The Stick with Darnold Thread

[genot]

9 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Dude, stop.

If youre going to shlt not he stats, then dont bring up stats.  Yeah, Luke Faulk anyone could have put up those stats.  

Darnold was a one year wonder who didnt even play 2 full seasons and his one season was a partial season.  

Yea. What's your point. That Wilson had a better college career than Darnold. Dude you stop.  

[varjet]

4 hours ago, Vin said:

Actually, resetting the QB contract clock was *THE* main reason Sam was dealt.

It was purely a Financial decision that had nothing to do with whether Joe believed or not that Sam could be successful if he remained here.

Let's look at it another way :

If Sam had 2 years remaining(along with the Team option for a 5th), I think joe would've had him stick around.    It's all about the bottom line here.  Nothing more, nothing less.

^^^ is exactly right.

Yes, Darnold had his ups and downs in NY, mostly down in Year 3 but he looked ok in year 2. 

But for the Jets, and I think it was mostly Hymie and the Johnsons rather than JD, they really did not want to pay $20mm/year and/or a big contract for someone who was inconsistent like Darnold was.  They would rather take the picks.  

I don’t think Darnold does well against the good defenses in the playoffs.  But he is a good guy and certainly good enough to win games in the regular season with a good supporting cast and coaching.  

[Barry McCockinner]

X

[Snell41]

I think Sam’s absolute ceiling would be an Eli/Favre type QB where you have to deal with the turnovers along with the production, and could still possibly put together a hot streak at the right time. I understand the Jets opting to go in another direction, especially when the contracts come into play. Problem is that the Jets are not much more ready now than they were three years ago to develop a rookie QB. I still like JD, Saleh, and LaFluer, but they might’ve bitten off a little more than they can chew by trying to develop Zach while also installing new systems on both sides of the ball and trying to wipe out a decade of losing culture all at the same time. It’s a massive baptism by fire for everyone. 

Listen, Zach sucked at BYU until last year. His ceiling is out of the league in 3 years. His floor is complete embarrassment, which is exactly what we’re seeing now


Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

[Jet Nut]

7 hours ago, Grandy said:

It was an easier schedule but Wilson but up the highest non-SEC QB rating in history.

There have been LOTS of QB's that have played easy schedules and none of them were that good. 

Yeah, the nonsense is how easy it is for a scrub like Wilson to put up numbers.

Yet somehow he put up record level numbers and others dont.

[Jet Nut]

6 hours ago, genot said:

Yea. What's your point. That Wilson had a better college career than Darnold. Dude you stop.  

You brought it up.

You challenged it

You called Darnold a much better prospect.

I asked what part of Darnold game is better and you said their numbers were similar, when someone else pointed out they weren't you went on to claim the school, the competition etc arent the same so those same numbers you were happy to bring up somehow stopped being relevant,

You stop

[genot]

51 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

You brought it up.

You challenged it

You called Darnold a much better prospect.

I asked what part of Darnold game is better and you said their numbers were similar, when someone else pointed out they weren't you went on to claim the school, the competition etc arent the same so those same numbers you were happy to bring up somehow stopped being relevant,

You stop

Dude. Everything I said, not only today, but the last 4 months is coming true. Darnold was a more NFL ready QB than Wilson. Probably because of the level of competition  he faced and performing in major bowl games. He was a better prospect entering the draft because they have a very similar skill set, but Darnold had success with that skill set facing a higher level of competition.  Wilson didn't have a better college career than Darnold, and that's excluding Darnold throwing  for 460 yards in the Rose Bowl.

[Vin]

On 9/26/2021 at 1:14 PM, Jet Nut said:

You have no idea how much was setting the clock and how much was JD thinking about Sam the QB 

True but you have no idea either so there. 

But in all seriousness,  I doubt he would've been traded if it was just after his 2nd season instead of the 3rd.

Someone brought up a valid point that the 3rd-season debacle would not have existed for him(Joe D) to look at to make that trade decision in the first place.    It is not out of the realm of possibility that he would've kept Sam, then traded the pick and got a ransom for it...and *ATTEMPT*(keyword here) to surround Sam with actual weapons for a change.

 

Anyway, this is all a moot point.

 

[TheNuuFaaolaExperience]

Darnold would look similar to Wilson if he was the QB of this team with the current system. Does anyone think that Darnold would have been anything more than a mild upgrade at this point? Wilson has avoided a few sacks that Darnold would have eaten. I don't see our record being anything other than 0-3 with Sam Darnold. 

[FidelioJet]

Does anyone think Darnold would look with the Jets right now?

I see no reason to believe Darnold would be any better with this roster? 

What would be happening now is Darnold would be 0-3 and one of the worst QB's in the NFL

And ZW would be starting in SF and showing massive potential to be a future all-pro.

[Vin]

5 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

Does anyone think Darnold would look with the Jets right now?

I see no reason to believe Darnold would be any better with this roster? 

What would be happening now is Darnold would be 0-3 and one of the worst QB's in the NFL

And ZW would be starting in SF and showing massive potential to be a future all-pro.

Agreed.

[FidelioJet]

14 minutes ago, TheNuuFaaolaExperience said:

Darnold would look similar to Wilson if he was the QB of this team with the current system. Does anyone think that Darnold would have been anything more than a mild upgrade at this point? Wilson has avoided a few sacks that Darnold would have eaten. I don't see our record being anything other than 0-3 with Sam Darnold. 

Exactly.

What changed for Darnold in his 4th year?

Did he all of a sudden become better than the 34th ranked QB in the NFL.  The Jets roster, right now, is worse than it was last year.

When a roster is this bad no QB will perform well.  

You guys are making it sound like Darnold was tearing it up here and we moved on.  He was awful here.  

Questioning Zach as a prospect, based on anything they've seen from these three games in asinine.

Moreover, ZW's skill-set is far superior to Sam's.  That's not debatable.

[FidelioJet]

25 minutes ago, Vin said:

True but you have no idea either so there. 

But in all seriousness,  I doubt he would've been traded if it was just after his 2nd season instead of the 3rd.

Someone brought up a valid point that the 3rd-season debacle would not have existed for him(Joe D) to look at to make that trade decision in the first place.    It is not out of the realm of possibility that he would've kept Sam, then traded the pick and got a ransom for it...and *ATTEMPT*(keyword here) to surround Sam with actual weapons for a change.

 

Anyway, this is all a moot point.

 

I still think they trade him...but can understand your thinking and you may very well be right...

Two things:

1) I think if he had two or three years left they probably get a 1st+ for him. 

2) I think they fell in love with ZW

As you said, it's a moot point though.

[SAM SAM HE'S OUR MAN]

On 4/3/2021 at 1:48 PM, playtowinthegame said:

Zach Wilson is only 2 years younger than Darnold and he has legitimate durability concerns, especially at the NFL level. I can see why there are those in the Jets building who are against betting (their careers) on Zach's shoulders shouldering the load of a 17 game season in the NFL.

 

[Albaniajet]

1 hour ago, FidelioJet said:

Does anyone think Darnold would look with the Jets right now?

I see no reason to believe Darnold would be any better with this roster? 

What would be happening now is Darnold would be 0-3 and one of the worst QB's in the NFL

And ZW would be starting in SF and showing massive potential to be a future all-pro.

Zach Wilson would be riding pine behind Garropolo in SF.  Garropolo is a better player bottom line

[FidelioJet]

6 minutes ago, Albaniajet said:

Zach Wilson would be riding pine behind Garropolo in SF.  Garropolo is a better player bottom line

Garapolo wouldn’t be on the team right now If they had ZW. 
What they gave to trade up tells you all you need to know about how they feel about Garrapolo. .  

[faba]

This fan base was mostly over with Darnold after last year regression really no choice from that perspective to move on

[JazzyJet]

16 minutes ago, Albaniajet said:

Zach Wilson would be riding pine behind Garropolo in SF.  Garropolo is a better player bottom line

no doubt, and SF is a better org than the Jets.

[jgb]

On 4/3/2021 at 8:28 PM, Creepy Lurker said:

If I hear about Darnold’s age one more time, I’m going to snap. He’s a useless, soft, sack of sh*t. He had 3 abysmal years, no fire and is not a leader. His contract situation alone makes sticking with him not smart or likely. All these idiots need to shut up. 

 

On 9/25/2021 at 3:20 AM, playtowinthegame said:

[dcJet]

Panthers fans are shocked at how bad Darnold is.

This has to be the 2nd worst extension ever given to a QB behind Sanchez's stupid extension.

Coach Rhule is trying to "Sanchez-proof" Darnold too.  Limit the play calling to protect the team from his turnover machinery.   Next step for Sam: Red, Yellow, Green?

 

[JohnnyLV]

25 minutes ago, dcJet said:

Panthers fans are shocked at how bad Darnold is.

This has to be the 2nd worst extension ever given to a QB behind Sanchez's stupid extension.

Coach Rhule is trying to "Sanchez" him too.  Limit the play calling to protect the team from his turnover machinery.   Next step for Sam: Red, Yellow, Green?

 

Rhule is clueless,

[Hex]

He looked good against the jets, so he's gonna be the mvp!

[TuscanyTile2]

On 9/26/2021 at 3:08 PM, varjet said:

^^^ is exactly right.

Yes, Darnold had his ups and downs in NY, mostly down in Year 3 but he looked ok in year 2. 

But for the Jets, and I think it was mostly Hymie and the Johnsons rather than JD, they really did not want to pay $20mm/year and/or a big contract for someone who was inconsistent like Darnold was.  They would rather take the picks.  

I don’t think Darnold does well against the good defenses in the playoffs.  But he is a good guy and certainly good enough to win games in the regular season with a good supporting cast and coaching.  

I honestly would have no issue bringing back Darnold as a backup.  And it probably sounds crazy (and may be crazy) but I still think it's possible he can be a good starting QB in this league.  It took Rich Gannon years before he finally figured it out.  

[slimjasi]

Even Colin Cowherd has jumped ship. He wants the Panthers to go after Watson, lol. 

[jgb]

54 minutes ago, dcJet said:

Panthers fans are shocked at how bad Darnold is.

This has to be the 2nd worst extension ever given to a QB behind Sanchez's stupid extension.

Coach Rhule is trying to "Sanchez" him too.  Limit the play calling to protect the team from his turnover machinery.   Next step for Sam: Red, Yellow, Green?

 

Trading for Sam? Yeah, ok, they took a flier that the Jets dragged him down. But to give the extension sight unseen? Just unforgiveable.

28 minutes ago, johnnysd said:

Rhule is clueless,

Hey, he'll be the smartest dude in the bread line next year.

[TuscanyTile2]

On 9/26/2021 at 9:37 PM, Jet Nut said:

Yeah, the nonsense is how easy it is for a scrub like Wilson to put up numbers.

Yet somehow he put up record level numbers and others dont.

Ty Detmer did that too.

Colt Brennan (RIP) did as well.

Neither were good NFL QBs.

That said, I still do believe in Zach.

[slimjasi]

1 minute ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

I honestly would have no issue bringing back Darnold as a backup.  And it probably sounds crazy (and may be crazy) but I still think it's possible he can be a good starting QB in this league.  It took Rich Gannon years before he finally figured it out.  

Different eras and very different players. Sam can't shake the ridiculous interceptions and I don't see that ever changing for any appreciably long period of time.

Maybe he has a flash in the pan season somewhere down the line (Vinny 98) as a veteran backup somewhere who gets a shot because of an injured starter and plays well for a year, but giving him a long term contract ever again at this point is a fool's move. 

He's not a long term starter. 

[jgb]

2 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

I honestly would have no issue bringing back Darnold as a backup.  And it probably sounds crazy (and may be crazy) but I still think it's possible he can be a good starting QB in this league.  It took Rich Gannon years before he finally figured it out.  

Gonna ride that pony to the bitter end, I see.

If Darnold becomes the second Rich Gannon ever and in years 13-17 of his career and for his 4th team plays at a high level, is that really a "win" for the pro-Darnold set? I mean I know they will do victory laps in their Rascal scooters and uncork champagne and sing "I told you so's" but... is it really a win?

[TuscanyTile2]

3 minutes ago, jgb said:

Trading for Sam? Yeah, ok, they took a flier that the Jets dragged him down. But to give the extension sight unseen? Just unforgiveable.

Hey, he'll be the smartest dude in the bread line next year.

The Panthers picking up Sam's 5th year option was a calculated gamble.  It looks like it was a huge mistake right now but sometimes you lose when you gamble.

[jgb]

1 minute ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

The Panthers picking up Sam's 5th year option was a calculated gamble.  It looks like it was a huge mistake right now but sometimes you lose when you gamble.

Ok, you've said this now several times. Surely you can tell us what a "win" looks like in this gamble.

(and FYI I called it at the time so no hindsight games being played here)

[TuscanyTile2]

Just now, slimjasi said:

Different eras and very different players. Sam can't shake the ridiculous interceptions and I don't see that ever changing for any appreciably long period of time.

Maybe he has a flash in the pan season somewhere down the line (Vinny 98) as a veteran backup somewhere who gets a shot because of an injured starter and plays well for a year, but giving him a long term contract ever again at this point is a fool's move. 

He's not a long term starter. 

 

Just now, jgb said:

Gonna ride that pony to the bitter end, I see.

If Darnold becomes the second Rich Gannon ever and in years 13-17 of his career and for his 4th team plays at a high level, is that really a "win" for the pro-Darnold set? I mean I know they will do victory laps in their Rascal scooters and uncork champagne and sing "I told you so's" but... is it really a win?

I realize I'm probably wrong about Sam.  But I do think that if there's anyone out there who can suddenly turn things around at some point (a la Rich Gannon or Vinny), I think he's as good a candidate as any for it.  

[TuscanyTile2]

1 minute ago, jgb said:

Ok, you've said this now several times. Surely you can tell us what a "win" looks like in this gamble.

(and FYI I called it at the time so no hindsight games being played here)

A "win" would've been if he had a good season and was a legit starter.  Then the Panthers could've kept him or traded him to a QB-needy team for a lot more than they paid to acquire him.

[jgb]

11 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

 

I realize I'm probably wrong about Sam.  But I do think that if there's anyone out there who can suddenly turn things around at some point (a la Rich Gannon or Vinny), I think he's as good a candidate as any for it.  

"Good a candidate as any." Yes I agree.  This is exactly what @Jetsfan80 and I have been arguing for almost a year:

He has exactly the same chance as any highly-drafted bust QB to turn it around -- and that percentage is very, very low (low single-digits).

But all people heard was that we "hate" him or have "an agenda" against him. It was never personal about Sam; it was statistical. 

[slimjasi]

4 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

 

I realize I'm probably wrong about Sam.  But I do think that if there's anyone out there who can suddenly turn things around at some point (a la Rich Gannon or Vinny), I think he's as good a candidate as any for it.  

Even if I agreed with the bolded, what you are essentially saying is "I think this one guy has as good a shot as anyone at pulling off this uncommon, statistically unlikely feat." 

In other words, he's still not a sound investment. 

[jgb]

5 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

A "win" would've been if he had a good season and was a legit starter.  Then the Panthers could've kept him or traded him to a QB-needy team for a lot more than they paid to acquire him.

If he had a good season and was a legit starter, Panthers would've signed him to a new deal in off season with new money anyway. What else you got?