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6 minutes ago, GreenFish said:

If Etienne falls to our 2nd round pick, take him. Otherwise get someone like Gainwell in the 3rd.

While the system is friendly on one cut and go RBs, having a high end one cut and go RB would be in even better. Especially one that can explode for a 70 yard TD.

A strong running game will go a long way in helping Zach transition to the NFL.

I understand the attraction, but I still wouldn't like it. And I'd hate it if they hadn't found an IOL upgrade at #23, first. If they were to go Edge or CB at #23, #34 has to be an OL. 

I agree on the strong running game, just think the most consistent way to get there is via the OL. 

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With the David Sills chatter and the fact that Christian Barmore will be a top 25 pick, it really gives JD the opportunity to move down from 23, still get an OL and pick up a second round pick that allows us to take Etienne at 34 if he falls.  

Its really just numbers - if we dont want a WR at 23, which I firmly believe we do not, there is some combination of Teven Jenkins, Wyatt Davis, Creed Humphrey, Vera-Tucker and even Cosmi to be there at the end of the first.   Taking etienne at 34 and then someone like Quinn Meinerz with the additional 2nd/top of the 3rd can allow JD to get an elite RB and re-tool the OL.

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12 hours ago, JETSY14 said:

No o line it doesn't matter who you put back there. The last 2 years we didn't Crack double digit rushing tds. Pretty pathetic. 

I think thats wrong.

Didnt Johnson go over 100 this year?

But still, yes the rush attack has been non existent 

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San Fran had the Lead in the SB but could not put the game away with their vaunted Shannahan running game keeping Mahomes off the field. Daddy Shanny won his 2 SB's if you remember with Terrell Davis not some of the crap RB's that followed him. 

Atlanta in the SB had a big lead and could not seal the game keeping Brady off the field because late they could not run the football.

Wonder how either of those teams would have loved to have an Emmitt Smith or a Marshall Faulk to put those games away late ?

This league has devalued RB's in favor of throwing the football but when it comes time to run out a game they can't do it and that has become an issue letting guys like Brady Manning Brees Rodgers Rothlesberger get back on the field in the 4th to steal games. Its why a team built like the Cowboys of the early 90's would have still been the best teams in the NFL to this day . Great OL, solid Possession receivers and run the ball down your throat in the 4th to preserve win after win and routinely beat high powered offenses like the Bills the Same way the Giants did by running the ball and keeping it out of the hands of said offenses. We don't see that much anymore because the NFL has changed and its changed in the wrong direction. 

Building a team in the mold of the Cowboys is the way to go IMHO a team that can beat you in many ways not just by trying to put up 40 every game. A solid running game also helps the defense with time of possession. if you have a freak duel threat RB available you take him. If you take a RB like that and still have a team that's not built properly like the Giants and the Cowboys can't blame that on the RB blame it on how the team is built. 

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6 hours ago, slats said:

I understand the attraction, but I still wouldn't like it. And I'd hate it if they hadn't found an IOL upgrade at #23, first. If they were to go Edge or CB at #23, #34 has to be an OL. 

I agree on the strong running game, just think the most consistent way to get there is via the OL. 

Yes, I agree with you about OL first. I’d only be ok with Etienne at 34 if we used 23 on OL. This is actually my ideal draft.

But if we go Edge or Corner at 23, then OL at 34 and RB in the 3rd.

I agree that you need a strong OL first and foremost. I just want an elite RB on top of that. Especially one that can cause headaches like Etienne. Kind of greedy I guess.

I like the way Dak was developed. I want Wilson to have easy throws and a strong running game to fall back on. As he develops, we can start moving towards a high powered air attack. Kind like the Seahawks did with Russel Wilson.

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On 4/10/2021 at 8:27 AM, slats said:

I agree 1000% on taking RBs early, especially in the system they're gonna be running, but I wonder how much of a priority they're putting on CB in the draft. Seems to me that there are still a few decent or better CBs out there in free agency, while the OL cupboard is essentially bare. First round is gonna be your best shot at an elite Edge, too, which JD and Saleh obviously focused on in free agency, but you have to wonder if they're done there. I think Saleh can make the CBs work provided he has a consistent pass rush. 

your right on CBs. there are alot still out there. but im, afraid JD wont overpay to get hem.

when Kwan Williams resigned with SF on a one year deal he said he had a few offers which were all similar including the Jets. but he chose SF.

we were 2-14. nobody's coming here for the same money.

before FA i would argue that nobody's coming to a 2-14 team unless we really overpay. others said we have so much money thats players would follow the money.

well we got the money, were just giving them enough to come here.

 

 

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On 4/10/2021 at 9:17 AM, Jet Nut said:

I think thats wrong.

Didnt Johnson go over 100 this year?

But still, yes the rush attack has been non existent 

I said for the year we didn't crack double digit touchdowns. We had 9 rushing tds the whole year.  Our only 100 plus yard game was by Johnson 104 yds.

 

In 2019 we had 6 tds for the year.  That's how good our line is. 

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We need upgrades and more diversity at the TE position.  Because TE will be a valued part of LaFleur's offense.  And Herndon is in the last year of his contract.  

So I would rather JD put a higher priority on TE then RB in this draft.  Like Pat Freiermuth, Tom Tremble, or even a late flyer on a under the radar Zach Davidson.  

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On 4/9/2021 at 5:15 PM, slats said:

This system makes stars out of nobodies. Watch Ty Johnson rush for 1000 this season. It’s both crazy and well within the realm of possibility. 

2,000 now that Gore is no More

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On 4/10/2021 at 9:17 AM, Jet Nut said:

I think thats wrong.

Didnt Johnson go over 100 this year?

But still, yes the rush attack has been non existent 

Yes he did and that was behind a crummy OL. And Adams had a 5.2 YPC average I believe. He's a dark horse that will surprise this coming year.  And we just signed Coleman. And we have Perine as a backup. There's only so many RB's you can have. We are set this year.  This is the least of our problems. 

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1 hour ago, Wonderboy said:

Yes he did and that was behind a crummy OL. And Adams had a 5.2 YPC average I believe. He's a dark horse that will surprise this coming year.  And we just signed Coleman. And we have Perine as a backup. There's only so many RB's you can have. We are set this year.  This is the least of our problems. 

I agree, Johnson and Adams should be interesting behind a better OL and the expected better coaching and game call.  

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On 4/9/2021 at 4:15 PM, joewilly12 said:

Travis Etienne 

He’s a luxury for a team like Tampa. Even they won’t waste a pick on him until the late second round. 

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On 4/10/2021 at 9:39 AM, Smashmouth said:

San Fran had the Lead in the SB but could not put the game away with their vaunted Shannahan running game keeping Mahomes off the field. Daddy Shanny won his 2 SB's if you remember with Terrell Davis not some of the crap RB's that followed him. 

Atlanta in the SB had a big lead and could not seal the game keeping Brady off the field because late they could not run the football.

Wonder how either of those teams would have loved to have an Emmitt Smith or a Marshall Faulk to put those games away late ?

This league has devalued RB's in favor of throwing the football but when it comes time to run out a game they can't do it and that has become an issue letting guys like Brady Manning Brees Rodgers Rothlesberger get back on the field in the 4th to steal games. Its why a team built like the Cowboys of the early 90's would have still been the best teams in the NFL to this day . Great OL, solid Possession receivers and run the ball down your throat in the 4th to preserve win after win and routinely beat high powered offenses like the Bills the Same way the Giants did by running the ball and keeping it out of the hands of said offenses. We don't see that much anymore because the NFL has changed and its changed in the wrong direction. 

Building a team in the mold of the Cowboys is the way to go IMHO a team that can beat you in many ways not just by trying to put up 40 every game. A solid running game also helps the defense with time of possession. if you have a freak duel threat RB available you take him. If you take a RB like that and still have a team that's not built properly like the Giants and the Cowboys can't blame that on the RB blame it on how the team is built. 

Terrell Davis was a 6th round pick.  

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1 hour ago, Joe Willie White Shoes said:

Terrell Davis was a 6th round pick.  

So was Tom Brady ... My argument is that a great RB should not be devalued and passed up in round one. If Terrell Davis was available via the draft knowing what he would become he should go in the first round like Smith and Faulk because without those 3 backs none of those teams win a SB 

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6 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:


But you don’t really know what these RBs will become, that’s the larger point.  The bust rate of 1st round RBs is higher than most positions. Rashaad Penny, Sony Michel, Leonard Fournette, Bishop Sankey, Gio Bernard, etc.

Meanwhile, the injury history makes even the “hits” not worth it.  The shelf life is just too short.  Saquon Barkley and Todd Gurley come to mind there.

This is very true and a good point. Keep in mind just like any other position including QB the injury bug can hit at any moment but it does happen more to RB's due to the nature of the position. Now if you happen to hit on a great one who can give you 10 solid years like a Payton, Faulk, Riggins, Smith, Martin, Tomlinson (lots more to mention) that's a really good thing because you now have a player who not only can be a huge threat but a player who can consistently take pressure off a QB by not only running but blocking and catching passes out of the back field as well as bering a huge value in a check down situation which happens a hell of a lot in the NFL just ask Drew Brees. 

So as a counter point everyone is drooling over these running QB's and in that respect name me one running QB and by that I mean a rushing type QB who ever won a SB just name me one ? They are fine (sarcasm) to take in round one  with usually a top 10 or better pick who never won anything and always have short injury prone careers. Are Fields and Lawrence getting more credit than they deserve because they can also run the football ? How's that going to work out if they run it in the NFL ? I said it when Cam Newton was running to get his MVP now he's a broken mess. Everyone Drooled over Lamar Jackson another running QB who threw for 90 yards in the AFCCG. I'm making this comparison because running the football in the NFL and doing it consistently wins playoff games. You can have all the great QB's you want but when its Minus 5 outside and the wind is blowing 20 miles an hour who do you rely on to get that playoff win one of those backs I mentioned or Dan Marino ? :)

 

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On 4/10/2021 at 7:48 AM, slats said:

I understand the attraction, but I still wouldn't like it. And I'd hate it if they hadn't found an IOL upgrade at #23, first. If they were to go Edge or CB at #23, #34 has to be an OL. 

I agree on the strong running game, just think the most consistent way to get there is via the OL. 

Slats I think we will fill our OL needs in rounds 2 and 3 ....IMO a real duel threat RB can make things very easy for not only the QB but for the OL as well teams will have to play honest at the low levels of the defense if you have a real threat at running back.

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41 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:


But you don’t really know what these RBs will become, that’s the larger point.  The bust rate of 1st round RBs is higher than most positions. Rashaad Penny, Sony Michel, Leonard Fournette, Bishop Sankey, Gio Bernard, etc.

Meanwhile, the injury history makes even the “hits” not worth it.  The shelf life is just too short.  Saquon Barkley and Todd Gurley come to mind there.

dont forget our own Blair Thomas.

though looking back at his stats he could have been better if he could stay on the field. missed 29 games in 4 years..

but like you said, its the shelf life. its way too short

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36 minutes ago, Smashmouth said:

This is very true and a good point. Keep in mind just like any other position including QB the injury bug can hit at any moment but it does happen more to RB's due to the nature of the position. Now if you happen to hit on a great one who can give you 10 solid years like a Payton, Faulk, Riggins, Smith, Martin, Tomlinson (lots more to mention) that's a really good thing because you now have a player who not only can be a huge threat but a player who can consistently take pressure off a QB by not only running but blocking and catching passes out of the back field as well as bering a huge value in a check down situation which happens a hell of a lot in the NFL just ask Drew Brees. 

So as a counter point everyone is drooling over these running QB's and in that respect name me one running QB and by that I mean a rushing type QB who ever won a SB just name me one ? They are fine (sarcasm) to take in round one  with usually a top 10 or better pick who never won anything and always have short injury prone careers. Are Fields and Lawrence getting more credit than they deserve because they can also run the football ? How's that going to work out if they run it in the NFL ? I said it when Cam Newton was running to get his MVP now he's a broken mess. Everyone Drooled over Lamar Jackson another running QB who threw for 90 yards in the AFCCG. I'm making this comparison because running the football in the NFL and doing it consistently wins playoff games. You can have all the great QB's you want but when its Minus 5 outside and the wind is blowing 20 miles an hour who do you rely on to get that playoff win one of those backs I mentioned or Dan Marino ? :)

 


 

You say in one breath that you agree RBs don’t last long, and in the next you say “But if you can get one that lasts 10 years...”

They don’t, dude.  There aren’t any Emmitt’s, Faulk’s or Gore’s anymore.  They don’t exist, and probably never will again. So even if you manage to draft an elite back, he’s probably giving you about 4 great years at most then flaming out. It’s a poor use of draft resources to take RBs high.

The middle rounds, however, are a fruitful place to find one.  Ideally, 3rd round.  Not too early, but early enough to maybe get a game changer, as the 4th round or later the best athletes tend to be off the board. 

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On 4/11/2021 at 10:05 PM, JETSY14 said:

I said for the year we didn't crack double digit touchdowns. We had 9 rushing tds the whole year.  Our only 100 plus yard game was by Johnson 104 yds.

 

In 2019 we had 6 tds for the year.  That's how good our line is. 

Crappy Oline outside of Becton who is our only good run blocker and Gase in his lunacy insisted on getting Frank Gore 30+ touches per game because he was the only player that actually liked him

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17 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:


But you don’t really know what these RBs will become, that’s the larger point.  The bust rate of 1st round RBs is higher than most positions. Rashaad Penny, Sony Michel, Leonard Fournette, Bishop Sankey, Gio Bernard, etc.

Meanwhile, the injury history makes even the “hits” not worth it.  The shelf life is just too short.  Saquon Barkley and Todd Gurley come to mind there.

The super bowl just had two first round running backs start for the both teams

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12 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

Crappy Oline outside of Becton who is our only good run blocker and Gase in his lunacy insisted on getting Frank Gore 30+ touches per game because he was the only player that actually liked him

Good thing for Becton or we wouldn't have a game with over 100 yards last year😆

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3 hours ago, Philc1 said:

The super bowl just had two first round running backs start for the both teams

Keyword is super bowl.... we are not even close to that caliber.  Once you are almost there then yes a first round rb is an option but not right now. 

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5 minutes ago, JETSY14 said:

Keyword is super bowl.... we are not even close to that caliber.  Once you are almost there then yes a first round rb is an option but not right now. 

And it’s not like the Bucs spent a 1st round pick on Fournette.  He was cast off by the Jaguars, of all teams.

Not to mention, the Chiefs won a Super Bowl prior to spending a 1st on Edwards-Helaire.

RB play clearly was not a driving force for either team.  It’s a luxury pick when you take one in the 1st.

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On 4/11/2021 at 4:38 PM, GreenReaper said:

We need upgrades and more diversity at the TE position.  Because TE will be a valued part of LaFleur's offense.  And Herndon is in the last year of his contract.  

So I would rather JD put a higher priority on TE then RB in this draft.  Like Pat Freiermuth, Tom Tremble, or even a late flyer on a under the radar Zach Davidson.  

Tight end is a must.  If our two 3rd round picks were Gainwell and Tremble id be estatic.

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21 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:


But you don’t really know what these RBs will become, that’s the larger point.  The bust rate of 1st round RBs is higher than most positions. Rashaad Penny, Sony Michel, Leonard Fournette, Bishop Sankey, Gio Bernard, etc.

Meanwhile, the injury history makes even the “hits” not worth it.  The shelf life is just too short.  Saquon Barkley and Todd Gurley come to mind there.

I'm thinking more early second just cause the entire 5th year option(due to shelf life). Outside Fournett(And was wrong) I didn't think any of them where worth it. I thought Sankey and Gio where like 3rd rounders though. Top 2 this year I wouldn't mind rolling the dice on if they fall that far

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5 minutes ago, Aaron Hernandez said:

I'm thinking more early second just cause the entire 5th year option(due to shelf life). Outside Fournett(And was wrong) I didn't think any of them where worth it. I thought Sankey and Gio where like 3rd rounders though. Top 2 this year I wouldn't mind rolling the dice on if they fall that far

Not sure what you mean there, as 2nd round picks don’t come with a 5th year option.  

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16 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

2nd round picks don’t come with a 5th year option.  

Yeah, why I like RB in the early second better than say a QB. I'd rather not negotiate from that gaurnteed position for a short life spot like RB. I concede to the smarter cap guys if I got it backwards on why I think early second is better than our late first. Even if he's good through 4 years I figure a cheaper team friendly deal beats negotiating on a 5th year option gaurnteed

 

Edit: I'm most likely wrong. Sperm or Bit will probably trash me. It's just my thinking

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5 minutes ago, Aaron Hernandez said:

Yeah, why I like RB in the early second better than say a QB. I'd rather not negotiate from that gaurnteed position for a short life spot like RB. I concede to the smarter cap guys if I got it backwards on why I think early second is better than our late first. Even if he's good through 4 years I figure a cheaper team friendly deal beats negotiating on a 5th year option gaurnteed

I’d prefer the 5th year option for a RB so that you get an extra year to run him into the ground.  A late 1st 5th year option isn’t that expensive.

If a RB ends up a stud, losing him after just 4 years feels like a very short time. You almost have to just go ahead and pay him at that point, much like the Saints had to do with Kamara.

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5 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

I’d prefer the 5th year option for a RB so that you get an extra year to run him into the ground.  A late 1st 5th year option isn’t that expensive.

If a RB ends up a stud, losing him after just 4 years feels like a very short time. You almost have to just go ahead and pay him at that point, much like the Saints had to do with Kamara.

This actually makes more sense. I guess if you think he's going to be that good just take him. It's just if he's that good you're negotiating with a fat garuntee sitting there also. If it works out it won't matter anyway really granted you get somebody that good. Guess I'm thinking of that second tier 

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Im satisfied with a running back by committee approach. That being Coleman, Johnson, maybe Adams, on 1st and 2nd down. I want a 3rd down back who can come in as a true duel threat, like a Bruce Harper. Richie Anderson 

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1 hour ago, Joe W. Namath said:

Tight end is a must.  If our two 3rd round picks were Gainwell and Tremble id be estatic.

If Jets don't get Freiermuth in round 2.  I'd definitely take Tremble in the 3rd.  Then possibly take  my first (maybe only) CB pick here also.  And hope for a Gainwell-Carter-Sermon in the 4th.

IMO...Gotta throw Saleh a CB bone here in the 3rd. 

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Chuba Hubbard is a great fit for the wide zone.  2,000 yard rusher in 2019.  Stupidly came back to school and had a miserable season mired by nagging injuries.  His stock has plummeted to day 3.  He’s now healthy.  His lost could be our gain.

 

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The Jaguars signed Robinson as an udfa and he became a freaking monster. They obviously were a terrible team with a terrible scheme and o line and still found a RB after the draft.

if Darnold is actually better but sucked because of Gase, our running backs (and honestly the entire offense) are probably way better than they looked. 

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