3 Reasons the Jets Must Keep Darnold

[Biggs]

Great argument for trading Darnold and building a better team with the extra pick.  We can roll with Morgan and get another piece.  
 

if you think the team sucks and no QB can make a difference that’s not an argument to keep Darnold.  It’s an argument to trade him and trade down. 

[CanadaSteve]

9 hours ago, rayzor said:

Rookie QBs will be a crap shoot.  The top ones played well enough in college to get drafted early.    The argument against Darnold is that he hasn’t shown anything in 3 years and his upside is limited.  The reality is we don’t know how he could do but his time has run out.  That’s the Jets fault.  The risk In not taking a QB this season is that we might not be in this high a position again. We all know how expensive it is to trade up just a few spots.  We lost 3 2’s on Darnold.  

Well, that is what the extra draft capital is for in next years draft.  If the Jets trade down, they could, hypothetically, be looking at three first round picks next year plus whatever else they get for the trade down.  By the time we use our 5+ picks in the top 100, plus two free agent periods, we could have a good enough team to then take a QB in the later parts of the first round good enough to step in with a bunch of talent around them.

OR we could do the SOJ thing: Draft a QB that nobody thinks is Andrew Luck or Aaron Rodgers, and have him step into a situation where he has no talent and no chance.  Maybe this time it will work!

[CanadaSteve]

9 hours ago, heymangold said:

If Zach Wilson is 1 win better than Sam Darnold, it’s worth it.  

GREAT!  With that philosophy, by the time we are on the next GM after the next GM after Douglas, and we have had another 6 losing seasons, we MIGHT be up to winning record!

[Jet Nut]

11 hours ago, joewilly12 said:

3 years record as starting NY Jets QB. 13-25 

So they should get rid of every player on the team the last 3 years?
 

[rangerous]

I’m glad I don’t have to make this decision. The jets have a top draft pick they, hopefully, will never get again.  They need to make it count. I am thinking saleh, lefleur, and Douglas will all be discussing darnold to see if he be the guy. I am also thinking they are discussing Wilson, fields, track, Jones, etc to see if those guys can upgrade the position.  And that should have a bearing as to whether they keep the 2 pick or trade back a few places.  I also think they can pick a QBs not named Wilson and move down a few spots. It may mean going into training camp with darnold but at least there’d be some real competition.

[derp]

This is a little all over the place. In reason 1 you’re talking about a rookie QB carrying the team (doesn’t just have to be better, has to be exceptional).

But then in reason 2, Darnold plus picks is likely better than the rookie (whose team would certainly have less draft capital than the Darnold scenario - but the capital from a Darnold trade).

As for reason 3, isn’t the goal to do more than just make the playoffs? None of those teams were even in the conference title games.

This also ignores the biggest reason to move on from Darnold - his contract status. It’s questionable if his fifth year option at $25M gets picked up. Either way they’re likely making a contract decision on him after this season - or they potentially have to franchise him if they don’t pick up the option.

After three years of subpar play let’s put his 2021 play into three categories - bad, average, and good. If he’s bad, easy to not extend - but he’s held back whatever pieces you added to try to make the team better and you still need to find a quarterback. In the average case, what do you pay a quarterback who’s been league average for one year with a better supporting cast and below average for three? Those guys don’t get long term contracts and you’re still in quarterback purgatory. And if he’s good, what do you give a guy in a contract year? Are you sure it’s sustainable? What are the Jets offering that he’s accepting - particularly with as tough a negotiator as Douglas seems to be.

[Biggs]

1 minute ago, Jet Nut said:

So they should get rid of every player on the team the last 3 years?
 

The team has loaded up on draft picks and cap space.  They are in position to draft an elite QB prospect if they want to.  They are in position to trade picks and players for better players at multiple positions including QB.  They should be looking to upgrade as many positions as possible including QB.  If they can't upgrade the QB position or don't believe any of the QB's available will be an upgrade for Darnold they should consider trading him for max value to get another piece to upgrade another position.

Darnold is going into his last year on his rookie deal.  If we take a 5th year option on him he will be paid top 10 QB money in 2022.  If we don't and he sucks he will be cut with no value.  If he's good and we don't we will franchise him or pay him top 5 NFL QB money going forward.

Unfortunately Darnold's value to the Jets would have been terrific if he was an elite or even a good NFL QB in year 3.  He's reached a point where he's cost vs. his potential is becoming prohibitive.  Had he actually shown the potential to be a great NFL QB he would be a tremendous value going into both 2021 and 2022.  Now he's simply potential at a price.  

This isn't about every player on the team, it's about Sam Darnold.  There seems to be a fear that he will become a good QB somewhere else.  If he does he will be paid an enormous amount of money and that team will lose other pieces.  I'm of the opinion that Sam may well turn into a good QB.  I don't see an elite game changer that takes up an enormous amount of the cap that prohibits us from putting a great team around him is likely.  In fact he has sucked being in that position and will likely suck if he gets paid and we have to shed players in 2 years to pay him.  

[More Cowbell]

11 hours ago, STLuLu said:

There's been a lot of hype on sports talk media and social media on the Jets parting ways with Sam Darnold in favor of drafting Zack Wilson with the #2 pick. If you're done with Darnold and think Wilson is a better option and you're rooting for Joe Douglas to make this happen, here are three reasons why you should be begging Douglas to pump the brakes:

1) Wilson can't be just better than Darnold, he has to be exceptional. The Jets have massive holes everywhere so signing a few free-agents and crossing your fingers on draft day isn't going to patch up all the holes. Because of the lack of talent, he has to possess Andrew Luck or Aaron Rogers like talent to place this team on his shoulders and ascend them out of the basement clown's club and up into the high-rise members only club.

2) Do you believe Wilson's odds are greater for him to make the Jets a better team vs keeping Darnold and trading out of the #2 spot in exchange for a boatload of picks? Even if you're a believer in Wilson, you can post all the videos of his fabulous incomplete passes you want, you still have to honest with yourself and think hard on this one. Even if Douglas only hits on 50% of his picks in the upcoming 2021 draft, the odds are still in favor of Darnold plus those picks.

3) 5 teams in the 2020 season made the post season dispite the performance of their QBs: The Steelers, the Browns, the Rams, the Bears, and the Washington football team. If we keep Darnold and trade out of the #2 slot and load up on talent to surround around him with, don't you believe we can be better than a team like the Steelers or the Titans and possibly make the playoffs? Or do you believe we would have a better chance with Wilson minus a void in talent? If you're a Wilson supporter these  are questions you have ask yourself and be honest about. My bet is on Dornald plus an above average supporting cast. I hope the Jets does the right thing and keep Darnold.

 

We will find out a lot about JD with this decision.  I honestly hope we take a QB but if JD feels Wilson or Fields is not the guy, then he should stick with Sam, but if he thinks one of the two will be a quality  NFL QB, he should take the player. It is just the better decision on many fronts. As I have said before, the upside to keeping Darnold is not as high as taking a QB in this draft. Keeping Darnold means we pickup a great prospect  or more picks in a trade down and have to hope it was all Gase and his horrible handling of Sam but if it turns out Sam is just a poor NFL QB, the downside is much worse than if the rookie QB busts. Neither  outcome is actually  any good but their is a book on Darnold. The Jets are supposed to know what we have in him after 3 seasons. If we keep him and he continues  to regress with the new CS, that is a huge mark of continued dysfunction in the organization.  If we trade Sam and the new QB develops, we have a window to get to a championship on the cheap rookie deal. We will be able to load up on FA and hopefully hit on a few draft picks along the way. That os a lot better than watching Sam improve with a better supporting cast and having to pay him a huge contract. Havi g a cheap QB with similar or better ability for another 4 or 5 years just makes more sense for the Jets right now if there is a QB that makes sense in the draft

 

[The Crusher]

Are we banking on the fact if we trade the number two build around  Darnold we will once again get the second overall pick to our QB next year? Is that the plan? 

[Matt39]

Since there’s a large portion of the fanbase who still thinks Darnold is good or salvageable for whatever reason...if the Jets don’t like any of the QB’s at 2...a season of Mariota would be better than another pointless one with Darnold. Mariotta is a better QB and we won’t have the same loyalty to him as we do with Darnold. Rip that bandaid off. 

[usapaw]

1 hour ago, MysticalJet2 said:

All I'll say is that if they trade Sam and go QB in the 1st round at 2, they better be sure it is a major upgrade.  If not, we are starting all over and it is the end of JD.  I think the safer choice (for JD) is to go 1 more year with Sam under the new system and see how it pans out... then go QB in FA or draft if it doesn't.

Exactly. Want to get fired within 2 years, select the wrong QB in a draft. Jets need everything. KC did it. Bills did it. TB did it. Better QB performance is about fixing those other needs first. Quite likely trading back the 2 will give us three first round picks (including the current 2 I believe?) for next year. If we need a qb upgrade at that point, pull the trigger. This year, 2 O linemen, 1-2 corners, 1-2 linebackers, 1-2 receivers, maybe a safety and DE, and some depth. That is a lot to address.

Oh yeah, forgot RB.

A long shot on a 5-7th round, or UFA, Ian Book type isn't out of the question. This all seems possible by trading back and limited free agency.  Possibility Morgan isn't a total flop.  

[bealeb319]

3 years record as starting NY Jets QB. 13-25 

With arguably some of the worst jets rosters out there...Sam has looked pretty trashy at times especially last year but he has also played behind some pretty horrific offensive lines with basically no running game and no real recievers? If we are being honest how many teams would be scrambling to sign our offensive players if they got cut as starters outside of maybe crowder who would get a mediocre contract and obviously becton who only played last year?

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using JetNation.com mobile app

[Jet Nut]

29 minutes ago, Biggs said:

The team has loaded up on draft picks and cap space.  They are in position to draft an elite QB prospect if they want to.  They are in position to trade picks and players for better players at multiple positions including QB.  They should be looking to upgrade as many positions as possible including QB.  If they can't upgrade the QB position or don't believe any of the QB's available will be an upgrade for Darnold they should consider trading him for max value to get another piece to upgrade another position.

Darnold is going into his last year on his rookie deal.  If we take a 5th year option on him he will be paid top 10 QB money in 2022.  If we don't and he sucks he will be cut with no value.  If he's good and we don't we will franchise him or pay him top 5 NFL QB money going forward.

Unfortunately Darnold's value to the Jets would have been terrific if he was an elite or even a good NFL QB in year 3.  He's reached a point where he's cost vs. his potential is becoming prohibitive.  Had he actually shown the potential to be a great NFL QB he would be a tremendous value going into both 2021 and 2022.  Now he's simply potential at a price.  

This isn't about every player on the team, it's about Sam Darnold.  There seems to be a fear that he will become a good QB somewhere else.  If he does he will be paid an enormous amount of money and that team will lose other pieces.  I'm of the opinion that Sam may well turn into a good QB.  I don't see an elite game changer that takes up an enormous amount of the cap that prohibits us from putting a great team around him is likely.  In fact he has sucked being in that position and will likely suck if he gets paid and we have to shed players in 2 years to pay him.  

Think you missed the sarcastic point.

The Jet record the last 3 seasons isnt entirely on Sam Darnold.  We lost plenty of games because of the lack of talent and poor coaching, not just because of the QBs play.  But the QB is the one person we conveniently blame.  

The idea has to hold true that the Jets record would have been better with Zack Wilson or Justin Fields at QB.  Otherwise were trading Darnold and drafting a replacement for no reason other than being afraid to pay a QB and losing draft capital 

[munchmemory]

Three reasons we must trade/release Darnold:

1. He sucks

2. He sucks

3. He sucks

Bonus #4:  He sucks

[Jet Nut]

10 hours ago, heymangold said:

If Zach Wilson is 1 win better than Sam Darnold, it’s worth it.  

And thats dead wrong.  

The team, any team with 1 less win and the number two overall pick in the draft is a better scenario.  

[Creepy Lurker]

I have a better plan which takes us even further back at QB. Let trade Darnold for picks AND trade down from #2 so we have extra picks to trade for Geno Smith to be our starting QB. 

[joewilly12]

1 hour ago, Jet Nut said:

So they should get rid of every player on the team the last 3 years?
 

A QB with a record of 13-25 record that is being outplayed by many rookie no nameQB's  who is showing no improvements. YES 

[TheNuuFaaolaExperience]

12 hours ago, joewilly12 said:

3 years record as starting NY Jets QB. 13-25 

But he is 13-0 in games that he has won. 

[Joe W. Namath]

5 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

So the difference between # 36 ranked QB play and upper tier QB play is someone calling the good plays.  Got it.  
 

I admire your childlike faith in Sam Darnold. I really do. 

The Darnold bobblehead he has on his nightstand is really cool.

[Sonny Werblin]

The question is what is the better way to build a winning team: Pick a QB at 2; or trade out of 2 for more draft assets to address a roster lacking in the type of high end talent a team needs to win? This is not a "Sam" question. It is more a question of will the Jets suffer in the long term by not drafting Wilson/Fields at #2 and instead drafting a QB in a future draft.

For those of you who feel you must strike while you have a top pick becasue you can only get a top QB in the first 3 to 5 picks of the draft, I would point out that most of the really good QBs in the NFL right now were taken after #5. Just look at the history of QBs taken in the top 5 of the draft since 2000: Vick; Carr; Harrington; Palmer; Manning; Rivers; Smith; Young; Russell; Ryan; Stafford; Sanchez; Bradford; Newton; Luck; Griffin; Bortles; Winston; Mariotta; Goff; Wentz; Trubitsky; Mayfield; Darnold; and Murray. The only SB winning QB on the list is Manning. The rest combined have 3 SB appearances - 1 each for Ryan, Newton and Goff.

I believe the reason for this has more to do with the QB's taken at the top being forced to try to succeed on bad teams rather than a team that can, to some extent, carry them while they learn on the fly.

IMO, a draft savvy GM like JD knows this and will not buck the odds by trying to improve his bad team by taking a QB at 2 if he can get more draft capital by trading back. Then, next year, assuming Darnold flames out (which is almost a given) the Jets will sign a vet and start looking for a QB after the 5th pick with a willingness to trade up to get him. 

[genot]

6 hours ago, BornJetsFan1983 said:

How about no losses with Darnold were his fault!

He never cost us a game even with the rookie mistakes. Sure we lost and sure he made some poor throws, but he was put in a mahomes superbowl position every single week with out the benefit of any legitimate gameplan, nfl offensive system, or good coaching. 

Everything wrong with his game is very fixable and a nfl coaching staff could fix in a season. See end of rookie season when we had actual nfl quality coaching. 

He still even till the last game he played showed talent and I think he can still lead the team to the promise land. No matter on your opinion of Darnold. Building a tram around him is a obviously the right thing.

Coachijg staff isn't tied to him but knows he can buy them another year to get qb while getting rest of team in shape.

My feelings about Gase are that he wasn't just a bad coach. He was a destructive coach to the development of a young QB. Has anybody heard of a coach who didn't have gameplans that we're specific to the team they we're playing. That's why they're were never adjustments in game. In his mind if you execute the plays and philosophy he has in mind. Notbing else is needed. He's delusional.

[UntouchableCrew]

While I don't agree with the argument that we should forego a QB and trade down, I get it. We need a talent infusion and more picks equals more shots at talented players.

That's not really the same thing as we must keep Darnold. We can trade down, accumulate picks, and move off Darnold anyway. Pick a QB in the 2nd, bring in a veteran, etc.

[genot]

1 hour ago, The Crusher said:

Are we banking on the fact if we trade the number two build around  Darnold we will once again get the second overall pick to our QB next year? Is that the plan? 

If Darnold doesn't show significant improvement we do next year what another team does this year with us. Trade up to grab a QB.   We have Two 1st rd picks.

[section314]

8 minutes ago, Sonny Werblin said:

The question is what is the better way to build a winning team: Pick a QB at 2; or trade out of to for more draft assets to address a roster lacking in the type of high end talent a team needs to win? This is not a "Sam" question. It is more a question of will the Jets suffer in the long term by not drafting Wilson/Fields at #2 and instead drafting a QB in a future draft.

For those of you who feel you must strike while you have a top pick becasue you can only get a top QB in the first 3 to 5 picks of the draft, I would point out that most of the really good QBs in the NFL right now were taken after #5. Just look at the history of QBs taken in the top 5 of the draft since 2000: Vick; Carr; Harrington; Palmer; Manning; Rivers; Smith; Young; Russell; Ryan; Stafford; Sanchez; Bradford; Newton; Luck; Griffin; Bortles; Winston; Mariotta; Goff; Wentz; Trubitsky; Mayfield; Darnold; and Murray. The only SB winning QB on the list is Manning. The rest combined have 3 SB appearances - 1 each for Ryan, Newton and Goff.

I believe the reason for this has more to do with the QB's taken at the top being forced to try to succeed on bad teams rather than a team that can, to some extent, carry them while they learn on the fly.

IMO, a draft savvy GM like JD knows this and will not buck the odds by trying to improve his bad team by taking a QB at 2 if he can get more draft capital by trading back. Then, next year, assuming Darnold flames out (which is almost a given) the Jets will sign a vet and start looking for a QB after the 5th pick with a willingness to trade up to get him. 

That is an incredibly great point. After TL, this is an absolute crap shoot with the rest of these QB's. The fact that many people have Lance, a guy who played one season against basically JV type talent, as the #2 QB should make you take a deep pause. Not picking on him, just to make the  point that if there are potentially 4 QB's rated as the 2nd best, none of them may be that good. To take one of them @#2, you have to be 100% sure, without a doubt, that said guy is definitely better than Sam. To be honest, I seriously doubt any of them are. I know that there is still a long way to go in this process, but it seems rather likely that we are not taking one of these guys at #2.

[The Crusher]

2 minutes ago, genot said:

If Darnold doesn't show significant improvement we do next year what another team does this year with us. Trade up to grab a QB.   We have Two 1st rd picks.

Good point. Also, we have no reason to believe with Darnold starting we won’t be at least in the top 6. So it could work. Honestly not sure I can watch another year if Sam Darnold as our Qb. We’ll see 

[DetroitRed]

Deshaun or load up on picks.  I’m down

[The Crusher]

4 hours ago, Biggs said:

Great argument for trading Darnold and building a better team with the extra pick.  We can roll with Morgan and get another piece.  
 

if you think the team sucks and no QB can make a difference that’s not an argument to keep Darnold.  It’s an argument to trade him and trade down. 

Wouldn’t that be something if the actual plan was to trade Sam, trade down and run with Morgan? Obviously bring in a vet too  but that’s pretty much off most people’s radar. 

[heymangold]

1 hour ago, Jet Nut said:

And thats dead wrong.  

The team, any team with 1 less win and the number two overall pick in the draft is a better scenario.  

So wtf is the point?  Constantly punting years for draft position?  At some point I’d like to cheer for a winner.

hell let’s run it back.  Sam at QB, Gore at RB and maybe next draft we’ll have the 1st pick and 120M in cap space.

[genot]

1 minute ago, The Crusher said:

Good point. Also, we have no reason to believe with Darnold starting we won’t be at least in the top 6. So it could work. Honestly not sure I can watch another year if Sam Darnold as our Qb. We’ll see 

It would be a great feel good story. Darnold proves himself worthy. Proven system with real coaching gets Darnold back his MoJo. I've said this before. Gase wasn't just a bad coach. He was destructive to a young QB. Consider this. Im a teacher. You have to be a good communicator to be a good teacher. Gase was Sam's QB coach. How'd that go.

[Icer]

We need to give our busts like five years to make sure the chance they are Alex Smith in hiding is not 99.9999999999%

[RedBeardedSavage]

8 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Justin Herbert had the # 32 ranked O-Line and a HC that got fired.  Didn’t stop him from being the Offensive ROY.

I guess the broader point is - good for him! He's better than Sam. To play like that as a rookie? Guy is probably special.

• We had the 29th ranked offensive line.
• We didn't have have Keenan Allen, Mike Williams and Hunter Henry.
• We had Adam Gase. 

So while Herbert's offensive line was slightly worse, his #weapinz were a lot better, Adam Gase is the worst coach in the sport, and yea, Herbert is just a beast.

[section314]

1 hour ago, The Crusher said:

Wouldn’t that be something if the actual plan was to trade Sam, trade down and run with Morgan? Obviously bring in a ver too  but that’s pretty much off most people’s radar. 

Crush....I agree with you. Been saying for months that I think Morgan is a way bigger part of this thing than anyone is letting on.

[#27TheDominator]

13 hours ago, RedBeardedSavage said:

At the point when he actually has a decent offensive line, skill position players and coach.

So, the exact reasons everybody incorrectly assessed Mark Sanchez? 

[genot]

2 minutes ago, section314 said:

Crush....I agree with you. Been saying for months that I think Morgan is a way bigger part of this thing than anyone is letting on.

No on that one. Morgan is a pocket passer. Really doesn't fit this WCO. 

[Biggs]

1 hour ago, Jet Nut said:

Think you missed the sarcastic point.

The Jet record the last 3 seasons isnt entirely on Sam Darnold.  We lost plenty of games because of the lack of talent and poor coaching, not just because of the QBs play.  But the QB is the one person we conveniently blame.  

The idea has to hold true that the Jets record would have been better with Zack Wilson or Justin Fields at QB.  Otherwise were trading Darnold and drafting a replacement for no reason other than being afraid to pay a QB and losing draft capital 

Blame?  There’s plenty of blame to go around.  Just because there’s plenty of blame to go around doesn’t make Darnold blameless.  Zach Wilson and Fields will be cheap for 4 years and they come onto a team with hopefully a good foundation of coaches.  Darnold is cheap next year and either craps out or becomes very expensive very fast.  
 

We also don’t need to draft either one of them and can trade Darnold.  
 

Im not opposed to turning over almost the entire roster if we could get value for it.  Rather than take it as sarcasm, I think it’s a good idea.  75% of this roster could be turned over and we could still improve the team.