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***OFFICIAL*** FIRE JOE DOUGLAS THREAD


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1 hour ago, dcJet said:

You can't credit a GM for finding an average or below average punter.  C'mon man.

 

He didn't sign a guy off waivers.....he spent a pick on him. That's the difference 

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just getting a head start here. Like getting on board with bitcoin at $5. 

I made the t-shirt.  Who's covering the plane and the billboard? SAR I

Who needs free agents when we're drafting guys like Ashtyn Davis, Jabari Zuniga, James Morgan and Cameron Clark?  

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16 minutes ago, kevinc855 said:

yes, making realy weak arguments based on Home Alone references….deep stuff, and some real hot takes

You need to relax. Maybe a lovely cheese pizza just for yourself would calm you down. 

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6 minutes ago, BornJetsFan1983 said:

I love pizza but it should have toppings.

Anchovies and pineapple for Jets fans.

Kevin gets extra anchovies.  😀

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20 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Nah. I'd argue that, as the starters finished their rookie deals or started to get older or just their production trailed off in general, drafting and signing bad players to replace them is what made those teams worse. They didn't need to let themselves hit rock bottom for the privilege of a scorched earth rebuild, which suck anyway because it makes it harder to discern good draft picks from just the least stinky turd.

That scorched earth type rebuild isn't done by perennial playoff teams. The only difference is the draft pick slots are a little better after a horrible season, but then perennial playoff teams deal with that annually as well (and with lower picks than we had). Meanwhile we also become a less attractive destination for FAs when we do these "proper" scorched earth rebuilds.

Draft bad players, sign and/or extend bad & unworthy players, and there's your talent drop-off.

Once teams are good at drafting and are a winning organization, they don't have to do scorched earth. They draft to supplement the next generation of talent.

The Patriots are an organization that have been robbing from Peter to pay Paul, in part because they haven't drafted well. They lived off Brady's greatness and his willingness to structure team-friendly deals, as well as free agents willing to chase a ring. Kicking the can down the road with free agents and sacrificing the future for the present can only go so far.

What the Jets need to do is build the foundation, create a winner, and then use the draft to stay on top and supplement. 

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2 hours ago, SackExchangeNYJ said:

What the Jets need to do is build the foundation, create a winner, and then use the draft to stay on top and supplement. 

We all agree with this.

The issue is Joe Douglas.  He was given the greatest head start any GM has been given in league history.  The Jets announced a rebuild in 2017, Sucked For Sam, and got him.  Then they got rid of a ton of pieces and accumulated picks and cap space in 2018.  Then they did a full draft and FA period in 2019.  Then they hired Joe Douglas who was paid $4M to hold a clipboard and have 11 months to prepare for a great 2020 draft.  Oops.

The hiring of Saleh isn't some reset on Joe Douglas who inherited Year 3 of an announced rebuild, did nothing to rebuild, tore it down even further, and is responsible for turning us into an expansion team.  This is Year 5 of the rebuild.  And Joe Douglas has made us worse than we were than when he got here, he took a 7-9 team with some stars and some potential, made it into a 2-14 joke, and just had a bad FA period.  I'm done with rebuilding.  Joe Douglas is on the hot seat.  Deservedly so.

SAR I

 

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3 minutes ago, SAR I said:

We all agree with this.

The issue is Joe Douglas.  He was given the greatest head start any GM has been given in league history.  The Jets announced a rebuild in 2017, Sucked For Sam, and got him.  Then they got rid of a ton of pieces and accumulated picks and cap space in 2018.  Then they did a full draft and FA period in 2019.  Then they hired Joe Douglas who was paid $4M to hold a clipboard and have 11 months to prepare for a great 2020 draft.  Oops.

The hiring of Saleh isn't some reset on Joe Douglas who inherited Year 3 of an announced rebuild, did nothing to rebuild, tore it down even further, and is responsible for turning us into an expansion team.  This is Year 5 of the rebuild.  And Joe Douglas has made us worse than we were than when he got here, he took a 7-9 team with some stars and some potential, made it into a 2-14 joke, and just had a bad FA period.  I'm done with rebuilding.  Joe Douglas is on the hot seat.  Deservedly so.

SAR I

 

A true rebuild starts w a complete tear down.  This roster, contracts etc have been so mismanaged for 20 years its taken him this whole time to tear down the roster.  Trading Sam was the final step to the tear down.

Now the rebuild begins.

Thats what people are missing.  Hes been tearing down since hes been here. The books are cleared now.  Draft captital has been acquired.

So saying hrs been rebuilding for 2 years is completely inaccurate.

Rebuild hasnt even begun yet.  Starts on draft night in 3 weeks.

 

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10 minutes ago, SAR I said:

We all agree with this.

The issue is Joe Douglas.  He was given the greatest head start any GM has been given in league history.  The Jets announced a rebuild in 2017, Sucked For Sam, and got him.  Then they got rid of a ton of pieces and accumulated picks and cap space in 2018.  Then they did a full draft and FA period in 2019.  Then they hired Joe Douglas who was paid $4M to hold a clipboard and have 11 months to prepare for a great 2020 draft.  Oops.

The hiring of Saleh isn't some reset on Joe Douglas who inherited Year 3 of an announced rebuild, did nothing to rebuild, tore it down even further, and is responsible for turning us into an expansion team.  This is Year 5 of the rebuild.  And Joe Douglas has made us worse than we were than when he got here, he took a 7-9 team with some stars and some potential, made it into a 2-14 joke, and just had a bad FA period.  I'm done with rebuilding.  Joe Douglas is on the hot seat.  Deservedly so.

SAR I

 

That head start came with a QB midway into his rookie deal and previous GMs with historically bad drafts. Every team misses on the draft sometimes. The Idzik/Maccagnan Jets drafts crashed and burned. 

That 2019 full draft. Who aside from Q was the highlight? Jachai Polite? Edoga? Wesco? Again, none of those picks made by Douglas, but left for him to inherit.

Let's not act like Douglas came to a franchise loaded with young talent. 

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34 minutes ago, Joe W. Namath said:

A true rebuild starts w a complete tear down.  This roster, contracts etc have been so mismanaged for 20 years its taken him this whole time to tear down the roster.  Trading Sam was the final step to the tear down.

Now the rebuild begins.

Thats what people are missing.  Hes been tearing down since hes been here. The books are cleared now.  Draft captital has been acquired.

So saying hrs been rebuilding for 2 years is completely inaccurate.

Rebuild hasnt even begun yet.  Starts on draft night in 3 weeks.

 

This team would be better right now if we had Jamal Adams and Leonard Williams on it.  This team would be better right now if we had spent the money on better free agents last year and this year.  

You are giving Joe Douglas a free pass for a 2019 investment where he held a clipboard for $4M for 11 months only to produce a 2020 so weak that we went from 7-9 to 2-14.  You shouldn't do that.  I get what he's trying to do, truly.  But he didn't start in 2021 and the Jets didn't begin the rebuild in 2021.  We've been rebuilding since 2017 and Douglas has been a Jet since 2019.  These facts don't get swept under the rug.  Douglas had better nail this draft or he's gone if we go 4-13 or similar.

SAR I

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31 minutes ago, SackExchangeNYJ said:

That head start came with a QB midway into his rookie deal and previous GMs with historically bad drafts. Every team misses on the draft sometimes. The Idzik/Maccagnan Jets drafts crashed and burned. 

That 2019 full draft. Who aside from Q was the highlight? Jachai Polite? Edoga? Wesco? Again, none of those picks made by Douglas, but left for him to inherit.

Let's not act like Douglas came to a franchise loaded with young talent. 

My contention is quite the opposite-  Douglas came to a franchise that was already 90% to rock bottom.  And all he did was take us from 7-9 to 2-14.  All he did was take us from 90% rock bottom to 100% rock bottom.  That's not his job.  No one said we had to chop the tree down to its roots, to take a bad roster and make it worse.  To make the Jets into an expansion team.  We had been tearing it down since 2017, since Suck For Sam, since Sam's rookie season.

Douglas joined a team already torn down.  And he tore it down further.  There is no evidence that he can build it back up.  2020 FA and draft was a "C" at best, and 2021 FA is the same.  

SAR I

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14 minutes ago, SAR I said:

My contention is quite the opposite-  Douglas came to a franchise that was already 90% to rock bottom.  And all he did was take us from 7-9 to 2-14.  All he did was take us from 90% rock bottom to 100% rock bottom.  That's not his job.  No one said we had to chop the tree down to its roots, to take a bad roster and make it worse.  To make the Jets into an expansion team.  We had been tearing it down since 2017, since Suck For Sam, since Sam's rookie season.

Douglas joined a team already torn down.  And he tore it down further.  There is no evidence that he can build it back up.  2020 FA and draft was a "C" at best, and 2021 FA is the same.  

SAR I

This roster was full of sh!t contracts(trumaine johnson, leveon bell etc) overhyped players(leo williams, jamal adams etc.) a sh!tty coaching staff, sh!tty culture, and a real sh!t qb.

Jet fans do not get the magnitude of the cleanup job Joe Douglas had to do.  It took him 2 years just to clean up this mess.

And he did it flawlessly.

Now that the deck is finally cleared.  The rebuild starts in three weeks on draft night.

I guess I cant expect most Jet fans to understand the correct way to teardown, then rebuild a roster for long term success.

Winning is so foreign to them they are clueless.  

In 3 years when we are one of the top teams in the nfl and a perrenial super bowl contenders ull still be opening cimini threads and whining about something.

Pathetic.

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3 minutes ago, Joe W. Namath said:

This roster was full of sh!t contracts(trumaine johnson, leveon bell etc) overhyped players(leo williams, jamal adams etc.) a sh!tty coaching staff, sh!tty culture, and a real sh!t qb.

Jet fans do not get the magnitude of the cleanup job Joe Douglas had to do.  It took him 2 years just to clean up this mess.

And he did it flawlessly.

Now that the deck is finally cleared.  The rebuild starts in three weeks on draft night.

I guess I cant expect most Jet fans to understand the correct way to teardown, then rebuild a roster for long term success.

Winning is so foreign to them they are clueless.  

In 3 years when we are one of the top teams in the nfl and a perrenial super bowl contenders ull still be opening cimini threads and whining about something.

Pathetic.

We are on the same page philosophically.  But disagree on the timing.

I contend that the Jets were already in a state of teardown long before Joe Douglas signed with the Jets and his clock ticking is already in Year 3.  You contend that he needed another 2 years to keep tearing the team down and we'll have to disagree on that.

And no matter what anyone says, we'd be a better team with Jamal Adams and Leonard Williams right now.  We didn't need to cut that deeply.

SAR I

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8 hours ago, SAR I said:

We are on the same page philosophically.  But disagree on the timing.

I contend that the Jets were already in a state of teardown long before Joe Douglas signed with the Jets and his clock ticking is already in Year 3.  You contend that he needed another 2 years to keep tearing the team down and we'll have to disagree on that.

And no matter what anyone says, we'd be a better team with Jamal Adams and Leonard Williams right now.  We didn't need to cut that deeply.

SAR I

The tear down that included signing aging veterans like Leveon Bell and Mosley (Trumaine the year before)? What on earth are you smoking.

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1 hour ago, mtwarlock31 said:

The tear down that included signing aging veterans like Leveon Bell and Mosley (Trumaine the year before)? What on earth are you smoking.

Look up the Jets transactions for 2017, 2018, and 2019.  Look who we dropped.  Adding a few free agents to sell tickets and jerseys isn't indicative of a team loading up for a Super Bowl run.  Chrisopher Johnson announced a rebuild, we Sucked For Sam, and we have been lopping off salary and good young players right up to this very day.  It's time to stop chopping and start growing.

SAR I

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24 minutes ago, SAR I said:

Look up the Jets transactions for 2017, 2018, and 2019.  Look who we dropped.  Adding a few free agents to sell tickets and jerseys isn't indicative of a team loading up for a Super Bowl run.  Chrisopher Johnson announced a rebuild, we Sucked For Sam, and we have been lopping off salary and good young players right up to this very day.  It's time to stop chopping and start growing.

SAR I

He dropped David Harris (age 32), Fitz (34), marshall (32), decker (30), reivs (32), mangold (32). And cleaned up contracts/players that have proven unsuccessful elsewhere (Wilkerson, Richardson, Lee, Pryor).

What was on this team in 2016-2017 that we should have kept long term? What draft picks did he hit on in 2017-2019 other than QW (jury still out at his price) that set JD up for success? If adding players to sell jerseys (that we are still dealing with cap ramifications in 2021 and beyond) is your idea of a successful rebuild / tear down, than you might be alone.

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10 hours ago, SAR I said:

My contention is quite the opposite-  Douglas came to a franchise that was already 90% to rock bottom.  And all he did was take us from 7-9 to 2-14.  All he did was take us from 90% rock bottom to 100% rock bottom.  That's not his job.  No one said we had to chop the tree down to its roots, to take a bad roster and make it worse.  To make the Jets into an expansion team.  We had been tearing it down since 2017, since Suck For Sam, since Sam's rookie season.

Douglas joined a team already torn down.  And he tore it down further.  There is no evidence that he can build it back up.  2020 FA and draft was a "C" at best, and 2021 FA is the same.  

SAR I

Oh, I absolutely think he had to complete the teardown. You don't keep 10% of an awful foundation in place. You rip the whole thing out and start anew.

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10 hours ago, SAR I said:

My contention is quite the opposite-  Douglas came to a franchise that was already 90% to rock bottom.  And all he did was take us from 7-9 to 2-14

SAR I

That's how rebuilds work. 

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This has to be one of the worst threads I have seen on this forum in a long time. Joe Douglas has been a godsend to this franchise. Our last two GMs were garbage and Tannenbaum was ok but ultimately could not survive. JD represents such a huge upgrade at GM that people can't see his plan entails building through the draft and not relying much on Free agents. The cleaning up of the roster by JD entails clearing out bad contracts, short term FA contracts as gap fillers (no over paying). 

This thread is premature, lets wait at least two years and see how these next two drafts turn out before we want JD gone. 

LL

 

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1 hour ago, SackExchangeNYJ said:

Oh, I absolutely think he had to complete the teardown. You don't keep 10% of an awful foundation in place. You rip the whole thing out and start anew.

I can't think of another NFL team that has attempted such a thing.  Joe Douglas will either go to the Hall Of Fame as the most innovative GM in the modern era or he will be shown the door by angry Jets fans when they realize they are an expansion team.

We were 7-9 before Joe Douglas put his paws all over the roster.  Then the same coaching staff and the same quarterback went 2-14.  They were the constant; the GM was the variable.  And he just had a sh-t FA period and got nothing in return for Darnold that will help us this season.

SAR I

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1 hour ago, slimjasi said:

That's how rebuilds work. 

The rebuild began 3 years before Douglas was hired and he's been here 2 years and 11 months.

This isn't how rebuilds work.  This is what it looks like when you spend 5 years tearing the roster to smithereens and have someone incapable of replenishing it.  Maccangan, now Douglas.  

This guy gets a free pass for 2019 and 2020 why?  We showed Gase the door after 4 measly games.  We're going to give Douglas 4 friggin' years? 

SAR I

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On 4/6/2021 at 7:07 PM, Joe W. Namath said:

I think 4-5 wins is possible.  Anything more and we have had a heck of a season.  
 

Year 3 of Zach Wilson will be the year this team makes a serious run.

Get ready!!

We should have won 5 games last year, with a competent CS we would have.

Denver, Pats and Raider games should have been wins.

Coaching matters, hopefully Saleh and company can coach

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On 4/6/2021 at 8:06 PM, Scotty Wooty Doo Doo said:

There have been teams that went from last to first in 1 year ,,,,that's my hope ,,,, just playing

Sent from my SM-G996U using JetNation.com mobile app
 

Not in a division like the todays AFCE 

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2 minutes ago, SAR I said:

The rebuild began 3 years before Douglas was hired and he's been here 2 years and 11 months.

SAR I

Douglas has no responsibility for anything Macc did. I'm not sure why this is so hard for some of you guys to understand. 

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3 minutes ago, SAR I said:

The rebuild began 3 years before Douglas was hired and he's been here 2 years and 11 months.

This isn't how rebuilds work.  This is what it looks like when you spend 5 years tearing the roster to smithereens and have someone incapable of replenishing it.  Maccangan, now Douglas.  

This guy gets a free pass for 2019 and 2020 why?  We showed Gase the door after 4 measly games.  We're going to give Douglas 4 friggin' years? 

SAR I

There are 3 types of jet fans right now.

1- Smart jet fans.  They understand what Douglas is doing and realize how lucky we are to have him

2- Darnold fanatics.  They hate Joe Douglas and Zach Wilson because their sh!tty hero was sent packing

3- SAR.  Still whining about Adam Gase who is so bad at coaching hes unemployed.

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8 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

Douglas has no responsibility for anything Macc did. I'm not sure why this is so hard for some of you guys to understand. 

That's not the point.

How many GM's inherit a team that has already announced to their fans is two-years-in to a deep rebuild and then gets hired weeks after the draft and paid $4M to do nothing but study the roster, study potential FA's, and study the upcoming NCAA class?  And then watch his team go an incredible 7-9 against all injuries/odds?  Last year shouldn't have been 2-14.  That's unacceptable.  And telling me that its okay for this year to be just as bad because 5 years of a rebuild isn't enough and we need 6 or 7 years is ridiculous.

The clock on Joe Douglas started before he even got here because the rebuild was already underway.  Not to mention, again, the amazing head start he was given, a $4M paid mulligan to sit there and do nothing but prepare for the 2020 FA period and draft......and come up blah in both.  And the 2021 FA period, blah again.  And trading Darnold, blah again.

SAR I

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9 minutes ago, Joe W. Namath said:

There are 3 types of jet fans right now.

1- Smart jet fans.  They understand what Douglas is doing and realize how lucky we are to have him

2- Darnold fanatics.  They hate Joe Douglas and Zach Wilson because their sh!tty hero was sent packing

3- SAR.  Still whining about Adam Gase who is so bad at coaching hes unemployed.

1 - SAR understands what Joe Douglas is doing.  It's not enough.  My mother could tear down this roster, get rid of anyone making too much, keep half the roster on 1-year deals, keep reaping JAG's and hope a few stick.  That's what all GM's do.  

2 - SAR  is not a Darnold fanatic.

3 - SAR was wrong about Adam Gase.  Adam Gase was awful.  But that doesn't mean Joe Douglas isn't awful too.  In fact, all evidence supports that he is.  He's here 2 years and 11 months and I can count on 1 finger the players that would start on another NFL team and that guy has a hard time staying on the field.

SAR I

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On 4/7/2021 at 12:04 PM, jetstream23 said:

He sits higher in the minds of Jets fans because he made a couple of highlight tackles.  His punting was far below average.

Big year coming up for him.  I'm hoping and expecting the Jets will be better on Special Teams, especially after signing their new Gunner from the Saints.  But that Gunner is only valuable if you can punt the ball high and deep.

Going by avg yards doesnt tell the story.

He was 20th in kicks inside the 20.  Given how many 3 and outs he kicked out of, that started on the 25, not too bad 

Youre not looking at the big picture

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12 hours ago, SAR I said:

This team would be better right now if we had Jamal Adams and Leonard Williams on it.  This team would be better right now if we had spent the money on better free agents last year and this year.  

You are giving Joe Douglas a free pass for a 2019 investment where he held a clipboard for $4M for 11 months only to produce a 2020 so weak that we went from 7-9 to 2-14.  You shouldn't do that.  I get what he's trying to do, truly.  But he didn't start in 2021 and the Jets didn't begin the rebuild in 2021.  We've been rebuilding since 2017 and Douglas has been a Jet since 2019.  These facts don't get swept under the rug.  Douglas had better nail this draft or he's gone if we go 4-13 or similar.

SAR I

JD's realm started in 2020 and the team he inherited sucked big time. His 2020 FA signings/lack of signings were not very good. Fant at RT for 10M and it looks like he's rolling with him again. Perrimen sucked. Letting Robbie go was a big mistake. Signing what turned out to be the worst OL helped to sabotage Sam. Great move was the haul he received for Jamal. Leo is a dog and getting a 3rd for him was also a winner. But he has to turn those picks into very good players.

His 2020 draft is so so at this point. Becton looks great and Mimms I have high hopes for.

2021 is the make or break year for Joe. FA looks better but time will tell. The draft - he went all in with Wilson and JD better pick good to very good premium position players at #23 and #34 along with a hit on one of the two 3rd rounders.

I am 100% behind all his moves but they better show up on game day. I'm not expecting to make the playoffs this year but I want to see a team that's clearly headed in the right direction. Then he can finish the rebuild in 2022.

 

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1 hour ago, Latinlawyer said:

This has to be one of the worst threads I have seen on this forum in a long time. Joe Douglas has been a godsend to this franchise. Our last two GMs were garbage and Tannenbaum was ok but ultimately could not survive. JD represents such a huge upgrade at GM that people can't see his plan entails building through the draft and not relying much on Free agents. The cleaning up of the roster by JD entails clearing out bad contracts, short term FA contracts as gap fillers (no over paying). 

This thread is premature, lets wait at least two years and see how these next two drafts turn out before we want JD gone. 

LL

 

Thank you, and Joe, why would argue with Sar1 when the guy thought AG was a viable HC?  The sheer fact that he predicates his rebuild argument on under MAC and tars JD with the same brush is ludicrous.  

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1 hour ago, SAR I said:

The clock on Joe Douglas started before he even got here because the rebuild was already underway.  

SAR I

This doesn't make any sense to me. 

Sorry 🤷‍♂️

 

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