The OTHER take of the 49ers moving to 3...

[Jet2020]

8 minutes ago, Biggs said:

There is absolutely no doubt that both Mayfield and Allen were ahead of Darnold on lots of NFL Draft boards.  It's highly likely that the No. 1 rated player in that draft on almost every draft board was Barkley.  Sam was a very flawed QB and has the personality of toast.  

Agree to disagree. There were rumors/discussions but I didn’t see one solid source saying Sam would slip outside of top 5. Josh Allen may have been a Jet if Giants took Sam. 

And yeah, Barkley was the top overall prospect, that part I’m not debating. 

[freestater]

Any really good safeties in this draft? Maybe a nice run-stuffing DT?

[bitonti]

19 hours ago, johnnysd said:

Not a chance. The Giants have been crucified for doing that exact thing. If they planned on that they would have traded down to Miami who inquired and then look to trade down again. I mean there will likely be only 1 non QB off the board when Miami picks at 6. Staying at 2 and selecting a player is incredibly bad value and JD is ALL about value.

The value of the instant hall of fame tackle is higher than the value of the oft injured bust qb 

If we are talking about value 

[bitonti]

16 hours ago, Jet2020 said:

Sewell at #2 is a disaster for this team. We are not ‘potentially’ a minor upgrade at LT away from being competitive. If we were going with LT, it better be in a big trade down scenario. Something like the Miami trade, maybe trade down 4-5 spots twice and closer to the teens than the QB slots at #2. With 49ers breathing down their necks, Jets can ask a fortune to pick Wilson if someone was sold on him. 

Just don’t f*ck it up like Parcells did. Go with Wilson. It’s an easier choice to live with if he busts. No one regrets drafting Darnold. It was the only logical move at the time. 

Parcells mistake was passing on two hall of fame lineman for a linebacker

[playtowinthegame]

I just read/heard Jim Mora Jr. say he expects the 49ers to draft Zach Wilson with the 3rd overall pick in the draft. Mora Jr. also alludes that the 49ers have inside knowledge Wilson will be available due to "a relationship" between the franchises - obviously he talking about Robert Saleh. The Jets are allegedly eyeing Justin Fields or, contain yourself @bitonti, Penei Sewell.

Here is the link for what it's worth. 

https://www.si.com/nfl/49ers/news/jim-mora-jr-expects-the-49ers-will-draft-zach-wilson

[Tranquilo]

3 minutes ago, playtowinthegame said:

I just read Jim Mora Jr. say he expects the 49ers to draft Zach Wilson with the 3rd overall pick in the draft. Mora Jr. also alludes that the 49ers have inside knowledge Wilson will be available due to "a relationship" between the franchises - obviously he talking about Robert Saleh. The Jets are allegedly eyeing Justin Fields or, contain yourself @bitonti, Penei Sewell.

Here is the link for what it's worth. 

https://www.si.com/nfl/49ers/news/jim-mora-jr-expects-the-49ers-will-draft-zach-wilson

Sounds like wishful thinking 

[Augustiniak]

7 minutes ago, playtowinthegame said:

I just read/heard Jim Mora Jr. say he expects the 49ers to draft Zach Wilson with the 3rd overall pick in the draft. Mora Jr. also alludes that the 49ers have inside knowledge Wilson will be available due to "a relationship" between the franchises - obviously he talking about Robert Saleh. The Jets are allegedly eyeing Justin Fields or, contain yourself @bitonti, Penei Sewell.

Here is the link for what it's worth. 

https://www.si.com/nfl/49ers/news/jim-mora-jr-expects-the-49ers-will-draft-zach-wilson

From douglas’ perspective trading back to 3 doesn’t make sense.  If he trades out of 2, he’d want major draft compensation but won’t get it moving back 1 spot.  If you’re taking a qb, take the guy you want who fits your system.  

[jbt]

9 minutes ago, playtowinthegame said:

I just read/heard Jim Mora Jr. say he expects the 49ers to draft Zach Wilson with the 3rd overall pick in the draft. Mora Jr. also alludes that the 49ers have inside knowledge Wilson will be available due to "a relationship" between the franchises - obviously he talking about Robert Saleh. The Jets are allegedly eyeing Justin Fields or, contain yourself @bitonti, Penei Sewell.

Here is the link for what it's worth. 

https://www.si.com/nfl/49ers/news/jim-mora-jr-expects-the-49ers-will-draft-zach-wilson

make them trade up and get a pick then

[BettyBoop]

What I find odd, almost inconceivable, is the report that said the Niners didn’t even speak to the Jets about trading up.  Why wouldn’t they?  What have they got to lose by offering the same package the Phins got?

[playtowinthegame]

2 minutes ago, Tranquilo said:

Sounds like wishful thinking 

Another thing I found interesting Mora Jr. said there's also the possibility the Jets and 49ers have something planned where they'll swap picks.

[playtowinthegame]

4 minutes ago, Augustiniak said:

From douglas’ perspective trading back to 3 doesn’t make sense.  If he trades out of 2, he’d want major draft compensation but won’t get it moving back 1 spot.  If you’re taking a qb, take the guy you want who fits your system.  

Throw in Kittles and I'll fall back to 3 then draft Fields. 

[nycdan]

8 minutes ago, playtowinthegame said:

Another thing I found interesting Mora Jr. said there's also the possibility the Jets and 49ers have something planned where they'll swap picks.

The 49ers don't really have any picks left to trade unless they are going to end up with no 1st or 2nd round picks (or maybe even 3rd) for the next 3 years.

Yeah, Kittles or Bosa, sure.  But then reality strikes and you remember they aren't stupid. Is there another player on their team we would want that they would part with?

I can't see any way it works.  SF already got a gift from the NFL for us hiring Saleh.  They don't need any more from us.

[Augustiniak]

7 minutes ago, playtowinthegame said:

Another thing I found interesting Mora Jr. said there's also the possibility the Jets and 49ers have something planned where they'll swap picks.

I think people try to make too much of gms and hcs who have relationships with guys on other teams.  So what if the new jets hc used to be a dc for sf.  That doesn’t mean they’re trading with them.  How many times have we read about how douglas and Phily had something planned.  Again, so what.  

[playtowinthegame]

1 minute ago, nycdan said:

The 49ers don't really have any picks left to trade.  

Yeah, Kittles or Bosa, sure.  But then reality strikes and you realize all they have is 3rd rounders and deeper.  Is there another player on their team we would want that they would part with?

I can't see any way it works.  SF already got a gift from the NFL for us hiring Saleh.  They don't need any more from us.

I do believe the 49ers and Jets have had some conversations with each other, and the 49ers do have conviction who they're going to get at quarterback. I'm not buying the 49ers are going to select Mac Jones.

[Augustiniak]

2 minutes ago, playtowinthegame said:

I do believe the 49ers and Jets have had some conversations with each other, and the 49ers do have conviction who they're going to get at quarterback. I'm not buying the 49ers are going to select Mac Jones.

Me neither, i think it’s for fields.

[nycdan]

4 minutes ago, Augustiniak said:

Me neither, i think it’s for fields.

I wonder.  Wilson has a Montana vibe to me.  I could see them being all over that.  

Would you take #3 plus #43 plus 2022 2nd and 2023 2nd for #2 (presumably drafting Fields)?

Wilson fans wouldn't go near that.  But if the Jets prefer Fields anyway, that's about the only thing that could make any sense.  Three second round picks and you take the guy you want anyway.  

[Icer]

38 minutes ago, playtowinthegame said:

I just read/heard Jim Mora Jr. say he expects the 49ers to draft Zach Wilson with the 3rd overall pick in the draft. Mora Jr. also alludes that the 49ers have inside knowledge Wilson will be available due to "a relationship" between the franchises - obviously he talking about Robert Saleh. The Jets are allegedly eyeing Justin Fields or, contain yourself @bitonti, Penei Sewell.

Here is the link for what it's worth. 

https://www.si.com/nfl/49ers/news/jim-mora-jr-expects-the-49ers-will-draft-zach-wilson

He sounds like most 49er fans trying to convince themselves they didn't trade 3 1s for Mac Jones

[JohnnyLV]

50 minutes ago, bitonti said:

The value of the instant hall of fame tackle is higher than the value of the oft injured bust qb 

If we are talking about value 

I have been hearing the Sewell is dropping because of maturity and motivational issues but yeah lets draft OT instead of a FQB. Good plan. You do realize that he had only 1 actual football game injury right? Cleaning up his labrums were just wear and tear and generally not considered a big deal.

[JohnnyLV]

2 minutes ago, Icer said:

He sounds like most 49er fans trying to convince themselves they didn't trade 3 1s for Mac Jones

Shanahan essentially confirmed he is taking Jones yesterday.

[playtowinthegame]

11 minutes ago, nycdan said:

I wonder.  Wilson has a Montana vibe to me.  I could see them being all over that.  

Would you take #3 plus #43 plus 2022 2nd and 2023 2nd for #2 (presumably drafting Fields)?

Wilson fans wouldn't go near that.  But if the Jets prefer Fields anyway, that's about the only thing that could make any sense.  Three second round picks and you take the guy you want anyway.  

That's the 49ers 1st and 2nd round picks in 2021, 2022, and 2023 to select Zach Wilson. I'm getting an image of Kyle Shanahan in a head band sitting next to Zach Wilson a la Mike Ditka in the dreadlocks wig after trading all their picks in one draft for Ricky Williams.

[nycdan]

Just now, playtowinthegame said:

That's the 49ers 1st and 2nd round picks in 2021, 2022, and 2023 to select Zach Wilson. I'm getting an image of Kyle Shanahan in a head band sitting next to Zach Wilson a la Mike Ditka in the dreadlocks wig after trading all their picks in one draft for Ricky Williams.

I agree.  But is it any crazier than spending 1st round picks in 2021, 2022, and 2023 to draft Mac Jones?  Clearly they do not want to roll with Jimmy G.

[playtowinthegame]

Just now, nycdan said:

I agree.  But is it any crazier than spending 1st round picks in 2021, 2022, and 2023 to draft Mac Jones?  Clearly they do not want to roll with Jimmy G.

I agree. The 49ers trading all of those picks for Mac Jones is crazy. It would make David Gettleman trading up for Daniel Jones look not so bad. 

[Fantasy Island]

20 hours ago, johnnysd said:

Not a chance. The Giants have been crucified for doing that exact thing. If they planned on that they would have traded down to Miami who inquired and then look to trade down again. I mean there will likely be only 1 non QB off the board when Miami picks at 6. Staying at 2 and selecting a player is incredibly bad value and JD is ALL about value.

[nycdan]

It's very possible Jones really is a smoke screen.

So I'm sitting on #3.  Let's say I want Fields.  No point in telling the world I do.  If someone wants Jones, they can get him later on.  

But let's say I, instead, tell the world I want Jones.  Let's also imagine the Falcons prefer Jones.

Now, they are thinking they may have to move up to #3 to get him.  I take their 2nd round pick and whatever else I can, move down to #4, and draft the guy I wanted all along.  If the Falcons prefer Fields, then I wasn't going to trade with them anyway and I'm no worse off.

From a game theory perspective, that makes a lot more sense than telling the truth.  So yeah, there is actually reason to lie at #3.

 

[Jet2020]

1 hour ago, bitonti said:

Parcells mistake was passing on two hall of fame lineman for a linebacker

That’s my point. Take the guy that’s staring you in the face and don’t trade out for peanuts. Twice. 

[playtowinthegame]

3 minutes ago, nycdan said:

So yeah, there is actually reason to lie at #3.

Heck, after Jacksonville selects Sunshine there's a reason to lie from the 2nd overall pick down through the first round. 

[Greenseed4]

29 minutes ago, johnnysd said:

Shanahan essentially confirmed he is taking Jones yesterday.

No he didn’t. 

[Fantasy Island]

1 hour ago, Augustiniak said:

From douglas’ perspective trading back to 3 doesn’t make sense.  If he trades out of 2, he’d want major draft compensation but won’t get it moving back 1 spot.  If you’re taking a qb, take the guy you want who fits your system.  

Fields, Wilson, Jones, Lance or Trask in the 2nd round.  I will take any of them over Darnold.

[mrmajix]

Maybe there is another possibility.....With JD's deliberate, conservative approach he overplayed the value he put on both the #2 pick AND Sam and now is left with dwindling value and takers for either. While JD was being worshipped by Jet fans for doing his due diligence other teams were making bold, decisive moves. 

[RedBeardedSavage]

28 minutes ago, nycdan said:

It's very possible Jones really is a smoke screen.

So I'm sitting on #3.  Let's say I want Fields.  No point in telling the world I do.  If someone wants Jones, they can get him later on.  

But let's say I, instead, tell the world I want Jones.  Let's also imagine the Falcons prefer Jones.

Now, they are thinking they may have to move up to #3 to get him.  I take their 2nd round pick and whatever else I can, move down to #4, and draft the guy I wanted all along.  If the Falcons prefer Fields, then I wasn't going to trade with them anyway and I'm no worse off.

From a game theory perspective, that makes a lot more sense than telling the truth.  So yeah, there is actually reason to lie at #3.

 

Jones is a great smokescreen choice because afterwards, whomever drops out of Fields or Wilson, you can admit to Jones being the smokescreen. 

You can't use Wilson for that right now, because everyone assumes he's going #2. And saying you want Fields now and then drafting Wilson, could backfire if Fields goes #2 - now everyone thinks you traded up and settled. 

The Mac Jones smokescreen is perfect. It's a total 'WTF?' for everyone in the NFL and easily deniable after-the-fact. 

[Big_Slick]

15 hours ago, doitny said:

funny thing is if Gettleman drafted a QB it would probably have been Sam.

would we have took Allen?

 

 

I think Macc would have taken Rosen.

[JohnnyLV]

39 minutes ago, nycdan said:

It's very possible Jones really is a smoke screen.

So I'm sitting on #3.  Let's say I want Fields.  No point in telling the world I do.  If someone wants Jones, they can get him later on.  

But let's say I, instead, tell the world I want Jones.  Let's also imagine the Falcons prefer Jones.

Now, they are thinking they may have to move up to #3 to get him.  I take their 2nd round pick and whatever else I can, move down to #4, and draft the guy I wanted all along.  If the Falcons prefer Fields, then I wasn't going to trade with them anyway and I'm no worse off.

From a game theory perspective, that makes a lot more sense than telling the truth.  So yeah, there is actually reason to lie at #3.

 

Sure in the abstract, but there comes a point where the risk does not equal the benefits. They made a trade they are comfortable with and will take the guy they want and don't care if people know since nothing can stop it.

[JohnnyLV]

6 minutes ago, Big_Slick said:

I think Macc would have taken Rosen.

I thought he actually confirmed it would have been Allen. Allen would have failed with us too.

[Big_Slick]

11 hours ago, RSJ said:

 

I dont see why that would be the case. Franchise LTs are also very valuable incase you missed Mahomes running for his life last month.


Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

 

After QB I think the OT's - both left and right are the most important positions on a team. Edge rushers line up in different spots and some teams have two guys who can come off the edge.

Of course, a team needs other non-QB premium positions to be successful but like in the SB even if you have everything else in, like KC, without OT's even the best QB in the game looks like crap.

[JohnnyLV]

30 minutes ago, Greenseed4 said:

No he didn’t. 

Unless the tweet I say was a deep fake he basically did.