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JD..No more project picks like Ashtyn Davis


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3 hours ago, Cut Jet Penalty Makers said:

I predict Morgan and Perine will be cut out of training camp

This is so naïve its ridiculous.  You are cutting two players that may have had rough rookie year with no OTAs and basically all virtual offseason.  Yet they are busts... I bet you are the same type of person that was ready to give away QW after his rookie season for a 3rd rounder like half the site and he didn't have a virtual offseason that year. My god... you millennials are impossibly impatient.. I bet you want to fire JD if he doesn't draft all OFF too... 

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4 hours ago, Cut Jet Penalty Makers said:

And James Morgan..please..only guys that are set in their position and can contribute immediately..I'm sick of these reach picks.

And the guard we drafted in the 4th round who never saw the field.  You forgot to add him into the equation.

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4 hours ago, Cut Jet Penalty Makers said:

And James Morgan..please..only guys that are set in their position and can contribute immediately..I'm sick of these reach picks.

All rookies are projects and need developing. Case in point. People wanted QW out of here a yr ago. Becton gave up 10+ sacks. I guess they were reaches. 

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2 hours ago, DoubleDown said:

Davis was a third rounder who cracked the starting lineup as a rookie and improved as the year went on. Exactly what should be expected from a third round pick.

Perine was admittedly underwhelming, but his performance was eerily close to Bilal Powell's first two years. Powell has always been a good comp for him. He's always going to be a rotational player and a contributor on special teams. That's not a bad thing for a fourth rounder.

Morgan and Clark get so much flack on this site, but there is literally nothing to judge them by. Last year was always going to be a redshirt year for them. If they  can develop into steady NFL backups or starters, they're not bad picks.

The one that worries me the most is Zuniga. I never liked the pick and he showed nothing in his brief appearances. It would have been nice if he flashed once or twice but I cannot recall even one play he made.

I hope Joe Douglas nails more picks than he did last year. It was overall a mediocre draft for him, but it's a fluid situation and the perception can certainly change if some of the above players step it up.

May I ask:

If you think Davis was "exactly what should be expected from a third round pick," and Perine "wasn't a bad thing for a fourth rounder," and I presume you like Becton and Mims, and he got a good CB in Hall and a punter in Mann, why would you think his draft was 'mediocre,' and that he needs to "nail more picks?" 

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57 minutes ago, Skeptable said:

This is so naïve its ridiculous.  You are cutting two players that may have had rough rookie year with no OTAs and basically all virtual offseason.  Yet they are busts... I bet you are the same type of person that was ready to give away QW after his rookie season for a 3rd rounder like half the site and he didn't have a virtual offseason that year. My god... you millennials are impossibly impatient.. I bet you want to fire JD if he doesn't draft all OFF too... 

I agree with you .... Don't put all of us "millennials" in the same boat. 😂

New posters should not be able to start new threads for at least a month, get on it Maxman.

I've been happy with JDs approach and don't see Morgan as a bad pick, if he's a decent backup it was a fine pick, anything more is a plus. I'm pretty sure that was a pick we got in a trade back anyway but let's crucify JD for it. It's like people either forget the ineptitude of Idzik and Mac or for some illogical reason attribute it to JD.

The book hasn't been written on JD yet... could be good could be bad, I'm all for letting it at out and have seen more good than bad in my opinion.

 

Side note:

For all we know he could be a boomer his name is "Cut Jet Penalty Makers"

Gen X doesn't get enough crap.... They suck as much as anybody and just get to skate on it. Fact is all of our generations are trash in their  own way... Humans kind of suck in general. 👍

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30 minutes ago, CanadaSteve said:

May I ask:

If you think Davis was "exactly what should be expected from a third round pick," and Perine "wasn't a bad thing for a fourth rounder," and I presume you like Becton and Mims, and he got a good CB in Hall and a punter in Mann, why would you think his draft was 'mediocre,' and that he needs to "nail more picks?" 

This is going to be a very long and drawn out process of turning this team around if he simply makes picks that "do what they should."  Hence, it was mediocre and he needs to nail picks that go above and beyond expectations moving forward.  If he can find diamonds in the rough in mid rounds, the rebuild will be accelerated exponentially.

Hall may have been his best pick last year.  He seems like he could potentially be a long term starter at CB and he got tremendous value out of that late pick.  Mann was mediocre in terms of punting, but I do like his physicality, and he makes a legitimate difference in terms of punt coverage.  Solid pick, but nothing extraordinary at this point.

To be clear, I am not as high on Becton and Mims as most of the board seems to be.

Becton had some nice moments where he looked dominant, but he also had some bad moments where he looked fairly vulnerable.  And he got dinged up multiple times last season so durability could potentially be a concern.  I'd like to see him toughen up a bit from an injury standpoint and polish up his game.

I loved the Mims pick, but I thought overall he was a bit underwhelming during the season.  He had a few nice moments, but I was expecting more of an impact overall and at least a couple of TDs would have been nice.  He also had some durability concerns with two pulled hammies.  I'd like to see what he can do in a new system with a new quarterback, but make no mistake, he still has much to prove.  I have said in the past that his floor is Stephen Hill, and he still hasn't proven to me that he is definitively better than his floor.

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5 hours ago, jetstream23 said:

Ashtyn Davis still has a lot to prove but I agree with you 100%.

When you consider him with the other guys taken in those rounds by JD....  Zuniga, James Morgan, Perine, Cameron Clark.... then Davis looks like a huge hit!

 

Agreed and honestly a Jets 3rd rounder that contributes even if only a little is a step in the right direction 

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For purposes of initial judgment on JD's 2020 draft class, for a team with a weak offensive line and WR corp, I don't think you can look at what JD drafted and what is the historical hit rate on third and fourth round draft picks.  You have to look at who was drafted after the Jets picked those four players we complain about-answer: lots of good players.  All Rookie OL, etc.   That is what is most frustrating.

I actually predict that Zuniga and Clark, with the new coaches, will actually look ok.  

Morgan in this scheme is a toss up, but not heading in a good direction.  I think we conclude he is a wasted pick. 

Davis-my theory is that he was drafted as a replacement for Maye with better coverage skills.  We thought at the time he was an ok draft pick.  Hopefully Saleh can use him.   Maybe he is the big nickle that teams need.  

Player Summary - Ashtyn Davis projects best into a role as a Cover-2 free safety at the pro level. Davis has strong tackling skills on the back end and some effective reps dropping down into the box to play man to man in the slot, but he's generally lacking in run support in the box to be asked upon to play such a role with consistency in the pros. Too many bad angles and too many reps getting stuck to blocks negate his versatility. Putting him in primarily Cover 2 will allow his deep range to be more effective. 

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2 minutes ago, RutgersJetFan said:

are you saying they shouldn't be cut

Davis and Morgan - The targets of this thread combined for only one penalty, I guess maybe that's enough to cut Davis, but seems like Morgan should get a longer leash here.

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7 hours ago, Beerfish said:

Davis I think is not that bad and will do much better this year.

Douglas did make some terrible picks last year and his pick priorities were pretty terrible in some cases.

He also made some very good promising picks but these guys have move from rookie to quality starter this year.

You are being too kind.  

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The griping about the Morgan pick is truly insane around these parts. 

When are you guys going to realize that we were so devoid of talent going into the draft last year, basic things that good teams plan for (cheap backup QBs, RBs, a reliable punter) were nowhere to be found on this roster. 

We all want instant starters, but there is no "middle class" on this roster, you know, guys who fill out the roster on their second contracts. The guys Mac should have hit on that are now mostly out of the league.

I didn't see a lot of boom or bust from JD's first draft, he was mostly looking for depth and positional competence. We haven't even had that in recent years, so I see the logic behind the picks.

Let's give these guys a non pandemic year to see what we have and then sh*t on them if necessary.

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9 hours ago, derp said:

His picks after the second round were intended to be guys developed to be starters or play key backup roles. Not everyone is going to impact day one and this team desperately needed depth built.

Guys like Perine and Morgan who will be cheap backups and in Perine’s case play specials teams for four years have value on a team even if they never step into major roles. Davis is helpful for a team that needs long-term answers and depth at safety. He and Zuniga certainly need to show something though. Hopefully the second year guys are healthier after last weird offseason.

I don’t think you draft a guard in the fourth round to be long-term depth though. Cam Clark needs to show something. It’s wild that a fourth round guard who showed nothing gets a pass just because this fanbase is so OL hungry.

Nobody has any idea what Cam Clark showed in practice.  What we do know is that his former head coach spent the entire season starting the worst player on the depth chart at RB.  Every rookie on the roster gets a pass based on having a head coach whose only qualification was having Peyton Manning's phone number.

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Seriously JD - I want Day 1 starters in the middle rounds of the draft, so what if the % of that happening is about 5% and that you found an opening day starter at CB in the 5th round of your first draft, all these guys should be starters.

Ridiculous thread

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4 hours ago, AFJF said:

Nobody has any idea what Cam Clark showed in practice.  What we do know is that his former head coach spent the entire season starting the worst player on the depth chart at RB.  Every rookie on the roster gets a pass based on having a head coach whose only qualification was having Peyton Manning's phone number.

That’s why I said needs to show something. We have I hate the *insert Ashtyn Davis, Jabari Zuniga, LaMical Perine. James Morgan* pick threads every couple months but nothing about Clark. That’s what I meant by gets a pass. 

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Aren't Perine and Davis the opposite type of pick?  I mean they both were able to contribute immediately, but Perine was more ready with low-ceiling and Davis more p athletic upside with a need for development and role definition.  This thread is the usual pick the good players, with the common bonus of they suck if they aren't studs by day 1.

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15 hours ago, Cut Jet Penalty Makers said:

And James Morgan..please..only guys that are set in their position and can contribute immediately..I'm sick of these reach picks.

Exactly!  Until we have a proven coaching staff that knows how to coach elite talent I want proven JAGS we can plug and play.  

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7 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

Aren't Perine and Davis the opposite type of pick?  I mean they both were able to contribute immediately, but Perine was more ready with low-ceiling and Davis more p athletic upside with a need for development and role definition.  This thread is the usual pick the good players, with the common bonus of they suck if they aren't studs by day 1.

Perine wasn’t bad, and no rbs not named gore got a real shot unless gore was injured.  And really, how can you truly evaluate any pick besides bechton with that team last year.  

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22 minutes ago, derp said:

That’s why I said needs to show something. We have I hate the *insert Ashtyn Davis, Jabari Zuniga, LaMical Perine. James Morgan* pick threads every couple months but nothing about Clark. That’s what I meant by gets a pass. 

Davis theoretically is like John Johnson and Eddie Jackson, who both had better scouting reports, better rookie years and were drafted lower than the early third round.

Maybe that is another reason so many people dislike the pick  

 

 

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37 minutes ago, varjet said:

Davis theoretically is like John Johnson and Eddie Jackson, who both had better scouting reports, better rookie years and were drafted lower than the early third round.

Maybe that is another reason so many people dislike the pick  

 

 

I understand why people don’t like all of those picks, that wasn’t the point. I don’t understand why Clark is never lumped in. Certainly didn’t show any more and of all the positions a fourth round guard should be able to make an impact. 

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16 hours ago, KRL said:

Tanking any rookie from last year with all the cancelled OTA's/pre-season is ridiculous

Well, there is going to be reduced OTA's et. al. this year too, so I guess we can start to evaluate the 2020 (and 2021) Draft Classes, um, lets see, carry the one, what, in 2035?  Or should we wait till 2040 do you think?

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Ashton may have just needed to mature guys .. he was a freaking rookie. Rookies in general suck (especially 3rd rounders) ... this kid needs some time is all  .... at least that is what I am hoping for .. he certainly has heart.

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1 hour ago, Joe W. Namath said:

Davis is going to be awesome this year and James Morgan will be our generations pat ryan.

Both great picks by Joe D.

I expect the Jets will bring in a veteran to backup Wilson...perhaps a Bridgewater type..how does Morgan even see the field next year in that scenario?...wasted pick...he'll be traded or released most likely.

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Half of the last 30 years we have been pissed about drafting a bust in the 1st round.

Probably 80% of the last 30 years we have been pissed about drafting a bust in the 2nd round.

Last year, our 1st round pick looked really good, and our 2nd round pick shows a lot of promise when healthy and playing for a coach who actually has a clue.  So what do we do?  Start whining about 3rd and 4th round picks.  Not having a total bust in the 1st two rounds is so unfamiliar to Jet fans it's creating mental disturbance.

Perhaps this time next year we'll be really mad about the 5th round bust JD picked.  Good times.

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32 minutes ago, Cut Jet Penalty Makers said:

I expect the Jets will bring in a veteran to backup Wilson...perhaps a Bridgewater type..how does Morgan even see the field next year in that scenario?...wasted pick...he'll be traded or released most likely.

Awesome pick.  look at what pat ryan did for us back in the day.  its not about right now.  Its about the long term success of this organization.  James Morgan will be an awesome backup for us who can come in and win games.  Maybe not this year, but who cares.  We are not competing for anything this year anyway.

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