Are you excited about drafting Zach Wilson?

[greenwichjetfan]

1 minute ago, FidelioJet said:

NFL scouts were familiar with Wilson.  Just because he wasn't on ABC and you didn't see him it doesn't mean he wasn't on the radar of NFL teams.

He was.  Did a breakout year help his national exposure - for sure.  But his natural skill-set was never going to get past NFL scouts.

Far too often people confuse ESPN with NFL front offices.  They are very different entities with different goals, jobs and agendas.

You're unreal. Your responses to all of the legit concerns over Wilson (inferior competition, better teammates, top2 OL) have been that nothing about Wilson's college career matters and that it's all about "skillsets" (still don't know how you're deriving any tangible meaning of skillset btw). Now you're saying that he was on GMs radars? He was the 52nd ranked QB in the entire nation heading into the COVID season. If scouts were familiar with him, it was because he was on the list of QBs that they wouldn't even need to care about. 

You've been reaching about everything related to this guy since you first saw him probably back in like December or something, and aside from being deliberately disingenuous, it's also just ******* ridiculous. It's one thing to want him because you have legit reasons. It's another to throw everything he and all of his peers have done over the last three years out of the window just to fit your narrative. 

[Big_Slick]

5 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

This is not how NFL teams operate.  They value the QB position over every other position.  When you are able to grab one you do it.  Using your mode of operation, when you are ready to bring in the QB you have to hope and pray youre in the position to draft one your like and that theres one there for the taking.  Also its not a 3 year ordeal to build a team up for that QB.  

With a trade down and all the extra picks that the Jets would've received a two year rebuild of the WORST roster in the NFL is quite doable. Then you get a QB and that doesn't require a top three pick.

That's how good NFL teams operate. They don't put a rookie QB in a position to fail.

[long time suffering Jets f]

1 hour ago, AFerg726 said:

Zach Wilson has the requisite talent to be selected at 2. It's generally rare that guys selected this high flame out due to talent. Wilson's success here will depend primarily on how we develop and support him. 

Couldn’t of said it better myself. I don’t care who we draft. It’s always the same concept. Proper coaching and a strong, talented roster will most often give you optimum QB play. Somewhere in an alternate universe we’re getting ready to draft another QB because Patrick Mahomes busted miserably.

[Tranquilo]

3 minutes ago, Big_Slick said:

With a trade down and all the extra picks that the Jets would've received a two year rebuild of the WORST roster in the NFL is quite doable. Then you get a QB and that doesn't require a top three pick.

That's how good NFL teams operate. They don't put a rookie QB in a position to fail.

You make it sound like the Jets don't already have a ton of picks. Maybe they just really like Zach Wilson and rather not trade up with those same picks they would've gotten this year for a QB next draft?

[long time suffering Jets f]

5 minutes ago, Big_Slick said:

With a trade down and all the extra picks that the Jets would've received a two year rebuild of the WORST roster in the NFL is quite doable. Then you get a QB and that doesn't require a top three pick.

That's how good NFL teams operate. They don't put a rookie QB in a position to fail.

I disagree. I’ve been watching the NFL for over 40 years. Many times I have watched teams with talented rosters but a lousy QB. Let’s say for arguments sake the Jets kept Darnold and went on to build a talented roster and he still didn’t elevate his play. There’s no guarantee we would be able to find his replacement. Bottom line is if you think you found a FQB you take him.

[Lurker89]

Sure...

He will either be a decent QB or the next effigy for burning... Win/Win.

[Big_Slick]

6 minutes ago, Tranquilo said:

You make it sound like the Jets don't already have a ton of picks. Maybe they just really like Zach Wilson and rather not trade up with those same picks they would've gotten this year for a QB next draft?

We don't have a ton of picks. We have the Jamal trade picks. Trading down would have given the Jets enough picks to rebuild what was the least talented and worst roster in the NFL. At #23 we probably won't get a top OL prospect and at #34 we don't know who'll be available. JD must hit on four of the five day one and day two picks.

It's a simple choice. A - build the roster first or B - draft a rookie QB and make him play behind a crappy team.

Everyone has a different opinion. JD choose to reset the financial QB clock. Let's hope the rookie QB is still standing in three years.

 

[Tranquilo]

Just now, Big_Slick said:

We don't have a ton of picks. We have the Jamal trade picks. Trading down would have given the Jets enough picks to rebuild what was the least talented and worst roster in the NFL. At #23 we probably won't get a top OL prospect and at #34 we don't know who'll be available. JD must hit on four of the five day one and day two picks.

It's a simple choice. A - build the roster first or B - draft a rookie QB and make him play behind a crappy team.

Everyone has a different opinion. JD choose to reset the financial QB clock. Let's hope the rookie QB is still standing in three years.

 

We do have a ton of picks. Maybe like 1 team has more picks than we do the next 2 years.

[HamBilly]

13 hours ago, BCJet said:

• Easy schedule  - did that affect Mahomes?
• One year wonder - I guess no one has heard of Baker, Kyler or Joe Burrow
• Too small - Kyler is shorter and lighter

Mahomes player at a high level for multiple years.

Baker wasn’t a 1 year wonder. He was seen as a day 2 pick before his Senior year.

Kyler frame is more sturdy.

 

 

[Big_Slick]

3 minutes ago, Tranquilo said:

We do have a ton of picks. Maybe like 1 team has more picks than we do the next 2 years.

It's going to take more than the 23 we stole from that feeble moron Pete Carroll and whatever their #1 gives us next year, which could be in the 23-28 range, to rebuild the worst roster in the NFL.

[Tranquilo]

1 minute ago, Big_Slick said:

It's going to take more than the 23 we stole from that feeble moron Pete Carroll and whatever their #1 gives us next year, which could be in the 23-28 range, to rebuild the worst roster in the NFL.

Don't worry, we are going to have our own first rounders too.

[Leftylarry]

9 minutes ago, Big_Slick said:

It's going to take more than the 23 we stole from that feeble moron Pete Carroll and whatever their #1 gives us next year, which could be in the 23-28 range, to rebuild the worst roster in the NFL.

An injury to Russell Wilson and that #1 can improve greatly, I mean greatly.

[Fantasy Island]

I would be excited if there was a chance JD drafts offense at 23 and 34 , but he won't and I'm not.  Caleb Farley is Dee Milliner and therefore I see the writing on the wall.

[Fantasy Island]

20 hours ago, The Crusher said:

No. He will die here. 

[Fantasy Island]

19 hours ago, JiFapono said:

I've met Pac, he's quite handsome.  Are you familiar with Antonio Banderas?  Similar yet different but both beautiful. 

[shuler82]

I used up all of my allotted excitement for young QBs in 2018 on Sam. Forgive me if I’m more measured in my enthusiasm this time around. 
 

I’m more excited  on the Saleh hire. Feels like he could be the right choice for once... or at the very least, end the downward spiral of ‘it can’t possibly get worse..hold my beer’ hires from end of Rex to Bowles to Gase.

[Big_Slick]

20 minutes ago, Leftylarry said:

An injury to Russell Wilson and that #1 can improve greatly, I mean greatly.

But but but they have Jamal. He's worth at least six wins all by himself.......

[JustEndTheSuffering]

I've learned my lesson about getting excited for guys who have never taken an NFL snap before. 

[Jet Nut]

1 hour ago, Big_Slick said:

Then you get a QB and that doesn't require a top three pick.

Thats a plan?  

Youre ignoring my point, putting the QB pick a year off doesnt guarantee you find one.  Want to wind up like Carolina or Denver, sitting on the outside looking in?  And thats this year with 5 QBs at the top of the draft, what if it were a year with only 2 QBs and you had to trade up that high to find one.

Using the pick to parlay it into multiple picks sounds good but leaves the QB spot a huge ?.  Add in we have a lot of picks as it is with 2 #1s.  We're in a good spot in we're still picking in the first even after using a 1st on a QB

[jgb]

If we pick Wilson over Fields we will regret it bigly.

I hope this post is necro'd 6 months from now to point out how stupid and wrong it was, but the guy looks like Jimmy Clausen.

[JohnnyLV]

1 hour ago, Big_Slick said:

We don't have a ton of picks. We have the Jamal trade picks. Trading down would have given the Jets enough picks to rebuild what was the least talented and worst roster in the NFL. At #23 we probably won't get a top OL prospect and at #34 we don't know who'll be available. JD must hit on four of the five day one and day two picks.

It's a simple choice. A - build the roster first or B - draft a rookie QB and make him play behind a crappy team.

Everyone has a different opinion. JD choose to reset the financial QB clock. Let's hope the rookie QB is still standing in three years.

 

Dude, in the next 2 years we have 4 first round picks 3 second round picks and 3 4th round picks. We already have enough to do both. We can take the potentially best QB in the draft AND have an insane amount of picks to build your team. The answer is actually C for the choice because the Jets have the ammo to get the QB and the better team. 

[JoshAllenSZN]

Hi all. I am a Bills fan (as made obvious by my screen name and avatar), and I come in peace. I've been talking draft with the same message board full of Bills fans for months now, and am looking for some fresh conversation.

I'm curious to know how the majority of fans on this forum are feeling about Zach Wilson being the QB of choice at pick 2. Are the majority of you solidly behind it? Is there a considerable contingent of anti-Wilson people here? Any Fields truthers? I tried to gather this information by reading through several threads first, but there are quite a few, and it's a lot to take in.

Note: I have no horse in this race. I'm routinely wrong about which QBs will succeed in the NFL. I wanted Josh Rosen over Josh Allen in 2018 -- whoops. 

So what's the deal? Is everyone mostly excited about Wilson? If so, were you excited from the get-go, or did you have to talk yourself into it, or what? What are your feelings about your new QB, two days away from Goodell handing him a Jets jersey?

[jetstream23]

Define "solidly"

 

[Savage69]

4 hours ago, The Crusher said:

Nice post Fido. Hopefully the Jets won’t draft him so he may reach his potential, 

Are you calling him a dog?? Shame on you Crusher no soup for you..

[Warfish]

1 minute ago, JoshAllenSZN said:

Hi all. I am a Bills fan....

Really JoshAllenSZN?  We couldn't tell. 

I'd say ~80% are supporters fully behind the Wilson pick.  The "he is elite top 5 in NFL" talk has already begun in earnest.

~15% are not, but accept that it is what it is at this point.

~5% are still dreaming it's all a 4D Chess ruse and we pick Fields/Jones/Trade Down/Etc.

 

[JoshAllenSZN]

6 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Really JoshAllenSZN?  We couldn't tell. 

I'd say ~80% are supporters fully behind the Wilson pick.  The "he is elite top 5 in NFL" talk has already begun in earnest.

~15% are not, but accept that it is what it is at this point.

~5% are still dreaming it's all a 4D Chess ruse and we pick Fields/Jones/Trade Down/Etc.

 

Gotta love the "4D chess" holdouts.

I'm curious to hear from those who don't support Wilson as the selection, what their reasoning is, and who they'd prefer instead.

[Leftylarry]

I think most Jetfans are glad the GM consulted with his HC and staff and together they came to the decision that resetting the salary at the QB position and getting back some of the draft capital used to acquire Sam was the correct way to go, even though many fans like me wanted to trade down and give Sam one more chance in a more user friendly offense for the QB.

 Some may think Fields or Trey Lance are the better prospects some just love  Wilson and are thrilled.

What’s sad is had the organization not been broken at its core, Jets would have fired Gase, made a    Decision to sit Sam and take a look at Morgan and would have completed the “ tank” and there would have been little controversy when the Jets traded Sam and took Trevor Lawrence.

[The Crusher]

17 minutes ago, Savage69 said:

Are you calling him a dog?? Shame on you Crusher no soup for you..

I understand, plus don’t like my food watered down  anyways, I take it straight. 

[Warfish]

15 minutes ago, JoshAllenSZN said:

Gotta love the "4D chess" holdouts.

I'm curious to hear from those who don't support Wilson as the selection, what their reasoning is, and who they'd prefer instead.

I prefer Fields.  But this class is, IMO, one of the least sure-thing in a long time.  I could see 4 or even all 5 of the top picks never being what people think they'll be.

I believe Wilson is very risky for the following reasons:

1. Size, he is shorter than preferred (6'2", if that) and has a slight frame (barely 210 in weight).

2. Injury History, has had Labrum Surgery on his throwing shoulder once already.

3. Limited Resume of Success, prior to 2020 he wasn't a legit prospect and was not even assured to be the 2020 starter at BYU.  Only after the COVID-effected season of 2020, where he was statistically lights out, did his meteoric rise to the #2 pick begin.

4. Extremely Weak Opponents, he was a BYU QB playing a very weak -3.89 SoS, 96th out of 128.  His 2020 numbers were exceptionally great, playing nearly the worst of the worst in college football.

5. Athleticism, Wilson is not the type of QB who will elude NFL pressure or make plays happen while under pressure IMO.  He did some of that at BYU, but he won't get away with it at the NFL level IMO.  He will need great protection by his O-line to potentially thrive (and our O-line is mostly horrible today).

5. Just a Feeling.  Nothing factual, I just don't get a "Legit Franchise QB" vibe from Wilson.  He reminds me of workout warriors, guys who have meh college resumes, come into the Combine, and blow people away with "measurables", "potential" and "intangibles".  I'm not generally a fan of those kind of players for a team like the Jets, for whom even "Being average" has been a real challenge the last decade or so.  

With all that said, while I think Wilson is risky, it doesn't mean he's a sure-bust.  Everything above could be just smoke, and maybe he is the elite potential his fans think he is.  I don't see it, but I'm a cynic, and maybe he'll prove me wrong.

[Beerfish]

I don't 'support' any prospect until he earns it at the pro level.  That doesn't mean I do not evaluate the college guys and I like wilson fine but his success like most QBs will depend on if the GM can build a team around him.

Give any of the QBs in this draft including Lawrence the kind of schlock talent and coaching the jets have had the last 3 years and the new guy will fail just like Darnold.

[Matt39]

Biggest concern other than competition is his arm. I think he has enough, but it’s average at best. Ball doesn’t pop off his arm.

[NIGHT STALKER]

Excited?  Not really...with just about every so called expert picking Wilson to go to the Jets, I would be surprised if we didn't pick him.  What I'm looking forward to is our pick at 23...it ranges from linemen, corners, LB, RB, TE, WR etc...if you want my emotion to be labeled excited, perhaps this pick because it's a mystery.

[munchmemory]

We spent the better part of pre/during/post dinner last night agonizing over the Wilson pick.  Please, Dear Lord, don't make this a Darnold Redux move.

[JoshAllenSZN]

41 minutes ago, Warfish said:

I prefer Fields.  But this class is, IMO, one of the least sure-thing in a long time.  I could see 4 or even all 5 of the top picks never being what people think they'll be.

I believe Wilson is very risky for the following reasons:

1. Size, he is shorter than preferred (6'2", if that) and has a slight frame (barely 210 in weight).

2. Injury History, has had Labrum Surgery on his throwing shoulder once already.

3. Limited Resume of Success, prior to 2020 he wasn't a legit prospect and was not even assured to be the 2020 starter at BYU.  Only after the COVID-effected season of 2020, where he was statistically lights out, did his meteoric rise to the #2 pick begin.

4. Extremely Weak Opponents, he was a BYU QB playing a very weak -3.89 SoS, 96th out of 128.  His 2020 numbers were exceptionally great, playing nearly the worst of the worst in college football.

5. Athleticism, Wilson is not the type of QB who will elude NFL pressure or make plays happen while under pressure IMO.  He did some of that at BYU, but he won't get away with it at the NFL level IMO.  He will need great protection by his O-line to potentially thrive (and our O-line is mostly horrible today).

5. Just a Feeling.  Nothing factual, I just don't get a "Legit Franchise QB" vibe from Wilson.  He reminds me of workout warriors, guys who have meh college resumes, come into the Combine, and blow people away with "measurables", "potential" and "intangibles".  I'm not generally a fan of those kind of players for a team like the Jets, for whom even "Being average" has been a real challenge the last decade or so.  

With all that said, while I think Wilson is risky, it doesn't mean he's a sure-bust.  Everything above could be just smoke, and maybe he is the elite potential his fans think he is.  I don't see it, but I'm a cynic, and maybe he'll prove me wrong.

Thanks for this.

For what it's worth, I am also of the opinion that Justin Fields is QB2. He has done it for longer, done it more consistently, and done it against better competition than Wilson. He scored 51 TDs to just 3 INTs in 2019. He threw 6 TDs against Clemson in the Sugar Bowl. That's a big time performance against legit competition in a big time moment. I feel that Fields is being overlooked/overthought in the same way that Deshaun Watson and Lamar Jackson were, which is to say that all three men proved themselves against legitimate competition in big moments over a long period of time, and all three possess impressive athleticism. And yet, Trubisky was drafted before Watson. Rosen was drafted before Jackson. I can't help but wonder if Fields will be next in the line of "what were they thinking not taking him?!" decisions by NFL decision makers. 

I can clearly see the traits that Wilson possesses that excite NFL decision makers. Then again, the fact that his one great year came against poor competition, as you mentioned, is concerning. Not only that, but it came against teams who often couldn't practice or prepare in the same way they normally would due to COVID precautions. His size also worries me a bit. Not his height so much, but the slightness of his frame.

Again, though, I'm usually bad at predicting QB success in the NFL, so my opinion is worth as much as a pack of Skittles.

[Patriot Killa]

Yes,

I think after seeing the kind of “student of the game” that he is in many of his interviews, it’s calming to see how he came back in 2020 after a meh 19’ & did everything a QB is suppose to do 1000X better than he previously did the year before. 
 

You can see how well it materializes for him on the field, how that Tom Brady esq obsession with mastering his craft & weekly game plan is clearly a big thing about him as a prospect from the mental side of the evaluation. 
 

I think, if placed in a well designed offense, with a considerable upgrade in pass catchers, & that film junkie mentality, he can be pretty successful early on. I’d love a 22TD/12 INT 62% + kind of year from him but I’ve learned from the past, so definitely not putting all the eggs in the basket this go around.