kevinc855 craps on the Darnold trade

[kevinc855]

@slats it is an honor sir

 

[GangGreened]

6 hours ago, Dunnie said:

On what planet was he ever drafted to be a starter ?????

Sent from my SM-G950U1 using JetNation.com mobile app
 

Makes it even more of a waste of a pick. 

[The Crusher]

12 hours ago, slats said:

Yeah, until James Morgan is throwing TDs in the fourth quarter of preseason games, then people here will be calling for him to start ahead of Wilson. 

I want this way more than I should. 

[kevinc855]

41 minutes ago, The Crusher said:

I want this way more than I should. 

A situation like that is why this forum is here.......crazy talk

[Dunnie]

You are absolutely clueless, please don’t reply to any of my posts again. So now we are using 4th round picks, on a team with countless holes, to draft back up qbs, pathetic. 

Child please ... he was never drafted to be the starter... ever ... thoughts to the contrary are delusional.

Sent from my SM-G950U1 using JetNation.com mobile app

[GreenFish]

Can the mods merge these crap on Jets threads into one Mega Crap thread?

[The Crusher]

56 minutes ago, kevinc855 said:

A situation like that is why this forum is here.......crazy talk

Not true. This forum is here for you Kev. 

[Ken Schroy]

On 4/5/2021 at 9:20 PM, kevinc855 said:

According to Battista, great move for Panthers. This seems to be a wide held opinion. 

Sam Darnold trade: Who are the winners and losers? (nfl.com)

You forgot to upvote yourself. I'll wait.

[Jet Nut]

7 minutes ago, Ken Schroy said:

You forgot to upvote yourself. I'll wait.

Or to read the article.

 

[Big_Slick]

On 4/5/2021 at 9:20 PM, kevinc855 said:

According to Battista, great move for Panthers. This seems to be a wide held opinion. 

Sam Darnold trade: Who are the winners and losers? (nfl.com)

Judy Battista is the best beat writer I've seen in the last 20 years. She didn't say that this was a home run for the Panthers. She laid out all possible outcomes and said this is JD's defining moment.

[rangerous]

and?  it's not like battista said anything that wasn't said or thought about before.  douglas wouldn't have made the trade if he wasn't convinced wilson is the guy.  and , just as important wilson is being deemed as a better player than darnold right now.  this means they looked at him over 3 seasons and decided it would be easier to make wilson into the qb they need than darnold.

[slats]

14 minutes ago, rangerous said:

and?  it's not like battista said anything that wasn't said or thought about before.  douglas wouldn't have made the trade if he wasn't convinced wilson is the guy.  and , just as important wilson is being deemed as a better player than darnold right now.  this means they looked at him over 3 seasons and decided it would be easier to make wilson into the qb they need than darnold.

I think the major factor is the financial reset. Now they'll have a QB on a rookie contract for four years instead of one. Gives them a lot of cap flexibility to build the roster around that player. 

Also, I like the trade Douglas made. While still disappointed that he didn't get more in this draft, I like the outside the box type thinking here. He didn't settle for anything conditional, he's got a second and fourth round pick coming next year. And while the rule of thumb is to downgrade the value of a future pick by one round for every year out it is, those devaluations don't come into play in the year your picking. Seattle's first rounder is definitely a first rounder, even if it was a year late. 

People who didn't want Darnold traded thought he might only fetch a third or fourth rounder, yet somehow miraculously yield a third round comp pick in 2023 (lol!), instead Douglas got a sixth round chip this year, but real picks in 2022 - a year ahead of the wishful thinking comp pick. It's a very good trade. 

[kevinc855]

8 hours ago, Ken Schroy said:

You forgot to upvote yourself. I'll wait.

Give me one second ☝️ 

[Biggs]

21 hours ago, isired said:

 

It's a pretty kevel-headed take that is nowhere near the rip of the Jets that the OP makes it out to be.

Nowhere does she say it's a "great" move for the Panthers. Her praise of the move is riddled with 'ifs' regarding Darnold's play - and she calls it "on paper, an incremental upgrade for the Panthers". I think her assessment is accurate, they gave up little if he remains a viable starter or becomes a FQB, but your translation of it is not.

One thing I agree with 100%, Darnold is the biggest winner - moving into a starting role with more talent on offense and (apparently) the intention to pick up his option.

Even if Darnold sucks it's a great deal for him.  He gets another year and another 18 million.  It's a great deal for him.  I think your take on this is correct.  A few issues with calling this an outright win for Carolina.

On paper, the one with actual performance grade statistics it's a huge downgrade for the Panthers.  If TB is cut there's also a 20 million dollar dead cap hit.  Carolina signed TB to a 33 million dollar guarantee last year.  Not sure their valuation of Darnold in a market where they were the only team playing makes this a great move for them.  Seems like we had zero leverage and Joe stayed in the pot and bluffed them into adding some draft capital they were initially unwilling to give up.   The fan base idea that we could get a 1 or a low 2 this year for him turned out to be crazy talk.

On paper for Carolina it's a terrible move.  It's only a good move if Darnold can be developed into a higher quality NFL starter than Bridgewater is now.  The pundits who slobbered over Darnold obviously are invested in that outcome.  Not to say they might not be right but they might not be.  

As of today I think Carolina is committed to 18 million for Darnold and 26 million for Teddy in 2022 if he isn't cut or traded.  Basically we got picks for a test drive since there was no way in hell we were using the option on him.  We clearly think Zach is better than Darnold and want to reset our cost for 4 years while we continue to build draft capital to rebuild the team.   If JD is right on Zach it's a great move for the Jets.  If Darnold doesn't turn into a better starting QB than Bridgewater for Carolina the deal sucks for them.  

With no results on either Zach or Darnold on Carolina the deal can't be evaluated at all.  It can only be evaluated in hindsight.  If Zach is better than Darnold and we get a starter and depth out of the picks or use them for leverage to trade up and get another quality starter, it's a home run for the Jets.  It also can turn into a win/win for both teams.  

[Alka]

1 hour ago, slats said:

I think the major factor is the financial reset. Now they'll have a QB on a rookie contract for four years instead of one. Gives them a lot of cap flexibility to build the roster around that player. 

Also, I like the trade Douglas made. While still disappointed that he didn't get more in this draft, I like the outside the box type thinking here. He didn't settle for anything conditional, he's got a second and fourth round pick coming next year. And while the rule of thumb is to downgrade the value of a future pick by one round for every year out it is, those devaluations don't come into play in the year your picking. Seattle's first rounder is definitely a first rounder, even if it was a year late. 

People who didn't want Darnold traded thought he might only fetch a third or fourth rounder, yet somehow miraculously yield a third round comp pick in 2023 (lol!), instead Douglas got a sixth round chip this year, but real picks in 2022 - a year ahead of the wishful thinking comp pick. It's a very good trade. 

I think it was a good trade as well, but not because of the financial implications.

If the Jets kept Darnold, and he improved dramatically this year with better coaching and players, then the money issue is no issue to me.  If the Jets kept Darnold, and the Jets picked up his 5th year option before the season, and he was bad, then the Jets screwed themselves.  If the Jets didn't pick up the option, and he was very good, then the Jets would have to pay premium (about 25-30M per season) to keep him.

To me, the only scenario that works out great for the Jets, is if Zach Wilson turns out to be very good, an Darnold continues to be the Darnold of old.  If that's the case, then the Jets did well.

[Gibby]

I liked Sam too and think he handles himself like a true professional and wish him well. Having said that.... It’s time to move on. Go Zack!

[Smashmouth]

On 4/5/2021 at 8:20 PM, kevinc855 said:

According to Battista, great move for Panthers. This seems to be a wide held opinion. 

Sam Darnold trade: Who are the winners and losers? (nfl.com)

1. Sam Darnolds Pocket awareness and footwork Stink. And they stink really bad. Crappy WR's don't force you to be bad in this area.

2. Sam Darnold consistently misses wide open WR's as shown by numerous analysts backed up by video of said misses. This Video is mind boggling since some of those misses were right in front of his face.

3. Sam Darnold who has been behind in football games more than he has been ahead by a large margin can't even rack up garbage yards when defenses back off. This is a big one for me because even crappy QB's can rack up the garbage yards. I think we can count on one hand how many 300 yard games Darnold has had in his career and that's a shame when you are always playing from behind and should have a lot of attempts.

4. Sam Darnold plays scared,  that does not mean he's not a tough kid, because he is, but he plays scared and that's the reason for so many back foot throws he seems afraid to step into the face a of a rush and make a good throw.

Sam is a good kid and I wish him well but I do not think he has the personality or the killer instinct to play the QB position. What this kid actually needs is a Bill Parcells type personality to set him straight. The Jets babied him, McCown babied him and the media to some extent babies him, when you hear him talk there's no fire at all he seems too laid back and now is the time he's going to have to step up.

[kelly]

On 4/5/2021 at 9:32 PM, The Crusher said:

As soon as I read the title and saw you posted it I already knew the result. If nothing else you are predictable. 

dear  " the crusher ",   hi !  ?.. if i may,

in re - the subject of  " predictable " ; apparently THAT can be considered a good thing...

by some  ?

ALL  of my  " X's "  have noted i am " predictable ".. but my   " FUTURE - X "   has reached the conclusion i am...

 

" consistent "    

[rangerous]

2 hours ago, slats said:

I think the major factor is the financial reset. Now they'll have a QB on a rookie contract for four years instead of one. Gives them a lot of cap flexibility to build the roster around that player. 

Also, I like the trade Douglas made. While still disappointed that he didn't get more in this draft, I like the outside the box type thinking here. He didn't settle for anything conditional, he's got a second and fourth round pick coming next year. And while the rule of thumb is to downgrade the value of a future pick by one round for every year out it is, those devaluations don't come into play in the year your picking. Seattle's first rounder is definitely a first rounder, even if it was a year late. 

People who didn't want Darnold traded thought he might only fetch a third or fourth rounder, yet somehow miraculously yield a third round comp pick in 2023 (lol!), instead Douglas got a sixth round chip this year, but real picks in 2022 - a year ahead of the wishful thinking comp pick. It's a very good trade. 

yep.  i think that's a part of it too but first and foremost is that wilson is/will be the qb the jets need.  i don't mind the trade because it improves the jets a draft pipeline for the next couple of drafts.

[Embrace the Suck]

[GREENBEAN]

On 4/5/2021 at 9:20 PM, kevinc855 said:

According to Battista, great move for Panthers. This seems to be a wide held opinion. 

Sam Darnold trade: Who are the winners and losers? (nfl.com)

Who's Kevin855c? 

?

[nycdan]

3 hours ago, slats said:

And while the rule of thumb is to downgrade the value of a future pick by one round for every year out it is, those devaluations don't come into play in the year your picking. Seattle's first rounder is definitely a first rounder, even if it was a year late. 

The math on this has always bothered me.  A mid-round 2nd round pick is worth about 45% of the same pick in the 1st round.  Same for 3rd and second.  The relative value gets much lower as you go further down.

So if teams followed this, I would be able to trade a mid-1st round pick for two first rounders next year and so on.  Or a mid-2nd round pick for two second rounders next year.  The Patriots used to do this, pushing current picks out into subsequent years at a premium, which over the long term, is an excellent strategy for maximizing draft value.

I don't think it really works out that way, but if it did, a smart GM would push picks forward every single year because after the first year, you would just be swimming in picks.

[GREENBEAN]

On 4/5/2021 at 10:07 PM, FidelioJet said:

It’s taken him 2 years to clean up the mess. It’s been a 2 year tear down. 
Seriously, he’s done a very good job of tearing things down while adding resources. 
It takes fortitude to follow through on this.  
But in all fairness, that was the easier part. It’s time to build now. 
 

he needs to start adding talent and building a team. The cash and picks are there - now he has to deliver. 

Well said. That's what everyone has been overlooking imo.  The focus has largely been undoing a decade of complete ineptitude. COMPLETE Ineptitude. 

We have one turd floating in the pool named CJ Mosely, but it's only fall so we have time to address it before the memorial day BBQ. 

JD has done what no other Jets GM has done before. Completely restarted the clock on this crappy franchise. All while accumulating more draft capital than we've had in 20 years.  I for one and happy with this trade, even though I can't help but be sad for how the Darnold era went as a whole. 

It takes conviction to do it this way and JD has shown he has that. 

[MichaelScott]

On 4/5/2021 at 9:38 PM, Warfish said:

We can judge the trade in two years, when we get whomever we're getting from those picks (the 6th this year and 4th next year are mostly irrelevant, the #2 next year is the meat of the trade for us) and when we see how Sam plays in 2021 down there.  Hot takes now are silly.

Unless, of course, if your hot take is that you're pathetic if you happen to be pleased with the trade for any reason whatsoever. 

[The Crusher]

1 hour ago, kelly said:

dear  " the crusher ",   hi !  ?.. if i may,

in re - the subject of  " predictable " ; apparently THAT can be considered a good thing...

by some  ?

ALL  of my  " X's "  have noted i am " predictable ".. but my   " FUTURE - X "   has reached the conclusion i am...

 

" consistent "    

You are one of the reasons I check my door twice at night to make sure it’s locked. 

[kevinc855]

Just for fun 

How would you feel as Zacs parents right now? 

 

[Grandy]

This thread is awesomesauce bro 

[joewilly12]

[Jets Things]

This is a thread

[mrcoops]

[ZachEY]

Zach's Parents: Have any leads on an apartment in NYC?

Sam's Parents: Don't sign a lease, get him out of there as quickly as possible.

Zach's Parents: He'll be fine, he doesn't suck at football.

[slimjasi]

We get it, Kev. 

We really do. 

[BoogSportsGuy]

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[munchmemory]

[PS17]