This new regime is tied to the QB that starts in September.

[Jet Nut]

20 minutes ago, Paradis said:

I understand what you’re saying, but I don’t think that GMing has only one book of success to follow. If as a GM you feel you could win with Josh Allen, or Baker, or Wilson, or fields; if you feel you can win with a handful of different quarterbacks if your team is built right, then maybe you don’t feel this is the right time to draft a quarterback. That approach has to be backed up with the right picks of course, but I don’t believe that his mandate has to be - get a quarterback this year (mainly cause our roster is so bad). Which is why I said I wouldn’t hold his feet to the fire if he rolled with Sam and made a lot of great pics. Who knows what happens next year as far as options at quarterback.

I agree.  My first choice was to roll Sam out again but I totally understand why they might want to abandon that plan and move on to whoever.  JD and a new staff probably would want their own guy, throw in the financial aspect and you could see it coming to a change.  And with all the extra picks they've accumulated they can use one on a QB and still have more picks than most teams. 

[Joe W. Namath]

2 hours ago, johnnysd said:

Exactly. I do not get it on any level. I think passing on a QB is completely idiotic, and while he has shot up the board this year his play was historical Not just good, among the best ever in college FB.  If JD somehow decides to pass we will regret it for years. Also we already have 2 years of multiple #1s among other high picks it is not like we are starved for draft capital.

Sam Darnold was ranked 36th of starters last year. Just think about that. He was worse than 4 back ups.  And yet we have people beside themselves wanting to pass on QB and give Darnold another shot. It is utterly bewildering.

Here is the irony though. The argument for giving Sam a shot is essentially he will be better with better weapons and a better OL Wilson will ALSO be better with talent that is many levels above what he played with. I am not sure if anyone noticed in the Pro Day how below average his receivers were. 

Passing on Wilson will be the worst move this team made since selecting a safety over Mahomes or Watson.

People really didn't learn from the last time. They want to pass again. Madness

You cannot talk sense to fans that wear Darnold feety pajamas to bed and have his bobblehead on their nightstand.

What you can do is be happy that we now have very smart people running this team who wont let sam darnold take another snap for the jets if their life depended on it.

[jetspenguin]

We won two games.  Wont take much to be DRAMATICALLY better

Hahahahaha

Sent from the Suicide Watch desk.

[jetspenguin]

We won two games.  Wont take much to be DRAMATICALLY better

That is true but it won't be the primary result of the rookies we draft imo. It will because we have a competent coaching staff, a few solid free agent additions and...a competent coaching staff.

A new qb that is mostly throwing to OUR team will help, a cb, wr, rb drafted will have minimal impact because there will be a learning curve. They by themselves won't be "the" difference, I just want them to clearly be a part of the solution and not the problem.

Sent from the Suicide Watch desk.

[Big_Slick]

13 hours ago, K_O_Brien said:

San Francisco obviously didn't think Darnold can run that system effectively, or they wouldn't have given up the farm for QB3 in this draft when they could have had Sam for a second rounder. If the Niners do not think Darnold can be effective in such a scheme, why would the Jets? 

 

I'm not so sure that's accurate. We'll never know for sure if SF offered the 2nd or if they did if JD turned them down.

[Big_Slick]

9 hours ago, johnnysd said:

Both Wilson and Lawrence are both elite prospects.

 

That's a real question. TL is definitely elite the jury is out on Wilson.

We'll find out how JD feels if he trades Sam or trades down.

[BroadwayRay]

16 hours ago, slats said:

If they trade out of the pick and trot Darnold out there, they're not tied to anything.

Don’t agree at all with this. If JD brings back Darnold as the starter, Darnold becomes Douglas’s responsibility. Douglas will get the credit if he succeeds and he will suffer the consequences if he fails. If Darnold fails and the Jets are not in a position to draft or trade for a QB in 2022, he will be roasted by fans and the media. If all of that happens while Wilson shines with another team, Douglas will wish he never left Philadelphia. 

[isired]

You do realize that you are essentially dismissing Wilson because he happened to improve a LOT. Like Burrow did last year. And if you read Peter King's article you would know it was hard work that did it for him. The hatred for WIlson is just mind numbing.

I'm not dismissing him. If they like him as potential FQB that they would take in any circumstance (other than maybe having the ability to draft Lawrence at 1) they should take him at 2.

Point is, saying 'if he's great and they passed on him' is not different than saying 'if he's a bust and they drafted him' at this point. One statement is no more valid or based in fact than the other at this point.

Same for saying that Wilson improved a lot in a year and right now there are no QB prospects as good in next year's draft. Because Wilson wasn't deemed worthy at this time last year and someone else could take the leap, too. Those are 2 of the few facts in the discussion. I can agree that Wilson improved A LOT and still not be sure that he's an Andrew Luck prospect like Lawrence. But I can 100% respect that JD or any FO that studies his film etc. and thinks that he is a FQB can and should take him if possible. It's their job to do just that if that's their opinion of him.

[JohnnyLV]

29 minutes ago, isired said:

 

 

I'm not dismissing him. If they like him as potential FQB that they would take in any circumstance (other than maybe having the ability to draft Lawrence at 1) they should take him at 2.

Point is, saying 'if he's great and they passed on him' is not different than saying 'if he's a bust and they drafted him' at this point. One statement is no more valid or based in fact than the other at this point.

Same for saying that Wilson improved a lot in a year and right now there are no QB prospects as good in next year's draft. Because Wilson wasn't deemed worthy at this time last year and someone else could take the leap, too. Those are 2 of the few facts in the discussion. I can agree that Wilson improved A LOT and still not be sure that he's an Andrew Luck prospect like Lawrence. But I can 100% respect that JD or any FO that studies his film etc. and thinks that he is a FQB can and should take him if possible. It's their job to do just that if that's their opinion of him.

 

Fair enough. I do think someone will emerge again in CFB at QB

[NamathToCaster]

I think Joe is going to pick Wilson and keep Darnold if he doesn't get a great trade for him.  Then he will let Sam determine his own fate.  If you are as good as they say you are Sam, prove it.  Joe will have covered himself by doing this.  

[Jet Nut]

19 hours ago, NIGHT STALKER said:

My God, some of you guys have already anointed JD like he's this draft guru.  His first draft was nothing to write home about.  If he had a couple of solid drafts under his belt, I could see the trade out of the two spot and gathering picks.  I say, play it safe and stay at two, see what he does with what picks we have.  By the way, Morgan says hi.  I still cannot believe this kid didn't see the field at least once on a 2-14 team...I would like to know JD's reasoning for that pick. 

One draft, less that a year old is the absolute last reason I would give for not trading down.

Its interesting that you think people have annointed JD like hes a draft guru after one draft but seems like you have the opposite feeling after that same single draft

Its way too early to judge the 2020 draft. a success or failure

[Jet Nut]

7 hours ago, Joe W. Namath said:

You cannot talk sense to fans that wear Darnold feety pajamas to bed and have his bobblehead on their nightstand.

What you can do is be happy that we now have very smart people running this team who wont let sam darnold take another snap for the jets if their life depended on it.

 

[Jet Nut]

1 hour ago, NamathToCaster said:

I think Joe is going to pick Wilson and keep Darnold if he doesn't get a great trade for him.  Then he will let Sam determine his own fate.  If you are as good as they say you are Sam, prove it.  Joe will have covered himself by doing this.  

Thats my thinking.  If JD doesnt get a fair offer for Sam, that teams, then go into the season with both QBs, even let Sam start.  Even if he does well eventually make the switch to Wilson, even if the team is competing, make the switch like Miami did.  We'll have a more valuable trade chip 

[Philc1]

Giving up on Sam after obvious mismanagement for 3 years and seeing him be the latest offensive player to blossom post-Gase will look bad- especially when Wilson is struggling and going on IR

[rillo]

Agreed, and in 3-4 years it'll be the same.

[Philc1]

4 minutes ago, rillo said:

Agreed, and in 3-4 years it'll be the same.

If JD drafts Wilson who is his replacement in 2023?

[rillo]

5 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

If JD drafts Wilson who is his replacement in 2023?

Couldn't tell ya. The chin? Give him full control ??

[Philc1]

Just now, rillo said:

Couldn't tell ya. The chin? Give him full control ??

Woody handpicking the next GM after Wilson ends up on IR multiple times.  Should be fun

[rillo]

3 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

Should be fun

It always is. 

[greengeek]

I seem to remember arguments about regularly drafting at QB because it is THE most important position on the field and NOBODY truly knows whether a prospect over- or under-performs his college tape and pro day outing. NOBODY. To me, we have to keep keep rolling those dice since there is basically zero evidence that Sam is a top 10 QB. The actual evidence says top 40, but that’s only considered good for music.

We’re not required to dump Sam while drafting Wilson, Fields, Lance, or even captain Morgan. Because it is more likely than not that Sam won’t turn his career completely around with weaponz or coaching (he already did seek out the best help in the offseason) we need to draft QB. The second pick is a real opportunity.

To my mind, if we pick a very promising QB at 2 and Sam beats them out in camp, this would be critical in his regaining the team trust. If he merely beats out the Captain, Saleh will have to work REALLY REALLY HARD to convince anyone that we’ve turned the corner to look at a brighter future.

If you ask me “what about the picks we could have had?” I say that losing those this year is basically the same as needing to trade up next year. Instead, let’s change the culture of our team now. Keep the momentum of our new coaching staff. Force Sam to win or lose to real competition. All gas, no brakes.

[QB1]

“Their own” guy thing is BS. They want the path that will most likely lead to success. 

[ToonforPrez]

23 hours ago, Joe W. Namath said:

How many times can the same thread be open.  My goodness this is painful.

[Adoni Beast]

On 3/27/2021 at 7:44 AM, zonajetfan said: I still believe we could see JD trade back still, likely with Carolina, and sell this idea of "punting", on not the season per say, but the decision on the QB of this regime for one more year. 

Carolina wants to trade up to #2 so bad that they didn’t even send Matt Rhule to Zach Wilson’s pro day?

Trading down is no longer an option. We are taking Zach Wilson.

[Adoni Beast]

Considering how putrid the GMs and Coached we’ve had here, I actually believe if they whiff on QB the rest of the team is good and competitive they’ll still keep Douglas and Saleh and give them a chance to find a QB if that’s the only missing piece.

[Augustiniak]

Just now, Adoni Beast said:

Carolina wants to trade up to #2 so bad that they didn’t even send Matt Rhule to Zach Wilson’s pro day?

Trading down is no longer an option. We are taking Zach Wilson.

Probably not so much not wanting to trade up, but the prohibitive cost plus the alleged douglas love for wilson has made it all but a moot point.  If a team wants a qb at this point, you’re path is probably through atlanta but that wouldn’t happen until they’re on the clock.

[NYJ1]

I personally think the most responsible thing to do is keep both? Why would you hitch your wagon to a single player. Why not maximize your chances. Keep Sammy, draft Wilson and let them fight it out in training camp.....

[sec101row23]

If JD takes Wilson at 2, that’s his guy, if he doesn’t make it work with Wilson then he’s done.   Sticking with Sam buys him a year on the rebuild and can easily move away from Sam if he doesn’t progress.   

[Maxman]

2 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

 

I got. Notification for this, did you originally tag me in it? Lol Sam is looking good.

[Jet Nut]

1 minute ago, Maxman said:

I got. Notification for this, did you originally tag me in it? Lol Sam is looking good.

LOL, yes I did and then figured no one would get the reasoning and pulled it. 

Unfortunately that might be the best Sam ever looked for the Jets, posing as a QB.  I wish he could've worked out.

[slats]

10 hours ago, BroadwayRay said:

Don’t agree at all with this. If JD brings back Darnold as the starter, Darnold becomes Douglas’s responsibility. Douglas will get the credit if he succeeds and he will suffer the consequences if he fails. If Darnold fails and the Jets are not in a position to draft or trade for a QB in 2022, he will be roasted by fans and the media. If all of that happens while Wilson shines with another team, Douglas will wish he never left Philadelphia. 

Oh look, I already answered about this singular hypothetical on page 1: 

22 hours ago, slats said:

That would be the worst case scenario, but there are a variety of other ones. The difference is that the Jets would be in prime position to right the wrong the following year if they stuck with Darnold. If they go with Wilson and he busts, that's a much bigger problem and they won't have the two extra first round picks to fix it anytime soon. 

I'm optimistic about the offense they'll be running this year, the new WRs they've added, and the help that's on the way via the draft. I think Sam would do better than we've seen with the support and coaching he's had to date. But it's not about some mystical belief in Darnold, it's about maximizing the value of that #2 pick. IMHO, there's a very strong case to be made that trading down is the safer option. 

Try to keep up. 

[BroadwayRay]

34 minutes ago, slats said:

Oh look, I already answered about this singular hypothetical on page 1: 

Try to keep up. 

Yup, I saw your answer. You called Darnold failing a "worst case scenario" when it is probably the most likely outcome. And you called a Wilson bust a bigger problem when that's something that would play out over two or three years. Still strongly disagree with your take -- just to keep up.

[slats]

6 minutes ago, BroadwayRay said:

Yup, I saw your answer. You called Darnold failing a "worst case scenario" when it is probably the most likely outcome. And you called a Wilson bust a bigger problem when that's something that would play out over two or three years. Still strongly disagree with your take -- just to keep up.

No. Darnold sucking and Wilson being a star would be an issue. If Darnold sucks and Wilson looks lost, it's much less of an issue. If Darnold looks competent and Wilson is struggling, he looks really smart. Many options there. 

Either way, there's no way that the Jets won't be in position to reset at the QB spot in 2022 with three first round picks and two more coming in 2023. 

[BroadwayRay]

1 minute ago, slats said:

Either way, there's no way that the Jets won't be in position to reset at the QB spot in 2022 with three first round picks and two more coming in 2023. 

The bolded section of your quote is a key fracture point between those who want to draft a QB this year and those who want to risk another year with Darnold.

You can't say "there's no way" the Jets won't be able to draft a QB in 2022. First of all, the 2022 QB class is looking pretty sucky right now. Second, you don't know if the teams in a position to draft the best QB prospects will want to draft down. And third, if it's a good prospect, the price to trade up would be enormous.

Sticking with Darnold another year risks putting the Jets in QB limbo yet again in 2022. And to repeat, his failing in 2021 is the most likely scenario based on history. Nobody has ever played that badly in their first three seasons of football and gone on to be a franchise QB. Everyone keeps bringing up Tannehill, but Tannehill was a good QB before he went to Tennessee. His three seasons with Gase were riddled with injuries. Alex Smith was a terrible QB for many years and managed to become an adequate QB under one of the best offensive coaches in NFL history.

[isired]

I think Joe is going to pick Wilson and keep Darnold if he doesn't get a great trade for him.  Then he will let Sam determine his own fate.  If you are as good as they say you are Sam, prove it.  Joe will have covered himself by doing this.  

I dont know if that will leave him 'covered' - he'll have wasted a second round pick as we watch some of the WR, Pitts, Sewell, etc star in the league.

[slats]

12 minutes ago, BroadwayRay said:

The bolded section of your quote is a key fracture point between those who want to draft a QB this year and those who want to risk another year with Darnold.

You can't say "there's no way" the Jets won't be able to draft a QB in 2022. First of all, the 2022 QB class is looking pretty sucky right now. Second, you don't know if the teams in a position to draft the best QB prospects will want to draft down. And third, if it's a good prospect, the price to trade up would be enormous.

Sticking with Darnold another year risks putting the Jets in QB limbo yet again in 2022. And to repeat, his failing in 2021 is the most likely scenario based on history. Nobody has ever played that badly in their first three seasons of football and gone on to be a franchise QB. Everyone keeps bringing up Tannehill, but Tannehill was a good QB before he went to Tennessee. His three seasons with Gase were riddled with injuries. Alex Smith was a terrible QB for many years and managed to become an adequate QB under one of the best offensive coaches in NFL history.

What happens if the Jets draft Wilson and he sucks? What then? They will have squandered the value of that #2 pick, still need a QB, and have much less ammo available to acquire one. 

We can speak in hypotheticals all day. 

And there are more ways to get a QB than to draft one. With five first round picks over two years and one of the league's better cap situations, the team will have options. Maybe some guy fighting for his starting job this summer emerges as the next super hot phenom, kinda like Wilson.