.

Then we watch Joe Flacco pull the deep ball attack from out of the grave it’s been buried In for years and post a TD/INT ratio of 6 to 3 in two games with the same weapons Darnold went 9 to 11 with in far more games played. Darnold cannot read the field well enough to have consistent success. Darnold gets very confused in both his post snap and pre snap reads but he is especially awful in his post snap reads. When defenders start rotating in coverage, Darnold absolutely goes brain dead.

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Bottom line is, you still need a QB to get you to the dance.  I hope JD knows that.  You do need both a great Offensive Line and a star QB but which is much more difficult to find? 

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1 hour ago, Phillyjet said:

Turns out the injuries on the O-line for KC were the difference maker in the game.  Mahomes looked pedestrian with the revolving doors on the line.  And Wisniewski coming back from the scrap heap to play. 

That game ups the argument that the Jets would be wiser to use their capital to build pieces around Darnold for this year, including a superior offensive line.  They have 2 draft picks next year and could leverage those to get a QB if it doesn't work.  But judging by the teams that are bidding on Darnold, I suspect his upside at 24 years old with a good offensive line, 3 years of experience in the NFL, and a system to match his skills gets us much further toward the playoffs than taking a QB at 2 and starting over.

There was zero in that game that made the argument that Darnold can play at a high level with a better OL.  The difference in that game was far more than the breakdown in the OL play.  KC was able to run the ball and didn't do it enough.  KC D was overmatched and lost it's composure.  Mahomes was clearly not 100%, Kelce and Hill were taken out of their game and Reid didn't run the ball enough when the game was still in hand.  

Mahomes was making crazy passes that were on target despite the rush.  Tampa Bays back 7 played out of their minds and Kelce looked like the pressure got to him.

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3 hours ago, Patriot Killa said:

Super clueless take imo.

Super clueless I guess, but an opinion nevertheless shared by people who work in the league, including coaches and front offices that I guess are clueless as well.   It's weird though that some of those front offices are among the best franchises in the league.  But what do they know?

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I just do not see it. They will throw all their public support they can behind Darnold, and even leak to the press (Cimini) that they are planning on keeping him, but I just do not see Saleh attaching his future to Darnold. By the time the draft comes around I think it will be really surprising if we do not take a QB at #2. It just makes too much sense for a new regime.

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4 hours ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

No. It doesn’t and shouldn’t. Darnold is not good. Even with zero time to throw the ball, Mahomes made plays that Darnold couldn’t dream about making. You cannot bring Darnold back and expect fans to take your regime seriously. There needs to be a change there. Period. 

That's it! .and JD must know this too

It's the reason why I'm quite certain Sam will be traded.  There's simply no room for error if you keep him.  The other options give them time.

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5 hours ago, LSJF said:

I don’t think JD or Saleh want to build their legacy around a QB they didn’t draft... Sam showed some flashes in year one... but has not inspired anyone since, and I like Sam... this breakdown says it all...the good bad and very ugly...

 

It's plays like the one at the 2:16 mark that have me convinced Sam will never be a franchise QB. You can't coach a QB to see the field. He couldn't spot a wide open receiver just 10 yards away. Denzel Mims was standing there all alone for what had to be about five seconds for an easy touchdown.

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4 hours ago, Patriot Killa said:

Then we watch Joe Flacco pull the deep ball attack from out of the grave it’s been buried In for years and post a TD/INT ratio of 6 to 3 in two games with the same weapons Darnold went 9 to 11 with in far more games played. Darnold cannot read the field well enough to have consistent success. Darnold gets very confused in both his post snap and pre snap reads but he is especially awful in his post snap reads. When defenders start rotating in coverage, Darnold absolutely goes brain dead.

Good.  But another difference is Flacco has a ton of experience and knows how to play the game. Darnold doesn’t have the experience and has to rely on the coaching.  Obviously his coaching wasn’t so good.

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5 hours ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

No. It doesn’t and shouldn’t. Darnold is not good. Even with zero time to throw the ball, Mahomes made plays that Darnold couldn’t dream about making. You cannot bring Darnold back and expect fans to take your regime seriously. There needs to be a change there. Period. 

In reality Mahomes can make plays that not just Darnold can’t make but any other QB can’t make

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2 hours ago, rangerous said:

Good.  But another difference is Flacco has a ton of experience and knows how to play the game. Darnold doesn’t have the experience and has to rely on the coaching.  Obviously his coaching wasn’t so good.

Excuses. I’ve seen plenty of 1st & 2nd year players process post and pre snap much better and much quicker.

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49 minutes ago, Patriot Killa said:

Excuses. I’ve seen plenty of 1st & 2nd year players process post and pre snap much better and much quicker.

That kid for Washington looked 10 times more composed than Darnold in the wild card game vs TB and he was in college 4 weeks before that.

It's stunning how people will handwave away 38 games worth of horrible starts from Darnold.

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2 hours ago, Skeet Ulrich said:

That kid for Washington looked 10 times more composed than Darnold in the wild card game vs TB and he was in college 4 weeks before that.

It's stunning how people will handwave away 38 games worth of horrible starts from Darnold.

Kyler Murray put up slightly better numbers in his rookie year than Darnold did in his 2nd year. Gardner Minshew put up better numbers in his rookie year than Darnold ever has. We’re talking about a guy who has never even eclipsed 20 TD’s in a season. Herbert shattered the NFL world in his first year, Baker shattered it his rookie year. Nick Mullens looked like he had a better clue in limited action & that’s with no experience. They all show the ability to read defenses and make quicker decisions than Darnold.

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11 hours ago, LSJF said:

I don’t think JD or Saleh want to build their legacy around a QB they didn’t draft... Sam showed some flashes in year one... but has not inspired anyone since, and I like Sam... this breakdown says it all...the good bad and very ugly...

 

This is such a dumb argument, that continues to be replayed here...

So JD and Saleh would be stupid to cash their chips on Darnold, who is still only 23 yrs old and was the #3 overall pick less than 3 yrs ago...

As opposed to giving up on Darnold, and drafting the next guy and who the hell knows if Fields or Wilson become the QB that apparently Darnold cannot be?  And if Darnold goes some where else and shines, and Fields/Wilson flounders, aren't we in the same spot?

Absurd...

Darnold is better than both Fields and Wilson right now, same amount of potential, debatable whether more or slightly less, but Darnold has 3 yrs of experience and growing pains, and has displayed toughness in playing the position and knows the NFL game.  He's a much better fit in the system that is coming to the team.

Staying with Darnold or trading him away and going after the next guy (unless it's Watson) is just as risky.  Except, sticking with Darnold, allows to build big time around him.  And I sure as hell don't want to give up the farm for Watson.

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1 hour ago, jeremy2020 said:

This is going to be a joy of an off season. People actually thinking darnold is as good as mahomes. 

I don’t think anyone believes that. But I do think a lot of us believe the other O team members make a difference.

Its because Mahomes is known to be great but still laid an egg that we focus on the whole roster. Not just the QB. 

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I hate to be a downer. There's so much offensive line talk on here.

Joe Douglas signed basically, possibly even literally, everyone to one year contracts last offseason...except Lewis, Van Roten, McGovern, and Fant. 

He also left himself room to get out of all of those contracts except McGovern's, to be fair. So he absolutely has the flexibility to go find upgrades.

But those guys weren't all on multi year deals by accident. Becton is on his rookie deal too, so all five opening day starters next year are signed through 2022. It's those guys, his draft picks, Maccagnan's remaining draft picks from the year before, bubble guys, Griffin who Douglas extended before last offseason, and that Mosley deal and that's the year Mosley likely gets cut. 

Continuity on the offensive line is a big factor in the quality of play as well. Metrics back that up.

We'd all like a great line, but I think we're probably looking at one new starter next year - maybe two. Not some big overhaul.

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1 hour ago, JetsRay said:

This is such a dumb argument, that continues to be replayed here...

So JD and Saleh would be stupid to cash their chips on Darnold, who is still only 23 yrs old and was the #3 overall pick less than 3 yrs ago...

As opposed to giving up on Darnold, and drafting the next guy and who the hell knows if Fields or Wilson become the QB that apparently Darnold cannot be?  And if Darnold goes some where else and shines, and Fields/Wilson flounders, aren't we in the same spot?

Absurd...

Darnold is better than both Fields and Wilson right now, same amount of potential, debatable whether more or slightly less, but Darnold has 3 yrs of experience and growing pains, and has displayed toughness in playing the position and knows the NFL game.  He's a much better fit in the system that is coming to the team.

Staying with Darnold or trading him away and going after the next guy (unless it's Watson) is just as risky.  Except, sticking with Darnold, allows to build big time around him.  And I sure as hell don't want to give up the farm for Watson.

Did you watch this video? It was unbiased and showed the good the bad and the pathetic… The thing with Sam, we are going to owe him a ton of money after this season... JD and Saleh didn’t didn’t draft him... therefore there’s no allegiance...

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On 2/8/2021 at 7:43 AM, Phillyjet said:

Turns out the injuries on the O-line for KC were the difference maker in the game.  Mahomes looked pedestrian with the revolving doors on the line.  And Wisniewski coming back from the scrap heap to play. 

That game ups the argument that the Jets would be wiser to use their capital to build pieces around Darnold for this year, including a superior offensive line.  They have 2 draft picks next year and could leverage those to get a QB if it doesn't work.  But judging by the teams that are bidding on Darnold, I suspect his upside at 24 years old with a good offensive line, 3 years of experience in the NFL, and a system to match his skills gets us much further toward the playoffs than taking a QB at 2 and starting over.

Exactly my sentiments 

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On 2/8/2021 at 12:26 PM, Phillyjet said:

Super clueless I guess, but an opinion nevertheless shared by people who work in the league, including coaches and front offices that I guess are clueless as well.   It's weird though that some of those front offices are among the best franchises in the league.  But what do they know?

Other front offices think that how the Chiefs' injury/ailment-riddled Offensive Line played in 1 game has something to do with what the Jets will do with Darnold?

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