Who should the Jets sign to backup Zach Wilson?

[Jet Nut]

2 hours ago, joewilly12 said:

Sam Darnold had all the practice snaps what good did that do him or the NY Jets. 

Bad players are replaced all over the league. 

Here we have excuse makers. 

49ers did it with Mullens and Washington did it with Heineke. 

 

 

Are you seriously asking why Sam got all the snaps?  

Are you going to double down on it by comparing Mullens and Heineke with the 3rd overall pick in the draft?  

 

[jgb]

We blew it by not picking up Tannehill. We blew it by trading away Teddy. We blew it by not offering more than Bills for Trubisky.
 

No more “all eggs in one basket.” Backup QB with upside or just roll with Morgan because what’s the point of a Nick Mullins where this team is at???

[slats]

It's really odd. If you go into a thread about last year's draft, James Morgan is generally considered the worst, stupidest, waste of a pick that JD has ever made. 

Then you come into this thread, and he's the fan favorite to win the job, with someone actually wondering why the Jets drafted Zach Wilson in the first place when they already have Captain Morgan available to lead the team to victory. 

That's a wide band of emotion for a guy who no one here has ever seen take a snap in a Jet uniform. 

Best case scenario, he does win the job. He's already here, he's cheap. Not sure why folks are concerned about upside from a #2 QB when we presumably just drafted a #1, but okay. Maybe you think Zack is RGIII to Morgan's Kirk Cousins? For me, it would be simply so that he looks good in preseasons, and when he's called upon in the regular season, and that as a result someone wants to send the Jets a higher pick than they spent on him to try him out as their starter. 

So if the Jets do grab the best of what's left for a backup, I would guess that means that either the people who have seen him take a snap don't feel he's up for the job, or that someone decided that a QB room with zero NFL starts might be problematic. 

[football guy]

3 minutes ago, slats said:

It's really odd. If you go into a thread about last year's draft, James Morgan is generally considered the worst, stupidest, waste of a pick that JD has ever made. 

Then you come into this thread, and he's the fan favorite to win the job, with someone actually wondering why the Jets drafted Zach Wilson in the first place when they already have Captain Morgan available to lead the team to victory. 

That's a wide band of emotion for a guy who no one here has ever seen take a snap in a Jet uniform. 

Best case scenario, he does win the job. He's already here, he's cheap. Not sure why folks are concerned about upside from a #2 QB when we presumably just drafted a #1, but okay. Maybe you think Zack is RGIII to Morgan's Kirk Cousins? For me, it would be simply so that he looks good in preseasons, and when he's called upon in the regular season, and that as a result someone wants to send the Jets a higher pick than they spent on him to try him out as their starter. 

So if the Jets do grab the best of what's left for a backup, I would guess that means that either the people who have seen him take a snap don't feel he's up for the job, or that someone decided that a QB room with zero NFL starts might be problematic. 

I think the truth about James Morgan lies somewhere in the middle. He has talent, but was drafted earlier than many felt he should go. Last year was going to be difficult for any young QB because of the pandemic. Justin Herbert may have surprised but I don't think that was necessarily the "norm"... trying to adapt to the NFL was harder than normal, so holding it against him that he wasn't even active in year 1 is somewhat unfair. Alternatively, it's not a secret that James Morgan was someone Adam Gase took more of a liking to than others. The scouting staff liked him as well, but that was when they were projecting him for Gase's offense. It's not to say he can't adjust and fit into LaFleur's... he can, but I'm not necessarily sure how he will. It's something the Jets will monitor. 

Ultimately, I think the Jets are going to give he and Mike White a chance to compete for the backup spot in the short-term, knowing they can always bring in Nick Mullens when he's healthy or a guy like Jeff Driskel. Outside of them, there should be a lot of guys to choose from... DEN, JAX, PIT, SF, TB, WAS are just a few teams who are carrying several QBs that either have ties to the Jets staff/FO or fit the scheme we're implementing. May even be a situation where they want to use training camp to give as many reps to Wilson and Morgan as possible, and if they feel Morgan isn't up to it they sign a grizzled vet who they know can step in and be a day 1 backup. 

[jetblue95]

pretty interesting that many of the experts here derided the idea of bringing in someone like hoyer to help in the QB room, yet a 6-time SB winning coach finds value in bringing him back year after year.

i'm not going to lose sleep over not bringing hoyer in, but i am not thrilled at the prospect of having 3 QBs on the roster who have never taken a snap in an nfl game.  can anyone find a precedent for that???

[jgb]

3 hours ago, jetblue95 said:

pretty interesting that many of the experts here derided the idea of bringing in someone like hoyer to help in the QB room, yet a 6-time SB winning coach finds value in bringing him back year after year.

i'm not going to lose sleep over not bringing hoyer in, but i am not thrilled at the prospect of having 3 QBs on the roster who have never taken a snap in an nfl game.  can anyone find a precedent for that???

A guy like Hoyer makes sense for team who believes it can contend (and Belichick always believes that and is now on short time as a HC). The goal is not to uncover new talent for such a team but survive if their starter is out for a couple games.

A team like the Jets in a full rebuild has different goals. I prefer a QB with upside for this reason.

[joewilly12]

9 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

Are you seriously asking why Sam got all the snaps?  

Are you going to double down on it by comparing Mullens and Heineke with the 3rd overall pick in the draft?  

 

Sam Darnold sucked he sucked for all 3 years he was with the NY Jets. 

Someone anyone should have replaced him. 

He's gone AG is gone all around bad experience anyway you look at it. 

Mullens and Heineke came off the bench probably no practice snaps and provided some life to their team. 

[jetblue95]

29 minutes ago, jgb said:

A guy like Hoyer makes sense for team who believes it can content (and Belichick always believes that and is now on short time as a HC). The goal is not to uncover new talent for such a team but survive if their starter is out for a couple games.

A team like the Jets in a full rebound has different goals. I prefer a QB with upside for this reason.

 

the pats also have cam newton, who may actually be the starter in week 1.

hoyer is there to help with mac jones.  although you bring up a good point - if belichick thinks hoyer can help them contend, why wouldn't you want such a player on the jets?

i'm fine with a QB with upside.  not sure i agree trubinsky or bridgewater offer much upside.

hopefully morgan shows something in camp.  but i'd still like to have someone on the roster who has actually taken a snap as an nfl QB to help all the young QBs on the roster.  and if wilson struggles or gets hurt, i'd like to have someone who can help the jets win games and help the other offensive players develop.

granted pickings are slim.

[jgb]

8 minutes ago, jetblue95 said:

 

the pats also have cam newton, who may actually be the starter in week 1.

hoyer is there to help with mac jones.  although you bring up a good point - if belichick thinks hoyer can help them contend, why wouldn't you want such a player on the jets?

i'm fine with a QB with upside.  not sure i agree trubinsky or bridgewater offer much upside.

hopefully morgan shows something in camp.  but i'd still like to have someone on the roster who has actually taken a snap as an nfl QB to help all the young QBs on the roster.  and if wilson struggles or gets hurt, i'd like to have someone who can help the jets win games and help the other offensive players develop.

granted pickings are slim.

I wanted Jets to keep Bridgwater in 2018 but I think that ship has now sailed.

Trubisky -- can agree to disagree although he has the best chance of active players of being the "next Ryan Tannehill" IMHO, although most likely a poor man's version of him. Buffalo actually the perfect fit for him. But will he get an opportunity? $2.5M what a steal. Wish JD offered him $3M.

With what's left now? I'd call JAX and inquire into Minshew. Worth a 4th rounder to me.

[Joe W. Namath]

The Jets are waiting for mullins to get healthy and will sign him right before camp starts at the end of july.

That has been the plan all along.  

[slats]

6 minutes ago, jgb said:

I wanted Jets to keep Bridgwater in 2018 but I think that ship has now sailed.

Trubisky -- can agree to disagree although he has the best chance of active players of being the "next Ryan Tannehill" IMHO, although most likely a poor man's version of him. Buffalo actually the perfect fit for him. But will he get an opportunity? $2.5M what a steal. Wish JD offered him $3M.

With what's left now? I'd call JAX and inquire into Minshew. Worth a 4th rounder to me.

Hi Mitch, er, sorry, Mitchell, uh, if I offered you another $500k, would you then prefer to come the last place team in the AFCe instead of the division winner? Ah, okay. 

I think Trubisky is hoping to look great in the preseason, maybe show up if/when needed during the season, and then land someplace where he can compete for a starting job again. The 2-14 Jets just were not that spot. 

I'd hate trading a pick for Minshew. At that point, you might as well just see if Morgan is Minshew. 

I also don't see the point in "upside" for a backup QB when you've just drafted the guy you hope is your starting QB for the next 15 years. The only value I see in it would be trade value. That's the main reason I'd like to see Morgan grab hold of the job over the course of the spring, to fulfill his potential as trade bait. What I want in the position is baseline competence. Sometimes that comes in jag form, and I'm cool with that. 

The 49ers have Josh Rosen now, so Nick Mullens will probably be available. 

[jgb]

9 minutes ago, slats said:

Hi Mitch, er, sorry, Mitchell, uh, if I offered you another $500k, would you then prefer to come the last place team in the AFCe instead of the division winner? Ah, okay. 

I think Trubisky is hoping to look great in the preseason, maybe show up if/when needed during the season, and then land someplace where he can compete for a starting job again. The 2-14 Jets just were not that spot. 

You're probably right. As stated, Bills perfect fit for him. That offense probably best chance for him to show something and he likely has a longer-term view than an extra $500k.

Quote

I'd hate trading a pick for Minshew. At that point, you might as well just see if Morgan is Minshew. 

I also don't see the point in "upside" for a backup QB when you've just drafted the guy you hope is your starting QB for the next 15 years. The only value I see in it would be trade value. That's the main reason I'd like to see Morgan grab hold of the job over the course of the spring, to fulfill his potential as trade bait. What I want in the position is baseline competence. Sometimes that comes in jag form, and I'm cool with that. 

We are both consistent here. I wanted Teddy as Darnold-bust insurance/to give our weaponinz competent play to develop and evaluate them if Darnold got hurt/benched and maybe, just maybe, "Kirk Cousins" Darnold out of a job by good play. I want someone like Minshew -- doesn't have to be him specifically, although he's my top choice -- for similar reasons. I'm not getting younger and would like the Jets to take two bites at the QB apple until they find one.

You were against keeping Bridge and also against trading for a QB now. Like I said, we disagree but we're both consistent.

Quote

The 49ers have Josh Rosen now, so Nick Mullens will probably be available. 

Mullens achieves none of my goals above and thus I have no interest in him. But realistically JD is more likely to agree with you than with me.

[peebag]

1 hour ago, jetblue95 said:

pretty interesting that many of the experts here derided the idea of bringing in someone like hoyer to help in the QB room, yet a 6-time SB winning coach finds value in bringing him back year after year.

i'm not going to lose sleep over not bringing hoyer in, but i am not thrilled at the prospect of having 3 QBs on the roster who have never taken a snap in an nfl game.  can anyone find a precedent for that???

Yes.

[jetblue95]

9 minutes ago, peebag said:

Yes.

 

and this precedent is???

[JohnnyLV]

11 hours ago, mrcoops said:

Looks like he was, indeed, a Cheatriot spy.

Also looks like the Jets might actually be willing to roll with White and Morgan as the QB depth.

Unless they are waiting for Mullens to get healthy, there is very little left on the vet FA QB market.

JD was super complimentary of Morgan and even said he wished that the beat writers could have seen him in practice. I just get the feeling the Jets sort of like what they have for now and might not make more changes until training camp and week before opening day. I do not really get the veteran backup QB concept for this team, seems slightly detrimental to me.

[Warfish]

Just curious, what are we losing if we do not sign a Hoyer-a-like to be our "Veteran backup" for 2021?

Like what are the actual tangible, verifiable losses we suffer by just sticking with Morgan/White/Wilson?

[peebag]

36 minutes ago, jetblue95 said:

 

and this precedent is???

sorry, I was agreeing with your argument 

[jetblue95]

10 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Just curious, what are we losing if we do not sign a Hoyer-a-like to be our "Veteran backup" for 2021?

Like what are the actual tangible, verifiable losses we suffer by just sticking with Morgan/White/Wilson?

 

hard to answer since i'm guessing no one here has ever been a professional QB so perhaps we aren't able to explain what having a veteran presence means to a rookie (or to 3 guys who have never taken a snap in the nfl).

yes, i know we have coaches, etc...  but having someone who can show the young guys what to do on and off the field, how to study, how to practice, how to prepare for a season, how to prepare for an individual game, how to dust yourself off after a tough outing, how to deal with the media, and so on may have some value.

i'm not definitively saying it does.  my belief is there is value here, but i cannot prove it.  

i've asked before if anyone can find precedent of a team entering the season with no QB on the roster ever having taken a snap in the nfl.  perhaps such a precedent does exist.  my guess is there is a reason teams seek to bring in a veteran presence to help young QBs.  the jets aren't the first franchise to hand the reins to a rookie.  my guess is every other time this has happened, the team has carried at least one "veteran" backup.  there probably is a reason for that.

in addition, should zach struggle or show he's not ready day 1 or get hurt, do we want to leave the team in the hands of morgan and white?  will that get the best out of mims and moore and carter and help the other players implement the new system?  maybe morgan is an nfl caliber player.  that would be great, and hopefully this is the case.  but if he's not?  

 

can i flip the question - what is the harm in bringing in a hoyer-like veteran to compete for a spot?  

[J_Smith]

I think we’re fine rolling without a veteran backup. Zach will have plenty of time with LaFleur, Knapp, and Calabrese. 

[JohnnyLV]

3 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Just curious, what are we losing if we do not sign a Hoyer-a-like to be our "Veteran backup" for 2021?

Like what are the actual tangible, verifiable losses we suffer by just sticking with Morgan/White/Wilson?

I do not see any real loss. From a lot of things I have heard Saleh say I believe he thinks that their systems are so strong that they prefer to develop players in their system so I suspect Saleh may not want a veteran imparting knowledge from other teams but prefers him to learn  from the staff they have. I can understand that. Zach has like 4 coaches outside of Saleh himself to work with plus I am sure he can bounce things off of Young when needed

[jgb]

44 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Just curious, what are we losing if we do not sign a Hoyer-a-like to be our "Veteran backup" for 2021?

Like what are the actual tangible, verifiable losses we suffer by just sticking with Morgan/White/Wilson?

We are losing nothing. Get a backup with some upside for once. No more Burnell mummies or Flacco corpses. And please no verified, undisputed JAGs like Mullins/Hoyer. Might as well just roll with Morgan at that point. At least give us a chance to find something pleasant and unexpected.

[Rhg1084]

We don’t need Brian Hoyer to help Wilson. The guys been a scrub his whole career, what advice is he gonna give him?! And if it comes down to actually taking snaps in a live game I’m sure James Morgan can do all the things Hoyer does if not more. 
 

The guys who will be most important to Wilson is Lafleur and Rob Calabrese. Wilson’s success will have a lot to do with those two. 
 

Everyone loved when Sam had McCown as his “mentor”. Look how that worked out