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If Your HC and OC Are Telling You They Can Fix Darnold, Then You...


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Point and laugh then draft a QB?

If Your HC and OC Are Telling You They Can Fix Darnold, Then You...   Realize that you hired a bunch of idiots. 

really? so you hire a highly touted head coach and OC and then you laugh in their face and go against their wishes on who they want at qb? that would be pretty dumb

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1 minute ago, The Crusher said:

Not as dumb as burning another year with Darnold. Kid is broke probably best go someplace and sit a bit. Dude literally looked like he was done with football most of last year. That doesn’t go away with coaching, not right away he will likely need change of scenery.  Want someone ready to compete and kick ass. I said this bunch of times here, this is the situation Darnold should have came into, I doubt we are having this conversation f he did. But kids busted, if I’m Joe, I’m starting over with my own guy. 

i get that mindset......but if thats not your brand new head coaches mindset you're telling him too bad? douglas isn't a coach......i think you listen to your brand new shiny coach in this case and give him the guy(s) he wants

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If Costello’s reports are true then Douglas is in quite the quandary.  Apparently Saleh and LeFleur like Darnold and think he is fixable and can thrive in their system.  If they are right, the timeline for making this team competitive just sped up a year or two.  With the haul you can get for the #2 pick, you can address IOL (x2), CB (x2), Edge, WR, RB, LB and TE. In the next two seasons.  That is not to suggest that every pick will be a hit, but the likelihood that the team would improve with all those selections increases dramatically.
So what do you do if you’re Douglas?  Will this cause a rift between coach and GM?  The good news is the Johnsons will have no say in this.

Where is this report?


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10 minutes ago, BettyBoop said:

If Costello’s reports are true then Douglas is in quite the quandary.  Apparently Saleh and LeFleur like Darnold and think he is fixable and can thrive in their system.  If they are right, the timeline for making this team competitive just sped up a year or two.  With the haul you can get for the #2 pick, you can address IOL (x2), CB (x2), Edge, WR, RB, LB and TE. In the next two seasons.  That is not to suggest that every pick will be a hit, but the likelihood that the team would improve with all those selections increases dramatically.

So what do you do if you’re Douglas?  Will this cause a rift between coach and GM?  The good news is the Johnsons will have no say in this.

JD has final word on everything, FINALLY.

I cannot emphasize enough just how important this is. No more does the coach have equal say on anything anymore. That’s the way it should be. 
All we need now is for JD’s decisions to be right! If not, see you at the next rebuild in 3 years!

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2 minutes ago, Patriot Killa said:

is that who they want or who they are okay rolling with because they think he’s fixable. I think there’s more layers that need to be mentioned in a situation like this.

idk, we don't even know if this is legitimate. but, lets say the case is that saleh and mcfleur have told douglas they'd rather work with darnold and whoever they can et with a trade down of the #2.......i think it would be an odd choice if douglas said "no screw you, you're gonna take wilson and i'm trading darnold"
 

 

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2 minutes ago, neckdemon said:

idk, we don't even know if this is legitimate. but, lets say the case is that saleh and mcfleur have told douglas they'd rather work with darnold and whoever they can et with a trade down of the #2.......i think it would be an odd choice if douglas said "no screw you, you're gonna take wilson and i'm trading darnold"
 

 

Unless he’s traded, then JD could just say he was doing what was in the best interest of the team in the future & adding another pick to the war chest.

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6 minutes ago, neckdemon said:

i get that mindset......but if thats not your brand new head coaches mindset you're telling him too bad? douglas isn't a coach......i think you listen to your brand new shiny coach in this case and give him the guy(s) he wants

I also appreciate that mindset, I do, but at the end of the day it’s Joe Douglas that has to make sure the right choice is made. It’s possible Sam could be better, but I doubt quick enough to justify offering him a contract at anything more than back up money at this point. Be tough spot if you gotta consider paying him FQB because we scraped out 8-8 next year. I just don’t feel Sam has done anything to show us he can be anything more than serviceable and that’s not even a guarantee. 

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Just now, The Crusher said:

I also appreciate that mindset, I do, but at the end of the day it’s Joe Douglas that has to make sure the right choice is made. It’s possible Sam could be better, but I doubt quick enough to justify offering him a contract at anything more than back up money at this point. Be tough spot if you gotta consider paying him FQB because we scraped out 8-8 next year. I just don’t feel Sam has done anything to show us he can be anything more than serviceable and that’s not even a guarantee. 

i'd argue that the 2nd half of 2019 showed he can be pretty good. we will find out in about 3 weeks exactly what decison has been made......i don't think either qb will be evaluated on record next year. it's going to be how they actually played. 8-8 might be an incredible result with this team next year

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3 minutes ago, neckdemon said:

i'd argue that the 2nd half of 2019 showed he can be pretty good. we will find out in about 3 weeks exactly what decison has been made......i don't think either qb will be evaluated on record next year. it's going to be how they actually played. 8-8 might be an incredible result with this team next year

You skipped 2020

 

Trubisky threw for 3000 yards, 17 tds and 10 int and went 8-7 as a starter in 2019. He just signed as a backup to Josh Allen for $2.5 million. Tell me again how 2019 matters.

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I absolutely believe Darnold could turn it around and improve. It's just extremely bad timing for him to prove to the team that he can do it. If you roll with him and he fails, you're back to square one next year. If you roll with him and he excels, are you going to end up in a situation where you are regretting a contract extension based on one good year of play? At the end of the day I just want to be able to watch some meaningful football games but it's going to be really fascinating to see how this all shakes out.

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1 minute ago, neckdemon said:

there isn't a qb in the league that would have looked good on this team last year. this team's talent level, especially on offense, was THAT bad. there wasn't a team in the league with a worse offensive roster. 

Flacco looked better

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Just now, TokyoJetsFan said:

Nothing appears to leak out of Joe Douglas’s office unless he wants it to.  You think he would let something leak that he’s at odds with what his new coach wants? It seems to me this is all just smoke to pump up Darnolds trade value.  

They could have traded him a month ago if they wanted without the need to pump value.

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23 minutes ago, Patriot Killa said:

One turned the ball over every time he sneezed at USC. The other threw 3 INT’s last year and barely ever makes a turnover worthy throw.

but sure thing! Keep saying they’re the same player.

Yes I’m saying both would look the way Sam did in the exact same situation and both will be very similar next season with the Jets except one will already be seasoned and have played in the offense so to me the decision is simple.

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I wonder why the jets would leak that they like Wilson AND Darnold. It’s such a mystery 

if this is actually true, it’s not negative. It’s positive. It means they have options. 
 

the. NFL is hyper competitive. Don’t forget that Gase brought JD in, JD gutted the roster and fired Gase. Then he was able to recruit very highly thought of coaches. It’s not like that gave him a red flag.  There is no reason that this would create a rift or a problem. 
 

they are big boys 

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6 minutes ago, BettyBoop said:

If Costello’s reports are true then Douglas is in quite the quandary.  Apparently Saleh and LeFleur like Darnold and think he is fixable and can thrive in their system.  If they are right, the timeline for making this team competitive just sped up a year or two.  With the haul you can get for the #2 pick, you can address IOL (x2), CB (x2), Edge, WR, RB, LB and TE. In the next two seasons.  That is not to suggest that every pick will be a hit, but the likelihood that the team would improve with all those selections increases dramatically.

So what do you do if you’re Douglas?  Will this cause a rift between coach and GM?  The good news is the Johnsons will have no say in this.

You draft Wilson at 2.  

Look Saleh and LeFleur might think that Darnold can be "fixed". They probably think that he can play at a decent level. Many coaches especially defensive coaches just prefer veteran QBs. It lowers the floor of how bad a team can be.

Caches are paid to be tactical and focus on the best record this year.

GMs are paid to ensure that the team is viewed form a strategic long term point of view as well as doing everything they can for short term success, but the long term in terms of drafting is more important.

When you put coaches in charge of drafting you wind up with what O'Brien did..

So yes JD does need to listen to his coaches but for a franchise defining decision like this his voice is relatively small because the HC will almost always want to start a veteran, And trading the pick when discussing a possible franchise guy is actually less value than taking Wilson, Rookie QB contracts are incredibly valuable 

Judging by his goofy grin at the pro day though I seriously doubt Saleh is opposed to Wilson. The Jets would have likely traded by now if they werent taking Wilson and the 49ers trade really makes trading 2 super unlikely. From a business standpoint you actually want Saleh to protest the pick as a way to make sure taking Wilson is the right move.

Also, QB decision are owner driven as well. In fact sometimes they are purely the owners decision and forced on the team. The Jets have essentially a new GM and a new HC and coaching staff. Having a new QB has very strong marketing appeal. New face of the franchise, new hope, more PSLs and tickets and jerseys.

Think of the scenarios

We trade and Darnold stays Darnold -Jets need new QB, likely have to use whatever future draft picks they got to get another way or go down the "we are ok with being mediocre" path with a retread FAIL

We trade and Darnold only improves a little bit like 20th in league. Sort of same situation as above? Do you extend him? Probably not so he plays on 5th year option and you hope he gets better. If he doesn't you just wasted 2 years of the Jets chances and the franchise tags or salary will consume the extra players you had anyway leaving the team weaker FAIL

Darnold is pretty good. Top 15-20. Now we have someone like Garappolo or Cousins. 49ers win the SB with a better QB and they just let the world know what they think of their chances. Cap issues affect you the same as  upper too FAIL

Darnold becomes elite. Everyone wins, his salary still eats up a lot of the equity from the draft but we have a 24 year old FQB Huge Win

Wilson is as bad as Darnold, or bottom 20. Rookie salary is so low that we still have more players which offsets not getting the pics a bit so it is not devastating but slightly easier to recover since Wilson makes only good backup money and likely has good trade value FAIL

Wilson is mid range. But he is on a rookie contract and we have way more cap room than the Darnold situation. We can likely be a playoff team and go deep in playoffs, if he is slightly better than Garappolo we can win a Championship WIN

Wilson becomes elite. GIGANTIC win. FQB on rookie salary is one of the best ways to get to SB. Just look at the QBs in the SB not named Brady on rookie contracts-this includes Mahomes last year he does not make the elite money until after his rookie contract which was brilliant by KC

So short term as in this year Darnold might make us slightly more competitive but the only way keeping Darnold is better is if he becomes elite. Who has a better chance at being elite? Wilson and not even close. Wilson is a no brainer choice for both football and marketing reasons.

 

 

 

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                             

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10 minutes ago, Lupz27 said:

Yes I’m saying both would look the way Sam did in the exact same situation and both will be very similar next season with the Jets except one will already be seasoned and have played in the offense so to me the decision is simple.

Well good thing that this isn’t the same situation thanks to upgrades via Free Agency.

WR corps looks to have some meat on the bones & though the OL, atm, looks disgustingly the same as last year, you have to expect JD will attack that early with premium picks & at least make for a competitive & decent young Ol group. Far cry from 2018 & 2019’s groups respectively...

Darnold is as seasoned as my mom’s portion of the thanksgiving meals. horrid & bland. 3 years in & makes the same mistakes as he did when he was a rookie, so you might as well actually draft & play a rookie in that case. 
 

I also think you can make the argument that Wilson is more well versed in what the LaFleur playbook will ask of him than we think. BYU ran a good portion of the Shanahan scheme as well.

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