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So this is what our Offense could look like...


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1 hour ago, David Harris said:

Always thankful for your info.

Regarding the draft I keep seeing AVT, Jenkins gone by 23. Maybe Cosmi or Mayfield?? Creed or Dickerson? 
 

maybe double up at 34

I really don't know right now. Everyone's offensive line grades are all over the place, with the only consensus being there's a lot of good ones. Jenkins and Humphrey are two players the Jets have established pretty consistent contact with. I think the Jets view Humphrey as a versatile iOL who will be a franchise C long-term. I think Jenkins has the ability to be an elite RG or RT. Kyle Long is my comp for him. My guess is he would get drafted with the intent to eventually move him out to RT, but Jets would keep him at G if he were to crush it there. 

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1 hour ago, BigRy56 said:

It all depends on who really Zach Wilson is. If he is as good as he’s marketed to be, the offense will be very good and he’ll turn Davis/Mims into one of the better duos in football.

He’s about to be the #2 pick in the draft. The expectation is that he will elevate the team around him, the way the really good ones do.

Just because Darnold fell on his face doesn’t mean it’s not still the standard for a top 5 QB pick...

Yep, at #2 OA Wilson is expected to elevate below average Offensive talent from day one and if he doesn't then he's a bust. According to 85% of the standard Sam was held to.

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4 hours ago, football guy said:

Not sure but I'm pretty convinced they'll take an OL in round 1 and use that player as a G for at least one season, if not going forward. Could be to trade up for AVT, could be a guy like Teven Jenkins, could even be a surprise like Creed Humphrey. Will find out more over the next week and while there's always the possibility the board doesn't fall their way, but it sounds like the team is hellbent on building this offensive line. 

I suggested JD might be taking at least 2 OL @ 23/34/66. @Sperm Edwards shot that theory down. Do you think JD may do that?  It’s a deep draft for OL. Don’t tell Sperm. 

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2 hours ago, varjet said:

Alex Lewis or Cameron Clark will be a G. 

a Rookie will be the other G. 

Clark didn’t even take a snap last year. Lewis is a JAG as is GVR. McGovern struggled but hit better as the year went on. The middle of the OL is just terrible. @ 23, JD may even have to reach if his target  -Tucker- is gone by then.  But the more I think about it, the more I’m open to trading up for a CB from 23. Reason being the OL is much deeper than CB in this draft. Horn would be my choice. The  good cb’s - Surtain, Farley, Horn - will be gone by 23. Then focus on the OL with the next 2 picks. They’ll be some good talent in round 3 that can be had for the OL. 

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The WR's are fine - Nothing exceptional but it's a solid group. I do worry we're going to cut Crowder though and if we do then the group is below average. He's probably the most reliable guy for Wilson. I do think the big bodied outside guys suit Wilson perfectly, if you watch his highlights he's superb at placing the ball for his guy to go and get it, even if they're covered. If this is what we go into opening day with I'll be happy.

Everything else is below average to terrible. Comfortably the worst group of Tight Ends in the league, maybe the worst group of backs and a bottom 5 offensive line. That's where the investment is needed in the draft and I'm still pissed we didn't get some starters in free agency. I'm genuinely concerned that Douglas is happy with Fant and GVR - They're his acquisitions and I think he may be desperate to see the best of them. Fant is on an abysmal contract and I think he's ridiculously overrated by fans here but I've made peace with him coming back. The interior of the line just isn't good enough and it will be disastrous putting Wilson behind that group. 

I know some people of wary about drafting too many OL high but I'd be more than happy with doubling down. The issues of Wilson playing behind two rookies is way overstated. If they're the best players they should play. Bring in genuine talent that can compete with what we have and let the best ones win the job. 

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7 hours ago, football guy said:

I really don't know right now. Everyone's offensive line grades are all over the place, with the only consensus being there's a lot of good ones. Jenkins and Humphrey are two players the Jets have established pretty consistent contact with. I think the Jets view Humphrey as a versatile iOL who will be a franchise C long-term. I think Jenkins has the ability to be an elite RG or RT. Kyle Long is my comp for him. My guess is he would get drafted with the intent to eventually move him out to RT, but Jets would keep him at G if he were to crush it there. 

@football guy A player that isn't getting mentioned at all is Cameron Clark, what does the team think

of him?  His tape out of Charlotte (particularly Clemson) was good, can he be a starter?

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10 hours ago, Samtorobby47 said:

So assuming we go Wilson and let’s say OL like @football guy is saying they’re targeting with 23. This is what the offense could look like week 1. 
 

QB: Wilson

RB: Coleman, Perrine, Johnson, Adams

TE: Herndon, Kroft

WR: Davis, V.Smith

WR: Mims, Cole

WR: Crowder, Berrios

LT: Becton

LG: Slater? Jenkins? Vera Tucker?

C : McGovern

RG: Van Roten

RT: Fant


Not bad. Not great. Seems like a “they’ll get the job done” group but no real take the top off a defense type playmakers anywhere. Or anyone you gotta really worry about. 
RB, G, WR, TE still need upgrades.  

I still thinking (hoping) Clark can push one of the guard spots or even rot.

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10 hours ago, JTJet said:

I wouldn't wish that roster on my worst enemy.

Still needs... 

RB1, TE1, WR1, C, RG, RT

Long way to go. 

The sky is falling! 

This whole RB1, WR1 stuff is way overblown. There are only a a handful of those types of players in the entire league. A solid RB by committee and a stable of #2 type WRs is how most NFL teams operate. And Mims, Davis, Crowder is not a bad starting trio at all. There is #1 type WR potential there. 

I'm glad to see @football guy saying it, but it's been obvious to me that the IOL would have to be addressed early in the draft. They need an upgrade at G/C from the draft starting this year. I don't see the huge move back into the top ten, but I could see a small move up like they had in place last year -but didn't need to execute- for the OT. This is a deep OL draft, and pick #23 or #34 should be able to provide that player. If they can drop that kind of anchor at RG, this OL is a lot better. 

TE is a position that I could see addressed in the draft before WR, but I think people are sleeping on Herndon. The dude looked good as a rookie, had his accident and injury and dropped off, but he's a guy who could very easily have a bounce back type season under the right coaching. 

There's still the whole draft, trades, cuts, etc., to add players still, but they have enough to get started here. 

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54 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

2 guards, RT and RB NEED to be upgraded if this offense is to be even competitive.   

Would prefer we draft Center/Guard, instead of 2 guards... McGovern can be moved to RG. We need our Mangold from this draft.

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1 hour ago, FidelioJet said:

This is the same offense it was last year with a rookie QB and a new #2 WR.

It still needs a lot of help to even be considered bottom 5.   

2 guards, RT and RB NEED to be upgraded if this offense is to be even competitive.   

Your making excuses for Wilson already......

I'm only joking, I agree with you lot of work needed on the offence. Personally I would focus on the o line this year and make sure Wilson stays upright for his confidence going forward.

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2 minutes ago, adobolo2 said:

Your making excuses for Wilson already......

I'm only joking, I agree with you lot of work needed on the offence. Personally I would focus on the o line this year and make sure Wilson stays upright for his confidence going forward.

Agreed.

The weapons, while not great are workable.  The OL is still likely the worst in the league.  As you said, keep him upright but I think just as important is to have a semblance of a running game that can take some pressure off him too.

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5 hours ago, Wonderboy said:

I suggested JD might be taking at least 2 OL @ 23/34/66. @Sperm Edwards shot that theory down. Do you think JD may do that?  It’s a deep draft for OL. Don’t tell Sperm. 

In fairness - and this may have been the team's feeling at the time - what was reported back was the team was going with Darnold for one more year and was not drafting a QB this year -- that they all wanted to go with Darnold and trade back, and if Douglas couldn't trade back then he was going to take Sewell at #2. 

What actually transpired is almost the exact opposite of that.

They traded Darnold and are going to draft a QB at #2, staying pat at that slot instead of trading down when the opportunity presented itself.

Not at all faulting @football guy here; he heard what he heard, and that may very well have been the inner circle's feeling at the time. But if feelings can change this much, then leaks may not be worth much. Further, these leaks into GM thinking may very well be planted - even to members of his second-to-inner circle - and he was half-expecting these to be leaked for his own purposes (e.g. in this case so teams would think they have to offer more to pry Darnold loose from the Jets). 

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1 hour ago, rangerous said:

I still thinking (hoping) Clark can push one of the guard spots or even rot.

I'm with you.

I'm kinda hoping JD's lack of aggression on the IOL was partly because he already has Clark penciled in as a starter.

I think it's unlikely as we would have heard something about him looking good, but one can hope!

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If JD can upgrade the o-line via the draft I actually think this has the potential to be a solid unit. The top end talent is certainly lacking - the only guy who you can realistically point to as having the potential to be a top 5 player at his position next year is Becton (and we'll see if the injury bug keeps biting). That being said the two most important individuals on the offense are the coach and the QB. If they hit on those it should be a much improved unit. I couldn't care less about the RB position, the WR groups is lacking a game changer but they have 4 solid WRs and Mims has potential. 

They are going to have to be relying on a rookie on the IOL - which I hate - but if he performs well, and they get average play out of the other guard spot whether that be GVR/Lewis (doubt)/Clark/Later draft pick - I actually think the offense could be an average unit. 

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11 hours ago, Samtorobby47 said:

So assuming we go Wilson and let’s say OL like @football guy is saying they’re targeting with 23. This is what the offense could look like week 1. 
 

QB: Wilson

RB: Coleman, Perrine, Johnson, Adams

TE: Herndon, Kroft

WR: Davis, V.Smith

WR: Mims, Cole

WR: Crowder, Berrios

LT: Becton

LG: Slater? Jenkins? Vera Tucker?

C : McGovern

RG: Van Roten

RT: Fant


Not bad. Not great. Seems like a “they’ll get the job done” group but no real take the top off a defense type playmakers anywhere. Or anyone you gotta really worry about. 
RB, G, WR, TE still need upgrades.  

RG needs a new starter too.

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18 minutes ago, slats said:

The sky is falling! 

This whole RB1, WR1 stuff is way overblown. There are only a a handful of those types of players in the entire league. A solid RB by committee and a stable of #2 type WRs is how most NFL teams operate. And Mims, Davis, Crowder is not a bad starting trio at all. There is #1 type WR potential there. 

I'm glad to see @football guy saying it, but it's been obvious to me that the IOL would have to be addressed early in the draft. They need an upgrade at G/C from the draft starting this year. I don't see the huge move back into the top ten, but I could see a small move up like they had in place last year -but didn't need to execute- for the OT. This is a deep OL draft, and pick #23 or #34 should be able to provide that player. If they can drop that kind of anchor at RG, this OL is a lot better. 

TE is a position that I could see addressed in the draft before WR, but I think people are sleeping on Herndon. The dude looked good as a rookie, had his accident and injury and dropped off, but he's a guy who could very easily have a bounce back type season under the right coaching. 

There's still the whole draft, trades, cuts, etc., to add players still, but they have enough to get started here. 

Best thing to help Wilson is to beef up those 3 guys right in front of him.  The rb issue is secondary, don’t take one early.  

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9 hours ago, Morrissey said:

We need serious help on interior OL. That absolutely must be priority in first 3 rounds. It should be prioritized over weapons which to me aren't as mad as some on here make it out to be. Weapons could be bigger priority in next years draft, first we need to protect Zach Wilson at all costs.

Wilson is used to throwing to crappy receivers. So fix the interior oline first. Totally agree.

 

 

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2 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

In fairness - and this may have been the team's feeling at the time - what was reported back was the team was going with Darnold for one more year and was not drafting a QB this year -- that they all wanted to go with Darnold and trade back, and if Douglas couldn't trade back then he was going to take Sewell at #2. 

What actually transpired is almost the exact opposite of that.

They traded Darnold and are going to draft a QB at #2, staying pat at that slot instead of trading down when the opportunity presented itself.

Not at all faulting @football guy here; he heard what he heard, and that may very well have been the inner circle's feeling at the time. But if feelings can change this much, then leaks may not be worth much. Further, these leaks into GM thinking may very well be planted - even to members of his second-to-inner circle - and he was half-expecting these to be leaked for his own purposes (e.g. in this case so teams would think they have to offer more to pry Darnold loose from the Jets). 

I just think we all over think this sh*t.

These guys aren't doing espionage.  They try and keep things tight, but things get out.

There was just no way they were ever keeping Darnold and not taking a QB at 2.  

Maybe they were trying to convince themselves they could keep Darnold for a while, hence those early rumors - as the Darnold is a true FQB scenario, would have given them amazing flexibility and growth opportunities.  I'm sure this was their preference, but he is not and was not going to be.  

When all was said and done, they did what they were always going to do - which was really the only logical option.

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2 minutes ago, Maxman said:

Wilson is used to throwing to crappy receivers. So fix the interior oline first. Totally agree.

 

 

This is true.

He did have a good amount of time, but his receivers weren't often wide open - he had to throw into a lot of tight windows.

We have a couple of big WR's, with long arms and good hands...Give him time and he should be able to put the ball in the right place for them to make a play on it.

OL early and often!

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13 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Further, these leaks into GM thinking may very well be planted - even to members of his second-to-inner circle - and he was half-expecting these to be leaked for his own purposes (e.g. in this case so teams would think they have to offer more to pry Darnold loose from the Jets). 

If the Jets wanted to move on from Darnold as much as the fans here from the start, they made a very good show of letting everyone believe that everyone in the building loved him. They have to wait a year to reap the benefits, but a 2, 4, & 6 is a good haul for damaged goods. 

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9 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

In fairness - and this may have been the team's feeling at the time - what was reported back was the team was going with Darnold for one more year and was not drafting a QB this year -- that they all wanted to go with Darnold and trade back, and if Douglas couldn't trade back then he was going to take Sewell at #2. 

What actually transpired is almost the exact opposite of that.

They traded Darnold and are going to draft a QB at #2, staying pat at that slot instead of trading down when the opportunity presented itself.

Not at all faulting @football guy here; he heard what he heard, and that may very well have been the inner circle's feeling at the time. But if feelings can change this much, then leaks may not be worth much. Further, these leaks into GM thinking may very well be planted - even to members of his second-to-inner circle - and he was half-expecting these to be leaked for his own purposes (e.g. in this case so teams would think they have to offer more to pry Darnold loose from the Jets). 

For one, I never said that the team would take Sewell at #2. That was never an option. 

Secondly, there was a healthy debate which direction the team should go, and the sentiment was that 60-40 Darnold would return to begin the offseason. I even made a pie chart to break it down lol. That's not 100-0. When the team hired Saleh those people thought it increased Darnold's chances of returning because the entire coaching staff was bullish on him. Saleh, Hymie, and CJ wanted Darnold. Douglas was reluctant to take anything less than FMV for #2 or Darnold. The feeling in the FO shifted a few weeks ago (before Wilson's pro day) because they had the sense that there wouldn't be a market for #2 that met the Jets requirements (needed to be a top 10 pick, wanted future 1s), whereas it was more likely the Jets would get close to FMV for Darnold. Douglas and Hogan evaluated the market, likely realized that they could not reduce the price for #2, and once Joe got a chance to meet Wilson in person it was pretty much a done deal that they would draft him... there just wasn't going to be an offer out there that was enough to give up #2. Ultimately he got FMV for Darnold, but in the form of future draft picks. They're picks he knows he's going to make and is approaching the rebuild methodically so I don't think he sees it as "it's less than a current 2nd because its a year later"... ultimately it's a 2nd round asset, a 4th round asset, and a 6th round asset. 

No, I don't buy the "he planted it" at all. I know what I know, and if people want to make conspiracy out of it so be it. Darnold returning to the team and trading down was a very real option until it became clear that the market for #2 wouldn't develop within the Jets time table, and I'm sure Douglas's personal evaluation of Wilson helped him change course as well. 

While Jets people don't agree with me, I still stick to my opinion that the signings of Davis and Cole, paired with Mims, was an indication of where Douglas was leaning. Those guys fit much better with Wilson than they would have Sam. 

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10 minutes ago, football guy said:

For one, I never said that the team would take Sewell at #2. That was never an option. 

Secondly, there was a healthy debate which direction the team should go, and the sentiment was that 60-40 Darnold would return to begin the offseason. I even made a pie chart to break it down lol. That's not 100-0. When the team hired Saleh those people thought it increased Darnold's chances of returning because the entire coaching staff was bullish on him. Saleh, Hymie, and CJ wanted Darnold. Douglas was reluctant to take anything less than FMV for #2 or Darnold. The feeling in the FO shifted a few weeks ago (before Wilson's pro day) because they had the sense that there wouldn't be a market for #2 that met the Jets requirements (needed to be a top 10 pick, wanted future 1s), whereas it was more likely the Jets would get close to FMV for Darnold. Douglas and Hogan evaluated the market, likely realized that they could not reduce the price for #2, and once Joe got a chance to meet Wilson in person it was pretty much a done deal that they would draft him... there just wasn't going to be an offer out there that was enough to give up #2. Ultimately he got FMV for Darnold, but in the form of future draft picks. They're picks he knows he's going to make and is approaching the rebuild methodically so I don't think he sees it as "it's less than a current 2nd because its a year later"... ultimately it's a 2nd round asset, a 4th round asset, and a 6th round asset. 

No, I don't buy the "he planted it" at all. I know what I know, and if people want to make conspiracy out of it so be it. Darnold returning to the team and trading down was a very real option until it became clear that the market for #2 wouldn't develop within the Jets time table, and I'm sure Douglas's personal evaluation of Wilson helped him change course as well. 

While Jets people don't agree with me, I still stick to my opinion that the signings of Davis and Cole, paired with Mims, was an indication of where Douglas was leaning. Those guys fit much better with Wilson than they would have Sam. 

Honestly Joe must really love Wilson ! This move takes big balls .. good for him. 

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A full season of Mims, Davis and Cole will be infinitely better than any other WR combo this team has had in the last 5 years.   Coleman, Johnson, Adams and Perine is the best group of RBs this team has had in the last 5 years.   While not the Kansas City Chiefs, the personnel on offense this year is already much better than it has been in the last few years.   Plus, this should improve after the draft.  

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1 hour ago, Maxman said:

Wilson is used to throwing to crappy receivers. So fix the interior oline first. Totally agree.

 

 

He's never had a WR group as talented as Davis, Mims, Crowder, Cole.

Again, it's not an elite WR group, but it's nowhere near the bottom of league anymore and if Mims takes the leap in year 2.. it's much better than that.

WR should not be a priority day 1 or 2.

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40 minutes ago, football guy said:

For one, I never said that the team would take Sewell at #2. That was never an option. 

Secondly, there was a healthy debate which direction the team should go, and the sentiment was that 60-40 Darnold would return to begin the offseason. I even made a pie chart to break it down lol. That's not 100-0. When the team hired Saleh those people thought it increased Darnold's chances of returning because the entire coaching staff was bullish on him. Saleh, Hymie, and CJ wanted Darnold. Douglas was reluctant to take anything less than FMV for #2 or Darnold. The feeling in the FO shifted a few weeks ago (before Wilson's pro day) because they had the sense that there wouldn't be a market for #2 that met the Jets requirements (needed to be a top 10 pick, wanted future 1s), whereas it was more likely the Jets would get close to FMV for Darnold. Douglas and Hogan evaluated the market, likely realized that they could not reduce the price for #2, and once Joe got a chance to meet Wilson in person it was pretty much a done deal that they would draft him... there just wasn't going to be an offer out there that was enough to give up #2. Ultimately he got FMV for Darnold, but in the form of future draft picks. They're picks he knows he's going to make and is approaching the rebuild methodically so I don't think he sees it as "it's less than a current 2nd because its a year later"... ultimately it's a 2nd round asset, a 4th round asset, and a 6th round asset. 

No, I don't buy the "he planted it" at all. I know what I know, and if people want to make conspiracy out of it so be it. Darnold returning to the team and trading down was a very real option until it became clear that the market for #2 wouldn't develop within the Jets time table, and I'm sure Douglas's personal evaluation of Wilson helped him change course as well. 

While Jets people don't agree with me, I still stick to my opinion that the signings of Davis and Cole, paired with Mims, was an indication of where Douglas was leaning. Those guys fit much better with Wilson than they would have Sam. 

Again, I'm not finding fault with you. If the team as a whole believed in Darnold - not that some were somewhat more bullish than others - they'd have kept Darnold instead of trading him. They're going with a total unknown instead, and have been fielding calls for Darnold for some time now without discouraging more to call. Teams that believe in their starting QB don't trade them for future non-1st round picks of unknown draft slots.

Anyway, "bullish" is relative not an absolute, and a team can be bullish on more than one player. I don't really know what is in Douglas's head, and take for granted what's in there can change for him just as it changes for any of us on the outside looking in. 

A trade is always FMV for the player, unless the GM just didn't entertain competing offers to find out what FMV was. Darnold was on the trade block for many weeks, and in the end it seems they couldn't get a 2nd round pick in this draft (let alone a 1st), which I'm sure he was trying to get (he could always have flipped a 2nd rounder this year for a 2nd rounder next year, and recouped more than just a future 4th). Other teams determine FMV and Douglas can't force a higher pick out of someone unwilling to pay it. The market said a future 2nd+4th is all Darnold was worth. I believe he exhausted all options. 

It's not like JD panicked and traded him too precipitously without first seeing what the top offer might've been. Truth is if he waited he might have gotten more - I doubt much more, though - but he might have gotten less. Right now Carolina's not guaranteed any of the top young QB prospects. Come draft day one they like might slip to them and then they're not making any offer for Darnold - like Washington allegedly bowing out after signing Fitz - so I don't fault him for taking the pick now. 

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5 hours ago, Irish Jet said:

The WR's are fine - Nothing exceptional but it's a solid group.  

I actually agree with this.  No superstar playmakers but I think there is enough talent there with LaFleur's offense to be better than we've seen in a decade.  

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