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Instead of explaining why we shouldn’t trade down ... I’ll just leave this here . U guys will like this @Mogglez @football guy 

Because this thread isn’t the only place where it happens. Post a film review?  It’s a race to see how quickly it can be derailed by children who are upset that the Jets might not get them their

Just say you paid for Matt Waldman’s RSP and be done with it.

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4 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

And Zach Wilson with a similarly poor supporting cast is going to be better than Pat Mahomes?

When did Mahomes become an option for us?  He's not relevant to us in this situation.

Darnold vs. Wilson/Fields/Jones/Lance.

That is the only comparison that is relevant.

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44 minutes ago, slats said:

He was never offered SF's package, and likely didn't want it, anyway. If we're to believe @football guy's posts, JD does not want to drop out of the top ten. 

What I think is that they like Zach Wilson, but are still eying the trade down possibility. If they don't get what they want for the pick, they'll take the QB and adjust accordingly. But if Carolina blinks and gives Douglas what he wants, the Jets are probably choosing between Slater and Waddle (I'd take the WR because I believe the falloff is greater at that position) at #8, and then have #23, 34 & 39 to complete the OL and maybe draft an Edge, too. And that's all before picking twice in the third round. 

My unpopular opinion is that it would be better for Saleh and LaFluer to install their program with Darnold rather than having all that focus on a rookie QB. I think Darnold could be at least a middle of the pack QB in this offense with those kinds of pieces around him. Jets would then have five first round picks over 2022 & 2023 and comfortable cap room to decide whether they want to resign Sam or swing for another QB. If Darnold sucks, they'll have a high pick to work with. 

There is literally nothing that points to that at all. Everything points to the Jets taking Wilson. Steve Young even confirmed it, and if you think the Jets did not share with SF what they are doing, Young is almost certainly in the inner circle with the Wilsons. And football guy seems to close 100% sure the Jets are taking Wilson as well. It seems like the internal staff watched Wilson's pro day and were cheering. I don't think the Jets like Wilson I think the Jets especially after his pro day love him. You really think the trades happening shortly after Wilson's measurables was coincidence?

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23 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Sorry, not quite sure what you're calling me out for here.

I have exactly two substantive concerns with Wilson:

1. He is small and light.  He's 6'3", 210.  That's small.

2. He played absolutely nobody in college.  His level of competition was extremely weak.

That is the extent of my substantive concerns about him.

At no point have I ever mentioned his religion, his family's wealth, or any other off-field factor as a concern.  While I do think he looks in some pictures a bit like a feminine Zack Morris from Saved by the Bell or the neighbor from Married with Children, frosted blond tips and all, that is more funny than a criticism.

I'll also push back on the "desperate for him to fail" argument.  If we draft Wilson, the only desperation I will have is the same one I've always had:, That this time we get it right, and the guy DOESN'T fail.  No Jet Fan wants the Jets QB to fail.  

Till then, like with all the prospects, we'll continue to analyze objectively, and then evaluate once they start playing.  

P.S. gonna be hilarious for all the usual suspects talking up and investing deeply in Wilson now if JD pulls a fast one and trades down or drafts Fields, lol.  We'd see a ton of 180's on Draft night if that happens, lol.

It would take me longer than draft night to do my 180 but I will do it over time because I'm a Jets fan and that's what I do.

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Zach Wilson earning the starting spot as a true freshman. BYU was getting destroyed by Utah State, late in garbage time the coach finally let Zach play. I like how the lineman instantly gravitates towards him on the sidelines.

 

 

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1 hour ago, The Crusher said:

I know how to get it done!

554998C8-3012-45B1-BF4A-305E39279785.jpegThat’s how you get it done! They should do anything for family !

I have to admit that EDGE is the most overrated position in football. People act like these guys are such franchise changers and there really is just no evidence of that. To win the SB you need to have a decent pass rush, and there have been Super Bowl games where EDGE played a big part in winning that game, but really there is no correlation to elite individual EDGE players moving the needle that much. Winning football is way more about offense, especially QB. Good offensive line, elite QB and some playmakers are what wins consistently. I mean a sack is only slightly more valuable to winning a game than a PD on third down. QB OT C DT are all more important than EDGE.

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17 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

And Zach Wilson with a similarly poor supporting cast is going to be better than Pat Mahomes?

You are the master of the straw man argument.  Who said he would be better than Mahomes?  Not me.  But I expect he will be better than Darnold (not a high bar).  And he will be playing on a rookie contract.  What other phony words are you going to put in my mouth?

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18 minutes ago, johnnysd said:

You do not pass on a franchise quarterback prospect when you have the 36th of 32 rated QB. People need to forget about Sam's initial ratings and analysis. He is not a good QB. There is also a ton of other reasons to choose QB at 2 that have nothing to do with the exact player. JD said that there is no trade value good enough for a franchise QB. Wilson is a much much better prospect than Sam. The Jets taking Wilson.

And not it does not make more sense to trade down. Now if that Jets were at 6 and needed to move up to #2 that might be a different conversation. But they don't. And SF with a better QB than us was willing to spend two additional first rounders and more to get a QB they do not like as much as Wilson. That says a ton about how Wilson is valued.

Could you expand upon the bold? Recent track record of QB’s drafted 1-3 is pretty gross - and whether that’s because the NFL is taking the wrong guys at the top of the draft or guys are failing without a quality supporting cast I think it’s a concern at #2 for the Jets this year since I don’t think the criteria has changed much and the supporting cast on offense is still aggressively mediocre.

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Just now, Bruce Harper said:

It would take me longer than draft night to do my 180 but I will do it over time because I'm a Jets fan and that's what I do.

I think people can do both without need of a 180, especially an immediate 180.

If you legit think Wilson is the best guy, bar none, own it.  No matter who the Jets actually pick.

Doesn't mean you won't root for say, Fields, if we picked him.  Just means you're not a flip flopper.

For example:  Baker Mayfield was 100% my guy.  I'll always admit that, openly.  I wanted him, and wanted him alot.  I did not want Darnold, Rosen, Allen or Jackson.  I was especially critical of both Jackson and Darnold, wrong as could be on one, quite right on the other.

None of the above meant I didn't root hard as normal for Darnold when he took the field for us.  Of course I did.

It just means I didn't suddenly start saying Mayfield sucks and that Darnold was elite just because we picked him.  A substantive opinion of a player shouldn't change instantly just because of what jersey he wears, whereas ROOTING for players is pretty much exclusive to what Jersey he wears (well, or what Fantasy Team you might have him on, for those that partake, lol).

/shrug.  Seems pretty strait forward to me.

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9 minutes ago, johnnysd said:

I have to admit that EDGE is the most overrated position in football. People act like these guys are such franchise changers and there really is just no evidence of that. To win the SB you need to have a decent pass rush, and there have been Super Bowl games where EDGE played a big part in winning that game, but really there is no correlation to elite individual EDGE players moving the needle that much. Winning football is way more about offense, especially QB. Good offensive line, elite QB and some playmakers are what wins consistently. I mean a sack is only slightly more valuable to winning a game than a PD on third down. QB OT C DT are all more important than EDGE.

Did you watch the super bowl sir

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20 minutes ago, johnnysd said:

There is literally nothing that points to that at all. Everything points to the Jets taking Wilson. Steve Young even confirmed it, and if you think the Jets did not share with SF what they are doing, Young is almost certainly in the inner circle with the Wilsons. And football guy seems to close 100% sure the Jets are taking Wilson as well. It seems like the internal staff watched Wilson's pro day and were cheering. I don't think the Jets like Wilson I think the Jets especially after his pro day love him. You really think the trades happening shortly after Wilson's measurables was coincidence?

There's no question in my mind, if they (the 49ers) can figure out how to get Zach, that's their No. 1 first choice," Young said. "I just don't know how they get it done. The Jets have committed to Zach and recruited the family. I just don't know how that gets undone, but you know, look, a lot can happen."

 

I have a hard time buying SF giving up that much for Jones if they want Wilson who is a completely different QB my money is on Wilson to SF. 

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2 minutes ago, FTL Jet Fan said:

 

There's no question in my mind, if they (the 49ers) can figure out how to get Zach, that's their No. 1 first choice," Young said. "I just don't know how they get it done. The Jets have committed to Zach and recruited the family. I just don't know how that gets undone, but you know, look, a lot can happen."

 

I have a hard time buying SF giving up that much for Jones if they want Wilson who is a completely different QB my money is on Wilson to SF. 

You bold the one sentence that’s just Young basically hoping for a Hail Mary that the Niners get Wilson. 

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7 minutes ago, Warfish said:

I think people can do both without need of a 180, especially an immediate 180.

If you legit think Wilson is the best guy, bar none, own it.  No matter who the Jets actually pick.

Doesn't mean you won't root for say, Fields, if we picked him.  Just means you're not a flip flopper.

For example:  Baker Mayfield was 100% my guy.  I'll always admit that, openly.  I wanted him, and wanted him alot.  I did not want Darnold, Rosen, Allen or Jackson.  I was especially critical of both Jackson and Darnold, wrong as could be on one, quite right on the other.

None of the above meant I didn't root hard as normal for Darnold when he took the field for us.  Of course I did.

It just means I didn't suddenly start saying Mayfield sucks and that Darnold was elite just because we picked him.  A substantive opinion of a player shouldn't change instantly just because of what jersey he wears, whereas ROOTING for players is pretty much exclusive to what Jersey he wears (well, or what Fantasy Team you might have him on, for those that partake, lol).

/shrug.  Seems pretty strait forward to me.

I want Wilson.   But if we trade down or draft Fields or Sewell or Pitts, I will take a deep breath and try to remind myself that these guys know a helluva lot more about football than I do and keep rooting for the team to become a consistent winner.

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Just now, Bruce Harper said:

I want Wilson.   But if we trade down or draft Fields or Sewell or Pitts, I will take a deep breath and try to remind myself that these guys know a helluva lot more about football than I do and keep rooting for the team to become a consistent winner.

We’re getting Wilson. Dudes are just grasping at straws with trade downs now. 

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1 minute ago, Tranquilo said:

You bold the one sentence that’s just Young basically hoping for a Hail Mary that the Niners get Wilson. 

of course he's hoping, byu to the 49ers without being stranded in the usfl or tampa bay.  

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8 minutes ago, Tranquilo said:

You bold the one sentence that’s just Young basically hoping for a Hail Mary that the Niners get Wilson. 

Exactly because why throw that out there after stating the above? Just my opinion.

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13 minutes ago, FTL Jet Fan said:

 

There's no question in my mind, if they (the 49ers) can figure out how to get Zach, that's their No. 1 first choice," Young said. "I just don't know how they get it done. The Jets have committed to Zach and recruited the family. I just don't know how that gets undone, but you know, look, a lot can happen."

 

I have a hard time buying SF giving up that much for Jones if they want Wilson who is a completely different QB my money is on Wilson to SF. 

OK, I'll play along. Please, enlighten us. How is SF going to undertake the heist of the draft and land Wilson?

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2 minutes ago, Tranquilo said:

You bold the one sentence that’s just Young basically hoping for a Hail Mary that the Niners get Wilson. 

Young’s comments were being presented as “The Jets are locked in on Zach Wilson and the Wilsons are cool with it,” when what he said sounds more like “the Niners want Wilson, the Wilsons want the Niners, but they’re going to have to move Joe Douglas to get it done.” Douglas could find himself in some sh*t if Wilson’s people just outright say he doesn’t want to be a Jet, which might be the case considering how much the Niners paid to move up to 3. What is Douglas’ recourse if they pull an Eli? Draft Zach and watch the Jets get destroyed by every segment of the NFL information sphere until they’re forced to trade him to the Niners?

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55 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Sorry, not quite sure what you're calling me out for here.

I have exactly two substantive concerns with Wilson:

1. He is small and light.  He's 6'3", 210.  That's small.

2. He played absolutely nobody in college.  His level of competition was extremely weak.

That is the extent of my substantive concerns about him.

At no point have I ever mentioned his religion, his family's wealth, or any other off-field factor as a concern.  While I do think he looks in some pictures a bit like a feminine Zack Morris from Saved by the Bell or the neighbor from Married with Children, frosted blond tips and all, that is more funny than a criticism.

I'll also push back on the "desperate for him to fail" argument.  If we draft Wilson, the only desperation I will have is the same one I've always had:, That this time we get it right, and the guy DOESN'T fail.  No Jet Fan wants the Jets QB to fail.  

Till then, like with all the prospects, we'll continue to analyze objectively, and then evaluate once they start playing.  

P.S. gonna be hilarious for all the usual suspects talking up and investing deeply in Wilson now if JD pulls a fast one and trades down or drafts Fields, lol.  We'd see a ton of 180's on Draft night if that happens, lol.

You said yesterday that it was ridiculous for me to say people were desperate to criticise the guy. Which they clearly are - I'm not responding to any of your criticisms of him in particular. The Zach Wilson = Johnny Manziel (which was it's own thread when I posted that) is just another example of the desperate attempts to put him down which are getting more and more ridiculous. 

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31 minutes ago, johnnysd said:

I have to admit that EDGE is the most overrated position in football. People act like these guys are such franchise changers and there really is just no evidence of that. To win the SB you need to have a decent pass rush, and there have been Super Bowl games where EDGE played a big part in winning that game, but really there is no correlation to elite individual EDGE players moving the needle that much. Winning football is way more about offense, especially QB. Good offensive line, elite QB and some playmakers are what wins consistently. I mean a sack is only slightly more valuable to winning a game than a PD on third down. QB OT C DT are all more important than EDGE.

Haha, No

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44 minutes ago, Larz said:

70A7F62C-6662-465D-8853-41655E840DE5.png

This is a misquote taken out of context. Listen to the interview. Young is discussing the Niners desire to get Wilson and is saying “but the Jets have committed to Zach Wilson.” The “Zach would love it/The family would love it” part is in reference to ending up with the Niners

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47 minutes ago, Warfish said:

When did Mahomes become an option for us?  He's not relevant to us in this situation.

Darnold vs. Wilson/Fields/Jones/Lance.

That is the only comparison that is relevant.

Where's your QB Patrick Ramsey when he's needed??LOL

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1 minute ago, Savage69 said:

Where's your QB Patrick Ramsey when he's needed??LOL

Probably laughing about how he was a better QB than Sam Darnold has been so far, lol.

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4 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

This is a misquote taken out of context. Listen to the interview. Young is discussing the Niners desire to get Wilson and is saying “but the Jets have committed to Zach Wilson.” The “Zach would love it/The family would love it” part is in reference to ending up with the Niners

Of course they would love it. If the 49ers cared about  family they would toss us Bosa and make it happen. 

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6 minutes ago, Irish Jet said:

You said yesterday that it was ridiculous for me to say people were desperate to criticise the guy. 

Except that isn't what I said.

This is what I said:

Quote

What a silly post. No one here is "rooting" for Wilson to fail if he is, in fact, the #2 pick of the Jets. You can be assured, even his loudest critics and most dedicated doubters will root their asses off for him come gameday Sunday. 

 

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1 minute ago, The Crusher said:

Of course they would love it. If the 49ers cared about  family they would toss us Bosa and make it happen. 

Bosa would be incredible, but I feel like, if the Wilsons play hardball, the Jets don’t ultimately have a ton of leverage with the 49ers. 

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11 minutes ago, BroadwayRay said:

OK, I'll play along. Please, enlighten us. How is SF going to undertake the heist of the draft and land Wilson?

I’m not saying it will be in a trade but perhaps our selection will not be Wilson. 

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2 minutes ago, FTL Jet Fan said:

I’m not saying it will be in a trade but perhaps our selection will not be Wilson. 

So we are just going to give away Wilson without squeezing the value of the 2nd pick? Does that sound like what Douglas would do? 

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1 minute ago, FTL Jet Fan said:

I’m not saying it will be in a trade but perhaps our selection will not be Wilson. 

Who will it be then? Are you saying all the reports of the Jets being in love with Wilson, of being locked onto him and "recruiting his family," from multiple reporters and insiders with multiple sources, are all some kind of ruse? 

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12 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

This is a misquote taken out of context. Listen to the interview. Young is discussing the Niners desire to get Wilson and is saying “but the Jets have committed to Zach Wilson.” The “Zach would love it/The family would love it” part is in reference to ending up with the Niners

He said the Jets are committed to Wilson and have “recruited” the family, and that is not something you really undo. Everything else is obviously wishful thinking by Young because he loves the player. You sound really really desperate here lol 

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