The Sharps Know Watson Will Be a Jet

[Jets Things]

22 minutes ago, Fantasy Island said:

Why can't we have both?

[Beerfish]

Just now, chad2coles said:

Every QB in the league is a 4 win QB or worse if you are going to use the situation Watson was put in last year to describe them.  Mahomes, Rodgers, no one was winning in Houston last year with the problems they had.

Exactly.

Thus proof that you had better build a roster with assets and often it is better to build the roster 1st then add the QB.  Tampa just won the super bowl doing this.  Much of KC was built before mahommes got there.

My beef with the super pro go get watson crowd is that the metrics change to suit their argument.

Draft picks are over rated, lots of busts go get the QB!  We have gobs of cap space!

Well we trade for watson and all of a sudden "We are confident that joe can use all of our remaining picks to build a great team and after absorbing a big QB cap hit we can then go out and get #1, #2, #3 rated FA's

[T0mShane]

4 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

Well we trade for watson and all of a sudden "We are confident that joe can use all of our remaining picks to build a great team and after absorbing a big QB cap hit we can then go out and get #1, #2, #3 rated FA's

If you think Douglas can build a great team through the draft with the picks he added by trading Adams, then you also believe Douglas can build a great team with Deshaun Watson and absent the picks you got by trading Adams. 

[chad2coles]

4 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

Exactly.

Thus proof that you had better build a roster with assets and often it is better to build the roster 1st then add the QB.  Tampa just won the super bowl doing this.  Much of KC was built before mahommes got there.

My beef with the super pro go get watson crowd is that the metrics change to suit their argument.

Draft picks are over rated, lots of busts go get the QB!  We have gobs of cap space!

Well we trade for watson and all of a sudden "We are confident that joe can use all of our remaining picks to build a great team and after absorbing a big QB cap hit we can then go out and get #1, #2, #3 rated FA's

I expect the Jets to be able to have at least 1 draft pick in each round of the next 2 years after trading for Watson (#2, #24, '22 1st, '23 1st for Watson, trade Darnold for a '21 2nd.)  I also think the Jets will be able to address some of their biggest holes in free agency before the draft with all the cap room they have.  If the Jet can add Watson, Thuney, and one of the top 5 available FA WRs, they still have the cap room to resign Maye, and bring in pieces on D before going BPA in the draft.

[undertow]

5 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

Exactly.

Thus proof that you had better build a roster with assets and often it is better to build the roster 1st then add the QB.  Tampa just won the super bowl doing this.  Much of KC was built before mahommes got there.

My beef with the super pro go get watson crowd is that the metrics change to suit their argument.

Draft picks are over rated, lots of busts go get the QB!  We have gobs of cap space!

Well we trade for watson and all of a sudden "We are confident that joe can use all of our remaining picks to build a great team and after absorbing a big QB cap hit we can then go out and get #1, #2, #3 rated FA's

I want Watson and I'm confident Joe Douglas understands the value of the 2nd pick and won't add 3 other 1st rounders and Q to that package which some of these lunatics are in favor of.  These GMs understand how many picks the 2nd is worth I don't think it's gonna take nearly as much to get the deal done as the media is throwing out there....that's if they trade him and don't play hardball.

[FidelioJet]

11 minutes ago, chad2coles said:

The cap space plays in your scenario with Wilson, but the cap space the Jets have to spend with Watson on the team can't help them.  The most valuable asset the Jets give up in trading for Watson is the #2 pick, which you spend on Wilson.

Watson and $80M in cap space this year is better than Wilson, $90M in cap space, #34 this year and a 1st round pick in '22 and '23.

You guys keep making 3 first round picks and $90mm in cap space sound like nothing.  it's very strange.

"Ehh...it's only 3 more first round after you account for drafting Wilson" - that's what I keep hearing like those 3 first round picks don't mean anything.  

The last two were Q and Becton - imagine this roster without them.

[derp]

1 hour ago, FidelioJet said:

That's one better than the Jets.

Of course.

[JustInFudge]

2 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

All things being equal I would rank it this way...

Watson - get him for #2 and #23 (or a one next year) I'm in.

Lawrence - I do think he's overrated but clearly the best college prospect

Wilson - great talent that has a skill-set perfectly suited for today's NFL and the system in which he'll be asked to play

Fields - I like Fields a lot, I think he'll actually be better early than Wilson as his legs will help carry him through the learning curve.  Has massive potential if he can put it together

Russ - Great player - too old to be joining the current Jets roster (3 years ago he would be #1 on this list)

You're a good sport, we just dont see eye to eye on stuff.

[carlito1171]

 

5 hours ago, T0mShane said:

https://www.reviewjournal.com/sports/sports-columns/todd-dewey/sharp-bettors-back-jets-in-nfl-futures-odds-2289367/

 

At this time last year, professional sports bettor Mark DeRosa bet big on Buccaneers futures based on his belief that Tom Brady would join Tampa Bay and lead it to the Super Bowl title.

DeRosa won more than a half million dollars as Brady did just that.

Perhaps based on a belief that Houston Texans quarterback Deshaun Watson will be traded to the Jets, sharp bettors at William Hill on Thursday wagered on New York to win the AFC East, AFC and the Super Bowl.

“Maybe they know something,” William Hill sportsbook director Nick Bogdanovich said. “I don’t know. Maybe they think Sam Darnold will start playing better.”

In the biggest move since William Hill posted 2021 NFL division odds, the Jets dropped from 20-1 to 12-1 to win their division.

[Yeetin It]

4 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

If that's the case we wouldn't have wasted 4 first round picks and $90mm on him. 

It's 1 first round pick and a fraction of the cost.

Watson is Brett Farving us.  Using the sucker team with the draft and cap capital to get him out of Houston and then will leave at his first opportunity.  

A weak armed, disgruntled, 4 win QB, coming to the worst roster in the NFL is a disaster waiting to happen. 

 

But what are your thoughts on Deshaun Watson?

[Jetsfan80]

4 hours ago, neckdemon said:

well so far the texans won't even listen to an offer for watson 

Let's see how they feel in April, when they're staring down the barrel of having 1) No first or 2nd round pick, and 2) AJ McCarron as their starting QB.  

[Jetsfan80]

4 hours ago, Greenbloodblitz said:

Let me add that when you put all your eggs in one basket, if we give up all that capital and all that pay to DeShawn let's just say he blows out a knee or has a high ankle sprain.

He won't be elevating anything around him except his leg and we'll be totally f*****.

This can happen to any QB or player.  It could happen to Josh Allen next year.  It could happen to Zach Wilson or Justin Fields.  Why is this such a fear that a move like this shouldn't happen?  Athletic, mobile QB's are the way of the NFL, and it's not going away.  All 4 of the top QB's in the 2021 class rely heavily on their legs.  

[JustInFudge]

2 hours ago, Patriot Killa said:

So stupid. I’m a Wilson fan and I don’t think any of those guys suck. Stop fishing out a narrative for groups of posters. No one else believes this. Not even @FidelioJet

Hi, patriot, come again?  lmfao

2 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

All things being equal I would rank it this way...

Watson - get him for #2 and #23 (or a one next year) I'm in.

Lawrence - I do think he's overrated but clearly the best college prospect

Wilson - great talent that has a skill-set perfectly suited for today's NFL and the system in which he'll be asked to play

Fields - I like Fields a lot, I think he'll actually be better early than Wilson as his legs will help carry him through the learning curve.  Has massive potential if he can put it together

Russ - Great player - too old to be joining the current Jets roster (3 years ago he would be #1 on this list)

 

[nycdan]

6 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Let's see how they feel in April, when they're staring down the barrel of having 1) No first or 2nd round pick, and 2) AJ McCarron as their starting QB.  

Well it's either/or.  Either they have no 1st or 2nd round picks, OR they have no DeShaun Watson.  

Honestly, IMO their roster is too bare and their cap too high to rebuild without trading Watson.  They have no hope of improving the roster this year.  If they are thinking they can ride it out and start the rebuild next year (probably with a top-3 pick) they have to consider that Watson, if forced to remain on the team, will be one season more pissed off.  And they don't really get significant cap room until 2023.  And, although they would never conceive of this, their current regime isn't likely to be attractive to Free Agents.

They probably are better off trading Watson for the biggest haul they can get, and hope they can start drafting well.  Not a lot of reason for hope right now.

[Pac]

I bet this thread, (much like the last 20 on the topic), is full of new opinions and information but I'll go ahead and skip reading it anyway.

[Jetsfan80]

5 minutes ago, nycdan said:

Well it's either/or.  Either they have no 1st or 2nd round picks, OR they have no DeShaun Watson.  

It can easily be both.  Watson is resolute about not playing for Houston this year.  Fail to trade Watson prior to the draft, and you're looking at no picks until Round 3 AND no Watson for a full season.  

[JustInFudge]

3 minutes ago, Pac said:

I bet this thread, (much like the last 20 on the topic), is full of new opinions and information but I'll go ahead and skip reading it anyway.

Should have done everyone a favor and skipped sharing this thought

[Savage69]

1 minute ago, Jetsfan80 said:

It can easily be both.  Watson is resolute about not playing for Houston this year.  Fail to trade Watson prior to the draft, and you're looking at no picks until Round 3 AND no Watson for a full season.  

And Watson is looking at no money and a year of his career wasted..

[Sperm Edwards]

3 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

In all seriousness I have two real concerns when it comes to bringing in Watson...

1) I don't buy that the Jets are close to a playoff roster as long as they have Watson.  What I saw last year was horrid, horrid football - the team's talent is frighteningly bad.  That's not being fixed by giving up 4 first round picks and $30mm a year to a QB right now.

2) More importably, yet closely tied to #1 is that I see Watson leaving the Jets as soon as possible.  Jets won't be good his first two years and the NY press and fans will get ugly -  he'll be forcing his way out and no way signing an extension.   If I truly thought we would have him for the next decade I would be much more inclined to be excited about this - having the time to build a team around him over the course of the next 3 to 5 year would make me feel more comfortable.  But I don't believe that's the case.  

Lastly, I'm not nearly as high on him as a player as you and most are...

I can understand those concerns. I think the first is a more legit one than the next, because there is a crying-wolf aspect to these requests.

A typically mild-mannered star player shoots his way off one team? Benefit of the doubt and there are others looking to cash in on the team's situation. He does it twice? I don't think the line of teams is so long anymore. Also less concerned given the length of time he's contractually tied up. But I'll acknowledge the concern isn't 0% (but it should be noted I don't think the concern is 0% for anyone we'd heavily invest into instead of Watson either). 

I'm looking and I think the combination of Watson + the handful or more of players they can add in FA and the draft (even without a 1st rounder), and how much better any will play when the guy throwing it or the guy next to him isn't so terrible, I don't think merely reaching playoff status is as far away as many think. 

I think your last statement is really what it comes down to. I think he's just a better player than you do. Fair enough.

[Patriot Killa]

22 minutes ago, JiF said:

Hi, patriot, come again?  lmfao

 

His reasoning for Zach over Russ is age concerns & that making it a bad fit. I would disagree with him there personally, whenever you can get a top 3 QB still playing MVP football, you take him, but I really don’t see where he’s saying Watson, Russ, Trevor & Fields suck & Zach is the savior. If you could point me in that direction, then we’d really be cooking.? 

otherwise I see some reasonable opinions like Lawrence not being the can’t-miss prospect the media claims he is but he’s still prospect #1 this year.(I know for a fact you agree with the first part of that opinion), he goes on to say that he likes your boy Fields and expects him to be very successful.(which everyone on here & their mothers know JiF believes that) I’m not trying to be @FidelioJet’s mother, I just think you’re being a bit unfair about Wilson and the posters that choose to believe in him. Too much “all gas & no brakes” for me personally.

[FidelioJet]

19 minutes ago, JiF said:

Hi, patriot, come again?  lmfao

 

Wait, what?

His point was totally validated!

[Jetsfan80]

4 minutes ago, Patriot Killa said:

I’m not trying to be @FidelioJet’s mother, I just think you’re being a bit unfair about Wilson and the posters that choose to believe in him. Too much “all gas & no brakes” for me personally.

You must really not like Robert Saleh, then!

[Warfish]

2 hours ago, Beerfish said:

Exactly.

Thus proof that you had better build a roster with assets and often it is better to build the roster 1st then add the QB.  Tampa just won the super bowl doing this.  Much of KC was built before mahommes got there.

My beef with the super pro go get watson crowd is that the metrics change to suit their argument.

Draft picks are over rated, lots of busts go get the QB!  We have gobs of cap space!

Well we trade for watson and all of a sudden "We are confident that joe can use all of our remaining picks to build a great team and after absorbing a big QB cap hit we can then go out and get #1, #2, #3 rated FA's

Remind me, who is your preferred QB for 2021?

 

 

[Patriot Killa]

11 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

You must really not like Robert Saleh, then!

I enjoy a moderate amount of gas over brake.

[Savage69]

2 minutes ago, Patriot Killa said:

I enjoy a moderate amount of gas over brake.

Crusher doesn't I bet..  https://cdn5.vectorstock.com/i/thumb-large/16/84/businessman-farting-with-blank-balloon-out-from-hi-vector-5011684.jpg

[BROOKLYN JET]

[Beerfish]

23 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Remind me, who is your preferred QB for 2021?

 

 

Darnold or a placeholder vet like a mariotta or bridgewater or winston or both.

That is my number one preference.

[jetswinbaby!]

So, we have the odds on the "Jets Winning Their Division"...

I would rather blow my money on "Hell Freezing Over"...

Higher probability...

 

[ZachEY]

4 hours ago, Fantasy Island said:

Why can't we have both?

Who wants that uncomfortably attractive woman when we already have this:

And she's got a $25 gift card to Applebees after giving the manager a piece of her mind because she asked for dressing on the side, and as you can clearly see, it was mixed in.

[chad2coles]

3 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

You guys keep making 3 first round picks and $90mm in cap space sound like nothing.  it's very strange.

"Ehh...it's only 3 more first round after you account for drafting Wilson" - that's what I keep hearing like those 3 first round picks don't mean anything.  

The last two were Q and Becton - imagine this roster without them.

I know the draft picks and cap room are valuable.  We agree there.  And the Jets will have draft picks and cap room to build around Watson. Here’s where we disagree  

Deshaun Watson is worth more than Zach Wilson, #34, ‘22 1st round pick, a ‘23 1st round pick, and their difference in cap hits. 
 

What Watson has done to start his career behind the terrible oline he’s had is unbelievable. If the Jets draft Wilson, there is a much better chance they are looking forward a new qb in 3 years than he’s a top 15 qb. Watson is a 25 year old top 3 qb and will have a lower cap hit than 5-10 qbs while he’s on the Jets. 

[Savage69]

6 minutes ago, chad2coles said:

I know the draft picks and cap room are valuable.  We agree there.  And the Jets will have draft picks and cap room to build around Watson. Here’s where we disagree  

Deshaun Watson is worth more than Zach Wilson, #34, ‘22 1st round pick, a ‘23 1st round pick, and their difference in cap hits. 
 

What Watson has done to start his career behind the terrible oline he’s had is unbelievable. If the Jets draft Wilson, there is a much better chance they are looking forward a new qb in 3 years than he’s a top 15 qb. Watson is a 25 year old top 3 qb and will have a lower cap hit than 5-10 qbs while he’s on the Jets. 

You need a certain temperament to play in NY and deal with the media. And when Watson isn't happy he wants out.. Not to mention if he see's a bunch of QB's making much more then him you know he won't be happy..

[FidelioJet]

7 minutes ago, chad2coles said:

I know the draft picks and cap room are valuable.  We agree there.  And the Jets will have draft picks and cap room to build around Watson. Here’s where we disagree  

Deshaun Watson is worth more than Zach Wilson, #34, ‘22 1st round pick, a ‘23 1st round pick, and their difference in cap hits. 
 

What Watson has done to start his career behind the terrible oline he’s had is unbelievable. If the Jets draft Wilson, there is a much better chance they are looking forward a new qb in 3 years than he’s a top 15 qb. Watson is a 25 year old top 3 qb and will have a lower cap hit than 5-10 qbs while he’s on the Jets. 

This is the part where I think Jet fans are being Naive...

What makes you think he's going to be okay with being a top 5 QB getting paid so low? What makes you think he'll accept that?

If he's not a top 5 QB who's going to demand to be off the team.  The Jets current roster is simply not in a good enough position to keep a guy like him happy.  We're going to spend 4 first round picks, get two 8-8 seasons and be drafting a new QB in 3 years - While Watson is off the real team on which he wanted to play.  

The Jets are the consummate suckers are our fans are happy to play along.

[chad2coles]

1 minute ago, Savage69 said:

You need a certain temperament to play in NY and deal with the media. And when Watson isn't happy he wants out.. Not to mention if he see's a bunch of QB's making much more then him you know he won't be happy..

What QB since Namath has had the temperament to play on the Jets?  How many years since Namath have the Jets not had bottom 10 QB production?  Watson will still have the signing bonus, it just won't count against the Jets cap.  Watson had the temperament to beat Alabama for a national championship and put up the numbers he has behind the Texans' garbage o-line, win division titles in both full seasons when they didn't fire his head coach mid season.  His temperament is coming into question because he doesn't want to play for a franchise run by a chaplain and because the argument against Watson doesn't work when you talk about value and production.

[Savage69]

1 minute ago, chad2coles said:

What QB since Namath has had the temperament to play on the Jets?  How many years since Namath have the Jets not had bottom 10 QB production?  Watson will still have the signing bonus, it just won't count against the Jets cap.  Watson had the temperament to beat Alabama for a national championship and put up the numbers he has behind the Texans' garbage o-line, win division titles in both full seasons when they didn't fire his head coach mid season.  His temperament is coming into question because he doesn't want to play for a franchise run by a chaplain and because the argument against Watson doesn't work when you talk about value and production.

I liked both Chad and Coles so we do agree on that.. Watson shouldn't have signed that contract if he wanted out.. And there is a big difference dealing with college media and NY NFL media which is much worse then when Joe played..

[chad2coles]

6 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

This is the part where I think Jet fans are being Naive...

What makes you think he's going to be okay with being a top 5 QB getting paid so low? What makes you think he'll accept that?

If he's not a top 5 QB who's going to demand to be off the team.  The Jets current roster is simply not in a good enough position to keep a guy like him happy.  We're going to spend 4 first round picks, get two 8-8 seasons and be drafting a new QB in 3 years - While Watson is off the real team on which he wanted to play.  

The Jets are the consummate suckers are our fans are happy to play along.

No, this is the part where the people crying about Watson’s contract realize it’s not a problem, so they come up with a hypothetical situation where it becomes a problem. First you can’t build a team around Watson with his salary, now his salary is too low so he’ll want out. 
 

you know happens if he needs a new contract after 3 years of being a top 5 qb for the Jets and he’s only 28 years old? He gets one. They would rework his deal anyway at that point, but they’ll use the fact that they have him for 2 years @ $32m plus the franchise tag as leverage.