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Don't you wish you had more legitimate complaints about Joe Douglas?


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On 4/9/2021 at 10:00 AM, slats said:

No more, "why couldn't he convince Joe Thuney to sign with the 2-14 Jets over the back-to-back AFC champs?" 

Or, "remember that time he took a backup QB with the second of three fourth rounders? I'm still not over that!" 

Or, "I can't believe he's signing guys who might not even make the final roster. Why doesn't he sign eighty-five starters?" 

Don't worry, kids, your time is coming! 

With this draft, the Jets will be cemented as Joe Douglas' team, for better or worse. He's got his hand-picked head coach. And not just the only coach who would take his calls, but a highly sought after head coaching candidate. In a few weeks, he'll have his shiny new hand-picked QB as well. Imagine? No longer having to bitch about a QB taken at #125 because now you can bitch about one taken #2 overall! How much fun is that going to be?!?

Depending on any draft picks trades, over two years he will have added three first round picks, two seconds, four thirds and four fourths. Three years worth of top half picks over the course of two. His free agents, too, on his terms. 

The team was dog **** when he stepped into the building in June of 2019. He cut Maccagnan's second pick that year before the season. He dug up the grave of Ryan Kalil because he recognized that the OL was in terrible shape. But coming in after the prime free agency period and the draft, there was little he could do but self-scout and the results have been a significant purge and rebuild in pretty short order.

Everything isn't going to be fixed in this draft, but a lot of things should be in place by the time it's done. We talk about the endless rebuild here but if Joe Douglas does his job well in the draft, we shouldn't be talking about the rebuild continuing next offseason. We should be talking about filling the last few holes, and maybe someone like me who hates taking RBs too early can start entertaining that idea next year when they have two firsts and two seconds to spend. No one should be expecting playoffs this year, but we should expect a team that looks competent and competitive with far fewer holes than they had in June of 2019. A team poised to get back into the post-season. 

And you guys will have things far more substantial to talk about other than who they're talking to about their backup QB spot. Should be fun! 

I get the feeling the thread title is a bit facetious? Say it isn't so?

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No more, "why couldn't he convince Joe Thuney to sign with the 2-14 Jets over the back-to-back AFC champs?"  Or, "remember that time he took a backup QB with the second of three fourth rounders?

Being miserable and treating the GM like dirt is every Jets fan’s god given right.

I’ve been in a seething rage since we drafted James Morgan (over that great nickel corner whose name I can’t spell on the Rams!!) my wife left me over it  

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On 4/9/2021 at 10:49 AM, FidelioJet said:

It's about developing the QB.  Right now it can't be about winning and losing.

JD tore this thing down the past two years and chose to start the rebuild with a QB at #2 overall.  Developing that QB needs to the first, second and third priority of this organization.

I'm all for a balanced team and once you develop the QB he should be able to carry the offense with less talent - but right now Zach Wilson's development should be the ONLY thing that matters.

Sure - having a good defense can help a QB but not as much as having a good OL, RB, TE or WR's...

Two other things to consider..

Defense was supported better in FA to date

Defense already and still has more talent than the offense.  You can probably go offense at 23 and 34 and the defense will still have the better roster.

 

i get what your saying, but im going to try to figured out what JD is doing.

regardless of defense being more supported in FA, he never touch CB, except resigning Guidry. i know you dont care if the other team scores 50 pts a game but i bet JD and Saleh does. beside that would put tremendous stress on the QB to throw it 50 times a game.

big need at CB

he signed 2 OL and has Clark coming back from where ever he was. thats 3 additions to the line. i dont think he made those moves because they sucked. im not sure hes thinking he needs one really early in the draft..

WR..... he signed 2 in FA. and has Crowder and Mims back. that looks like 4 decent starters. i dont think thats a big priority early either.

TE.... i was watching NFL access last night and they listed all the TEs drafting in the first rd. there were 10 and they all sucked. i never even heard of some of those guys. it tells me that GMs dont consider TE a premium pick in the 1st rd.

RB..... i believe @Sperm Edwards had a great post on this. 

with that said i think its a CB at 23. i would love a Center, wish JD got a vet to go with the rookie QB but a really good center will be a great help to Wilson

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On 4/10/2021 at 5:04 PM, kelly said:

..he had to have surgery for a back injury.he's hoping to be back.

just an fyi ;  >  https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/30957726/kansas-city-chiefs-tackle-mitchell-schwartz-back-surgery-eyes-healthy-2021-season

~ ~ Photo by Mitchell Schwartz in Dallas, Texas. May be an image of 1 person.

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    Injury Update: I’m getting surgery today. I was hoping to recover enough during the season to get back on the field, especially for the playoffs and Super Bowl, but that never happened. It’s time to address the issue since it isn’t going away on its own. The recovery process isn’t too long, hence being able to wait until now to do it, otherwise I would have done this earlier. Looking forward to a healthy 2021! #Chiefs #ChiefsKingdom
    6w

He’s a good player and I wish him luck but his ability to stay healthy going forward is an issue

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2 hours ago, doitny said:

i get what your saying, but im going to try to figured out what JD is doing.

regardless of defense being more supported in FA, he never touch CB, except resigning Guidry. i know you dont care if the other team scores 50 pts a game but i bet JD and Saleh does. beside that would put tremendous stress on the QB to throw it 50 times a game.

big need at CB

he signed 2 OL and has Clark coming back from where ever he was. thats 3 additions to the line. i dont think he made those moves because they sucked. im not sure hes thinking he needs one really early in the draft..

WR..... he signed 2 in FA. and has Crowder and Mims back. that looks like 4 decent starters. i dont think thats a big priority early either.

TE.... i was watching NFL access last night and they listed all the TEs drafting in the first rd. there were 10 and they all sucked. i never even heard of some of those guys. it tells me that GMs dont consider TE a premium pick in the 1st rd.

RB..... i believe @Sperm Edwards had a great post on this. 

with that said i think its a CB at 23. i would love a Center, wish JD got a vet to go with the rookie QB but a really good center will be a great help to Wilson

Yeah, I understand and don't really disagree on what they will do or at least willing to do.  I doubt they're locked in on corner but that is my best guess as to what we're going to take there.

I just feel pretty strongly that it's the wrong, shortsighted  move.  

Maybe I'll be pleasantly surprised and they'll do what right and go offense at 23, 34 and 66.  But I agree with you that it's highly unlikely.  

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On 4/9/2021 at 10:00 AM, slats said:

No more, "why couldn't he convince Joe Thuney to sign with the 2-14 Jets over the back-to-back AFC champs?" 

Or, "remember that time he took a backup QB with the second of three fourth rounders? I'm still not over that!" 

Or, "I can't believe he's signing guys who might not even make the final roster. Why doesn't he sign eighty-five starters?" 

Don't worry, kids, your time is coming! 

With this draft, the Jets will be cemented as Joe Douglas' team, for better or worse. He's got his hand-picked head coach. And not just the only coach who would take his calls, but a highly sought after head coaching candidate. In a few weeks, he'll have his shiny new hand-picked QB as well. Imagine? No longer having to bitch about a QB taken at #125 because now you can bitch about one taken #2 overall! How much fun is that going to be?!?

Depending on any draft picks trades, over two years he will have added three first round picks, two seconds, four thirds and four fourths. Three years worth of top half picks over the course of two. His free agents, too, on his terms. 

The team was dog **** when he stepped into the building in June of 2019. He cut Maccagnan's second pick that year before the season. He dug up the grave of Ryan Kalil because he recognized that the OL was in terrible shape. But coming in after the prime free agency period and the draft, there was little he could do but self-scout and the results have been a significant purge and rebuild in pretty short order.

Everything isn't going to be fixed in this draft, but a lot of things should be in place by the time it's done. We talk about the endless rebuild here but if Joe Douglas does his job well in the draft, we shouldn't be talking about the rebuild continuing next offseason. We should be talking about filling the last few holes, and maybe someone like me who hates taking RBs too early can start entertaining that idea next year when they have two firsts and two seconds to spend. No one should be expecting playoffs this year, but we should expect a team that looks competent and competitive with far fewer holes than they had in June of 2019. A team poised to get back into the post-season. 

And you guys will have things far more substantial to talk about other than who they're talking to about their backup QB spot. Should be fun! 

Robert Saleh's head is shiny. Not a complaint, just an observation . . . that will somehow manage to turn into a complaint by someone down the line. For the record, I never went the bottom feeder route on Adam Gase's eyes as far as criticism goes, it's just dirty pool and made me uncomfortable. He obviously has a form of Tourette's, and he would've done the world a favor by admitting he has it and advocating for people who suffer ridicule instead of hiding it under a hat.  He just sucked, period.  That must have been a wildly uncomfortable position for Joe Douglas to be in, firing his friend; so luckily the Johnsons did it for him technically. And it was a good lockerroom move in this instance to NOT do it himself, believe it. 

Anyway, I always say this, but Jets fans are a curious, quirky, bunch and I'm confident in my conclusion. The underdogs of the football world from the get go, it carried over into being a fan ever since. Misfits, convicts, upstarts, people who don't fit into other teams boxes (no, not box seats, of course, that's too upscale). Anyway, within that, we're probably one of the most loyal fanbases out there no matter how much we get jobbed.

So back to what I also always say, if some Jets fans - and you know who you are - found an attache case on the side of a deserted road with $50 grand in it, they'd complain it wasn't $100 grand. 

 

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8 hours ago, slats said:

You're set up for disappointment, while I'm maybe in position to be pleasantly surprised. 

Rookie head coach, rookie offensive coordinator, rookie QB. It's highly unlikely to be smooth sailing. 

I guess I am just more frustrated, more intolerant and less patient with us being a perennial last place, can't score butt-of-jokes type team then you are at this point. 

This is JD's third season.  And you're basically telling me "expect us to suck on offense, but slightly less than we sucked last year".  

 

 

 

 

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15 hours ago, Dunnie said:

I have literally zero complaints about Joe D. Even his taking a snooze during the game ...I was about to ream him out over that ...but then I caught myself snoring during most of 2020s games.

Sent from my SM-G950U1 using JetNation.com mobile app
 

Whoever says the Jets aren't the occasional panacea for insomnia is a big, fat, liar. Joe Douglas is big and fat, but not a liar. 

EDIT & P.S.: For comparative purposes, big and fat who fell asleep and lied about it a/k/a BFL (Big Fat(cesa) Liar). That was really fun for a Monday morning. 

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2 minutes ago, doitny said:

i get what your saying, but im going to try to figured out what JD is doing.

regardless of defense being more supported in FA, he never touch CB, except resigning Guidry. i know you dont care if the other team scores 50 pts a game but i bet JD and Saleh does. beside that would put tremendous stress on the QB to throw it 50 times a game.

big need at CB

he signed 2 OL and has Clark coming back from where ever he was. thats 3 additions to the line. i dont think he made those moves because they sucked. im not sure hes thinking he needs one really early in the draft..

WR..... he signed 2 in FA. and has Crowder and Mims back. that looks like 4 decent starters. i dont think thats a big priority early either.

TE.... i was watching NFL access last night and they listed all the TEs drafting in the first rd. there were 10 and they all sucked. i never even heard of some of those guys. it tells me that GMs dont consider TE a premium pick in the 1st rd.

RB..... i believe @Sperm Edwards had a great post on this. 

with that said i think its a CB at 23. i would love a Center, wish JD got a vet to go with the rookie QB but a really good center will be a great help to Wilson

I'd also have been more comfortable upgrading 2 OL positions by going for one name veteran (e.g. Linsley) and one rookie. 

He's going with another method that can have acceptable results, but the idea behind doing it is to use the saved cap room elsewhere, except he's not doing that.

I feel like the best individual guard production is being overblown, as though the league's never seen such incompetent blocking -- pass blocking in particular, where Darnold "got killed" every week through the end of the season. I'm not expecting individual all-pro blocking from the competition winner, but the Jets aren't trying to go 1-for-1 with a cheap guard competing with a 6th or 7th round pick either (as many playoff teams have done). Assuming the 23/34 rookie starts right away, the other veteran-competition-winner guard is going to have to earn the starting job; and given their non-guaranteed salaries are all too high for pure backups, each to potentially earn a roster spot in the process.

Douglas is betting that the best of the rest - I've been using terms like King of the Dipshits, which I stole from 16 Candles - will yield an adequate starter. Benton is an experienced OLC who was the 49ers' OLC since the Shanahan regime began. They did fine without every starter being a recent high pick or top-3 salaried player at his relative position. 

And in fairness, like many others, it's not like Linsley was great right out of the gate himself. In the 2017 offseason if anyone told you Corey Linsley - a fairly recent, late 5th round pick, who'd max out with an $8MM/year extension that following December - is going to soon be a 1st team all pro center, that fan would've been laughed at & thought delusional. 

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why would we want more legit complaints against douglas? i think people forget he was a newbie at gm when hired so some missteps are expected.  i don't think his missteps up until now have done anything to change the past couple of seasons for the jets.  this next season and the subsequent ones will be key.  and i'm sure there will be plenty of complaints about douglas if this team continues to under perform in the future.  there just won't be a whole lot of excuses.

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JD isn't going to be perfect.  That's fine. 

JD chose a slow rebuild - no shortcuts and no peaking early like Macc did. 

Trust the process.  It's going to continue to be painful.  Two seasons from now, we'll be able to root for wins again... if he can draft.

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4 minutes ago, dcJet said:

JD isn't going to be perfect.  That's fine. 

JD chose a slow rebuild - no shortcuts and no peaking early like Macc did. 

Trust the process.  It's going to continue to be painful.  Two seasons from now, we'll be able to root for wins again... if he can draft.

Dude....it does not take 4 seasons to get to "winning again" 

CMON MAN

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12 minutes ago, dcJet said:

JD isn't going to be perfect.  That's fine. 

JD chose a slow rebuild - no shortcuts and no peaking early like Macc did. 

Trust the process.  It's going to continue to be painful.  Two seasons from now, we'll be able to root for wins again... if he can draft.

It should not be painful with the picks and draft capital we have

as I have said MANY times parcells took a 4-28  team to the AFC championship year two and although he probably cost us peyton or some will say he did-his rebuild was not a quick fix -he had one of the best drafts in franchise history and gave us some players that were key for us for many years among them martin ellis abraham pennington coles and bect(he was not great but light years better than our guys now)

Joe has numerous draft picks of substance and he best land stars ...

 

 

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8 minutes ago, kevinc855 said:

Dude....it does not take 4 seasons to get to "winning again" 

CMON MAN

I said 2 seasons but 4 wouldn't surprise me with this roster and our draft history.

We're still rooting for losses next year, right?

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5 minutes ago, kmnj said:

It should not be painful with the picks and draft capital we have

as I have said MANY times parcells took a 4-28  team to the AFC championship year two and although he probably cost us peyton or some will say he did-his rebuild was not a quick fix -he had one of the best drafts in franchise history and gave us some players that were key for us for many years among them martin ellis abraham pennington coles and bect(he was not great but light years better than our guys now)

Joe has numerous draft picks of substance and he best land stars ...

 

 

That was out best draft ever.  Let's do that again this year.

We should get a dead cat coach bounce this year... maybe 6-7 wins.   Let's see if it's sustainable.

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1 hour ago, dcJet said:

I said 2 seasons but 4 wouldn't surprise me with this roster and our draft history.

We're still rooting for losses next year, right?

I’m assuming your trolling 

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5 minutes ago, kevinc855 said:

I’m assuming your trolling 

Am I out-kevining you?  😀

No troll.   Just math.  We need to replace 13-15 starters plus add depth. 

We got 2 good starters in FA. Draft adds a rookie QB and maybe 1 or 2 more rookie starters that may stick assuming bust rates.  At this rate, optimistically assuming 5 new starters a year, we need three years.

I think we'll be rooting for losses this year and I don't see a winning season in the next two seasons but that's ok, let's try this slow rebuild.  We have no choice, they told us no shortcuts.

 

 

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1 hour ago, dcJet said:

JD isn't going to be perfect.  That's fine. 

JD chose a slow rebuild - no shortcuts and no peaking early like Macc did. 

Trust the process.  It's going to continue to be painful.  Two seasons from now, we'll be able to root for wins again... if he can draft.

Nobody's perfect, and - draft pick accumulation aside - in terms of results, Douglas hasn't been even in the ballpark of very good yet, let alone merely not-perfect. One can be a subpar GM and still be a substantial upgrade to Maccagnan.

I'm optimistic at least in the sense that I think (a) he and his coach are very much on the same page, and (b) he doesn't seem to obsess over a player/prospect, even to the team's detriment. The latter suggests he's thinking/planning and not just reacting, so I definitely like that. But investments aren't still good if they don't eventually pay off.

If one of the veteran guards pans out like he's betting on, then he gambled correctly. If the available iOL starters end up being expensive letdowns for their team (Zeitler, Linsley, even Trent Williams; Thuney I think was never signing here short of a kooky offer of $19MM/yr or more), then not only was bringing one of them in a bad mistake, but it also requires the team to stick with that mistake next year, too. 

Absolutely, some of the criticism is just stupid. Some of the time (basically any time I'm the one doing it) the criticism is valid. 

I do hope his idea of a slow rebuild isn't that slow. Rookie contracts don't last forever, and I'd like to see more than one clearly above-average performer from his draft class.

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