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Draft Guru Mel Kiper goes on the record: “Jets should keep Darnold and PASS on Zach Wilson

GreekJet

By GreekJet
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pointman
pointman

Hey Mel,  

neckdemon
neckdemon

whether he is a hack or not......what he says about zach wilson is true. he was good for 1 yr against a schedule full of sh*t teams.....and lost to the only good team on the schedule. that doesn't eve

long time suffering Jets f
long time suffering Jets f

I’m starting to think there’s a conspiracy going on with these so called draft experts. They just want the Jets continue to lose so they have someone to kick around.

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T0mShane

T0mShane

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It has to be a real consideration for teams as to whether or not they see Sam Darnold as a better prospect than Wilson, Fields, Lance, etc. He doesn’t turn 24 until June, and he has a lot of starting experience in a brutal situation. I can see teams like the Niners and Panthers wanting to kick the tires instead of risking a one on an absolute unknown. Not the Jets, mind you, because I think the die is cast here. But, in a new environment. 

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Warfish

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26 minutes ago, GreekJet said:

I 100% agree with this concern.  Wilson to me looks like the poster-child for one-year-wonder overdrafting.  Much talent, such skills, no.......real.....resume.  San Diego Barber College wins don;t impress me.

But I've always been a guy who wants guys with resume, not the "no production/big potential" hype lords.

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GodDamnSnack

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2 minutes ago, Warfish said:

I 100% agree with this concern.  Wilson to me looks like the poster-child for one-year-wonder overdrafting.  Much talent, such skills, no.......real.....resume.  San Diego Barber College wins don;t impress me.

But I've always been a guy who wants guys with resume, not the "no production/big potential" hype lords.

It's one of the reasons I'm higher on Fields. You can see exactly what you're getting and it's really good. A lot of the criticism on Fields also isn't easy to falsify (slow reads, etc.) and should be taken with a grain of salt.

Would not be surprised at all if Fields is the ROY at the end of next year and seen as a better prospect than Trevor (who I love as well). I'll be all over this board saying "I told you so" to anyone who listens, when that happens :)

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neckdemon

neckdemon

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34 minutes ago, rangerous said:

the guy is a hack.  if you like darnold you like the message.  if you don't like darnold you hate it.  either way consider the source.

whether he is a hack or not......what he says about zach wilson is true. he was good for 1 yr against a schedule full of sh*t teams.....and lost to the only good team on the schedule. that doesn't even take into account he has already had 2 shoulder surgeries and is built like a female runway model.

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Beerfish

Beerfish

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16 minutes ago, long time suffering Jets f said:

I’m starting to think there’s a conspiracy going on with these so called draft experts. They just want the Jets continue to lose so they have someone to kick around.

What they say, long term, may make us a winner.

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nycdan

nycdan

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It's interesting to feel the swing of opinion.  Last week it was all aboard the Zach Wilson train but it feels like the pendulum is swinging back to the other side, be it Fields or Darnold.  It wasn't possible to create any drama around the #1 pick this year, so they went next best thing, maybe.  At the end of the day, my money is on Lawrence - Fields - Wilson - Lance - Jones in that order.

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long time suffering Jets f

long time suffering Jets f

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11 minutes ago, neckdemon said:

whether he is a hack or not......what he says about zach wilson is true. he was good for 1 yr against a schedule full of sh*t teams.....and lost to the only good team on the schedule. that doesn't even take into account he has already had 2 shoulder surgeries and is built like a female runway model.

That’s why I want to trade for Watson. If we draft a QB instead I prefer Fields over Wilson. 

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genot

genot

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40 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

It has to be a real consideration for teams as to whether or not they see Sam Darnold as a better prospect than Wilson, Fields, Lance, etc. He doesn’t turn 24 until June, and he has a lot of starting experience in a brutal situation. I can see teams like the Niners and Panthers wanting to kick the tires instead of risking a one on an absolute unknown. Not the Jets, mind you, because I think the die is cast here. But, in a new environment. 

Jet's won't be drafting a QB Tom.for all the reasons you and Kiper stated. The new environment is Saleh, LaFleur. Unless Darnold is suffering from Post Traumatic Gase Syndrome, i don't see why the success people think he could find elsewhere, he couldn't find here.

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varjet

varjet

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19 minutes ago, heymangold said:

Steve Young went to BYU, he turned out to be pretty good.  Phil Simms went to some college I’ve never heard of.  Point being, doesn’t really matter where you’re from, if you have the tools you have the tools.

A good NFL scout can figure out whether a player's success in college will translate to the pros.  

Great college players on great college teams end up flopping, and players like Allen, Mahomes and Aaron Rodgers end up great NFL players (I am ignoring Brady).

Wilson played who he had to play.   After we see how he measures physically, and how that compares to some other QBs, we can get a better sense of how he will do.  I do think that a QB needs to be athletic to succeed.  Look at:

Darnold:  https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/sam-darnold (not that athletic)

Mahomes: https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/patrick-mahomes (very athletic)

Rodgers:  https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/aaron-rodgers 

Trubisky:  https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/mitch-trubisky (more athletic than you think)

Daniel Jones:  https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/mitch-trubisky (like Josh Allen)

Josh Allen:  https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/josh-allen

Let's see how Zach Wilson measures up like.  

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Jetsfan80

Jetsfan80

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1 minute ago, varjet said:

Great college players on great college teams end up flopping, and players like Allen, Mahomes and Aaron Rodgers end up great NFL players (I am ignoring Brady).

Not always, obviously.  Deshaun Watson being the most notable, recent example.

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dcJet

dcJet

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33 minutes ago, heymangold said:

Steve Young went to BYU, he turned out to be pretty good.  Phil Simms went to some college I’ve never heard of.  Point being, doesn’t really matter where you’re from, if you have the tools you have the tools.

Oh good.  There's hope for Morgan who went to Fashion Institute University.

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varjet

varjet

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10 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Not always, obviously.  Deshaun Watson being the most notable, recent example.

Thanks.  I did not meant to say that being a great QB on a great college team was irrelevant.

Its really art and science to figure out what college QBs will be good in the NFL.

Even the ESPN top 60 QBs-Mayfield was rated the top of the 60.  He can be a good NFL QB, but there are many better ones ranked below him.  

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Bowles Movement

Bowles Movement

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10 hours ago, rangerous said:

the guy is a hack.  if you like darnold you like the message.  if you don't like darnold you hate it.  either way consider the source.

Say what you want but Kiper has been doing this as a full time job for a long time and he wouldn’t be featured yearly on every draft show and periodical if he didn’t know anything.   Other analysts have said the same as Kiper regarding Darnold..  Add to that that there is interest in Darnold from other QB needy teams that also get paid to analyze players, so consider that source.

Then consider the “ credentials” of the posters here.   I’m a pretty smart guy and have been a hard core football and Jets fan for 50 yrs but I can’t compare Darnold to Fields to Wilson and say one is clearly better.   How do you factor in supporting team, strength of schedule, coaching, injuries, mental approach, leadership and things we may not even be aware of?  I can understand being frustrated with Darnolds results and I can understand having a preference for a certain player, but to beat your chest and say you KNOW this guy is clearly better and the only choice??   Cmon man!

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oatmeal

oatmeal

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10 hours ago, long time suffering Jets f said:

I’m starting to think there’s a conspiracy going on with these so called draft experts. They just want the Jets continue to lose so they have someone to kick around.

When you have one of the most polarizing teams in sports history and a low hanging fruit fan base, in the words largest media market, it leads to a prefect storm of click bait porn. 
 


ESPN know the majority of the fan base are done with Sam, ESPN is also a struggling network.. nothing to see here 

 

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rangerous

rangerous

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1 hour ago, Bowles Movement said:

Say what you want but Kiper has been doing this as a full time job for a long time and he wouldn’t be featured yearly on every draft show and periodical if he didn’t know anything.   Other analysts have said the same as Kiper regarding Darnold..  Add to that that there is interest in Darnold from other QB needy teams that also get paid to analyze players, so consider that source.

Then consider the “ credentials” of the posters here.   I’m a pretty smart guy and have been a hard core football and Jets fan for 50 yrs but I can’t compare Darnold to Fields to Wilson and say one is clearly better.   How do you factor in supporting team, strength of schedule, coaching, injuries, mental approach, leadership and things we may not even be aware of?  I can understand being frustrated with Darnolds results and I can understand having a preference for a certain player, but to beat your chest and say you KNOW this guy is clearly better and the only choice??   Cmon man!

I suppose you can say kiper must know something but then the whole talking head landscape is littered with with people like Stephen A, or Greenie, both of whom know absolutely nothing about anything.  And then this goes down to the local level with guys like carton or benigno and even maneesh who are just good at stirring things up without knowing what’s best.  
 

I know I have zero credentials. I’m just a fan and try to logically understand the process and why certain players should be kept or launched.

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